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Groups > comp.lang.python > #81089 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Michael Torrie <torriem@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2014-11-20 09:51 -0700 |
| Last post | 2014-11-21 12:39 +1100 |
| Articles | 2 on this page of 62 — 13 participants |
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Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Michael Torrie <torriem@gmail.com> - 2014-11-20 09:51 -0700
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-11-20 20:56 +0200
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-11-21 10:49 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-11-21 08:36 +0200
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-11-21 18:02 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-11-21 09:14 +0200
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-11-21 18:29 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-11-21 10:16 +0200
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-11-21 19:24 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-11-21 08:03 -0800
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-11-21 18:36 +0200
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-11-22 03:52 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-11-22 15:38 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-11-22 08:40 +0200
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-11-23 00:50 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-11-23 01:17 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-11-22 16:18 +0200
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Roy Smith <roy@panix.com> - 2014-11-22 09:44 -0500
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-11-22 16:56 +0200
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2014-11-22 07:44 -0800
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2014-11-22 07:57 -0800
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-11-22 19:49 +0200
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-11-22 18:17 +0000
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2014-11-22 11:32 -0800
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2014-11-22 11:17 -0800
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-11-23 07:17 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-11-22 22:04 +0000
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-11-23 09:31 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-11-22 23:38 +0000
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2014-11-23 04:52 -0800
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) random832@fastmail.us - 2014-11-22 20:52 -0500
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-11-23 13:11 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) random832@fastmail.us - 2014-11-22 22:10 -0500
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com> - 2014-11-23 11:33 -0500
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-11-24 03:39 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) random832@fastmail.us - 2014-11-23 13:13 -0500
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Dave Angel <d@davea.name> - 2014-11-23 15:31 -0500
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-11-24 09:22 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com> - 2014-11-23 20:24 -0500
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) random832@fastmail.us - 2014-11-24 00:05 -0500
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Gregory Ewing <greg.ewing@canterbury.ac.nz> - 2014-11-24 11:51 +1300
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-11-24 09:59 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-11-24 08:57 +0200
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-11-24 18:18 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-11-24 09:40 +0200
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-11-25 09:56 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-11-25 10:08 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-11-25 08:23 +0200
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-11-25 22:56 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-11-26 00:07 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2014-11-25 06:26 -0800
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) random832@fastmail.us - 2014-11-22 20:35 -0500
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-11-23 17:17 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-11-23 17:37 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) wxjmfauth@gmail.com - 2014-11-23 07:40 -0800
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-11-21 11:32 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-11-21 12:10 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2014-11-22 02:23 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-11-22 02:40 +1100
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Tim Chase <python.list@tim.thechases.com> - 2014-11-21 10:00 -0600
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) random832@fastmail.us - 2014-11-20 20:31 -0500
Re: python 2.7 and unicode (one more time) Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2014-11-21 12:39 +1100
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| From | random832@fastmail.us |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-11-20 20:31 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <mailman.16073.1416533493.18130.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #81154 |
On Thu, Nov 20, 2014, at 20:10, Chris Angelico wrote: > 2) Languages which use a different alphabet (eg Cyrillic - Russian, > Bulgarian). You could possibly cram them into an eight-bit encoding > without tipping ASCII out, but I'm not sure. In Unicode, these > languages are all easily supported by the BMP, as they don't use a > huge number of characters each. There are numerous eight-bit encodings that support latin and one other alphabet. Remember, ASCII is a seven-bit encoding, and an eight-bit encoding is basically two seven-bit encodings. The most difficult (of those still possible at all) language to encode in eight bits is actually Vietnamese, which uses the Latin alphabet, due to the sheer number of accented letters used. Windows' encoding of it (along with some other lesser used encodings, all for Vietnamese) is the only 8-bit encoding to use combining accents, in a way unfortunately incompatible with unicode normalization if naively translated, whereas VISCII sacrifices a handful of C0 control characters in addition to fully packing the high half with letters. -- Random832
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| From | Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-11-21 12:39 +1100 |
| Message-ID | <mailman.16074.1416533965.18130.python-list@python.org> |
| In reply to | #81154 |
On Fri, Nov 21, 2014 at 12:31 PM, <random832@fastmail.us> wrote: > On Thu, Nov 20, 2014, at 20:10, Chris Angelico wrote: >> 2) Languages which use a different alphabet (eg Cyrillic - Russian, >> Bulgarian). You could possibly cram them into an eight-bit encoding >> without tipping ASCII out, but I'm not sure. In Unicode, these >> languages are all easily supported by the BMP, as they don't use a >> huge number of characters each. > > There are numerous eight-bit encodings that support latin and one other > alphabet. Remember, ASCII is a seven-bit encoding, and an eight-bit > encoding is basically two seven-bit encodings. I'm aware of this; Greek, for instance, fits quite happily into ISO-8859-7, which is eight-bit. > The most difficult (of those still possible at all) language to encode > in eight bits is actually Vietnamese, which uses the Latin alphabet, due > to the sheer number of accented letters used. Windows' encoding of it > (along with some other lesser used encodings, all for Vietnamese) is the > only 8-bit encoding to use combining accents, in a way unfortunately > incompatible with unicode normalization if naively translated, whereas > VISCII sacrifices a handful of C0 control characters in addition to > fully packing the high half with letters. This is what I was suspicious of. The very notion of "combining accents" already breaks the notion that "a byte is a character is a glyph", which most eight-bit encodings try to pretend. In any case, the BMP still easily copes with them all. (Hmm. I wonder how you'd typeset the old "Self-Pronouncing Alphabet" for English? It's basically English text with a few markings added to letters - not standard diacriticals that already exist in Unicode, but dots. Probably possible, one way or another... but I haven't seen SPA text since the 90s, and that was in stuff published back in the 80s or so.) ChrisA
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