Groups | Search | Server Info | Keyboard shortcuts | Login | Register [http] [https] [nntp] [nntps]


Groups > comp.misc > #1911 > unrolled thread

Re: ebooks

Started byRS Wood <rsw@therandymon.com>
First post2014-03-23 12:06 +0000
Last post2014-03-23 19:23 -0400
Articles 20 on this page of 165 — 42 participants

Back to article view | Back to comp.misc

This discussion starts older than the indexed window; earlier articles aren't shown. The article labeled Started by below is the oldest one visible, not the original post.


Contents

  Re: ebooks RS Wood <rsw@therandymon.com> - 2014-03-23 12:06 +0000
    Re: ebooks "Stanley Daniel de Liver" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2014-03-23 12:11 +0000
      Re: ebooks Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> - 2014-03-23 14:43 +0000
        Re: ebooks Hils <hils@saynotospam.net> - 2014-03-23 16:14 +0000
        Re: ebooks root <NoEMail@home.org> - 2014-03-23 18:09 +0000
          Re: ebooks "Stanley Daniel de Liver" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2014-03-23 19:21 +0000
          Re: ebooks Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> - 2014-03-23 20:34 +0000
            Re: ebooks Alan Bowler <atbowler@thinkage.ca> - 2014-06-13 14:14 -0400
              Re: ebooks "Stanley Daniel de Liver" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2014-06-13 21:44 +0100
              Re: ebooks Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2014-06-13 16:53 -0400
                Re: ebooks Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2014-06-14 08:37 +0100
                  Re: ebooks Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2014-06-14 18:34 -0400
                  Re: ebooks RS Wood <rsw@therandymon.com> - 2014-06-15 10:40 +0000
                    Re: ebooks "Stanley Daniel de Liver" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2014-06-15 12:05 +0100
                      Re: ebooks Bob Eager <news0002@eager.cx> - 2014-06-15 11:20 +0000
                        Re: ebooks "Stanley Daniel de Liver" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2014-06-15 12:37 +0100
                          Re: ebooks root <NoEMail@home.org> - 2014-06-15 17:48 +0000
                            Re: ebooks Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2014-06-15 15:59 -0400
                              Re: ebooks "Oeter Johns" <oj19854@nospam.com> - 2014-06-16 06:30 +1000
                                Re: ebooks Andy Leighton <andyl@azaal.plus.com> - 2014-06-16 04:04 -0500
                                  Re: ebooks Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2014-06-16 11:44 +0000
                                  Re: ebooks Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2014-06-16 10:32 -0400
                                    Re: ebooks Andy Leighton <andyl@azaal.plus.com> - 2014-06-16 10:43 -0500
                                      Re: ebooks Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2014-06-16 13:13 -0400
                                      Re: ebooks "Oeter Johns" <oj19854@nospam.com> - 2014-06-17 06:45 +1000
                                    Re: ebooks "Oeter Johns" <oj19854@nospam.com> - 2014-06-17 06:36 +1000
                        Re: ebooks RS Wood <rsw@therandymon.com> - 2014-06-15 22:43 +0000
                          Re: ebooks Bob Eager <news0002@eager.cx> - 2014-06-15 23:26 +0000
                            Re: ebooks "Stanley Daniel de Liver" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2014-06-16 22:01 +0100
                Re: ebooks "Oeter Johns" <oj19854@nospam.com> - 2014-06-15 06:27 +1000
        Re: ebooks "Stanley Daniel de Liver" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2014-03-23 19:09 +0000
        Re: ebooks Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-24 01:55 +0000
          Re: ebooks Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> - 2014-03-24 10:35 +0000
            Re: ebooks Peter Flass <Peter_Flass@Yahoo.com> - 2014-03-24 13:01 -0400
              Re: ebooks Dag-Erling Smørgrav <des@des.no> - 2014-03-24 17:15 +0100
            Re: ebooks Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2014-03-24 15:07 +0000
              Re: ebooks Rich <rich@example.com> - 2014-03-24 17:13 +0000
                Re: ebooks Walter Banks <walter@bytecraft.com> - 2014-03-24 13:07 -0500
                  Re: ebooks "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2014-03-24 13:28 -0500
                    Re: ebooks Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-03-24 21:48 +0100
                      Re: ebooks Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> - 2014-03-24 22:57 +0000
                    Re: ebooks "Lanto J." <lantoj78@gmail.com> - 2014-03-25 08:14 +1100
                      Re: ebooks Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-25 00:01 +0000
                        Re: ebooks "Lanto J." <lantoj78@gmail.com> - 2014-03-26 07:17 +1100
                          Re: ebooks Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-25 23:44 +0000
                            Re: ebooks "Lanto J." <lantoj78@gmail.com> - 2014-03-26 12:01 +1100
                            Re: ebooks Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> - 2014-03-26 13:36 +0000
                              Re: ebooks "Stanley Daniel de Liver" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2014-03-26 20:08 +0000
                  Re: ebooks Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2014-03-24 14:48 -0400
                    Re: ebooks Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz <spamtrap@library.lspace.org.invalid> - 2014-03-25 18:13 -0400
                      Re: ebooks Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2014-03-27 01:20 -0400
                  Re: ebooks Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2014-03-25 05:49 +0000
                    Re: ebooks Hils <hils@saynotospam.net> - 2014-03-25 07:06 +0000
                      Re: ebooks Walter Banks <walter@bytecraft.com> - 2014-03-25 08:19 -0500
                        Re: ebooks Walter Bushell <proto@panix.com> - 2014-03-25 09:40 -0400
                          Re: ebooks "Slp" <slp0987@nospam.com> - 2014-03-26 11:14 +1100
                        Re: ebooks Peter Flass <Peter_Flass@Yahoo.com> - 2014-03-25 15:42 -0400
                          Re: ebooks Stephen Sprunk <stephen@sprunk.org> - 2014-03-25 11:47 -0500
                          Re: ebooks Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz <spamtrap@library.lspace.org.invalid> - 2014-03-25 19:25 -0400
                            Re: ebooks Peter Flass <Peter_Flass@Yahoo.com> - 2014-03-26 12:19 -0400
                              Re: ebooks Stephen Sprunk <stephen@sprunk.org> - 2014-03-26 08:25 -0500
                                Re: ebooks Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz <spamtrap@library.lspace.org.invalid> - 2014-03-26 16:01 -0400
                                  Re: ebooks RS Wood <rsw@therandymon.com> - 2014-03-26 20:38 +0000
                                    Re: ebooks "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2014-03-27 08:19 +1100
                                  Re: ebooks Stephen Sprunk <stephen@sprunk.org> - 2014-03-26 15:58 -0500
                                    Re: ebooks Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz <spamtrap@library.lspace.org.invalid> - 2014-03-27 06:28 -0400
                                  Re: ebooks Dag-Erling Smørgrav <des@des.no> - 2014-03-26 22:03 +0100
                                  Re: ebooks Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2014-03-27 00:46 -0400
                                Re: ebooks "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2014-03-26 15:01 -0500
                                  Re: ebooks scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2014-03-26 20:57 +0000
                                    Re: ebooks "Stanley Daniel de Liver" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2014-03-27 13:23 +0000
                                      Re: ebooks Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-03-27 17:48 +0100
                                  Re: ebooks Stephen Sprunk <stephen@sprunk.org> - 2014-03-27 08:26 -0500
                                    Re: ebooks greymausg <maus@mail.com> - 2014-03-27 14:55 +0000
                                    Re: ebooks "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2014-03-27 10:05 -0500
                                      Re: ebooks Stephen Sprunk <stephen@sprunk.org> - 2014-03-27 11:55 -0500
                                        Re: ebooks "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2014-03-27 14:25 -0500
                                          Re: ebooks scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2014-03-27 20:44 +0000
                                          Re: ebooks Johny B Good <johnny-b-good@invalid.ntlworld.com> - 2014-03-28 01:38 +0000
                                            Re: ebooks "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2014-03-27 22:37 -0500
                                              Re: ebooks Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2014-03-27 23:52 -0400
                                                Re: ebooks "Slp" <slp0987@nospam.com> - 2014-03-28 16:07 +1100
                                          Re: ebooks Stephen Sprunk <stephen@sprunk.org> - 2014-03-28 10:52 -0500
                                            Re: ebooks "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2014-03-28 11:57 -0500
                                              Re: ebooks Stephen Sprunk <stephen@sprunk.org> - 2014-03-28 14:41 -0500
                                              Re: ebooks Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> - 2014-03-28 21:27 +0000
                                                Re: ebooks "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2014-03-28 17:02 -0500
                                                Re: ebooks Peter Flass <Peter_Flass@Yahoo.com> - 2014-03-28 23:46 -0400
                                              Re: ebooks Philip Shaw <jnufcvyvuc@tznvy.pbz> - 2014-04-02 01:32 +0000
                                                Re: ebooks Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-04-02 14:28 +0000
                                                  Re: ebooks Philip Shaw <jnufcvyvuc@tznvy.pbz> - 2014-04-07 05:32 +0000
                                                    Re: ebooks "John" <j@j.j> - 2014-04-17 16:36 -0700
                                                Re: ebooks "Charlie Gibbs" <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2014-04-02 07:31 -0800
                              Re: ebooks scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2014-03-26 13:38 +0000
                                Re: ebooks Stephen Sprunk <stephen@sprunk.org> - 2014-03-26 11:14 -0500
                                  Re: ebooks Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2014-03-27 00:56 -0400
                                    Re: ebooks Clark G <clarkm.geimsler@ieeemmm.org> - 2014-03-27 16:52 +0000
                                      Re: ebooks "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2014-03-27 14:03 -0500
                                      Re: ebooks Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2014-03-27 23:07 -0400
                                      Re: ebooks Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-03-27 21:44 +0100
                              Re: ebooks Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-26 13:51 +0000
                              Re: ebooks "Charlie Gibbs" <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2014-03-26 09:22 -0800
                                Re: ebooks "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2014-03-26 13:54 -0500
                                Re: ebooks davidmylastname@acm.org (David Griffith) - 2014-03-27 03:41 +0000
                                  Re: ebooks Walter Bushell <proto@panix.com> - 2014-03-27 07:36 -0400
                                    Re: ebooks Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz <spamtrap@library.lspace.org.invalid> - 2014-03-28 03:40 -0400
                                  Re: ebooks Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-03-27 17:59 +0100
                              Re: ebooks Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2014-03-26 15:38 -0700
                                Re: ebooks Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2014-03-26 22:09 -0400
                                  Re: ebooks "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2014-03-27 13:55 -0500
                                    Re: ebooks Johny B Good <johnny-b-good@invalid.ntlworld.com> - 2014-03-28 02:27 +0000
                                      Re: ebooks cb@bobby.df.lth.se (Christian Brunschen) - 2014-03-28 10:42 +0000
                                    Re: ebooks Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2014-03-27 23:12 -0400
                                  Re: ebooks Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2014-03-28 23:17 -0700
                              Re: ebooks Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz <spamtrap@library.lspace.org.invalid> - 2014-03-26 16:06 -0400
                          Re: ebooks "Charlie Gibbs" <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2014-03-26 09:19 -0800
                            Re: ebooks "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2014-03-26 13:50 -0500
                              Re: ebooks Hils <hils@saynotospam.net> - 2014-03-26 20:00 +0000
                              Re: ebooks "Charlie Gibbs" <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2014-03-26 13:30 -0800
                                Re: ebooks Stephen Sprunk <stephen@sprunk.org> - 2014-03-26 15:51 -0500
                            Re: ebooks Will Honea <whonea@whonea.net> - 2014-03-26 13:09 -0600
                            Re: ebooks Peter Flass <Peter_Flass@Yahoo.com> - 2014-03-26 19:23 -0400
                              Re: ebooks "Slp" <slp0987@nospam.com> - 2014-03-27 08:12 +1100
                                Re: ebooks despen@verizon.net (Dan.Espen) - 2014-03-26 19:24 -0400
                            Re: ebooks Johny B Good <johnny-b-good@invalid.ntlworld.com> - 2014-03-26 23:40 +0000
                              Re: ebooks Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz <spamtrap@library.lspace.org.invalid> - 2014-03-27 06:36 -0400
                                Knuth/TeX (was Re: ebooks) RS Wood <rsw@therandymon.com> - 2014-03-27 14:33 +0000
                                  Re: Knuth/TeX (was Re: ebooks) "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2014-03-27 14:01 -0500
                            Re: ebooks rpw3@rpw3.org (Rob Warnock) - 2014-03-27 03:10 +0000
                      Re: ebooks Stephen Sprunk <stephen@sprunk.org> - 2014-03-25 08:19 -0500
                        Re: ebooks Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> - 2014-03-25 15:16 +0000
                      Re: ebooks Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-25 13:32 +0000
                        Re: ebooks RS Wood <rsw@therandymon.com> - 2014-03-25 15:20 +0000
                          Re: ebooks Peter Flass <Peter_Flass@Yahoo.com> - 2014-03-25 15:49 -0400
                            Re: ebooks RS Wood <rsw@therandymon.com> - 2014-03-25 15:58 +0000
                            Re: ebooks Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2014-03-27 01:46 -0400
                          Re: ebooks "Charlie Gibbs" <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2014-03-25 08:48 -0800
                            Re: ebooks RS Wood <rsw@therandymon.com> - 2014-03-25 21:20 +0000
                    Re: ebooks "Slp" <slp0987@nospam.com> - 2014-03-26 07:31 +1100
                  Re: ebooks Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz <spamtrap@library.lspace.org.invalid> - 2014-03-25 08:42 -0400
                Re: ebooks Will Honea <whonea@whonea.net> - 2014-03-24 12:52 -0600
              Re: ebooks Peter Flass <Peter_Flass@Yahoo.com> - 2014-03-24 20:12 -0400
                Re: ebooks Stephen Sprunk <stephen@sprunk.org> - 2014-03-24 15:54 -0500
                Re: ebooks Rob Myers <rob@robmyers.org> - 2014-03-24 22:19 +0000
              Re: ebooks "Slp" <slp0987@nospam.com> - 2014-03-25 07:54 +1100
            Re: ebooks scott@alfter.diespammersdie.us (Scott Alfter) - 2014-03-24 16:21 +0000
            Re: ebooks Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-24 17:02 +0000
              Re: ebooks Walter Banks <walter@bytecraft.com> - 2014-03-24 12:21 -0500
              Re: ebooks Bob Eager <news0002@eager.cx> - 2014-03-24 19:50 +0000
                Re: ebooks Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> - 2014-03-24 22:48 +0000
                  Re: ebooks Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-24 23:42 +0000
                    Re: ebooks Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> - 2014-03-25 15:07 +0000
                      Re: ebooks Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-25 23:40 +0000
                        Re: ebooks Dag-Erling Smørgrav <des@des.no> - 2014-03-26 21:57 +0100
                          Re: ebooks Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-28 13:58 +0000
                            Re: ebooks Dag-Erling Smørgrav <des@des.no> - 2014-03-28 15:44 +0100
                      Re: ebooks "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2014-03-26 11:35 +1100
            Re: ebooks "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2014-03-25 07:28 +1100
              Re: ebooks Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> - 2014-03-24 22:31 +0000
                Re: ebooks Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-25 00:06 +0000
                Re: ebooks "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2014-03-26 07:06 +1100
            Re: ebooks Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz <spamtrap@library.lspace.org.invalid> - 2014-03-24 10:25 -0400
        Re: ebooks Mike Sanders <mike@taco-shack.cow> - 2014-03-24 06:04 +0000
        Re: ebooks Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-03-26 13:17 +0100
    Re: ebooks Peter Flass <Peter_Flass@Yahoo.com> - 2014-03-23 19:23 -0400

Page 2 of 9 — ← Prev page 1 [2] 3 4 5 6 7 8 9  Next page →


#3701

FromPeter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com>
Date2014-06-16 11:44 +0000
Message-ID<853647522424611392.485159peter_flass-yahoo.com@news.eternal-september.org>
In reply to#3700
Andy Leighton <andyl@azaal.plus.com> wrote:
> On Mon, 16 Jun 2014 06:30:57 +1000, Oeter Johns <oj19854@nospam.com> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> "Michael Black" <et472@ncf.ca> wrote in message 
>> news:alpine.LNX.2.02.1406151551290.7355@darkstar.example.org...
>>> On Sun, 15 Jun 2014, root wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> I used to prefer FB reader, but now I prefer EBook-Droid as
>>>> the reader app for my tablets. Among other things, EBookDroid
>>>> can handle djvu formatted content.
>>>> 
>>> And that seems to be where things are going, it seems like the recent 
>>> ebook readers are tablets.
>>> 
>>> There was an article some years back about how standalone devices were 
>>> loosing way, I hadn't noticed, but did afterwards.  Most of the MP3 
>>> players are gone, unless you buy a really cheap one (I did, it didn't do 
>>> folders).
>> 
>> There are still plenty of ipods around.
> 
> Not just ipods.  I recently bought a SanDisk Sansa Clip+. 8GB of storage
> on the player plus it uses microSDXC cards so I have another 64GB of
> storage there.  It was pretty cheap, and is very small. The inbuilt
> software has database limitations but it is very easy to replace it
> with RockBox (which I did even before loading any music onto it).

We have one.  The biggest problem I had with it was trying to download
content from the iTunes store (wanted something only available there). 
Getting around the DRM took (IIRC) two or three steps.

-- 
Pete

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#3706

FromMichael Black <et472@ncf.ca>
Date2014-06-16 10:32 -0400
Message-ID<alpine.LNX.2.02.1406161025080.9025@darkstar.example.org>
In reply to#3700
On Mon, 16 Jun 2014, Andy Leighton wrote:

> On Mon, 16 Jun 2014 06:30:57 +1000, Oeter Johns <oj19854@nospam.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> "Michael Black" <et472@ncf.ca> wrote in message
>> news:alpine.LNX.2.02.1406151551290.7355@darkstar.example.org...
>>> On Sun, 15 Jun 2014, root wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> I used to prefer FB reader, but now I prefer EBook-Droid as
>>>> the reader app for my tablets. Among other things, EBookDroid
>>>> can handle djvu formatted content.
>>>>
>>> And that seems to be where things are going, it seems like the recent
>>> ebook readers are tablets.
>>>
>>> There was an article some years back about how standalone devices were
>>> loosing way, I hadn't noticed, but did afterwards.  Most of the MP3
>>> players are gone, unless you buy a really cheap one (I did, it didn't do
>>> folders).
>>
>> There are still plenty of ipods around.
>
> Not just ipods.  I recently bought a SanDisk Sansa Clip+. 8GB of storage
> on the player plus it uses microSDXC cards so I have another 64GB of
> storage there.  It was pretty cheap, and is very small. The inbuilt
> software has database limitations but it is very easy to replace it
> with RockBox (which I did even before loading any music onto it).
>
I thought iPods had at this point become more like a small tablet (or, an 
iPhone without the phone capabiity).  I gather you can run other programs 
on it, making it a more universal device.  I thought the later models even 
had built in cameras.

The flyers here aren't showing much in the way of MP3 players in between 
the iPod and the cheap ones.  I thus thought Sansa had gotten out of the 
MP3 business.

I certainly bought a Sansa Fuze because it was more open, and had the card 
slot.  Mine Sansa Fuze was an 8gig, and then I got a 16gig microSD card. 
Back in December I got a 32gig microSD card when there were some really 
good prices, but I haven't swapped it in.  And yes, according to what I've 
read, the limits of the software will fill up before all of that 32gig.

One thing that disappoints me is that it takes so long to build up that 
database (I presume because it's looking at the MP3 tags to get track 
information).  I ahd thought originally of swapping cards for different 
types of music, but it takes so long, I can't be bothered.  I bought one 
of those Sansa cards that came with preloaded music (when they were on 
sale shortly before they disappeared), and the time to build up the 
database means I've not put it back in since I got the 16gig microSD card.
That was a relatively cheap way to get music for the thing, and it had an 
odd selection, too much that I already had, yet some stuff I didn't, not 
just artists but songs of artist I already had. The problem wsa, one 
couldn't select a given song, so you just had to wait for it to appear.

   Michael

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#3707

FromAndy Leighton <andyl@azaal.plus.com>
Date2014-06-16 10:43 -0500
Message-ID<slrnlpu44c.ecb.andyl@azaal.plus.com>
In reply to#3706
On Mon, 16 Jun 2014 10:32:51 -0400, Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> wrote:
> On Mon, 16 Jun 2014, Andy Leighton wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 16 Jun 2014 06:30:57 +1000, Oeter Johns <oj19854@nospam.com> wrote:
>> Not just ipods.  I recently bought a SanDisk Sansa Clip+. 8GB of storage
>> on the player plus it uses microSDXC cards so I have another 64GB of
>> storage there.  It was pretty cheap, and is very small. The inbuilt
>> software has database limitations but it is very easy to replace it
>> with RockBox (which I did even before loading any music onto it).
>>
> I thought iPods had at this point become more like a small tablet (or, an 
> iPhone without the phone capabiity).  I gather you can run other programs
> on it, making it a more universal device. 

I think the Shuffle is still available isn't it?  I don't really know
I am not an Apple person.

> The flyers here aren't showing much in the way of MP3 players in between 
> the iPod and the cheap ones.  I thus thought Sansa had gotten out of the 
> MP3 business.

Sandisk still show them on their website, and list a new model the
Clip Sport.

> I certainly bought a Sansa Fuze because it was more open, and had the card
> slot.  

The card slot was a big selling point for me too.

-- 
Andy Leighton => andyl@azaal.plus.com
"The Lord is my shepherd, but we still lost the sheep dog trials" 
   - Robert Rankin, _They Came And Ate Us_

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#3711

FromMichael Black <et472@ncf.ca>
Date2014-06-16 13:13 -0400
Message-ID<alpine.LNX.2.02.1406161311170.9285@darkstar.example.org>
In reply to#3707
On Mon, 16 Jun 2014, Andy Leighton wrote:

> On Mon, 16 Jun 2014 10:32:51 -0400, Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> wrote:
>> On Mon, 16 Jun 2014, Andy Leighton wrote:
>>
>>> On Mon, 16 Jun 2014 06:30:57 +1000, Oeter Johns <oj19854@nospam.com> wrote:
>>> Not just ipods.  I recently bought a SanDisk Sansa Clip+. 8GB of storage
>>> on the player plus it uses microSDXC cards so I have another 64GB of
>>> storage there.  It was pretty cheap, and is very small. The inbuilt
>>> software has database limitations but it is very easy to replace it
>>> with RockBox (which I did even before loading any music onto it).
>>>
>> I thought iPods had at this point become more like a small tablet (or, an
>> iPhone without the phone capabiity).  I gather you can run other programs
>> on it, making it a more universal device.
>
> I think the Shuffle is still available isn't it?  I don't really know
> I am not an Apple person.
>
Would you buy an MP3 player that doesnt' have a display?

I bought a $20 about ten years ago that didn't display the MP3 tags, but 
did have a display.  That was useless enough.

So I discounted the Shuffle, though I think they are there in the flyers.

Maybe it's just that Apple's brand is strong enough that there is demand, 
so the flyers here have them. But I was certain the Sansa players had 
disappeared, it's been a few years since I saw them in the flyers (though 
I never looked further than the flyers).

   Michael

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#3716

From"Oeter Johns" <oj19854@nospam.com>
Date2014-06-17 06:45 +1000
Message-ID<c093d8Ftnb1U1@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#3707

"Andy Leighton" <andyl@azaal.plus.com> wrote in message 
news:slrnlpu44c.ecb.andyl@azaal.plus.com...
> On Mon, 16 Jun 2014 10:32:51 -0400, Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> wrote:
>> On Mon, 16 Jun 2014, Andy Leighton wrote:
>>
>>> On Mon, 16 Jun 2014 06:30:57 +1000, Oeter Johns <oj19854@nospam.com> 
>>> wrote:
>>> Not just ipods.  I recently bought a SanDisk Sansa Clip+. 8GB of storage
>>> on the player plus it uses microSDXC cards so I have another 64GB of
>>> storage there.  It was pretty cheap, and is very small. The inbuilt
>>> software has database limitations but it is very easy to replace it
>>> with RockBox (which I did even before loading any music onto it).
>>>
>> I thought iPods had at this point become more like a small tablet (or, an
>> iPhone without the phone capabiity).  I gather you can run other programs
>> on it, making it a more universal device.
>
> I think the Shuffle is still available isn't it?

Yep
https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&tbm=shop&q=ipod+shuffle
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_1?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=ipod%20shuffle

I don't really know
> I am not an Apple person.
>
>> The flyers here aren't showing much in the way of MP3 players in between
>> the iPod and the cheap ones.  I thus thought Sansa had gotten out of the
>> MP3 business.
>
> Sandisk still show them on their website, and list a new model the
> Clip Sport.
>
>> I certainly bought a Sansa Fuze because it was more open, and had the 
>> card
>> slot.
>
> The card slot was a big selling point for me too.
 

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#3715

From"Oeter Johns" <oj19854@nospam.com>
Date2014-06-17 06:36 +1000
Message-ID<c092r6FtjevU1@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#3706

"Michael Black" <et472@ncf.ca> wrote in message 
news:alpine.LNX.2.02.1406161025080.9025@darkstar.example.org...
> On Mon, 16 Jun 2014, Andy Leighton wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 16 Jun 2014 06:30:57 +1000, Oeter Johns <oj19854@nospam.com> 
>> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> "Michael Black" <et472@ncf.ca> wrote in message
>>> news:alpine.LNX.2.02.1406151551290.7355@darkstar.example.org...
>>>> On Sun, 15 Jun 2014, root wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> I used to prefer FB reader, but now I prefer EBook-Droid as
>>>>> the reader app for my tablets. Among other things, EBookDroid
>>>>> can handle djvu formatted content.
>>>>>
>>>> And that seems to be where things are going, it seems like the recent
>>>> ebook readers are tablets.
>>>>
>>>> There was an article some years back about how standalone devices were
>>>> loosing way, I hadn't noticed, but did afterwards.  Most of the MP3
>>>> players are gone, unless you buy a really cheap one (I did, it didn't 
>>>> do
>>>> folders).
>>>
>>> There are still plenty of ipods around.
>>
>> Not just ipods.  I recently bought a SanDisk Sansa Clip+. 8GB of storage
>> on the player plus it uses microSDXC cards so I have another 64GB of
>> storage there.  It was pretty cheap, and is very small. The inbuilt
>> software has database limitations but it is very easy to replace it
>> with RockBox (which I did even before loading any music onto it).
>>
> I thought iPods had at this point become more like a small tablet

No.

> (or, an iPhone without the phone capabiity).

Yes.

> I gather you can run other programs  on it, making it a more universal 
> device.

Yes, particularly with the ipod touch.

> I thought the later models even had built in cameras.

Only the high end ones do, the low end ones like the ipod shuffle don't.

> The flyers here aren't showing much in the way of MP3 players in between 
> the iPod and the cheap ones.  I thus thought Sansa had gotten out of the 
> MP3 business.
>
> I certainly bought a Sansa Fuze because it was more open, and had the card 
> slot.  Mine Sansa Fuze was an 8gig, and then I got a 16gig microSD card. 
> Back in December I got a 32gig microSD card when there were some really 
> good prices, but I haven't swapped it in.  And yes, according to what I've 
> read, the limits of the software will fill up before all of that 32gig.
>
> One thing that disappoints me is that it takes so long to build up that 
> database (I presume because it's looking at the MP3 tags to get track 
> information).  I ahd thought originally of swapping cards for different 
> types of music, but it takes so long, I can't be bothered.  I bought one 
> of those Sansa cards that came with preloaded music (when they were on 
> sale shortly before they disappeared), and the time to build up the 
> database means I've not put it back in since I got the 16gig microSD card.
> That was a relatively cheap way to get music for the thing, and it had an 
> odd selection, too much that I already had, yet some stuff I didn't, not 
> just artists but songs of artist I already had. The problem wsa, one 
> couldn't select a given song, so you just had to wait for it to appear.
 

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#3691

FromRS Wood <rsw@therandymon.com>
Date2014-06-15 22:43 +0000
Message-ID<lnl7j4$bu5$1@solani.org>
In reply to#3679
On 2014-06-15, Bob Eager <news0002@eager.cx> wrote:
> On Sun, 15 Jun 2014 12:05:41 +0100, Stanley Daniel de Liver wrote:
>
>> I have an e-ink reader, just the job for erm reading, and just about
>> usable for simple web browsing, if nothing else to hand.
>
> What do you use? I currently have an old Kindle which is nearly 4 years 
> old and on its last legs.
>
> I am aware that some e-ink readers are limited in the formats they can 
> handle; that's not a problem as I can convert. I'm more concerned about 
> those (I *think* the Nook is one) where only part of the storage can be 
> used for non-supplier books.
>

I've got the Nook simple touch (no glow light, bought it previous to
that innovation).  You can plug it into any computer via a USB cable and
upload to it whatever the heck you like.  There's also a slot on the
side where you can insert a chip (forget what they're called, but
they're small), providing a way to have gigabytes of epubs on your Nook.
I'm pretty happy with the hardware - I use mine with B&N's store, but
also plug it into a Linux box and Calibre is more than adequate (and in
a lot of ways, better than the alternatives) to stuff it full of my own,
DRM-free files.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#3693

FromBob Eager <news0002@eager.cx>
Date2014-06-15 23:26 +0000
Message-ID<c06ockF5h0rU4@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#3691
On Sun, 15 Jun 2014 22:43:48 +0000, RS Wood wrote:

> On 2014-06-15, Bob Eager <news0002@eager.cx> wrote:
>> On Sun, 15 Jun 2014 12:05:41 +0100, Stanley Daniel de Liver wrote:
>>
>>> I have an e-ink reader, just the job for erm reading, and just about
>>> usable for simple web browsing, if nothing else to hand.
>>
>> What do you use? I currently have an old Kindle which is nearly 4 years
>> old and on its last legs.
>>
>> I am aware that some e-ink readers are limited in the formats they can
>> handle; that's not a problem as I can convert. I'm more concerned about
>> those (I *think* the Nook is one) where only part of the storage can be
>> used for non-supplier books.
>>
>>
> I've got the Nook simple touch (no glow light, bought it previous to
> that innovation).  You can plug it into any computer via a USB cable and
> upload to it whatever the heck you like.  There's also a slot on the
> side where you can insert a chip (forget what they're called, but
> they're small), providing a way to have gigabytes of epubs on your Nook.
> I'm pretty happy with the hardware - I use mine with B&N's store, but
> also plug it into a Linux box and Calibre is more than adequate (and in
> a lot of ways, better than the alternatives) to stuff it full of my own,
> DRM-free files.

It says on Wikipedia (which I treat with caution):

"has 4 GB of storage, of which 2 GB is reserved for Nook Store content 
and 512 MB for additional user content"

Is this true? I have no interest in B&N content...



-- 
Using UNIX since v6 (1975)...

Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
 http://www.mirrorservice.org

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#3717

From"Stanley Daniel de Liver" <admin@127.0.0.1>
Date2014-06-16 22:01 +0100
Message-ID<op.xhkfbzlno4et73@dell3100>
In reply to#3693
On Mon, 16 Jun 2014 00:26:12 +0100, Bob Eager <news0002@eager.cx> wrote:

> On Sun, 15 Jun 2014 22:43:48 +0000, RS Wood wrote:
>
>> On 2014-06-15, Bob Eager <news0002@eager.cx> wrote:
>>> On Sun, 15 Jun 2014 12:05:41 +0100, Stanley Daniel de Liver wrote:
>>>
>>>> I have an e-ink reader, just the job for erm reading, and just about
>>>> usable for simple web browsing, if nothing else to hand.
>>>
>>> What do you use? I currently have an old Kindle which is nearly 4 years
>>> old and on its last legs.
>>>
>>> I am aware that some e-ink readers are limited in the formats they can
>>> handle; that's not a problem as I can convert. I'm more concerned about
>>> those (I *think* the Nook is one) where only part of the storage can be
>>> used for non-supplier books.
>>>
>>>
>> I've got the Nook simple touch (no glow light, bought it previous to
>> that innovation).  You can plug it into any computer via a USB cable and
>> upload to it whatever the heck you like.  There's also a slot on the
>> side where you can insert a chip (forget what they're called, but
>> they're small), providing a way to have gigabytes of epubs on your Nook.
>> I'm pretty happy with the hardware - I use mine with B&N's store, but
>> also plug it into a Linux box and Calibre is more than adequate (and in
>> a lot of ways, better than the alternatives) to stuff it full of my own,
>> DRM-free files.
>
> It says on Wikipedia (which I treat with caution):
>
> "has 4 GB of storage, of which 2 GB is reserved for Nook Store content
> and 512 MB for additional user content"
>
> Is this true? I have no interest in B&N content...
>
I think so; but it's not too hard to get most of that back; and you can  
plug in an SD card;
see text above.
>
>


-- 
It's a money /life balance.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#3667

From"Oeter Johns" <oj19854@nospam.com>
Date2014-06-15 06:27 +1000
Message-ID<c03pj1Fq28hU1@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#3661

"Michael Black" <et472@ncf.ca> wrote in message 
news:alpine.LNX.2.02.1406131644360.3888@darkstar.example.org...
> On Fri, 13 Jun 2014, Alan Bowler wrote:
>
>> On 2014-03-23 4:34 PM, Whiskers wrote:
>>> Perhaps makers will start fitting both types of display to the same
>>> gadget; I believe at least one smartphone model is going to have both
>>> soon.
>>
>> May not need both.  A few years back someone demonstrated
>> a colour e-ink display fast enough for video.
>>
>>
> I got my ebook reader last year, about this time, for about fifty dollars 
> with tax.  That was on sale, but it wsa a Kobo Mini.
>
> There are advantages to a dedicated reader.

There are even bigger advantages to reading
your ebooks on a smartphone or small tablet.

I'd already bought a
> Blackberry Plabyook, but it's a bit heavy.  I'd doze off and drop the 
> Playbook, while if I doze off holding the Kobo Mini, it's usually still in 
> my hand when i wake up.

It would be with a smartphone too. And its easier to organise a
decent holder for it so that you don't drop it when you doze off too.

> The e-ink readers don't draw as much current.

Yes, but there are so many other advantages with using
a smartphone and its no big deal to charge it every night.

> And since they don't do rapid pages so well, one is less likely to get 
> distracted by the Web.

That's a remarkably silly reason for having one.

The Kobo Mini does have a browser, but it's too
> slow and limited.

So its useless if you want to check something you have just read on the web 
etc.

> I bought the tablet since if I was spending money I figured spend a bit 
> more and get full function.  And I'm happy with the tablet as a tablet. 
> But  I realized soon that I would be buying a dedicated ebook reader at 
> some point, the experience of the tablet made me realize a dedicated one 
> was the way to go.

I got tablets and smartphones and see no point in dedicated
ebook readers that can't do what I do when reading ebooks,
check stuff on the web, do all sort of other stuff like set
reminders because of something I have just read, etc etc etc.

> Apart from weight and size, the ebook reader really is a low drain on 
> power, it lasts weeks between charging (at least when I've got the wifi 
> turned off), while the Playbook needs charging every few hours (or left 
> plugged into the charger).

Any decent smartphone or small tablet will do fine on a single
charge a day while you are sleeping. You have to put it down
to go to sleep and so you might as well put it on the charger.

The only time the longer time between charges really matters
much is when travelling and its easy to handle that situation now.

> I have a Microsoft Surface 2, won last month from a contest.  That's the 
> best of the lot, but it's too big still to relax with a book.

Yeah, the smaller tablets make more sense for that.

I prefer to read on the big 27" widescreen monitor
with a mouse on a ripped off book cover on my lap
in a deep armchair. I compute like that too.

I do use the smartphone for other situations like the doctor's waiting room
etc and it's more convenient than the paperback I used to take with me 
there,
particularly being able to carry a variety of books trivially and have the 
system
keep track of where I got up to in each of them automatically and auto synch
with the other systems I read ebooks on too.

> And sadly, the Kobo app doesn't do magazines, and I admit magazines with 
> their glossy color photos really need a fancier tablet to read them.

I haven't bothered with magazines in decades now.

> So now I have three options.  The Playbook is large enough that I can live 
> with it, but still small enough to pack into something like a large 
> pocket.

I prefer a smartphone for that situation.

> I cant' do that with the Surface 2.  But the Kobo Mini is lighter and 
> smaller, so I can take it to read books, and the browser is there in case 
> I come across free wifi and a need to use it.

> It's hard to judge.  I would like to see cheaper ebook readers but the 
> trend seems to be towards unified devices.

Because that's what most want.

> Mp3 players are disappearing,

Not really, particularly for kids who sometimes have them instead of phones.

> low end cameras are fewer in number, the only cheap GPS units I've seen 
> have been at garage and rummage sales.

You can still buy them new, but it makes no sense to do that,
any decent smartphone can do that now.

The assumption being that you get
> all the functions with a tablet.

Or a smartphone. The ones with the best screens are very readable. 

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#1919

From"Stanley Daniel de Liver" <admin@127.0.0.1>
Date2014-03-23 19:09 +0000
Message-ID<op.xc6vhowzo4et73@dell3100>
In reply to#1913
On Sun, 23 Mar 2014 14:43:13 -0000, Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com>  
wrote:

> On 2014-03-23, Stanley Daniel de Liver <admin@127.0.0.1> wrote:
>> On Sun, 23 Mar 2014 12:06:53 -0000, RS Wood <rsw@therandymon.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2014-03-19, greymausg <maus@mail.com> wrote:
>>>> I was reading "Mining the Social Web", obtained (!) from the Internet,
>>>> and found it interesting, so I downloaded  the second edition from
>>>> ora.. I had a few instructional ebooks before, and found them hard to
>>>> deal with, bad   fonts, etc.  The above book seems to be where things
>>>> are going, nicely intigrated. Most of the address are bit.ly/* which
>>>> entailed just clicking on (I find some of these shortened addresses
>>>> had to deal with in printed form, bad eyesight)
>>>>
>>>> As I wrote, seems to be a pointer to the future.
>>>>
>>>> (The book itself?... well, its all about going through the official
>>>> API.  No great fun)
>>>>
>>>> Hello,anyone there?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> I'm here, and I'll ignore my plonkiful colleague here.  "Mining the
>>> Social Web" sounds like the worst book ever published - I'd hate to  
>>> read
>>> it.  But I agree with you about ebooks in general.
>>>
>>> I was a reluctant convert - still very much like my bookshelf and my
>>> collection and some things like a few poetry anthologies I like to just
>>> flip through over coffee when I want a change from the glowing screen  
>>> of
>>> my RSS reader.  But I almost never buy hardcovers anymore and
>>> increasingly find myself going straight to the ebook version.  The
>>> exception is tech manuals, which I like in paper and at my side.  But
>>> fiction, magazines, literature, short stories, all that  kind of stuff  
>>> -
>>> I like the hassle-free lifestyle of ebooks.
>>>
>>> My one caveat is that I buy from Barnes & Noble because they use EPUB
>>> and though they DRM it, it is so trivially cracked using Calibre that
>>> it's practically a non-issue.  That means I get to 'keep' my ebooks in
>>> an open, standard, published format.  I refuse to deal with the more
>>> popular Kindle and its AZW format (MOBI + other stuff) because it's  
>>> less
>>> open.
>>>
>>> That means as Amazon slowly wins over the market and B&N is slowly
>>> sidelined, I am disappointed.
>
> I have yet to buy an ebook; my use for ebook readers is for access to
> out-of-print or out-of-copyright books from, for example, Project
> Gutenberg.  They're also handy for use with the instruction manuals
> available only as PDF files.
>
> The biggest problem with ebooks is navigation; you can't slide a
> finger-nail between pages at roughly the right distance between front
> and back and then flick pages to find what you want, for example, and
> having to go to a menu 'tree' to move about in a book is horribly slow -
> or impossible, if the book hasn't been formatted to match the way your
> ebook reader needs.  There are ebook readers that can't even 'do'
> bookmarks!
>
some do; but OTOH, try doing a scan for a particular word in a non-ebook.
(using an Index is cheating!)
>>> There are still a couple of bricks-and-mortar bookstores I visit, but
>>> they're struggling and all hanging on only because they've specialized
>>> in something off-beat.  But I'd love if you could come in, browse,  
>>> drink
>>> coffee, chat with the proprietor - who knows and loves books - and then
>>> take your purchases via some digital mechanism.  We're not there yet,
>>> and maybe never will be, but it certainly seems like a way of avoiding
>>> the currently inevitable monopoly provider model, which is anathema to
>>> the economies of small towns.
>>
>> In the UK a bookshop is (was?) a bookshop; there's no coffee provided.
>> Unless one or two have latterly adopted that leftpond practice.
>
> There are bookshops that have coffee bars in them in London.  I suspect
> the idea arrived with US television programmes or films.  There are also
> a few restaurants with shelves of books for the patrons to use.  I
> approve of both arrangements.  I also know, and like, a public library
> that has a small coffee shop inside it.  Not in London but still in the
> UK, I used to know a Church of England parish church whose adjoining
> church hall had a licensed bar (but no books other than what you'd
> expect in a church).
>
> If I'm going to pay for a book, I want a hard copy; a proper paperback
> at least.  I am repelled by the idea of paying money for a licence to
> possess one digital copy which is not transferable to anyone else, and
> possibly not even to another device owned by me, and which can be
> withdrawn at any time the provider sees fit.  Books are for sharing and
> passing on and going back to; that's perfectly possible with ebooks, but
> not while the publishers try to impose 'digital rights management' and
> 'licenses' and other nonsense making such activities 'shady' or
> 'illegal'.
Totally agree.



-- 
It's a money /life balance.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#1928

FromLewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies>
Date2014-03-24 01:55 +0000
Message-ID<slrnliv440.4s1.g.kreme@amelia.local>
In reply to#1913
In message <slrnlitso1.23e.catwheezel@ID-107770.user.individual.net> 
  Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> wrote:
> The biggest problem with ebooks is navigation; you can't slide a
> finger-nail between pages at roughly the right distance between front
> and back and then flick pages to find what you want,

I can. Not PHYSICAL pages, but yes, I slide my finger along the bottom
until I'm say, half way in, then tap right/left to flip pages to the
right page.

> If I'm going to pay for a book, I want a hard copy; a proper paperback
> at least.  I am repelled by the idea of paying money for a licence to
> possess one digital copy which is not transferable to anyone else, and
> possibly not even to another device owned by me, and which can be
> withdrawn at any time the provider sees fit.  Books are for sharing and
> passing on and going back to; that's perfectly possible with ebooks, but
> not while the publishers try to impose 'digital rights management' and
> 'licenses' and other nonsense making such activities 'shady' or
> 'illegal'.

Fortunately, stripping the DRM from ebooks is trivial.

-- 
Penny, I'm a physicist. I have a working knowledge of the entire
universe and everything it contains.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#1933

FromWhiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com>
Date2014-03-24 10:35 +0000
Message-ID<slrnlj02jc.1j0.catwheezel@ID-107770.user.individual.net>
In reply to#1928
On 2014-03-24, Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
> In message <slrnlitso1.23e.catwheezel@ID-107770.user.individual.net>
> Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> wrote:
>> The biggest problem with ebooks is navigation; you can't slide a
>> finger-nail between pages at roughly the right distance between front
>> and back and then flick pages to find what you want,
>
> I can. Not PHYSICAL pages, but yes, I slide my finger along the bottom
> until I'm say, half way in, then tap right/left to flip pages to the
> right page.
>
>> If I'm going to pay for a book, I want a hard copy; a proper
>> paperback at least.  I am repelled by the idea of paying money for a
>> licence to possess one digital copy which is not transferable to
>> anyone else, and possibly not even to another device owned by me, and
>> which can be withdrawn at any time the provider sees fit.  Books are
>> for sharing and passing on and going back to; that's perfectly
>> possible with ebooks, but not while the publishers try to impose
>> 'digital rights management' and 'licenses' and other nonsense making
>> such activities 'shady' or 'illegal'.
>
> Fortunately, stripping the DRM from ebooks is trivial.

But doing so contravenes the 'licence' or 'end user licensing agreement'
to which you have to agree before you can access the original file.  The
publishers will compare this with a thief getting into a money-box by
picking a simple lock; what matters is that it was done, not how easy it
might have been.  If the licence to read an ebook is found to be
enforceable in law then the publishers will start going after people who
they believe have breached that licence - just as the recorded music
industry have been chasing people who make unencrypted copies of CDs and
MPEGs available.

With printed books and pressed gramophone records, it's easy for the
industry to enforce the idea that if you want another copy, you have to
get it from them and pay for it.  They can't control what you do with
that copy, but they can be reasonably certain that any copies in
circulation have been made by them and paid for.  

Digital media have fundamentally changed those facts.  If I want to
share a book that I'm reading on my tablet, without sharing the device
and all its other content, I can transmit it to my friend's device by
cable or wifi or bluetooth or infrared or some other means - but that
creates a duplicate of the original.  Even if publishers try to include
a program that will erase the original if it detects a copy being made,
any code that can be invented can be countered by other code so such
attempts at 'protection' are ultimately futile.  

This is fine for end users, at least in the short term, but is very bad
news for the content providers whose income depends on getting paid per
copy created.  It's bad enough for it to make some businesses
unsustainable; as already noted in this thread, actual bricks and mortar
book shops (and record shops too) are becoming rarer.  Publishers too
face a real threat to their long term survival, and that in turn means
that writers will lose that avenue of support and payment.  

Creative types are adaptable and will eventually find new ways of
earning from their work, but the intermediaries who depend on both the
creators and the consumers co-operating with them, will have to work out
some new way to survive, otherwise they will vanish.  We can expect them
to fight very hard, and possibly 'dirty', to preserve themselves.

-- 
-- ^^^^^^^^^^
--  Whiskers 
-- ~~~~~~~~~~

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#1937

FromPeter Flass <Peter_Flass@Yahoo.com>
Date2014-03-24 13:01 -0400
Message-ID<lgpaaf$acd$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#1933
On 03/24/2014 06:35 AM, Whiskers wrote:
> On 2014-03-24, Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
>> In message <slrnlitso1.23e.catwheezel@ID-107770.user.individual.net>
>> Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> wrote:
>>> The biggest problem with ebooks is navigation; you can't slide a
>>> finger-nail between pages at roughly the right distance between front
>>> and back and then flick pages to find what you want,
>>
>> I can. Not PHYSICAL pages, but yes, I slide my finger along the bottom
>> until I'm say, half way in, then tap right/left to flip pages to the
>> right page.
>>
>>> If I'm going to pay for a book, I want a hard copy; a proper
>>> paperback at least.  I am repelled by the idea of paying money for a
>>> licence to possess one digital copy which is not transferable to
>>> anyone else, and possibly not even to another device owned by me, and
>>> which can be withdrawn at any time the provider sees fit.  Books are
>>> for sharing and passing on and going back to; that's perfectly
>>> possible with ebooks, but not while the publishers try to impose
>>> 'digital rights management' and 'licenses' and other nonsense making
>>> such activities 'shady' or 'illegal'.
>>
>> Fortunately, stripping the DRM from ebooks is trivial.
>
> But doing so contravenes the 'licence' or 'end user licensing agreeme

There is legality and there is what is right.  They're often not the 
same things these days when mobney buys law.
...
> With printed books and pressed gramophone records, it's easy for the
> industry to enforce the idea that if you want another copy, you have to
> get it from them and pay for it.  They can't control what you do with
> that copy, but they can be reasonably certain that any copies in
> circulation have been made by them and paid for.

I think various ebook vendors have the option to "lend" a book to 
someone else, in exactly thee dame fashion you lend a physical book. 
they get a copy for a period of time and you lose access to yours.  In 
fact this is better than lending a physical book, since the software 
insures you get it back.

I think Amazon has a "lending library" facility where you donate your 
book when you're done and they lend it to other Kindle users.  I haven't 
yet checked this out to see how it works.

I'm happy to work with these restrictions.  I'm not trying to rip anyone 
off.

-- 
Pete

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#1939

FromDag-Erling Smørgrav <des@des.no>
Date2014-03-24 17:15 +0100
Message-ID<86bnwv609r.fsf@nine.des.no>
In reply to#1937
Peter Flass <Peter_Flass@Yahoo.com> writes:
> I think Amazon has a "lending library" facility where you donate your
> book when you're done and they lend it to other Kindle users.  I
> haven't yet checked this out to see how it works.

Kindle loaning is not available in my neck of the woods, but from what I
gather, you can only lend to someone you already know, and only for 14
days, and only once per copy, and only if the publisher had opted in.

There used to be a site called LendInk that matched lenders with
loaners.  A bunch of third-rate authors who didn't bother to check the
facts behind the latest twitter rumor had it taken down under the
assumption that it was distributing pirated ebooks.  The after-the-fact
rationalization was not pretty.

DES
-- 
Dag-Erling Smørgrav - des@des.no

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#1938

FromAhem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net>
Date2014-03-24 15:07 +0000
Message-ID<20140324150738.5356ce46db117f1d68f9734f@eircom.net>
In reply to#1933
On Mon, 24 Mar 2014 10:35:24 +0000
Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> wrote:

> Creative types are adaptable and will eventually find new ways of
> earning from their work, but the intermediaries who depend on both the
> creators and the consumers co-operating with them, will have to work out
> some new way to survive, otherwise they will vanish.  We can expect them
> to fight very hard, and possibly 'dirty', to preserve themselves.

	I would be perfectly happy to see the intermediaries vanish and the
creators benefit directly from the consumers. As far as I'm concerned they
only exist to funnel creations in one direction and money in the other, if
they can be rendered obsolete so much the better.

-- 
Steve O'Hara-Smith                          |   Directable Mirror Arrays
C:>WIN                                      | A better way to focus the sun
The computer obeys and wins.                |    licences available see
You lose and Bill collects.                 |    http://www.sohara.org/

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#1942

FromRich <rich@example.com>
Date2014-03-24 17:13 +0000
Message-ID<533067cd$0$17082$c3e8da3$dd9697d2@news.astraweb.com>
In reply to#1938
In comp.misc Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
> On Mon, 24 Mar 2014 10:35:24 +0000
> Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> wrote:

> > Creative types are adaptable and will eventually find new ways of
> > earning from their work, but the intermediaries who depend on both
> > the creators and the consumers co-operating with them, will have to
> > work out some new way to survive, otherwise they will vanish.  We
> > can expect them to fight very hard, and possibly 'dirty', to
> > preserve themselves.

>         I would be perfectly happy to see the intermediaries vanish
> and the creators benefit directly from the consumers. As far as I'm
> concerned they only exist to funnel creations in one direction and
> money in the other, if they can be rendered obsolete so much the
> better.

How very true.  The intermediaries served a purpose when "publishing"
involved needing to apply ink to paper, bind the result into a book,
ship the book to a seller, etc.

The internet allows for the creators to sell directly to the consumer,
with no intermediary necessary for "distribution" purposes.  That is
what is seriously disrupting the market for music, books, and films. 
And so much the better.  The intermediaries are no longer necessary.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#1945

FromWalter Banks <walter@bytecraft.com>
Date2014-03-24 13:07 -0500
Message-ID<5330744D.23831713@bytecraft.com>
In reply to#1942

Rich wrote:

> In comp.misc Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
> > On Mon, 24 Mar 2014 10:35:24 +0000
> > Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> wrote:
>
> > > Creative types are adaptable and will eventually find new ways of
> > > earning from their work, but the intermediaries who depend on both
> > > the creators and the consumers co-operating with them, will have to
> > > work out some new way to survive, otherwise they will vanish.  We
> > > can expect them to fight very hard, and possibly 'dirty', to
> > > preserve themselves.
>
> >         I would be perfectly happy to see the intermediaries vanish
> > and the creators benefit directly from the consumers. As far as I'm
> > concerned they only exist to funnel creations in one direction and
> > money in the other, if they can be rendered obsolete so much the
> > better.
>
> How very true.  The intermediaries served a purpose when "publishing"
> involved needing to apply ink to paper, bind the result into a book,
> ship the book to a seller, etc.
>
> The internet allows for the creators to sell directly to the consumer,
> with no intermediary necessary for "distribution" purposes.  That is
> what is seriously disrupting the market for music, books, and films.
> And so much the better.  The intermediaries are no longer necessary.

Publishers also provide editing services that puts authors works
in a form that can be understood by the intended audience in the
expected context. That is a skill set that very few authors have
(even very good ones). Editors also rarely make good authors.

w..




[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#1946

From"Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net>
Date2014-03-24 13:28 -0500
Message-ID<bpbbq6FgmrkU1@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#1945
"Walter Banks" wrote:

> Publishers also provide editing services that puts authors works
> in a form that can be understood by the intended audience in the
> expected context. That is a skill set that very few authors have
> (even very good ones). Editors also rarely make good authors.

I think the last three editors in the world work for _The New Yorker_. 
Everything else seems to be kbd -> word processor -> spell checker -> 
consumer.

I had occasion to work with real editors on two occasions, both for 
technical writing and I was just amazed at how they could increase the 
quality.  I think I had other editors too, but they weren't visible to me 
and I didn't actually talk to them.

I have an idea for a program the world needs.  A spell checker that makes a 
list of words that you allowed them to change. In anything of any size I can 
easily allow two or three changes I did not really want. maybe that will be 
in the first Word Processor to exceed the 1 TB barrier. 

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#1955

FromPaul Sture <nospam@sture.ch>
Date2014-03-24 21:48 +0100
Message-ID<d9i60b-iff.ln1@news.chingola.ch>
In reply to#1946
On 2014-03-24, Osmium <r124c4u102@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> I had occasion to work with real editors on two occasions, both for 
> technical writing and I was just amazed at how they could increase the 
> quality.  I think I had other editors too, but they weren't visible to me 
> and I didn't actually talk to them.
>
> I have an idea for a program the world needs.  A spell checker that makes a 
> list of words that you allowed them to change. In anything of any size I can 
> easily allow two or three changes I did not really want. maybe that will be 
> in the first Word Processor to exceed the 1 TB barrier. 

That's an excellent idea.

The "out of the box" behaviour of various packages leaves a lot to be
desired, particularly with regard to so called "smart quotes" and emdash.
Those are just the examples which caused me grief.  I am sure there are
other examples.  My examples:

1) Web sites which contain snippets of code, where double quotes and/or
   single quotes are automatically converted to "smart quotes" by the
   publishing process.  The results are not valid code and are a real pain
   in the neck if you want to copy and paste them to prove them out.

2) I haven't looked at OpenOffice since LibreOffice came out, but OpenOffice
   would silently apply spelling autocorrections to spreadsheet data.
   The one that got me was the silent conversion of hypen to emdash, and
   it wasn't discovered until we tried importing some spreadsheet results
   into a database.

-- 
Paul Sture

"In that case," said Napoleon, "let us wait twenty minutes; when the enemy
is making a false movement we must take good care not to interrupt him."

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


Page 2 of 9 — ← Prev page 1 [2] 3 4 5 6 7 8 9  Next page →

Back to top | Article view | comp.misc


csiph-web