Groups > comp.mobile.android > #54790 > unrolled thread

Is Apple acknowledging that many users want an active stylus on their phones?

Started by	sms <scharf.steven@geemail.com>
First post	2018-08-16 17:58 -0700
Last post	2018-08-17 12:01 -0500
Articles	20 on this page of 111 — 14 participants

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#54866

From	Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com>
Date	2018-08-19 18:24 +1200
Message-ID	<plb2ea$149i$1@gioia.aioe.org>
In reply to	#54843

On 2018-08-18 22:35:15 +0000, abcdef said:

> On 8/18/2018 3:01 PM, Your Name wrote:
>> On 2018-08-18 15:13:42 +0000, abcdef said:
> 
>> Yes, there's no reason you cannot use Apple headphones with non-Aplpe
>> devices ...
> 
> Is price a reason? Target EarPods are US$29. The competition just down
> the aisle with similar specs is around $19.

Similar specs? Maybe. Similar sound quality? possibly

Apple's "coolness" factor ... nope, not a chance. Buying these Apple 
Earpods means any dweeb can hide their $20 Android phone in their 
pocket and walk around pretending they actually bought an iPhone.  ;-)

> And with the competition you actually have a color choice...

Ahh, you want a choice of colours. Try this company for colour Apple EarPods:
<https://www.colorware.com/p-743-apple-airpods.aspx>

or, if you're a cheapskate, there's always these:
<https://earskinz.com/

>> That's why there's an adapter to let you use headphone jack
>> accessories with non-headphone jack Apple devices.
> 
> Ah yes. You must mean that damn dangling dongle. We discussed it earlier
> in the thread.

It's doesn't need to be a dangling dongle. The ElementDigital Dual 
Lightning Splitter Adapter is a small tube that attaches to the bottom 
of the iOS device, and off one end is a regular headphone jack and on 
the other end is another Ligthning socket. The Amazon link for this one 
no longer works, so maybe it's not for sale any more (could try eBay), 
but there's also the similar Tessin iPhone 7/8/X Adapter and Splitter.
<https://www.amazon.com/TESSIN-Splitter-Lightning-Headphone-Compatible/dp/B07857L1KD/> 

But, it doesn't even need to be a plug-in adaptor. Griffin makes the 
iTrip Clip, which is a headphone adaptor into which you can plug 
regular wired headphones, and it connects to the iOS device via 
Bluetooth ... you'll then have wireless-wired headphones.  :-)
<https://griffintechnology.com/itrip-clip-bluetooth-headphone-adapter>

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#54867

From	abcdef <abcdef@abcdef.com>
Date	2018-08-18 23:45 -0700
Message-ID	<plb3n6$o3j$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to	#54866

On 8/18/2018 11:24 PM, Your Name wrote:

> Apple's "coolness" factor ... nope, not a chance. Buying these Apple 
> Earpods means any dweeb can hide their $20 Android phone in their 
> pocket and walk around pretending they actually bought an iPhone. 
> ;-)

Those Target (non-Apple) standard headphones also come in white. So you
can buy them, save 10 bucks, and still look cool... ;)

> It's doesn't need to be a dangling dongle...

That dangling dongle discussion was a bit of tongue in cheek thing for
me. Since I'm not planning on buying any Apple products anytime soon,
and the wife has never even used the headphone that came with her
iPhone, the problem that never was has pretty much been solved in this
family...

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#54870

From	Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com>
Date	2018-08-19 19:33 +1200
Message-ID	<plb6fu$1b5p$1@gioia.aioe.org>
In reply to	#54867

On 2018-08-19 06:45:58 +0000, abcdef said:
> On 8/18/2018 11:24 PM, Your Name wrote:
>> 
>> Apple's "coolness" factor ... nope, not a chance. Buying these Apple 
>> Earpods means any dweeb can hide their $20 Android phone in their 
>> pocket and walk around pretending they actually bought an iPhone. ;-)
> 
> Those Target (non-Apple) standard headphones also come in white. So you
> can buy them, save 10 bucks, and still look cool... ;)

Ah, but they don't look the same ... unless the manufacturer is Chinese 
and doesn't care about Apple lawsuits.

>> It's doesn't need to be a dangling dongle...
> 
> That dangling dongle discussion was a bit of tongue in cheek thing for
> me. Since I'm not planning on buying any Apple products anytime soon,
> and the wife has never even used the headphone that came with her
> iPhone, the problem that never was has pretty much been solved in this
> family...

Very few people use the headphones, with any phone. Mainly because for 
most people the mobile phone is simply a messaging device - basically a 
glorified two-way pager.

In the old days Apple shipped a microphone with all Macs which very few 
people used that either (even less once the 'novelty' of  recording 
raspberry noises wore off.)

More recently Apple used to ship a remote control with every Mac, but 
very few people used that either.

The stickers / decals Apple put in the boxes got more use than any of 
those extras.

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#54873

From	Arlen Holder <arlenholder@nospam.net>
Date	2018-08-19 08:31 +0000
Message-ID	<plb9sf$gic$2@news.mixmin.net>
In reply to	#54870

On 19 Aug 2018 00:33:19 GMT, Your Name wrote:

> Very few people use the headphones, with any phone. Mainly because for 
> most people the mobile phone is simply a messaging device - basically a 
> glorified two-way pager.

Speak for yourself that you use the iPhone as a mere toy.

I guess that's ok though - as it won't work in the real world anyway.

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#54890

From	abcdef <abcdef@abcdef.com>
Date	2018-08-19 10:55 -0700
Message-ID	<plcauj$244$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to	#54870

On 8/19/2018 12:33 AM, Your Name wrote:
> On 2018-08-19 06:45:58 +0000, abcdef said:
>> On 8/18/2018 11:24 PM, Your Name wrote:
>>> 
>>> Apple's "coolness" factor ... nope, not a chance. Buying these 
>>> Apple Earpods means any dweeb can hide their $20 Android phone
>>> in their pocket and walk around pretending they actually bought
>>> an iPhone. ;-)
>> 
>> Those Target (non-Apple) standard headphones also come in white.
>> So you can buy them, save 10 bucks, and still look cool... ;)
> 
> Ah, but they don't look the same ... unless the manufacturer is 
> Chinese and doesn't care about Apple lawsuits.

Yes, I suppose those who care about such things would immediately
recognize the headphone imposters. But the lookalike wearers are safe
from the likes of me. When I see white headphones, wired or not, I
immediately think Apple. (Me? Brainwashed?? ;)

>> That dangling dongle discussion was a bit of tongue in cheek thing 
>> for me.

> Very few people use the headphones, with any phone.

Agreed.

I was happy and surprised to find that my Motorola phone had
exceptional audio not only in fidelity but also in volume. After adding
an equalizer app to adjust the frequency spectrum to match my older ears
it turned out to be better than any of my mp3 players. So I am a happy
exception.

> for most people the mobile phone is simply a messaging device - 
> basically a glorified two-way pager.

Many of my friends and family have abandoned their home phones and use
the mobile as their ONLY phone.

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#54900

From	Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com>
Date	2018-08-20 10:36 +1200
Message-ID	<plcrd5$rbc$1@gioia.aioe.org>
In reply to	#54890

On 2018-08-19 17:55:32 +0000, abcdef said:
> On 8/19/2018 12:33 AM, Your Name wrote:
>> On 2018-08-19 06:45:58 +0000, abcdef said:
>>> On 8/18/2018 11:24 PM, Your Name wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Apple's "coolness" factor ... nope, not a chance. Buying these Apple 
>>>> Earpods means any dweeb can hide their $20 Android phone
>>>> in their pocket and walk around pretending they actually bought
>>>> an iPhone. ;-)
>>> 
>>> Those Target (non-Apple) standard headphones also come in white.
>>> So you can buy them, save 10 bucks, and still look cool... ;)
>> 
>> Ah, but they don't look the same ... unless the manufacturer is Chinese 
>> and doesn't care about Apple lawsuits.
> 
> Yes, I suppose those who care about such things would immediately
> recognize the headphone imposters. But the lookalike wearers are safe
> from the likes of me. When I see white headphones, wired or not, I
> immediately think Apple. (Me? Brainwashed?? ;)
> 
>>> That dangling dongle discussion was a bit of tongue in cheek thing for me.
> 
>> Very few people use the headphones, with any phone.
> 
> Agreed.
> 
> I was happy and surprised to find that my Motorola phone had
> exceptional audio not only in fidelity but also in volume. After adding
> an equalizer app to adjust the frequency spectrum to match my older ears
> it turned out to be better than any of my mp3 players. So I am a happy
> exception.
> 
>> for most people the mobile phone is simply a messaging device - 
>> basically a glorified two-way pager.
> 
> Many of my friends and family have abandoned their home phones and use
> the mobile as their ONLY phone.

The phone companies here in New Zealand have that option. You can even 
keep your old landline phone number and have the calls forwarded to 
your mobile, or even a group of mobiles.

There's also the option of plugging a landline phone into your internet 
modem, so those with a fibre or home-4G connection don't need the old 
copper landline wiring coming into the house from the street.

But the reality is that people are making and receiving fewer and fewer 
actual phone calls these days. Most communication on mobile phones is 
via various messaging apps, TXTing, and less so on phones via email.

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#54927

From	abcdef <abcdef@abcdef.com>
Date	2018-08-19 21:44 -0700
Message-ID	<pldgv0$5id$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to	#54900

On 8/19/2018 3:36 PM, Your Name wrote:
> On 2018-08-19 17:55:32 +0000, abcdef said:

>> Many of my friends and family have abandoned their home phones and
>>  use the mobile as their ONLY phone.
> 
> The phone companies here in New Zealand have that option. You can 
> even keep your old landline phone number and have the calls forwarded
> to your mobile, or even a group of mobiles.

We have similar phone number options here in the states. But I get so
many junk calls these days I probably will just abandon my number if
(when?) I cut the cord.

> There's also the option of plugging a landline phone into your 
> internet modem, so those with a fibre or home-4G connection don't 
> need the old copper landline wiring coming into the house from the 
> street.

While I do have landline twisted pair phone service available, my home
phone is currently provided by my cable company (bundle) and shares a
modem with my Internet service. The cable TV has its own separate modem.

> Most communication on mobile phones is via various messaging apps, 
> TXTing, and less so on phones via email.

Yup. Most of my extended family communications are by text these days.

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#54892

From	Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid>
Date	2018-08-19 18:38 +0000
Message-ID	<plckgj.6vk.1@ID-201911.user.individual.net>
In reply to	#54870

Your Name <YourName@yourisp.com> wrote:
[...]
> Very few people use the headphones, with any phone.

  You're kidding, right!?

  Many - especially younger - people use headphones - wired or wireless
- with their smartphones, when they're outdoors.

>						      Mainly because for 
> most people the mobile phone is simply a messaging device - basically a 
> glorified two-way pager.

  That's one of them there trolls/flamebaits, isn't it!?

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#54874

From	Arlen Holder <arlenholder@nospam.net>
Date	2018-08-19 08:31 +0000
Message-ID	<plb9sg$gic$3@news.mixmin.net>
In reply to	#54866

On 18 Aug 2018 23:24:11 GMT, Your Name wrote:

> Apple's "coolness" factor ... nope, not a chance. Buying these Apple 
> Earpods means any dweeb can hide their $20 Android phone in their 
> pocket and walk around pretending they actually bought an iPhone.  ;-)

I'm curious if you actually *believe* a silly cellphone is a "status"
symbol.

Are you _really_ that shallow?

How about you get an *education* as your status symbol?
Or say something intelligent at the very least.

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#54881

From	Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies>
Date	2018-08-19 13:04 +0000
Message-ID	<slrnpniqn0.2c5q.g.kreme@jaka.lan>
In reply to	#54823

In message <pl86io$je$1@dont-email.me> abcdef <abcdef@abcdef.com> wrote:
> On 8/17/2018 2:31 PM, nospam wrote:
>> abcdef <abcdef@abcdef.com> wrote:

>> [Long group dissertation snipped] apple knows what the breakdown is.

> They certainly do. At Target this afternoon I found two kinds of Apple
> EarPods for sale. One with a Lightning connector and one with a STANDARD
> connector. Apple ain't no fool...

>>> my local stores carry STANDARD headphones in droves

>> most of which are not as good as the ones bundled in the box.

> Ah, there's that "MOST" word again. Besides surveying millions of Apple
> users about what headphones they use, you also came and surveyed all the
> headphones that are available in my local stores too??

The vast majority of wired headphones are complete shit.


-- 
"I've had a perfectly wonderful evening. But this wasn't it." - Groucho
Marx

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#54902

From	sms <scharf.steven@geemail.com>
Date	2018-08-19 15:55 -0700
Message-ID	<plcsh5$flo$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to	#54808

On 8/17/2018 11:01 AM, abcdef wrote:
> On 8/17/2018 10:30 AM, nospam wrote:
>> abcdef <abcdef@abcdef.com wrote:
> 
>>> I would miss a headphone jack. However the wife has yet to complain
>>> about her iPhone not having one. Guess it's a YMMV thing...
> 
>> it has a digital headphone jack and includes headphones in the box
> 
> One size headphone fits all? No thanks. YMMV.
> 
>> as well as an adapter for legacy analog headphones.
> 
> Having a headphone dongle dangling? No thanks. YMMV.
> 
>> it also fully supports all bluetooth headsets and headphones.
> 
> Bluetooth? More cost, battery charge hassle, and bulk. No thanks. YMMV.

You can add a headphone jack to an iPhone 7, not sure about an iPhone 8.

See <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utfbE3_uAMA> It took him 17 weeks 
to do it.

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#54903

From	Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
Date	2018-08-19 17:16 -0700
Message-ID	<0001HW.212A3FEF00025D92700001DE02CF@news.giganews.com>
In reply to	#54902

On Aug 19, 2018, sms wrote
(in article <plcsh5$flo$1@dont-email.me>):

> On 8/17/2018 11:01 AM, abcdef wrote:
> > On 8/17/2018 10:30 AM, nospam wrote:
> > > abcdef <abcdef@abcdef.com wrote:
> >
> > > > I would miss a headphone jack. However the wife has yet to complain
> > > > about her iPhone not having one. Guess it's a YMMV thing...
> >
> > > it has a digital headphone jack and includes headphones in the box
> >
> > One size headphone fits all? No thanks. YMMV.
> >
> > > as well as an adapter for legacy analog headphones.
> >
> > Having a headphone dongle dangling? No thanks. YMMV.
> >
> > > it also fully supports all bluetooth headsets and headphones.
> >
> > Bluetooth? More cost, battery charge hassle, and bulk. No thanks. YMMV.
>
> You can add a headphone jack to an iPhone 7, not sure about an iPhone 8.
>
> See <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utfbE3_uAMA>  It took him 17 weeks
> to do it.

The question should be, “Why would you need to add a headphone jack to an 
iPhone 8 when there are so many great Lightning, or BT options out there?”

The usual answer would be so that I can use high quality earphones/headphones 
with said iP8. I have an iP8+ which was delivered with Apple Lightning 
connector Earpods, and the Lightning to jack adaptor, and I have no problem 
finding quality head/earphones which will work with it. Some of them are 
pre-Lightning, and still work just fine.

I am not a fan of the wired Earpods so I have looked for alternatives. 
Several years ago when I had an iPhone (iP4S, iP5, iP6S+) with a headphone 
jack I bought a pair of wonderful Etymotic ER4 earphones, but they only 
provide noise isolation not true noise cancellation. So for travel, and noise 
cancellation while flying I bought a pair of Bose QC 35 headphones, and they 
are great, but they still have the bulk of headphones. So when I got an iP6 
which has both a standard headphone jack and a Lightning connector I looked 
for alternatives, both Lightning connector, and BlueTooth. I was surprised to 
find what was available from Beats, JBL, Phillips, B&O, and others, some with 
adaptive noise cancellation some without.

My big discovery was the RAYZ from Pioneer. They use a Lightning connector, 
they have adaptive noise cancellation thanks to the power of the iPhone A11 
chip, and they also have a pass-through Lightning connector for charging 
while still connected.Best of all they are affordable.

<https://www.pioneerrayz.com/earphones>

Then a few weeks ago I decided to buy a set of Apple Airpods, and for general 
use with iOS devices they are hard to beat. ...but no noise cancellation, or 
good isolation, so I still have a place for the Bose QC 35s, and the Pioneer 
RAYZ.

While the Etymolic ER4s are getting to be 8 years old now, they still provide 
quality sound, and they work just fine on the iP8+ with the Apple provided 
adaptor.
-- 

Regards,
Savageduck

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#54904

From	Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
Date	2018-08-19 17:42 -0700
Message-ID	<0001HW.212A45EC0003C4DD700001DE02CF@news.giganews.com>
In reply to	#54902

On Aug 19, 2018, sms wrote
(in article <plcsh5$flo$1@dont-email.me>):

>
> You can add a headphone jack to an iPhone 7, not sure about an iPhone 8.
>
> See <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utfbE3_uAMA>  It took him 17 weeks
> to do it.

BTW: That was waste of time, and money given that he had the solution in hand 
with the Lightning/headphone adapter to start with. An exercise in futility.

-- 

Regards,
Savageduck

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#54912

From	Arlen Holder <arlenholder@nospam.net>
Date	2018-08-20 02:06 +0000
Message-ID	<pld7mm$tiq$6@news.mixmin.net>
In reply to	#54904

On 19 Aug 2018 17:42:20 GMT, Savageduck wrote:

> BTW: That was waste of time, and money given that he had the solution in hand 
> with the Lightning/headphone adapter to start with. An exercise in futility.

It's instructive though, to be another case where even the simplest of
things are far harder to do with Apple equipment, where the _only_ reason
for the lost functionality was to increase Apple profits (IMHO).

Just as Tim Cook was caught in two bold-face public lies last year, the
"courageous" lost functionality will, eventually, IMHO, be shown to be what
it was all along.

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#54934

From	sms <scharf.steven@geemail.com>
Date	2018-08-20 06:26 -0700
Message-ID	<plefhj$cbq$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to	#54904

On 8/19/2018 5:42 PM, Savageduck wrote:
> On Aug 19, 2018, sms wrote
> (in article <plcsh5$flo$1@dont-email.me>):
> 
>>
>> You can add a headphone jack to an iPhone 7, not sure about an iPhone 8.
>>
>> See <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utfbE3_uAMA>  It took him 17 weeks
>> to do it.
> 
> BTW: That was waste of time, and money given that he had the solution in hand
> with the Lightning/headphone adapter to start with. An exercise in futility.
> 

Many people want to charge their phone and use headphones at the same time.

While there are adapters for that, i.e. 
<https://www.amazon.com/dp/B074WDWVX1> it gets clunky to be carrying and 
using all these extra bits.

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#54936

From	nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
Date	2018-08-20 09:36 -0400
Message-ID	<200820180936367585%nospam@nospam.invalid>
In reply to	#54934

In article <plefhj$cbq$1@dont-email.me>, sms
<scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:

> 
> Many people want to charge their phone and use headphones at the same time.

not very many, since iphone batteries easily lasts a full day in
typical use, usually well into the second day, so there's little need
to do both. the iphone 8 and later have wireless charging, so even if
someone does want to do both, there's no conflict. all iphones have
bluetooth, so that's yet another option.

you are also ignoring that numerous android phones do not have an
analog headphone jack.

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#54941

From	Arlen Holder <arlenholder@nospam.net>
Date	2018-08-20 14:27 +0000
Message-ID	<plej4v$it0$2@news.mixmin.net>
In reply to	#54936

On 20 Aug 2018 06:36:36 GMT, nospam wrote:

> you are also ignoring that numerous android phones do not have an
> analog headphone jack.

You Apple Apologists *love* to blame Android for the lack of basic
functionality on iOS mobile devices.

In addition, you Apple Apologists always find the *worst* to compare with.

It's the *only* way you _can_ compare iOS with Android.

Any idiot, as you prove, can find a terrible comparison.

It takes intelligence, for example, to get good price-to-performance.

My Android phone, for example, has the "courageous" basic functionality of
a headphone jack, and it costs five times *less* than a far less functional
equivalent hardware iPhone.

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#54944

From	nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
Date	2018-08-20 10:41 -0400
Message-ID	<200820181041220730%nospam@nospam.invalid>
In reply to	#54941

In article <plej4v$it0$2@news.mixmin.net>, Arlen Holder
<arlenholder@nospam.net> wrote:

> My Android phone, for example, has the "courageous" basic functionality of
> a headphone jack, and it costs five times *less* than a far less functional
> equivalent hardware iPhone.

meanwhile, the google pixel, what google's vision of what an android
phone should be, does *not* have an analog headphone jack. 

nor does the essential phone from andy rubin, who created android
itself, along with many other android phones from motorola, htc, le
eco, and others.

they all, however, have a modern digital headphone jack, one which is
more reliable and more capable.

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#54949

From	Arlen Holder <arlenholder@nospam.net>
Date	2018-08-20 15:42 +0000
Message-ID	<plenhp$s2m$2@news.mixmin.net>
In reply to	#54944

On 20 Aug 2018 07:41:22 GMT, nospam wrote:

> meanwhile, the google pixel, what google's vision of what an android
> phone should be, does *not* have an analog headphone jack. 

You said yourself, many times, so don't deny it, that Google can afford to
put phones out there that they don't plan to directly make money on (that
was your excuse, in the past, why Nexus phones had such great
price-to-performance compared with the far less functional iPhones.

Now we find that Google themselves, is marketing the $160 Google Pixel Buds
for that Pixel phone you so very much seem to love to compare with Apple.
<https://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/2017/10/04/hello-google-pixel-buds-goodbye-headphone-jack/731438001/>

> nor does the essential phone from andy rubin, who created android
> itself, along with many other android phones from motorola, htc, le
> eco, and others.

All I'm saying is that the "courageous" marketing spin of Apple wasn't due
to anything other than sheer profit motive.

I'm never one to disparage Apple's profits - and you know that - since I
think they're one of the best MARKETED companies on this planet - and they
deserve their money.

Read what they said about Google and the lack of the headphone jack here:
  "Smell that? It's the stench of irony. Last year on Oct. 4, it was 
   Google who made fun of Apple for ditching the popular port."
  <https://www.cnet.com/news/pixel-2-xl-no-headphone-jack/>

The point is that both Google and Apple are ditching the basic
functionality for one reason and one reason only, the "courageous" decision
to milk an extra few hundred dollars out of each customer! (Bear in mind,
the devices get broken, batteries wear out, they get lost, etc.)

> they all, however, have a modern digital headphone jack, one which is
> more reliable and more capable.

I have given, as gifts, headphone-less iPhones to people who wanted
iPhones, where they complain about the lack of the basic functionality of
the missing headphone jack.

They love their iPhones. They really do. 
They also hate that their iPhone doesn't have the basic functionality of a
headphone jack.

There is one reason and one reason only for the "courageous" decision to
eliminate basic functionality - for both Google & Apple - and it's sheer
profit motive. There was no consideration in the least for the loyal
customer, IMHO.

You Apple Apologists always find the *worst* examples to compare with.
And then you blame Android for all the faults of the iPhone.

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#54961

From	nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
Date	2018-08-20 13:33 -0400
Message-ID	<200820181333219897%nospam@nospam.invalid>
In reply to	#54949

In article <plenhp$s2m$2@news.mixmin.net>, Arlen Holder
<arlenholder@nospam.net> wrote:

> 
> > meanwhile, the google pixel, what google's vision of what an android
> > phone should be, does *not* have an analog headphone jack. 
> 
> You said yourself, many times, so don't deny it, that Google can afford to
> put phones out there that they don't plan to directly make money on (that
> was your excuse, in the past, why Nexus phones had such great
> price-to-performance compared with the far less functional iPhones.

nexus phones are no longer made and pixel phones cost about the same as
similar iphones.

> Now we find that Google themselves, is marketing the $160 Google Pixel Buds
> for that Pixel phone you so very much seem to love to compare with Apple.
>
> <https://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/2017/10/04/hello-google-pixel-buds-goodby
> e-headphone-jack/731438001/>

yep. it ain't just apple who realizes that the future is wireless.

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Is Apple acknowledging that many users want an active stylus on their phones?

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