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Good keyboard

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  Good keyboard David Niklas <doark@mail.com> - 2016-02-11 06:20 +0100
    Re: Good keyboard David Christensen <dpchrist@holgerdanske.com> - 2016-02-11 19:30 +0100
      Re: Good keyboard Martin Read <zen75502@zen.co.uk> - 2016-02-11 21:30 +0100
      Re: Good keyboard Glenn English <ghe@srv.slsware.net> - 2016-02-11 22:00 +0100
      Re: Good keyboard shawn wilson <ag4ve.us@gmail.com> - 2016-02-13 06:50 +0100
        Re: Good keyboard Patrick Bartek <nemommxiv@gmail.com> - 2016-02-13 07:50 +0100
          Re: Good keyboard Glenn Holmer <shadowm@lyonlabs.org> - 2016-02-13 18:30 +0100
            Re: Good keyboard jdd <jdd@dodin.org> - 2016-02-13 19:20 +0100
              Re: Good keyboard martin f krafft <madduck@debian.org> - 2016-02-13 22:00 +0100
                Re: Good keyboard rlharris@oplink.net - 2016-02-13 23:30 +0100
                  Re: Good keyboard martin f krafft <madduck@debian.org> - 2016-02-14 09:40 +0100
                    Re: Good keyboard Gary Roach <gary719_list1@verizon.net> - 2016-02-15 00:20 +0100
                      Re: Good keyboard Gary Roach <gary719_list1@verizon.net> - 2016-02-15 03:20 +0100
                        Re: Good keyboard rlharris@oplink.net - 2016-02-15 03:40 +0100

#164053 — Good keyboard

Hello,
If I'm remembering rightly, a while back (months), there was a
discussion about keyboards.
I noticed this one and wanted to know if it looks good and is worth $220
(the average BK goes for $100, so you can imagine my surprise), I'm
uncertain.
I'm I know that this might be an opinion matter.

https://www.crowdsupply.com/ugl/ultimate-hacking-keyboard

I don't need a new KB now, but the discount that is being offered will not
last forever.

Thanks, David

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#164068

On 02/10/2016 09:00 PM, David Niklas wrote:
> If I'm remembering rightly, a while back (months), there was a
> discussion about keyboards.
> I noticed this one and wanted to know if it looks good and is worth $220
> (the average BK goes for $100, so you can imagine my surprise), I'm
> uncertain.
> I'm I know that this might be an opinion matter.
>
> https://www.crowdsupply.com/ugl/ultimate-hacking-keyboard
>
> I don't need a new KB now, but the discount that is being offered will not
> last forever.

I've just about beat my Dell/ Alps OEM keyboard to death, and have been 
searching for a replacement.  The primary market for high-dollar 
keyboards seems to be gaming.  A secondary is heavy typing (secretary, 
programming).  My interest is the latter, but I do game occasionally.  I 
prefer to keep the noise down.  I like a number pad.  My keyboard, 
mouse, KVM, and older machines use PS/2 cabling and connectors.  I use 
PS/2 to USB adapters on newer machines.  Multi-key rollover through the 
KVM works if the host is PS/2, but fails if the host is USB.


The CODE keyboard looks appealing:

     https://codekeyboards.com/


This page discusses the various Cherry key switch colors:

 
http://www.keyboardco.com/blog/index.php/2012/12/an-introduction-to-cherry-mx-mechanical-switches/


Does anybody have the CODE 104-Key MX Brown, or something similar? 
Thoughts?  Comments?


David

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#164076

On 11/02/16 18:21, David Christensen wrote:
> Does anybody have the CODE 104-Key MX Brown, or something similar?
> Thoughts?  Comments?

My Das Keyboard has Cherry MX Brown keyswitches. I find it quite 
pleasant to type on (I type pretty fast), and I can say that while it's 
not silent, it is certainly quieter than the IBM Model M I had on very 
extended loan from a friend.

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#164079

> On Feb 11, 2016, at 11:21 AM, David Christensen <dpchrist@holgerdanske.com> wrote:
> 
> Thoughts?  Comments?

Have you looked into a Cherry? They use Cherry switches (surprise). And they're quiet until the key hits the bottom, then they make the sound of a key hitting the bottom.

There were several models available when I bought mine, but I found one that was pretty "vanilla". UBS and (at the time) PS/2 -- they're on PS/2 to USB adapters now.

I don't know about key rollover, but I've never had a problem with that (it's quite possible that I just type too slowly :-).

They're on all my important machines now, and I love them dearly.

-- 
Glenn English

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#164137

[Multipart message — attachments visible in raw view] — view raw

On Feb 11, 2016 1:21 PM, "David Christensen" <dpchrist@holgerdanske.com>
wrote:
>

Thoughts?  Comments?
>

I don't have one of those (but I think I'll buy one). Currently I swear by
my ducky mini (obviously remap caps lock to escape - also, I use vim/vim
mode so YMMV if you like arrowing around which means it also doesn't do
well in bios or lilo/grub - has fn arrow but that's obviously a PITA). I
also have a DasKeyboard but a few keys squeak so that's turned into a $100
brick. And I have a Lexmark model M but still prefer my ducky due to its
size on my desk.

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#164138

On Sat, 13 Feb 2016, shawn wilson wrote:

> On Feb 11, 2016 1:21 PM, "David Christensen"
> <dpchrist@holgerdanske.com> wrote:
> >
> 
> Thoughts?  Comments?
> >
> 
> I don't have one of those (but I think I'll buy one). Currently I
> swear by my ducky mini (obviously remap caps lock to escape - also, I
> use vim/vim mode so YMMV if you like arrowing around which means it
> also doesn't do well in bios or lilo/grub - has fn arrow but that's
> obviously a PITA). I also have a DasKeyboard but a few keys squeak so
> that's turned into a $100 brick. And I have a Lexmark model M but
> still prefer my ducky due to its size on my desk.

When my last keyboard started failing, I replaced it with a Kensington
Keyboard for Life (K64307A).  Been using it now for 6 years or so.
Maybe longer.  Can't remember exactly.  Still works fine.  Blow it out
weekly, and clean the exterior monthly using 90% isopropyl alcohol.
Just as solid as it was when I bought it. If it ever fails Kensington
replaces it for free. It cost me $15 US IIRC.

FWIW, I do a lot of typing for my business and personal use.  Am even
working on a couple of books. I'm a touch typist. So, I don't pound on
it like it's a manual typewriter, but it does get daily use for
several hours a day. Anyone who spends $100 these days on a keyboard has
got to be nuts whether they think it's worth or not. But it's your
money.

B

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#164145

On 02/13/2016 12:47 AM, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> When my last keyboard started failing, I replaced it with

http://www.kinesis-ergo.com/shop/advantage-for-pc-mac/

Worth every penny.

-- 
Glenn Holmer (Linux registered user #16682)
"After the vintage season came the aftermath -- and Cenbe."

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#164146

Le 13/02/2016 18:08, Glenn Holmer a écrit :
> On 02/13/2016 12:47 AM, Patrick Bartek wrote:
>> When my last keyboard started failing, I replaced it with
>
> http://www.kinesis-ergo.com/shop/advantage-for-pc-mac/
>
> Worth every penny.
>
wow... needs some learning, so Dvorak probably better :-)

jdd

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#164148

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also sprach jdd <jdd@dodin.org> [2016-02-14 07:14 +1300]:
> >http://www.kinesis-ergo.com/shop/advantage-for-pc-mac/
> >
> >Worth every penny.
> >
> wow... needs some learning, so Dvorak probably better :-)

You used to be able to get these with Dvorak, not sure if that's
still the case.

I liked the keyboard, but using it for coding, Vim, etc. just wasn't
very easy. The F-keys are unusably small, and to use keys like
Insert/End/Home etc. always requires you to move your hands as
I found it not doable with just the thumbs.

Hth,

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems
 
don't hate yourself in the morning -- sleep till noon.

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#164149

On Sat, February 13, 2016 2:39 pm, martin f krafft wrote:
> You used to be able to get these with Dvorak, not sure if that's
> still the case.

For the Dvorak layout, just select the appropriate xkb map
(APPLICATIONS->SETTINGS->KEYBOARD).

Several are available; I use and recommend the Classic Dvorak, in which
the numeric row is:

unshifted   [731902468]

shifted     {&%#!()@$^*}

Russ

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#164153

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also sprach rlharris@oplink.net <rlharris@oplink.net> [2016-02-14 11:20 +1300]:
> For the Dvorak layout, just select the appropriate xkb map
> (APPLICATIONS->SETTINGS->KEYBOARD).

Apart from there being no "Applications" menu on my Debian system… ;)
</tongueInCheek>

This won't address the issue of having keys labeled physically.
I can touch type, but there are times when I really appreciate to
just being able to hit the key as advertised without having to first
position, gain my bearing, and then move…

-- 
 .''`.   martin f. krafft <madduck@d.o> @martinkrafft
: :'  :  proud Debian developer
`. `'`   http://people.debian.org/~madduck
  `-  Debian - when you have better things to do than fixing systems
 
"all i know is that i'm being sued for unfair business
 practices by micro$oft. hello pot? it's kettle on line two."
                                                -- michael robertson

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#164169

On 02/14/2016 12:33 AM, martin f krafft wrote:
> also sprach rlharris@oplink.net <rlharris@oplink.net> [2016-02-14 11:20 +1300]:
>> For the Dvorak layout, just select the appropriate xkb map
>> (APPLICATIONS->SETTINGS->KEYBOARD).
> Apart from there being no "Applications" menu on my Debian system… ;)
> </tongueInCheek>
>
> This won't address the issue of having keys labeled physically.
> I can touch type, but there are times when I really appreciate to
> just being able to hit the key as advertised without having to first
> position, gain my bearing, and then move…
>
I've been using a microsoft Ergonomic model 4000 v.1 for years. I love 
it. I recently looked around for a replacement ( turned out not to be 
the problem). I found that the newer Microsoft keyboards were garbage in 
comparison. The only one that came close was a Fellows for which I can 
not remember the model. I spend a lot of time on the keyboard and much 
prefer the slanted ergonomic layout. It takes some getting used to but 
once you d you will never want to go back to a standard layout. I don't 
understand the fascination with the Dvorák keyboard. While I will admit  
that it is more efficient than the qwerty lay out, this really will come 
into play if you can type faster than 150 cps or so. Who can? Most users 
are lucky to make 40 cps and if programming even slower.

For your consideration.

Gary R

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#164176

On 02/14/2016 03:16 PM, Gary Roach wrote:
> On 02/14/2016 12:33 AM, martin f krafft wrote:
>> also sprach rlharris@oplink.net <rlharris@oplink.net> [2016-02-14 
>> 11:20 +1300]:
>>> For the Dvorak layout, just select the appropriate xkb map
>>> (APPLICATIONS->SETTINGS->KEYBOARD).
>> Apart from there being no "Applications" menu on my Debian system… ;)
>> </tongueInCheek>
>>
>> This won't address the issue of having keys labeled physically.
>> I can touch type, but there are times when I really appreciate to
>> just being able to hit the key as advertised without having to first
>> position, gain my bearing, and then move…
>>
> I've been using a microsoft Ergonomic model 4000 v.1 for years. I love 
> it. I recently looked around for a replacement ( turned out not to be 
> the problem). I found that the newer Microsoft keyboards were garbage 
> in comparison. The only one that came close was a Fellows for which I 
> can not remember the model. I spend a lot of time on the keyboard and 
> much prefer the slanted ergonomic layout. It takes some getting used 
> to but once you d you will never want to go back to a standard layout. 
> I don't understand the fascination with the Dvorák keyboard. While I 
> will admit  that it is more efficient than the qwerty lay out, this 
> really will come into play if you can type faster than 150 cps or so. 
> Who can? Most users are lucky to make 40 cps and if programming even 
> slower.
>
> For your consideration.
>
> Gary R
>
>
Oops. Corrections. Thats 150 wpm not 150 cps.

Gary R.

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#164177

On Sun, February 14, 2016 7:12 pm, Gary Roach wrote:
...
>> I've been using a microsoft Ergonomic model 4000 v.1 for years. I love
>> it. I recently looked around for a replacement ( turned out not to be the
>> problem). I found that the newer Microsoft keyboards were garbage in
>> comparison. The only one that came close was a Fellows for which I can
>> not remember the model.

I enjoyed using the thin Apple keyboard, but put it away a few years back
when I could not figure out the proper xkb category; but I think I now
know how to specify the keyboard to the Debian installer.

>> I spend a lot of time on the keyboard and much
>> prefer the slanted ergonomic layout.

I did not notice any comments on my comparison of a computer keyboard with
a piano keyboard in this respect; but that also is something to consider. 
Who would suffer from poor "ergonomics" more than would the pianist?

>> I don't understand the fascination with the Dvorak keyboard. While I
>> will admit that it is more efficient than the qwerty lay out, this
>> really will come into play if you can type faster than 150 wpm or so.
>> Who can?

Perhaps you should consider your definition of efficiency.  I live at the
keyboard, and to me the measure of that which you term "efficiency"
involves consideration of a number of factors, including fatigue,
typographical error rate, and intuitiveness of the layout; the words per
minute count is at the bottom of my list.

To me, one of the greatest benefits of the Dvorak layout comes in entry of
text which incudes numerals.  With the Classic Dvorak layout, the
keystrokes for numerals are instinctive; thus I seldom make an error. 
Such was not the case forty years ago when I could type 120 wpm on QWERTY
on a manual keybar typewriter.

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