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Lost Mail Function

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Contents

  Lost Mail Function Jerry F <jerryf@pipeline.com> - 2015-03-09 00:20 -0400
    Re: Lost Mail Function Andreas Rutishauser <andreas@macandreas.ch> - 2015-03-09 07:20 +0100
      Re: Lost Mail Function Jerry Fensterstock <jerryf@pipeline.com> - 2015-03-09 15:44 -0400
        Re: Lost Mail Function Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-09 20:09 +0000
          Re: Lost Mail Function "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> - 2015-03-10 00:17 +0000
            Re: Lost Mail Function Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-10 00:51 +0000
              Re: Lost Mail Function Jerry Fensterstock <jerryf@pipeline.com> - 2015-03-09 21:36 -0400
                Re: Lost Mail Function Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-10 03:07 +0000
                  Re: Lost Mail Function JoeyDee <email@nothanks.com> - 2015-03-10 09:23 -0400
                    Re: Lost Mail Function Jerry Fensterstock <jerryf@pipeline.com> - 2015-03-10 13:18 -0400
                      Re: Lost Mail Function Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-10 17:29 +0000
                  Re: Lost Mail Function "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> - 2015-03-11 02:05 +0000
                    Re: Lost Mail Function Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-11 14:05 +0000
                      Re: Lost Mail Function "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> - 2015-03-12 01:03 +0000
              Re: Lost Mail Function "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> - 2015-03-11 01:59 +0000
                Re: Lost Mail Function Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-11 14:04 +0000
                  Re: Lost Mail Function "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> - 2015-03-12 01:12 +0000
          Re: Lost Mail Function Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> - 2015-03-09 20:29 -0400
            Re: Lost Mail Function Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-10 03:44 +0000
              Re: Lost Mail Function Jerry Fensterstock <jerryf@pipeline.com> - 2015-03-10 08:17 -0400
                Re: Lost Mail Function Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-10 15:18 +0000
                  Re: Lost Mail Function Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> - 2015-03-10 12:12 -0400
                    Re: Lost Mail Function Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-10 16:33 +0000
                      Re: Lost Mail Function Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> - 2015-03-10 16:51 -0400
                        Re: Lost Mail Function Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-10 21:00 +0000
                          Re: Lost Mail Function Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> - 2015-03-11 12:26 -0400
                            Re: Lost Mail Function Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-11 16:52 +0000
                              Re: Lost Mail Function Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> - 2015-03-11 13:48 -0400
                                Re: Lost Mail Function Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-11 18:05 +0000
                                  Re: Lost Mail Function Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> - 2015-03-11 16:31 -0400
              Re: Lost Mail Function Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> - 2015-03-10 10:47 -0400

Page 2 of 2 — ← Prev page 1 [2]

#28104

On 2015-03-10, Jerry Fensterstock <jerryf@pipeline.com> wrote:
> On 2015-03-10 03:44:27 +0000, Jolly Roger said:
>
>> Why bother with all that nonsense when you can just type the name of the
>> group to have all of them added in one instant?
>> 
>>> This is how I do it in SL -- it sounds like Apple has gone really
>>> backwards in newer versions if you can't do this.
>> 
>> Sounds more like you are holding onto some old method and don't want to
>> learn a newer, more efficient method to me.
>
> The problem is that this is not a fixed group.  The people I will email 
> to will vary depending upon the content of the messsage.  Allowing me 
> to select names on the fly, from my Contacts directory gives me the 
> most flexibility possible.

You still have the flexibility to choose multiple people - with the
keyboard, not with the mouse:

1. Type Command-N to start a new message, and the "To" field is active.
2. Type the beginning of a name until the correct name appears. 
3. Press the Return key, which places the person into the field.
4. Go to step 2 and repeat until done.

It's fast and simple. I argue faster and simpler than your mouse-based
method:

1. From the Mail menu bar choose File > New Message.
2. Click the "Address" button at the top of the window.
3. Scroll through the list and click the person/address you want to add
to select that person in the list.
4. Repeat step 3 while holding down Command/Shift to select more people
from the list.
5. Drag (or double-click) the selected list of people/addresses.

> Apple decided that I don't need this.  I, along with a lot of othher
> folks, have sent them feedback on this.  I am not optimistic.  

Apple probably recognizes that moving a mouse cursor around the screen,
clicking names, and dragging them on the screen is slower and less
efficient than simply typing the names you want. Anyhow, it's good you
submitted feedback. Just don't hold your breath. ; )

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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#28105

In article <cm8gamFm2agU1@mid.individual.net>,
 Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:

> On 2015-03-10, Jerry Fensterstock <jerryf@pipeline.com> wrote:
> > On 2015-03-10 03:44:27 +0000, Jolly Roger said:
> >
> >> Why bother with all that nonsense when you can just type the name of the
> >> group to have all of them added in one instant?
> >> 
> >>> This is how I do it in SL -- it sounds like Apple has gone really
> >>> backwards in newer versions if you can't do this.
> >> 
> >> Sounds more like you are holding onto some old method and don't want to
> >> learn a newer, more efficient method to me.
> >
> > The problem is that this is not a fixed group.  The people I will email 
> > to will vary depending upon the content of the messsage.  Allowing me 
> > to select names on the fly, from my Contacts directory gives me the 
> > most flexibility possible.
> 
> You still have the flexibility to choose multiple people - with the
> keyboard, not with the mouse:
> 
> 1. Type Command-N to start a new message, and the "To" field is active.
> 2. Type the beginning of a name until the correct name appears. 
> 3. Press the Return key, which places the person into the field.
> 4. Go to step 2 and repeat until done.

You seem to have skipped the steps of going back and forth between the 
Mail application and Address Book to find all the names I want to send 
to.

Your method requires at least 3 or 4 keystrokes for each recipient. 
That's at least 45 keystrokes when sending to a dozen people.

> 
> It's fast and simple. I argue faster and simpler than your mouse-based
> method:
> 
> 1. From the Mail menu bar choose File > New Message.
> 2. Click the "Address" button at the top of the window.
> 3. Scroll through the list and click the person/address you want to add
> to select that person in the list.
> 4. Repeat step 3 while holding down Command/Shift to select more people
> from the list.
> 5. Drag (or double-click) the selected list of people/addresses.

About a dozen mouse clicks to send to a dozen people. What's the problem?

> 
> > Apple decided that I don't need this.  I, along with a lot of othher
> > folks, have sent them feedback on this.  I am not optimistic.  
> 
> Apple probably recognizes that moving a mouse cursor around the screen,
> clicking names, and dragging them on the screen is slower and less
> efficient than simply typing the names you want. Anyhow, it's good you
> submitted feedback. Just don't hold your breath. ; )

-- 
Barry Margolin, barmar@alum.mit.edu
Arlington, MA
*** PLEASE post questions in newsgroups, not directly to me ***

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#28106

On 2015-03-10, Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
> In article <cm8gamFm2agU1@mid.individual.net>,
>  Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2015-03-10, Jerry Fensterstock <jerryf@pipeline.com> wrote:
>> > On 2015-03-10 03:44:27 +0000, Jolly Roger said:
>> >
>> >> Why bother with all that nonsense when you can just type the name of the
>> >> group to have all of them added in one instant?
>> >> 
>> >>> This is how I do it in SL -- it sounds like Apple has gone really
>> >>> backwards in newer versions if you can't do this.
>> >> 
>> >> Sounds more like you are holding onto some old method and don't want to
>> >> learn a newer, more efficient method to me.
>> >
>> > The problem is that this is not a fixed group.  The people I will email 
>> > to will vary depending upon the content of the messsage.  Allowing me 
>> > to select names on the fly, from my Contacts directory gives me the 
>> > most flexibility possible.
>> 
>> You still have the flexibility to choose multiple people - with the
>> keyboard, not with the mouse:
>> 
>> 1. Type Command-N to start a new message, and the "To" field is active.
>> 2. Type the beginning of a name until the correct name appears. 
>> 3. Press the Return key, which places the person into the field.
>> 4. Go to step 2 and repeat until done.
>
> You seem to have skipped the steps of going back and forth between the 
> Mail application and Address Book to find all the names I want to send 
> to.

Nope. Usually, the list of people I want to message is already in my
head. So I just type the first couple letters for each name I want,
pressing Return between each one, and I'm done. There's no need to
switch to any other application. And if the list of people I want to
message isn't in my head, they are in a group, and I can just type the
name of that group instead. Done deal. If I want to omit one or two
people from the group, I can then delete one or two from the To field.
Simple.

If the list of people you want to message isn't already in your head,
and you don't have a group set up, then you are working in a very
inefficient manner to begin with and probably should address that
problem for your own sake.

> Your method requires at least 3 or 4 keystrokes for each recipient. 
> That's at least 45 keystrokes when sending to a dozen people.

What you are conveniently ignoring is that with my method there is no
context switch between using the keyboard and using the mouse, and no
scrolling, and no hunting involved as there is with your method. It's
been shown time and again that removal of such context switches results
in more efficiency and saved time. Sit someone down and time them using
each method and the results are clear. My method is way faster and more
efficient.

>> It's fast and simple. I argue faster and simpler than your mouse-based
>> method:
>> 
>> 1. From the Mail menu bar choose File > New Message.
>> 2. Click the "Address" button at the top of the window.
>> 3. Scroll through the list and click the person/address you want to add
>> to select that person in the list.
>> 4. Repeat step 3 while holding down Command/Shift to select more people
>> from the list.
>> 5. Drag (or double-click) the selected list of people/addresses.
>
> About a dozen mouse clicks to send to a dozen people. What's the problem?

No problem - just way less efficient and slower. By all means, lobby
Apple to give you features that allow you to use your inefficient,
slower method, if you insist. Just don't act like you are completely
unable to do what you want when a better alternative exists.

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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#28113

In article <cm8kmdFnchkU1@mid.individual.net>,
 Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:

> On 2015-03-10, Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
> > In article <cm8gamFm2agU1@mid.individual.net>,
> >  Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
> >
> >> On 2015-03-10, Jerry Fensterstock <jerryf@pipeline.com> wrote:
> >> > On 2015-03-10 03:44:27 +0000, Jolly Roger said:
> >> >
> >> >> Why bother with all that nonsense when you can just type the name of the
> >> >> group to have all of them added in one instant?
> >> >> 
> >> >>> This is how I do it in SL -- it sounds like Apple has gone really
> >> >>> backwards in newer versions if you can't do this.
> >> >> 
> >> >> Sounds more like you are holding onto some old method and don't want to
> >> >> learn a newer, more efficient method to me.
> >> >
> >> > The problem is that this is not a fixed group.  The people I will email 
> >> > to will vary depending upon the content of the messsage.  Allowing me 
> >> > to select names on the fly, from my Contacts directory gives me the 
> >> > most flexibility possible.
> >> 
> >> You still have the flexibility to choose multiple people - with the
> >> keyboard, not with the mouse:
> >> 
> >> 1. Type Command-N to start a new message, and the "To" field is active.
> >> 2. Type the beginning of a name until the correct name appears. 
> >> 3. Press the Return key, which places the person into the field.
> >> 4. Go to step 2 and repeat until done.
> >
> > You seem to have skipped the steps of going back and forth between the 
> > Mail application and Address Book to find all the names I want to send 
> > to.
> 
> Nope. Usually, the list of people I want to message is already in my
> head. So I just type the first couple letters for each name I want,
> pressing Return between each one, and I'm done. There's no need to
> switch to any other application. And if the list of people I want to
> message isn't in my head, they are in a group, and I can just type the
> name of that group instead. Done deal. If I want to omit one or two
> people from the group, I can then delete one or two from the To field.
> Simple.
> 
> If the list of people you want to message isn't already in your head,
> and you don't have a group set up, then you are working in a very
> inefficient manner to begin with and probably should address that
> problem for your own sake.

I have a group of 80 people (all the local bridge players I know), I 
want to select 15-20 of them (the ones I want to ask to play in a 
particular event).

-- 
Barry Margolin, barmar@alum.mit.edu
Arlington, MA
*** PLEASE post questions in newsgroups, not directly to me ***

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#28114

On 2015-03-10, Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
>
> I have a group of 80 people (all the local bridge players I know), I 
> want to select 15-20 of them (the ones I want to ask to play in a 
> particular event).

And another sub-group is out of the question why?

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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#28146

In article <cm94c2FrpmsU1@mid.individual.net>,
 Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:

> On 2015-03-10, Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
> >
> > I have a group of 80 people (all the local bridge players I know), I 
> > want to select 15-20 of them (the ones I want to ask to play in a 
> > particular event).
> 
> And another sub-group is out of the question why?

Because it's not the same sub-group each time I want to do this.

So basically I would have to create a new group at that time, which is 
essentially the same process as selecting people for that email. 
Actually, worse, because the only way to put people in groups in Address 
Book is by dragging, not simple clicking. Half the time when I do this, 
if I don't get the motion just right it thinks I'm swiping over a bunch 
of contacts, and then tries to drag them all.

-- 
Barry Margolin, barmar@alum.mit.edu
Arlington, MA
*** PLEASE post questions in newsgroups, not directly to me ***

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#28148

On 2015-03-11, Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
> In article <cm94c2FrpmsU1@mid.individual.net>,
>  Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2015-03-10, Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
>> >
>> > I have a group of 80 people (all the local bridge players I know), I 
>> > want to select 15-20 of them (the ones I want to ask to play in a 
>> > particular event).
>> 
>> And another sub-group is out of the question why?
>
> Because it's not the same sub-group each time I want to do this.
>
> So basically I would have to create a new group at that time, which is 
> essentially the same process as selecting people for that email. 

The way to do it is to type the first few letters of each person's name,
then Return to accept each one in turn. It's fast and easy. It's not
that you cannot do what you want - it's just you cannot do it with the
mouse anymore since Apple removed that function.

> Actually, worse, because the only way to put people in groups in Address 
> Book is by dragging, not simple clicking. Half the time when I do this, 
> if I don't get the motion just right it thinks I'm swiping over a bunch 
> of contacts, and then tries to drag them all.

That's incorrect. You can select multiple people and choose File > New
Group From Selection with no dragging involved.

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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#28155

In article <cmba6kFe53qU2@mid.individual.net>,
 Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:

> On 2015-03-11, Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
> > In article <cm94c2FrpmsU1@mid.individual.net>,
> >  Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
> >
> >> On 2015-03-10, Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
> >> >
> >> > I have a group of 80 people (all the local bridge players I know), I 
> >> > want to select 15-20 of them (the ones I want to ask to play in a 
> >> > particular event).
> >> 
> >> And another sub-group is out of the question why?
> >
> > Because it's not the same sub-group each time I want to do this.
> >
> > So basically I would have to create a new group at that time, which is 
> > essentially the same process as selecting people for that email. 
> 
> The way to do it is to type the first few letters of each person's name,
> then Return to accept each one in turn. It's fast and easy. It's not
> that you cannot do what you want - it's just you cannot do it with the
> mouse anymore since Apple removed that function.

And now we get back to the fact that I have to remember all the names I 
want to type.

There's almost nothing easier than picking things out of a list with the 
mouse. Why make things more complicated?

> 
> > Actually, worse, because the only way to put people in groups in Address 
> > Book is by dragging, not simple clicking. Half the time when I do this, 
> > if I don't get the motion just right it thinks I'm swiping over a bunch 
> > of contacts, and then tries to drag them all.
> 
> That's incorrect. You can select multiple people and choose File > New
> Group From Selection with no dragging involved.

Hmm, never noticed that one before. Although creating a group just for 
one-time use seems silly. Also, this means I have to go into another 
application -- I used to be able to do the selection directly from 
within Mail.

-- 
Barry Margolin, barmar@alum.mit.edu
Arlington, MA
*** PLEASE post questions in newsgroups, not directly to me ***

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#28157

On 2015-03-11, Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
> In article <cmba6kFe53qU2@mid.individual.net>,
>  Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2015-03-11, Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
>> > In article <cm94c2FrpmsU1@mid.individual.net>,
>> >  Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> On 2015-03-10, Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> > I have a group of 80 people (all the local bridge players I know), I 
>> >> > want to select 15-20 of them (the ones I want to ask to play in a 
>> >> > particular event).
>> >> 
>> >> And another sub-group is out of the question why?
>> >
>> > Because it's not the same sub-group each time I want to do this.
>> >
>> > So basically I would have to create a new group at that time, which is 
>> > essentially the same process as selecting people for that email. 
>> 
>> The way to do it is to type the first few letters of each person's name,
>> then Return to accept each one in turn. It's fast and easy. It's not
>> that you cannot do what you want - it's just you cannot do it with the
>> mouse anymore since Apple removed that function.
>
> And now we get back to the fact that I have to remember all the names I 
> want to type.

Not if you type the group name and then remove names you don't want. 

> There's almost nothing easier than picking things out of a list with the 
> mouse. Why make things more complicated?

Typing a group name and then removing items from a list doesn't seem any
more complicated than opening the contacts list and scrolling through a
bunch of contacts, selecting the ones I want, and then double-clicking
or dragging them into Mail. We can agree to disagree though.

>> > Actually, worse, because the only way to put people in groups in Address 
>> > Book is by dragging, not simple clicking. Half the time when I do this, 
>> > if I don't get the motion just right it thinks I'm swiping over a bunch 
>> > of contacts, and then tries to drag them all.
>> 
>> That's incorrect. You can select multiple people and choose File > New
>> Group From Selection with no dragging involved.
>
> Hmm, never noticed that one before. Although creating a group just for 
> one-time use seems silly. Also, this means I have to go into another 
> application -- I used to be able to do the selection directly from 
> within Mail.

You can do the selection from within Mail - just not with the mouse.

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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#28164

In article <cmbefkFe53qU8@mid.individual.net>,
 Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:

> On 2015-03-11, Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
> > In article <cmba6kFe53qU2@mid.individual.net>,
> >  Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
> >
> >> On 2015-03-11, Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
> >> > In article <cm94c2FrpmsU1@mid.individual.net>,
> >> >  Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> On 2015-03-10, Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I have a group of 80 people (all the local bridge players I know), I 
> >> >> > want to select 15-20 of them (the ones I want to ask to play in a 
> >> >> > particular event).
> >> >> 
> >> >> And another sub-group is out of the question why?
> >> >
> >> > Because it's not the same sub-group each time I want to do this.
> >> >
> >> > So basically I would have to create a new group at that time, which is 
> >> > essentially the same process as selecting people for that email. 
> >> 
> >> The way to do it is to type the first few letters of each person's name,
> >> then Return to accept each one in turn. It's fast and easy. It's not
> >> that you cannot do what you want - it's just you cannot do it with the
> >> mouse anymore since Apple removed that function.
> >
> > And now we get back to the fact that I have to remember all the names I 
> > want to type.
> 
> Not if you type the group name and then remove names you don't want. 
> 
> > There's almost nothing easier than picking things out of a list with the 
> > mouse. Why make things more complicated?
> 
> Typing a group name and then removing items from a list doesn't seem any
> more complicated than opening the contacts list and scrolling through a
> bunch of contacts, selecting the ones I want, and then double-clicking
> or dragging them into Mail. We can agree to disagree though.

Deleting 60 out of 80 is more work than selecting 20 out of 80.

> 
> >> > Actually, worse, because the only way to put people in groups in Address 
> >> > Book is by dragging, not simple clicking. Half the time when I do this, 
> >> > if I don't get the motion just right it thinks I'm swiping over a bunch 
> >> > of contacts, and then tries to drag them all.
> >> 
> >> That's incorrect. You can select multiple people and choose File > New
> >> Group From Selection with no dragging involved.
> >
> > Hmm, never noticed that one before. Although creating a group just for 
> > one-time use seems silly. Also, this means I have to go into another 
> > application -- I used to be able to do the selection directly from 
> > within Mail.
> 
> You can do the selection from within Mail - just not with the mouse.

How do you do it from within Mail? And if I've already gone through the 
process of adding the big group and then deleting everyone I don't want, 
why would I need to create the group any more? The group was only going 
to be needed for that one message anyway.

-- 
Barry Margolin, barmar@alum.mit.edu
Arlington, MA
*** PLEASE post questions in newsgroups, not directly to me ***

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#28102

In article <cm77krFca0lU1@mid.individual.net>,
 Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:

> On 2015-03-10, Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
> > In article <cm6cvdF5s3dU1@mid.individual.net>,
> >  Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Honestly, they both seem counter-productive to me. The way I normally do
> >> it is:
> >> 
> >> 1. Type Command-N to start a new message, and the "To" field is active.
> >> 2. Type the beginning of a name. 
> >> 3. As soon as the correct name appears, press the Return key, which
> >> places it into the field, and the field is ready to accept another name.
> >> 3. Go to step 2 and repeat until done.
> >> 
> >> I consider this to be quicker and simpler than selecting names with a
> >> mouse cursor and dragging them into the field.
> >
> > I often want to select many names from a group. I don't remember all the 
> > names, so I open up the contact list, select the group, and then scan 
> > down the group members selecting the ones I want. And I don't have to 
> > drag anything, just double-click to add them to "To", or click once and 
> > then click on the field name in the contacts window. You can also 
> > shift-click on each name, and then click on the field name at the end to 
> > add them all at once.
> 
> Why bother with all that nonsense when you can just type the name of the
> group to have all of them added in one instant?

That only works if I want to send to EVERYONE in the group. This is not 
usually the case.

-- 
Barry Margolin, barmar@alum.mit.edu
Arlington, MA
*** PLEASE post questions in newsgroups, not directly to me ***

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