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Anyone got any idea what governs update timing?

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  Anyone got any idea what governs update timing? licensedtoquill@gmail.com - 2014-01-01 08:17 -0800
    Re: Anyone got any idea what governs update timing? Don Bruder <dakidd@sonic.net> - 2014-01-01 09:01 -0800
      Re: Anyone got any idea what governs update timing? licensedtoquill@gmail.com - 2014-01-01 09:41 -0800
        Re: Anyone got any idea what governs update timing? David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> - 2014-01-01 13:47 -0600
          Re: Anyone got any idea what governs update timing? J Burns <burns4@nowhere.com> - 2014-01-01 14:58 -0500
            Re: Anyone got any idea what governs update timing? David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> - 2014-01-01 15:08 -0600
              Re: Anyone got any idea what governs update timing? J Burns <burns4@nowhere.com> - 2014-01-01 21:46 -0500
                Re: Anyone got any idea what governs update timing? dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-01-02 22:48 +1300
                  Re: Anyone got any idea what governs update timing? licensedtoquill@gmail.com - 2014-01-02 06:44 -0800
                    Re: Anyone got any idea what governs update timing? J Burns <burns4@nowhere.com> - 2014-01-02 11:46 -0500
        Re: Anyone got any idea what governs update timing? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2014-01-01 17:56 -0500

#54194 — Anyone got any idea what governs update timing?

I only just got an update message telling me to update to Mavericks on my 2010 MacBook Pro. 

I cant say I didn't know about it as my 2009 MacBook received its update about a month ago and I had to spend a short amount of time running a node check to straighten out things the upgrade screwed up a bit.  I just dont understand what governs when your computer either knows or is told by the mothership that there is an update out there which it needs?

Update has been working, - it has been telling me for a month or so that it needs an update to iTunes and Digital Camera RAW Compatibility; which I havent been bothering to install because I dont use RAW files and stopped believing long ago that any update to iTunes was anything other than some method of making spending money easier with iTunes.

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#54198

In article <b2e6fe04-4489-45cd-b15f-99f87c21968a@googlegroups.com>,
 licensedtoquill@gmail.com wrote:

> I only just got an update message telling me to update to Mavericks on my 
> 2010 MacBook Pro. 
> 
> I cant say I didn't know about it as my 2009 MacBook received its update 
> about a month ago and I had to spend a short amount of time running a node 
> check to straighten out things the upgrade screwed up a bit.  I just dont 
> understand what governs when your computer either knows or is told by the 
> mothership that there is an update out there which it needs?
> 
> Update has been working, - it has been telling me for a month or so that it 
> needs an update to iTunes and Digital Camera RAW Compatibility; which I 
> havent been bothering to install because I dont use RAW files and stopped 
> believing long ago that any update to iTunes was anything other than some 
> method of making spending money easier with iTunes.

Back here in 10.4 land, it's an "E.T., Phone home!" thing. Whenever the 
last update happened, that's the time of day the "call" happens. 
Basically, your rig says "When was the last time I did an update check? 
Oh - long enough ago. OK, Hey! Apple! Any updates for me? There are? OK, 
hand 'em to me." Or "Nothing? OK, I'll check back tomorrow/next 
week/whatever."

-- 
Security provided by Mssrs Smith and/or Wesson. Brought to you by the letter Q

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#54201

OK but my question was how I have been updating regularly for the last two months that Mavericks has been out there and it has taken two months for the mothership to notice that there is a whole OS upgrade out there

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#54211

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On Wednesday, 01 January 2014 09:41 -0800, 
 in article <5370e686-8faf-47c0-88dd-4631b9a33de8@googlegroups.com>, 
 licensedtoquill@gmail.com <licensedtoquill@gmail.com> wrote:

> OK but my question was how I have been updating regularly for the 
> last two months that Mavericks has been out there and it has taken 
> two months for the mothership to notice that there is a whole OS 
> upgrade out there

The OS X 10.9.1 updated didn't exist, prior to about two weeks ago.  
It was released 16 December 2013.

- -- 
David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com>
 Be kind to animals; kiss a shark.

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#54212

On 1/1/14, 2:47 PM, David Ritz wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> On Wednesday, 01 January 2014 09:41 -0800,
>   in article <5370e686-8faf-47c0-88dd-4631b9a33de8@googlegroups.com>,
>   licensedtoquill@gmail.com <licensedtoquill@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> OK but my question was how I have been updating regularly for the
>> last two months that Mavericks has been out there and it has taken
>> two months for the mothership to notice that there is a whole OS
>> upgrade out there
>
> The OS X 10.9.1 updated didn't exist, prior to about two weeks ago.
> It was released 16 December 2013.
>

When Software Update offered me 10.9.0, I declined to update at the 
time. I didn't see it offered again.  I sought out 10.9.1 when it was 
available.

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#54220

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On Wednesday, 01 January 2014 14:58 -0500, 
 in article <la1s0c$ppk$1@dont-email.me>, 
 J Burns <burns4@nowhere.com> wrote:

> On 1/1/14, 2:47 PM, David Ritz wrote:

>> The OS X 10.9.1 updated didn't exist, prior to about two weeks ago.
>> It was released 16 December 2013.

> When Software Update offered me 10.9.0, I declined to update at the 
> time. I didn't see it offered again.  I sought out 10.9.1 when it 
> was available.

That is an entirely different matter.

<http://support.apple.com/kb/HT6065>
<quote>
About the OS X Mavericks v10.9.1 Update

   Learn about the OS X Mavericks v10.9.1 Update

   The OS X Mavericks v10.9.1 Update is recommended for all OS X
   Mavericks users.
</quote>

While you declined to update to OS X 10.9, when Software Update 
offered it, you were able to locate and install OS X 10.9.1, at your 
discretion.  You're installation was not an update.

How do you expect Software Update to infer your intention of waiting 
for the first update to Mavericks, to be released, before installing 
Mavericks?  The 10.9.1 update was only automatically offered to those 
who had previously installed Mavericks; a set of users, which did not 
include you.

- -- 
David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com>
 Be kind to animals; kiss a shark.

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#54241

On 1/1/14, 4:08 PM, David Ritz wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> On Wednesday, 01 January 2014 14:58 -0500,
>   in article <la1s0c$ppk$1@dont-email.me>,
>   J Burns <burns4@nowhere.com> wrote:
>
>> On 1/1/14, 2:47 PM, David Ritz wrote:
>
>>> The OS X 10.9.1 updated didn't exist, prior to about two weeks ago.
>>> It was released 16 December 2013.
>
>> When Software Update offered me 10.9.0, I declined to update at the
>> time. I didn't see it offered again.  I sought out 10.9.1 when it
>> was available.
>
> That is an entirely different matter.
>
> <http://support.apple.com/kb/HT6065>
> <quote>
> About the OS X Mavericks v10.9.1 Update
>
>     Learn about the OS X Mavericks v10.9.1 Update
>
>     The OS X Mavericks v10.9.1 Update is recommended for all OS X
>     Mavericks users.
> </quote>
>
> While you declined to update to OS X 10.9, when Software Update
> offered it, you were able to locate and install OS X 10.9.1, at your
> discretion.  You're installation was not an update.
>
> How do you expect Software Update to infer your intention of waiting
> for the first update to Mavericks, to be released, before installing
> Mavericks?  The 10.9.1 update was only automatically offered to those
> who had previously installed Mavericks; a set of users, which did not
> include you.

I'm not talking about 10.9.1.  I don't recall the wording of the buttons 
in Software Update, but when I've declined other updates, I understood I 
was saying "not now."  The next time Software Update checked, they would 
be offered again.

When I declined 10.9.0, I assumed it would be offered a week later, when 
Software Update checked again and I'd had time to think it over.  It 
wasn't.  My point was that Software Update didn't treat Mavericks like 
other updates.

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#54259

J Burns <burns4@nowhere.com> wrote:

> On 1/1/14, 4:08 PM, David Ritz wrote:
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > Hash: SHA1
> >
> > On Wednesday, 01 January 2014 14:58 -0500,
> >   in article <la1s0c$ppk$1@dont-email.me>,
> >   J Burns <burns4@nowhere.com> wrote:
> >
> >> On 1/1/14, 2:47 PM, David Ritz wrote:
> >
> >>> The OS X 10.9.1 updated didn't exist, prior to about two weeks ago.
> >>> It was released 16 December 2013.
> >
> >> When Software Update offered me 10.9.0, I declined to update at the
> >> time. I didn't see it offered again.  I sought out 10.9.1 when it
> >> was available.
> >
> > That is an entirely different matter.
> >
> > <http://support.apple.com/kb/HT6065>
> > <quote>
> > About the OS X Mavericks v10.9.1 Update
> >
> >     Learn about the OS X Mavericks v10.9.1 Update
> >
> >     The OS X Mavericks v10.9.1 Update is recommended for all OS X
> >     Mavericks users.
> > </quote>
> >
> > While you declined to update to OS X 10.9, when Software Update
> > offered it, you were able to locate and install OS X 10.9.1, at your
> > discretion.  You're installation was not an update.
> >
> > How do you expect Software Update to infer your intention of waiting
> > for the first update to Mavericks, to be released, before installing
> > Mavericks?  The 10.9.1 update was only automatically offered to those
> > who had previously installed Mavericks; a set of users, which did not
> > include you.
> 
> I'm not talking about 10.9.1.  I don't recall the wording of the buttons
> in Software Update, but when I've declined other updates, I understood I
> was saying "not now."  The next time Software Update checked, they would
> be offered again.
> 
> When I declined 10.9.0, I assumed it would be offered a week later, when
> Software Update checked again and I'd had time to think it over.  It 
> wasn't.  My point was that Software Update didn't treat Mavericks like
> other updates.

Mavericks isn't being offered via the Software Update mechanism. It
appears that App Store in Mountain Lion (and later) has a new mechanism
to offer major OS upgrades periodically, which is separate from the
Software Update and App Update mechanisms.

In 10.6 and 10.7, App Store only handled app updates. Software Update
was separate, using basically the same user interface as in earlier OS X
versions.

In 10.8, Apple moved the Software Update user interface into App Store,
but kept the underlying infrastructure the same, including the command
line "softwareupdate" tool, the servers involved, the mechanisms to find
updates, the receipts database and tie-in with Installer.app, etc. App
Store presents all these updates in a single "Software Update" section
in App Store. App updates are listed in a separate group and have a
different infrastructure and implementation (tied to the iTunes Store,
and handled similarly to iOS app updates).

The offer of Mavericks on the Updates tab in 10.8's App Store is not
part of the Software Update category, nor does it appear via the command
line softwareupdate tool, nor is it downloaded automatically if
automatic update downloads are enabled. It isn't the same as App updates
either, so it must be a new category. We don't have much information as
to how this mechanism works.

-- 
David Empson
dempson@actrix.gen.nz

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#54264

Thanks guys, I think you are both on to something: OS upgrades are indeed handled differently though they do look superficially the same.  There are two categories now in what looks like Software Update and it had a  multi-gigabyte update for iMovie and iPhoto at the same time.

In addition, I DID have an applecare issue at the time 10.9 came out related to  a motherboard issue which may have prevented my being offered Mavericks at that stage.  Curiously Apple assigned me a senior adviser to take care of it after I had spent around 20-30 hours on the phone and had three to five visits to the store and returns to the depot where they couldnt really figure out what was wrong with the unit.

By the time 10.9.1 came out, it SEEMS either the rep had (gone ill or) dropped the ball and Apple were no longer interested in assisting me. So they pumped out the upgrade when they gave up trying to help me (won't return my calls) and closed the case out?

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#54267

On 1/2/14, 9:44 AM, licensedtoquill@gmail.com wrote:
> Thanks guys, I think you are both on to something: OS upgrades are
> indeed handled differently though they do look superficially the
> same.  There are two categories now in what looks like Software
> Update and it had a  multi-gigabyte update for iMovie and iPhoto at
> the same time.
>
> In addition, I DID have an applecare issue at the time 10.9 came out
> related to  a motherboard issue which may have prevented my being
> offered Mavericks at that stage.  Curiously Apple assigned me a
> senior adviser to take care of it after I had spent around 20-30
> hours on the phone and had three to five visits to the store and
> returns to the depot where they couldnt really figure out what was
> wrong with the unit.
>
> By the time 10.9.1 came out, it SEEMS either the rep had (gone ill
> or) dropped the ball and Apple were no longer interested in assisting
> me. So they pumped out the upgrade when they gave up trying to help
> me (won't return my calls) and closed the case out?
>

Is your computer still broken?

It seemed funny that they offered Mavericks by Software Update.  I 
wonder how many customers they expected to click "update"?  Even if you 
wanted to switch to an unknown OS without thinking it over, you'd need 
to be sure everything was backed up, the downtime could be hours, and it 
might take additional time to get everything working with the new OS.

I wonder if Software Update was used as a sort of email ad, to let 
customers know Mavericks was available.  If Apple had both your 
computers listed under the same owner, maybe that's why Mavericks was 
offered only once.

After I turned down 10.9.0, Software Update kept offering me 
Mavericks-compatible app updates.  I wonder if that was another way of 
reminding customers that Mavericks was available.

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#54223

On 14-01-01 12:41, licensedtoquill@gmail.com wrote:
> OK but my question was how I have been updating regularly for the last two months that Mavericks has been out there and it has taken two months for the mothership to notice that there is a whole OS upgrade out there


launchd has batch job timing capabilities so software update would run
at regular intervals.

In your case, it is possible that Apple's servers didn't tell your
software update about availibility of Mavericks for some reason.
Consider a theoretical case where they know of a problem with your
hardware or others software on your machine and decide not to offer
Mavericks yet.

It could also be that Apple wants to stagger updates to reduce
network/server loads.

If you manually go to the app store, does it offer you Maveriks if you
ask for it ?

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