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Groups > comp.os.linux.misc > #94962 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Farley Flud <ff@gnulinux.rocks> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2026-11-02 23:08 +0000 |
| Last post | 2026-11-06 23:00 -0500 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 93 — 26 participants |
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Is This An Old Folks Home? Farley Flud <ff@gnulinux.rocks> - 2026-11-02 23:08 +0000
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 02:51 +0100
On the on-topicness of tape drives (was: Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-04 23:47 +0000
Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2026-11-05 04:14 +0000
Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-05 17:29 -0500
Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2026-11-05 22:52 +0000
Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-05 19:11 -0500
Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2026-11-06 02:41 +0000
Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-05 22:31 -0500
Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-06 20:51 +0000
Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-07 02:41 +0000
Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-11-07 06:39 -0800
Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-07 18:30 +0000
Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-11-07 15:26 -0800
Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-08 01:15 +0000
Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-08 11:28 +0000
Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-08 18:14 +0000
Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives Beej Jorgensen <beej@beej.us> - 2026-11-06 05:59 +0000
Re: Tape Drives Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-06 06:18 +0000
Re: Tape Drives Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-07 18:40 +0800
Re: Tape Drives Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-07 07:33 -0700
Re: Tape Drives c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-07 13:12 -0500
Re: Tape Drives "Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2026-11-08 14:32 +0000
Re: Tape Drives c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-08 21:31 -0500
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-02 21:08 -0500
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-03 02:26 +0000
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? Woozy Song <suzyw0ng@outlook.com> - 2026-11-04 09:55 +0800
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-03 22:14 -0500
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2026-11-04 03:54 +0000
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-04 06:21 +0000
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? TJ <TJ@noneofyour.business> - 2026-11-05 20:40 -0500
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-05 21:52 -0500
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-06 14:28 +0100
My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-11-06 18:37 -0800
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-07 00:51 -0500
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-11-07 06:20 -0800
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-07 07:38 -0700
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-08 02:47 +0000
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-11-08 04:23 +0000
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-08 05:00 +0000
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-08 20:50 -0500
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-09 03:53 +0000
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-10 15:06 +0100
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-10 15:01 +0100
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-07 07:31 -0700
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-11-07 06:52 -0800
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-07 20:09 -0500
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-11-08 08:08 +0000
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-08 21:24 -0500
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-11-08 18:34 -0800
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-08 22:54 -0500
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-09 04:39 +0000
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-09 21:08 -0500
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-10 02:25 +0000
Re: My Computer History Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-10 02:32 +0000
Re: My Computer History c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-09 23:07 -0500
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-09 22:49 -0500
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-11-10 06:03 -0800
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-10 15:08 +0000
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-09 07:29 -0700
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-09 16:11 +0000
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-09 21:19 -0500
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) Bob Eager <throwaway0008@eager.cx> - 2026-11-10 14:31 +0000
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2026-11-09 07:48 -1000
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-09 21:55 -0500
Re: My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-09 21:35 -0700
Re: spooling, My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-09 16:56 +0000
Re: spooling, My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-09 21:46 -0500
Re: spooling, My Computer History (Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-11-10 18:06 +0000
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? Beej Jorgensen <beej@beej.us> - 2026-11-04 19:15 +0000
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? Farley Flud <ff@gnulinux.rocks> - 2026-11-04 20:38 +0000
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-04 23:51 +0000
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? "s|b" <me@privacy.invalid> - 2026-11-05 17:48 +0100
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-11-05 16:56 +0000
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-05 20:55 +0000
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? "Joel W. Crump" <joelcrump@gmail.com> - 2026-11-06 12:23 -0500
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? Farley Flud <ff@gnulinux.rocks> - 2026-11-06 19:25 +0000
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? "Joel W. Crump" <joelcrump@gmail.com> - 2026-11-06 15:59 -0500
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-07 02:50 +0000
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-07 09:03 +0000
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-07 18:01 +0000
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-07 21:55 +0000
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-08 01:01 +0000
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? L Thorpe <lt666@sixsixsix.net> - 2026-11-07 18:31 +0000
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? "Joel W. Crump" <joelcrump@gmail.com> - 2026-11-07 13:39 -0500
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? L Thorpe <lt666@sixsixsix.net> - 2026-11-07 19:07 +0000
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? "Joel W. Crump" <joelcrump@gmail.com> - 2026-11-07 14:30 -0500
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? "Joel W. Crump" <joelcrump@gmail.com> - 2026-11-07 13:01 -0500
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-07 15:54 -0500
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? "Joel W. Crump" <joelcrump@gmail.com> - 2026-11-08 00:33 -0500
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-08 21:05 -0500
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? "Joel W. Crump" <joelcrump@gmail.com> - 2026-11-10 05:30 -0500
Re: Is This An Old Folks Home? c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-06 23:00 -0500
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| From | Farley Flud <ff@gnulinux.rocks> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-02 23:08 +0000 |
| Subject | Is This An Old Folks Home? |
| Message-ID | <18e45d18dce2f904$1893$2999836$802601b3@news.usenetexpress.com> |
Is this group an actual GNU/Linux discussion forum or a sordid home for decrepit old folks and faltering has-beens? I don't want no useless info on pre-historic tape readers. I, and many others, want cutting edge philosophy on GNU/Linux/FOSS. Otherwise, go bury yourselves, grandpas. Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha! -- Gentoo/LFS: Is there any-fucking-thing else?
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| From | "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-03 02:51 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <nkst1dF3cbcU8@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #94962 |
On 2026-11-03 00:08, Farley Flud wrote:
> Is this group an actual GNU/Linux discussion forum or a sordid
> home for decrepit old folks and faltering has-beens?
>
> I don't want no useless info on pre-historic tape readers.
>
> I, and many others, want cutting edge philosophy on GNU/Linux/FOSS.
>
> Otherwise, go bury yourselves, grandpas.
>
> Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha!
Then why are you here, granny? :-p
--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.
ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺.
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| From | Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-04 23:47 +0000 |
| Subject | On the on-topicness of tape drives (was: Re: Is This An Old Folks Home?) |
| Message-ID | <11cgg6t$14knq$2@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #94970 |
On 2026-11-03, Carlos E. R. wrote: > On 2026-11-03 00:08, Farley Flud wrote: >> Is this group an actual GNU/Linux discussion forum or a sordid >> home for decrepit old folks and faltering has-beens? >> >> I don't want no useless info on pre-historic tape readers. >> >> I, and many others, want cutting edge philosophy on GNU/Linux/FOSS. >> >> Otherwise, go bury yourselves, grandpas. >> >> Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha! > > Then why are you here, granny? :-p That's actually a load of nonsense in that a very good use of this group would be someone looking for advice on using a tape drive on GNU/Linux. I'd argue that, if tape drives are out because that's not the topic, then so is FOSS in general, unless it's something that's part of a GNU/Linux distribution... While I've never used a tape drive myself, I do use the Tape ARchiver a lot, although sometimes I use the BSD one and not the GNU one, as the latter can't do ZIP, RAR, ISO9660, &c. :-) -- Nuno Silva
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| From | Rich <rich@example.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-05 04:14 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives |
| Message-ID | <11cgvrp$19a03$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #95143 |
Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> wrote: > On 2026-11-03, Carlos E. R. wrote: > >> On 2026-11-03 00:08, Farley Flud wrote: >>> Is this group an actual GNU/Linux discussion forum or a sordid >>> home for decrepit old folks and faltering has-beens? >>> >>> I don't want no useless info on pre-historic tape readers. >>> >>> I, and many others, want cutting edge philosophy on GNU/Linux/FOSS. >>> >>> Otherwise, go bury yourselves, grandpas. >>> >>> Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha! >> >> Then why are you here, granny? :-p > > That's actually a load of nonsense in that a very good use of this > group would be someone looking for advice on using a tape drive on > GNU/Linux. Do keep in mind that Farley is a known troll. It is best to just ignore the troll's posts.
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| From | c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-05 17:29 -0500 |
| Subject | Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives |
| Message-ID | <ipucna2KmLW-nnD3nZ2dnZfqn_WdnZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #95152 |
On 11/4/26 23:14, Rich wrote: > Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> wrote: >> On 2026-11-03, Carlos E. R. wrote: >> >>> On 2026-11-03 00:08, Farley Flud wrote: >>>> Is this group an actual GNU/Linux discussion forum or a sordid >>>> home for decrepit old folks and faltering has-beens? >>>> >>>> I don't want no useless info on pre-historic tape readers. >>>> >>>> I, and many others, want cutting edge philosophy on GNU/Linux/FOSS. >>>> >>>> Otherwise, go bury yourselves, grandpas. >>>> >>>> Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha! >>> >>> Then why are you here, granny? :-p >> >> That's actually a load of nonsense in that a very good use of this >> group would be someone looking for advice on using a tape drive on >> GNU/Linux. > > Do keep in mind that Farley is a known troll. > > It is best to just ignore the troll's posts. Also, tape drives are STILL in use, to around 30tb for the more expensive units. Not 'ideal' for big storage any more, but still valuable. Check Amazon, a number to choose from. Now the big reel-2-reel jobbies from all the old sci-fi movies .... no ... gone.
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| From | Rich <rich@example.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-05 22:52 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives |
| Message-ID | <11cj1ag$22805$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #95198 |
c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> wrote: > On 11/4/26 23:14, Rich wrote: >> Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> wrote: >>> On 2026-11-03, Carlos E. R. wrote: >>> >>>> On 2026-11-03 00:08, Farley Flud wrote: >>>>> Is this group an actual GNU/Linux discussion forum or a sordid >>>>> home for decrepit old folks and faltering has-beens? >>>>> >>>>> I don't want no useless info on pre-historic tape readers. >>>>> >>>>> I, and many others, want cutting edge philosophy on GNU/Linux/FOSS. >>>>> >>>>> Otherwise, go bury yourselves, grandpas. >>>>> >>>>> Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha! >>>> >>>> Then why are you here, granny? :-p >>> >>> That's actually a load of nonsense in that a very good use of this >>> group would be someone looking for advice on using a tape drive on >>> GNU/Linux. >> >> Do keep in mind that Farley is a known troll. >> >> It is best to just ignore the troll's posts. > > Also, tape drives are STILL in use, to around 30tb for the more > expensive units. Not 'ideal' for big storage any more, but still > valuable. Check Amazon, a number to choose from. Yup, LTO tapes are in wide use for backing up all those Tb's stored on all those clouds. The prices, for the latest models, are at "enterprise only need apply" levels, but tape is very much alive and well. > Now the big reel-2-reel jobbies from all the old sci-fi movies .... > no ... gone. Yep, except for museums and the occasional sci-fi movie that want's to look 'retro'.
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| From | c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-05 19:11 -0500 |
| Subject | Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives |
| Message-ID | <OUadnZiWV4m8hnD3nZ2dnZfqnPednZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #95201 |
On 11/5/26 17:52, Rich wrote: > c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> wrote: >> On 11/4/26 23:14, Rich wrote: >>> Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> wrote: >>>> On 2026-11-03, Carlos E. R. wrote: >>>> >>>>> On 2026-11-03 00:08, Farley Flud wrote: >>>>>> Is this group an actual GNU/Linux discussion forum or a sordid >>>>>> home for decrepit old folks and faltering has-beens? >>>>>> >>>>>> I don't want no useless info on pre-historic tape readers. >>>>>> >>>>>> I, and many others, want cutting edge philosophy on GNU/Linux/FOSS. >>>>>> >>>>>> Otherwise, go bury yourselves, grandpas. >>>>>> >>>>>> Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha! >>>>> >>>>> Then why are you here, granny? :-p >>>> >>>> That's actually a load of nonsense in that a very good use of this >>>> group would be someone looking for advice on using a tape drive on >>>> GNU/Linux. >>> >>> Do keep in mind that Farley is a known troll. >>> >>> It is best to just ignore the troll's posts. >> >> Also, tape drives are STILL in use, to around 30tb for the more >> expensive units. Not 'ideal' for big storage any more, but still >> valuable. Check Amazon, a number to choose from. > > Yup, LTO tapes are in wide use for backing up all those Tb's stored on > all those clouds. The prices, for the latest models, are at > "enterprise only need apply" levels, but tape is very much alive and > well. > >> Now the big reel-2-reel jobbies from all the old sci-fi movies .... >> no ... gone. > > Yep, except for museums and the occasional sci-fi movie that want's to > look 'retro'. Hmm ... one of those "Captain America" movies of late. The evil genius had his brain digitized and stored on a warehouse full of those tape units. Tape is slow - often VERY VERY slow - but it can still deliver an acceptable storage-per-dollar figure in some applications. I wonder how many corps still have a "The backup tapes SHALL be stored in the fireproof safe each evening" in the Official Rules book ? :-) Most of the kiddies don't even know what those big tape reels were DOING rolling back and forth and how SLOW computing was back in the day. "Batch jobs" ? "Code overlays" ? "Temporary intermediate storage" ? But they DID look Cool ! Today, a USB dual-drive unit with a couple of 16tb magnetics inside - faster and cheaper and still small enough to put in the safe. But tape isn't dead, not YET anyway. Yea yea, we all hoped for petabyte holographic crystal mass storage about the size of a thumb drive by now, very Trek. Sorry ....
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| From | Rich <rich@example.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-06 02:41 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives |
| Message-ID | <11cjepn$25vtg$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #95209 |
c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> wrote: > On 11/5/26 17:52, Rich wrote: >> c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> wrote: >>> On 11/4/26 23:14, Rich wrote: >>>> Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> wrote: >>>>> On 2026-11-03, Carlos E. R. wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> On 2026-11-03 00:08, Farley Flud wrote: >>>>>>> Is this group an actual GNU/Linux discussion forum or a sordid >>>>>>> home for decrepit old folks and faltering has-beens? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I don't want no useless info on pre-historic tape readers. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I, and many others, want cutting edge philosophy on GNU/Linux/FOSS. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Otherwise, go bury yourselves, grandpas. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha! >>>>>> >>>>>> Then why are you here, granny? :-p >>>>> >>>>> That's actually a load of nonsense in that a very good use of this >>>>> group would be someone looking for advice on using a tape drive on >>>>> GNU/Linux. >>>> >>>> Do keep in mind that Farley is a known troll. >>>> >>>> It is best to just ignore the troll's posts. >>> >>> Also, tape drives are STILL in use, to around 30tb for the more >>> expensive units. Not 'ideal' for big storage any more, but still >>> valuable. Check Amazon, a number to choose from. >> >> Yup, LTO tapes are in wide use for backing up all those Tb's stored on >> all those clouds. The prices, for the latest models, are at >> "enterprise only need apply" levels, but tape is very much alive and >> well. >> >>> Now the big reel-2-reel jobbies from all the old sci-fi movies .... >>> no ... gone. >> >> Yep, except for museums and the occasional sci-fi movie that want's to >> look 'retro'. > > Hmm ... one of those "Captain America" movies of late. The evil > genius had his brain digitized and stored on a warehouse full of > those tape units. > > Tape is slow - often VERY VERY slow - but it can still deliver an > acceptable storage-per-dollar figure in some applications. Yes, although that comes with a very big "it depends" star next to it. For random access, yes, very very slow. For sequential access, modern LTO-10 drives claim a native 400MB/s write speed (https://spectralogic.com/wp-content/uploads/LTO-10-Tape-Drive-Datasheet-Spectra-Logic.pdf) 400MB/s rivals a good many of the non-super performance SSD's, and out ranks many mechanical disks as well. Just don't try to randomly read the data back out later.... > I wonder how many corps still have a "The backup > tapes SHALL be stored in the fireproof safe each > evening" in the Official Rules book ? :-) Since those sorts of rules books are very often never scrutinized for "what can we remove", likely nearly all of them that used to have that clause in their rule book. > Today, a USB dual-drive unit with a couple > of 16tb magnetics inside - faster and cheaper > and still small enough to put in the safe. > > But tape isn't dead, not YET anyway. The big advantage tape gives enterprise customers is 40TB of native capacity per LTO-10 tape, and long term storage claims. So their rule book can also include: "every fourth backup set is shipped off to Iron Mountan" as their 'offsite' storage aspect, with some reasonable expectation they can read the tape in 5 or 10 years (presuming they have a compatible drive with which to do so). And that 40TB of tape costs way less than two 20TB hard drives to store the same 40TB.
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| From | c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-05 22:31 -0500 |
| Subject | Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives |
| Message-ID | <5Pycne6ZkLGe13D3nZ2dnZfqnPednZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #95218 |
On 11/5/26 21:41, Rich wrote: > c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> wrote: >> On 11/5/26 17:52, Rich wrote: >>> c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> wrote: >>>> On 11/4/26 23:14, Rich wrote: >>>>> Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> wrote: >>>>>> On 2026-11-03, Carlos E. R. wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> On 2026-11-03 00:08, Farley Flud wrote: >>>>>>>> Is this group an actual GNU/Linux discussion forum or a sordid >>>>>>>> home for decrepit old folks and faltering has-beens? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I don't want no useless info on pre-historic tape readers. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I, and many others, want cutting edge philosophy on GNU/Linux/FOSS. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Otherwise, go bury yourselves, grandpas. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Then why are you here, granny? :-p >>>>>> >>>>>> That's actually a load of nonsense in that a very good use of this >>>>>> group would be someone looking for advice on using a tape drive on >>>>>> GNU/Linux. >>>>> >>>>> Do keep in mind that Farley is a known troll. >>>>> >>>>> It is best to just ignore the troll's posts. >>>> >>>> Also, tape drives are STILL in use, to around 30tb for the more >>>> expensive units. Not 'ideal' for big storage any more, but still >>>> valuable. Check Amazon, a number to choose from. >>> >>> Yup, LTO tapes are in wide use for backing up all those Tb's stored on >>> all those clouds. The prices, for the latest models, are at >>> "enterprise only need apply" levels, but tape is very much alive and >>> well. >>> >>>> Now the big reel-2-reel jobbies from all the old sci-fi movies .... >>>> no ... gone. >>> >>> Yep, except for museums and the occasional sci-fi movie that want's to >>> look 'retro'. >> >> Hmm ... one of those "Captain America" movies of late. The evil >> genius had his brain digitized and stored on a warehouse full of >> those tape units. >> >> Tape is slow - often VERY VERY slow - but it can still deliver an >> acceptable storage-per-dollar figure in some applications. > > Yes, although that comes with a very big "it depends" star next to it. > For random access, yes, very very slow. Kinda forget "RA" ... But, back in the day, the CPUs were so slow and multi-user so clunky ... even 'temporary' storage of intermediate results to tapes was acceptable. > For sequential access, modern LTO-10 drives claim a native 400MB/s > write speed > (https://spectralogic.com/wp-content/uploads/LTO-10-Tape-Drive-Datasheet-Spectra-Logic.pdf) > 400MB/s rivals a good many of the non-super performance SSD's, and out > ranks many mechanical disks as well. Just don't try to randomly read > the data back out later.... Today, a two-drive USB disk unit can seriously out-perform tapes - and it's still pretty compact. >> I wonder how many corps still have a "The backup >> tapes SHALL be stored in the fireproof safe each >> evening" in the Official Rules book ? :-) > > Since those sorts of rules books are very often never scrutinized for > "what can we remove", likely nearly all of them that used to have that > clause in their rule book. It'd be fun to have a survey of Big Corp IT rule books, just to SEE how many still have that rule "-) >> Today, a USB dual-drive unit with a couple >> of 16tb magnetics inside - faster and cheaper >> and still small enough to put in the safe. >> >> But tape isn't dead, not YET anyway. > > The big advantage tape gives enterprise customers is 40TB of native > capacity per LTO-10 tape, and long term storage claims. So their rule > book can also include: "every fourth backup set is shipped off to Iron > Mountan" as their 'offsite' storage aspect, with some reasonable > expectation they can read the tape in 5 or 10 years (presuming they > have a compatible drive with which to do so). As said, tapes DO have some advantages. Good capacity for cheap and the modern tapes WILL last a long time. Alas nothing 'optical', even Blu-Rays, remotely match the capacity. HAVE a Blu-Ray unit. Mostly my (home) backups go to a little NAS - four-drive USB unit - using NFS. However about every six months I burn my most important shit to a BR. Even though "home", still have to pick and choose carefully just so it'll fit on a disk. Make a big ZIP or TAR, burn it. Biz uses, even BR-DL is not enough. Disappointing. > And that 40TB of tape costs way less than two 20TB hard drives to store > the same 40TB. True. Tape is CHEAP. Also SLOW SLOW SLOW. A multi-drive USB unit with some big mag drives WOULD cover it ... and still small enough for the fireproof safe. "Cloud" can be OK too ... but, if smart, DO always keep a LOCAL backup (or two or three). Vlad or Xi or Kim are gonna disappear all that 'cloud' shit Real Soon Now. The cyber-war is ON. The commiesocialistDems LOVE Xi and Kim, won't do a single thing to thwart them. Then there will be much crying and screaming and gnashing of teeth and infidels burnt at the stake and desolation and ........... What WOULD happen to global biz if all the cloud apps/storage (and backup storage) was corrupted at a stroke ? SO many totally rely on M$ cloud shit for ALL biz needs. But if it Goes Away ... even for a week or for months (or forever) ........ No, they WON'T be 'ready for it' - that much is obvious. 'Cloud' has become a religion - faith. Anyway, if you want tape, Linux still understands tape.
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| From | Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-06 20:51 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives |
| Message-ID | <G5rHS.177$ML4.125@fx14.iad> |
| In reply to | #95223 |
On 2026-11-06, c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> wrote:
> On 11/5/26 21:41, Rich wrote:
>
>> c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Tape is slow - often VERY VERY slow - but it can still deliver an
>>> acceptable storage-per-dollar figure in some applications.
>>
>> Yes, although that comes with a very big "it depends" star next to it.
>> For random access, yes, very very slow.
>
> Kinda forget "RA" ...
>
> But, back in the day, the CPUs were so slow and
> multi-user so clunky ... even 'temporary' storage
> of intermediate results to tapes was acceptable.
Don't underestimate sequential processing. Sophisticated
techniques were developed that didn't need random access.
You make the most of what you have.
Many tape drives could read tape backwards, which was
exploited by, e.g., sort programs. This could save the
minute or two it would take to rewind the tape before
starting the next pass.
>> And that 40TB of tape costs way less than two 20TB hard drives to store
>> the same 40TB.
>
> "Cloud" can be OK too ... but, if smart, DO
> always keep a LOCAL backup (or two or three).
> Vlad or Xi or Kim are gonna disappear all that
> 'cloud' shit Real Soon Now. The cyber-war
> is ON. The commiesocialistDems LOVE Xi and Kim,
> won't do a single thing to thwart them.
Your #1 right-winger seems to like Kim a lot too.
But we don't need him - a friend lost a lot of
precious photos due to a screw-up at his cloud
provider that had nothing to do with Vlad or Xi
or whoever.
> Then there will be much crying and screaming
> and gnashing of teeth and infidels burnt at
> the stake and desolation and ...........
As long as we can find a scapegoat...
> What WOULD happen to global biz if all the
> cloud apps/storage (and backup storage) was
> corrupted at a stroke ? SO many totally
> rely on M$ cloud shit for ALL biz needs.
> But if it Goes Away ... even for a week or
> for months (or forever) ........
Maybe Lord Bill will decide to pull the plug.
Temporarily, anyway. There are lots of ransom
opportunities.
> No, they WON'T be 'ready for it' - that much is
> obvious. 'Cloud' has become a religion - faith.
I should get one of those T-shirts that says,
There is no Cloud.
It's just someone else's computer.
--
/~\ Charlie Gibbs | Too many people have become
\ / <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> | dependent on the Internet.
X I'm really at ac.dekanfrus | It Clouds their thinking.
/ \ if you read it the right way. |
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| From | rbowman <bowman@montana.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-07 02:41 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives |
| Message-ID | <nl7hefFpkshU9@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #95252 |
On Fri, 06 Nov 2026 20:51:50 GMT, Charlie Gibbs wrote: > I should get one of those T-shirts that says, > > There is no Cloud. > It's just someone else's computer. I got some funny looks when I said we were already using a private cloud. Most of the companies that were touting a cloud solution for emergency services software backed off. Some of the security requirements assumed the computer would be surrounded by armed responders,
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| From | Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-07 06:39 -0800 |
| Subject | Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives |
| Message-ID | <11cnd7t$3gikg$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #95271 |
On 11/6/2026 18:41, rbowman wrote: > On Fri, 06 Nov 2026 20:51:50 GMT, Charlie Gibbs wrote: > >> I should get one of those T-shirts that says, >> >> There is no Cloud. >> It's just someone else's computer. > > I got some funny looks when I said we were already using a private cloud. > Most of the companies that were touting a cloud solution for emergency > services software backed off. Some of the security requirements assumed > the computer would be surrounded by armed responders, As I understand it, that is a reasonable assumption in your local region? (Even for a "private cloud".) -- Lars Poulsen - an old geek in Santa Barbara, California
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| From | rbowman <bowman@montana.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-07 18:30 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives |
| Message-ID | <nl9918F6ec9U2@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #95311 |
On Sat, 7 Nov 2026 06:39:57 -0800, Lars Poulsen wrote: > On 11/6/2026 18:41, rbowman wrote: >> On Fri, 06 Nov 2026 20:51:50 GMT, Charlie Gibbs wrote: >> >>> I should get one of those T-shirts that says, >>> >>> There is no Cloud. >>> It's just someone else's computer. >> >> I got some funny looks when I said we were already using a private >> cloud. >> Most of the companies that were touting a cloud solution for emergency >> services software backed off. Some of the security requirements assumed >> the computer would be surrounded by armed responders, > > As I understand it, that is a reasonable assumption in your local > region? (Even for a "private cloud".) Yes. Interfacing with the NCIC carries a number of requirements. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Crime_Information_Center In addition state CJIN (Criminal Justice Information Network) impose their requirements. Even our support people had to be vetted and finger printed before accessing a site. In theory I could look over their shoulder but couldn't access the sites myself. I carefully avoided the certification to maintain separation from the support tasks. The theory broke down when the support people brought back logs but we didn't talk about that. I'll admit I saw some juicy stuff. NCIC tried to respond to the implications of off-premises clouds. HIPAA also had an oar in the water. https://www.hhs.gov/hipaa/index.html
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| From | Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-07 15:26 -0800 |
| Subject | Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives |
| Message-ID | <11coc2j$3svhe$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #95320 |
On 11/7/2026 10:30, rbowman wrote: > On Sat, 7 Nov 2026 06:39:57 -0800, Lars Poulsen wrote: > >> On 11/6/2026 18:41, rbowman wrote: >>> On Fri, 06 Nov 2026 20:51:50 GMT, Charlie Gibbs wrote: >>> >>>> I should get one of those T-shirts that says, >>>> >>>> There is no Cloud. >>>> It's just someone else's computer. >>> >>> I got some funny looks when I said we were already using a private >>> cloud. >>> Most of the companies that were touting a cloud solution for emergency >>> services software backed off. Some of the security requirements assumed >>> the computer would be surrounded by armed responders, >> >> As I understand it, that is a reasonable assumption in your local >> region? (Even for a "private cloud".) > > Yes. Interfacing with the NCIC carries a number of requirements. > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Crime_Information_Center > > In addition state CJIN (Criminal Justice Information Network) impose their > requirements. Even our support people had to be vetted and finger printed > before accessing a site. In theory I could look over their shoulder but > couldn't access the sites myself. I carefully avoided the certification to > maintain separation from the support tasks. > > The theory broke down when the support people brought back logs but we > didn't talk about that. I'll admit I saw some juicy stuff. > > NCIC tried to respond to the implications of off-premises clouds. HIPAA > also had an oar in the water. > > https://www.hhs.gov/hipaa/index.html My comment was mean to be snarky: I think you live in either Montana and Wyoming, in a rural county with lots of survivalists running around, so a goodly number of employees of any company can be expected to armed at their workplaces. -- Lars Poulsen - an old geek in Santa Barbara, California
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| From | rbowman <bowman@montana.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-08 01:15 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives |
| Message-ID | <nla0p7F6ec9U5@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #95333 |
On Sat, 7 Nov 2026 15:26:09 -0800, Lars Poulsen wrote: > My comment was mean to be snarky: I think you live in either Montana and > Wyoming, in a rural county with lots of survivalists running around, so > a goodly number of employees of any company can be expected to armed at > their workplaces. I think there was something in the employee handbook about that but there were no metal detectors. I never felt the need. That said the programming department did have a yearly day at the range as sort of a bonding exercise. There was everything from muzzle loaders on up.
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| From | The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-08 11:28 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives |
| Message-ID | <11cpmc4$8pq1$2@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #95333 |
On 07/11/2026 23:26, Lars Poulsen wrote: > ...in either Montana and Wyoming, in a rural county with lots of > survivalists running around, so a goodly number of employees of any > company can be expected to armed at their workplaces. Interesting correlation you make. Why would survivalists (so called) be especially armed *at work* ? -- There is nothing a fleet of dispatchable nuclear power plants cannot do that cannot be done worse and more expensively and with higher carbon emissions and more adverse environmental impact by adding intermittent renewable energy.
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| From | rbowman <bowman@montana.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-08 18:14 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives |
| Message-ID | <nlbsgoFjmsaU1@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #95347 |
On Sun, 8 Nov 2026 11:28:04 +0000, The Natural Philosopher wrote: > On 07/11/2026 23:26, Lars Poulsen wrote: >> ...in either Montana and Wyoming, in a rural county with lots of >> survivalists running around, so a goodly number of employees of any >> company can be expected to armed at their workplaces. > > Interesting correlation you make. > Why would survivalists (so called) be especially armed *at work* ? Open carry has always been legal in this state except for court houses, saloons, and a few other places. While I've seen people carrying in the library or market they are very, very rare. They're also the people that cause me to formulate a plan in case the situation goes south. There may be more concealed firearms but concealment is rather the point. My original statement concerned PSAPs https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_safety_answering_point They aren't necessarily in police stations but often are. Even if they are not access is restricted. By their nature they are privy to sensitive criminal and medical information.
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| From | Beej Jorgensen <beej@beej.us> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-06 05:59 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: On the on-topicness of tape drives |
| Message-ID | <11cjqcm$291ke$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #95198 |
In article <ipucna2KmLW-nnD3nZ2dnZfqn_WdnZ2d@giganews.com>, c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> wrote: > Also, tape drives are STILL in use, to around 30tb for the more > expensive units. Not 'ideal' for big storage any more, but still > valuable. Recent headline: "FUJIFILM to Increase Production Capacity by 5x for Magnetic Data Storage Tape". I guess AI is driving demand up again. And this is from a recent Tom's Hardware article: The current LTO-10 generation stores up to 40TB of uncompressed data per cartridge, while HPE and Quantum — the companies behind the LTO Program — now envision LTO-14 cartridges with up to 365TB of native capacity. IIRC, the data from Arecibo radio telescope used to be shipped back to the mainland on tape because that was the only thing that had the bandwidth. "Never underestimate the bandwidth of a station wagon full of tapes hurtling down the highway." > Now the big reel-2-reel jobbies from all the old sci-fi movies .... no > ... gone. We had one 9-track when I worked as a computer operator in 1992. It was used to send financial records to the bank. That was the first and last one I saw in use. -- Brian "Beej Jorgensen" Hall | beej@beej.us
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| From | Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-06 06:18 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: Tape Drives |
| Message-ID | <11cjrg8$29e56$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #95228 |
On Fri, 6 Nov 2026 05:59:51 -0000 (UTC), Beej Jorgensen wrote: > We had one 9-track when I worked as a computer operator in 1992. It > was used to send financial records to the bank. That was the first > and last one I saw in use. A decade earlier, it was a slightly different story. Also, back then, it was still the fashion in movies and TV to portray a computer as having lots of tape drives with the reels spinning busily, as though such heavy tape usage was characteristic of normal computer operation. That would have been true a decade before that, but by the time the 1980s came along, tapes were primarily used for backup and data interchange between installations. Furthermore, back then, there was real difficulty in getting data between different brands of personal computers, because of incompatible floppy disk formats, and many machines not even having floppy drives. But there was this open protocol called “Kermit”, which ran on serial lines (or modem connections), for which implementations were available for just about every kind of computer under the sun, big and small. And you could get copies free, just by sending a blank reel of tape to the University of Columbia; they would put all the latest versions of all the releases on that, and send it back.
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| From | Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-07 18:40 +0800 |
| Subject | Re: Tape Drives |
| Message-ID | <YeDHS.42538$sxp1.28972@fx06.ams4> |
| In reply to | #95229 |
On 11/6/2026 2:18 PM, Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote: > On Fri, 6 Nov 2026 05:59:51 -0000 (UTC), Beej Jorgensen wrote: > >> We had one 9-track when I worked as a computer operator in 1992. It >> was used to send financial records to the bank. That was the first >> and last one I saw in use. > > A decade earlier, it was a slightly different story. > > Also, back then, it was still the fashion in movies and TV to portray > a computer as having lots of tape drives with the reels spinning > busily, as though such heavy tape usage was characteristic of normal > computer operation. That would have been true a decade before that, > but by the time the 1980s came along, tapes were primarily used for > backup and data interchange between installations. > > Furthermore, back then, there was real difficulty in getting data > between different brands of personal computers, because of > incompatible floppy disk formats, and many machines not even having > floppy drives. But there was this open protocol called “Kermit”, which > ran on serial lines (or modem connections), for which implementations > were available for just about every kind of computer under the sun, > big and small. > > And you could get copies free, just by sending a blank reel of tape to > the University of Columbia; they would put all the latest versions of > all the releases on that, and send it back. Now now Lawrence, don't act like it's all gone. You can still get it, and use it, at https://www.kermitproject.org/index.html and https://davidrg.github.io/ckwin/ to transfer files with all kinds of protocols. I used it in recent years to transfer files between FreeDOS computer and Windows 10, so it's definitely still useful. Information and download links for MS-DOS Kermit can be found here, https://www.kermitproject.org/mskermit.html and you can even download and read the book /Using MS-DOS Kermit/, 2nd edition from that website. I'm sure someone in the retrocomputing hobby at alt.folklore.computers can make use of these software packages, perhaps after two hundred years; so it's definitely worth mentioning. Best wishes and happy Kermit! -- Johann | email: invalid -> com | http://www.myrkraverk.com/blog/ I'm not from the Internet, I just work there. | via Easynews.com https://bsky.app/profile/myrkraverk.bsky.social | for ( ;; ) _:; Federated at https://fed.brid.gy/bsky/myrkraverk.bsky.social
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