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Groups > comp.lang.javascript > #33714 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Xue Feng <xf.lotus@yahoo.com> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2017-08-08 23:43 +0800 |
| Last post | 2017-08-10 18:52 +0200 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 36 — 10 participants |
Back to article view | Back to comp.lang.javascript
why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Xue Feng <xf.lotus@yahoo.com> - 2017-08-08 23:43 +0800
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Robert Heller <heller@deepsoft.com> - 2017-08-08 11:16 -0500
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> - 2017-08-08 17:40 +0000
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> - 2017-08-08 21:38 -0700
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? John G Harris <niam@jghnorth.org.uk.invalid> - 2017-08-09 14:51 +0100
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> - 2017-08-09 11:01 +0000
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2017-08-09 16:17 +0200
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2017-08-09 16:14 +0100
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> - 2017-08-09 10:25 -0700
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2017-08-09 21:04 +0100
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> - 2017-08-09 13:11 -0700
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2017-08-10 00:59 +0100
[ANN] Spam filter for Google Groups (was: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null?) Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2017-08-10 05:06 +0200
Re: [ANN] Spam filter for Google Groups (was: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null?) Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> - 2017-08-10 01:00 -0700
Re: [ANN] Spam filter for Google Groups (was: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null?) John G Harris <niam@jghnorth.org.uk.invalid> - 2017-08-10 09:40 +0100
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> - 2017-08-10 00:56 -0700
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2017-08-09 22:01 +0200
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2017-08-09 23:35 +0100
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2017-08-10 10:05 +0200
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2017-08-10 15:08 +0100
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2017-08-10 16:42 +0200
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2017-08-09 23:56 +0200
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2017-08-10 01:40 +0100
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2017-08-10 03:44 +0200
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2017-08-10 03:20 +0100
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2017-08-10 04:33 +0200
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2017-08-10 03:57 +0100
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2017-08-08 23:20 +0200
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> - 2017-08-08 21:20 -0700
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Cezary Tomczyk <cezary.tomczyk@gmail.com> - 2017-08-09 09:26 +0200
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> - 2017-08-09 01:31 -0700
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2017-08-09 11:32 +0200
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Cezary Tomczyk <cezary.tomczyk@gmail.com> - 2017-08-10 09:10 +0200
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2017-08-10 14:51 +0200
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2017-08-10 15:11 +0100
Re: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? Cezary Tomczyk <cezary.tomczyk@gmail.com> - 2017-08-10 18:52 +0200
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| From | Xue Feng <xf.lotus@yahoo.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-08-08 23:43 +0800 |
| Subject | why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? |
| Message-ID | <omcm6a$rga$1@gioia.aioe.org> |
Hi all,
I got an idea by a book that the code can be written as following:
var ans = prompt("Enter a number: ");
if (!ans)
throw ...
to check whether the 'ans' get a null.
I don't understand why the ! operator can do this. thanks.
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| From | Robert Heller <heller@deepsoft.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-08-08 11:16 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <j6GdnWKTHu5rfhTEnZ2dnUU7-TnNnZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #33714 |
From the World of K&R C (where many of javascript's features originated
from, way back in the dark ages, before the bool[ean] type):
false is 0, true is anything not 0
NULL is 0, any valid pointer is not 0 (well, this is presumed, assuming
nominally valid code -- eg a function said to return a pointer will either a
valid pointer or NULL).
!false is true
!true is false
!<any non-0 value> [true] is 0 [false]
!NULL is not NULL
!<non-NULL pointer> is 0 == NULL.
At Tue, 8 Aug 2017 23:43:28 +0800 Xue Feng <xf.lotus@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> Hi all,
> I got an idea by a book that the code can be written as following:
> var ans = prompt("Enter a number: ");
> if (!ans)
> throw ...
> to check whether the 'ans' get a null.
> I don't understand why the ! operator can do this. thanks.
>
>
--
Robert Heller -- 978-544-6933
Deepwoods Software -- Custom Software Services
http://www.deepsoft.com/ -- Linux Administration Services
heller@deepsoft.com -- Webhosting Services
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| From | Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-08-08 17:40 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrnooju52.303.jon+usenet@sable.unequivocal.eu> |
| In reply to | #33714 |
On 2017-08-08, Stefan Ram <ram@zedat.fu-berlin.de> wrote:
> Xue Feng <xf.lotus@yahoo.com> writes:
>>var ans = prompt("Enter a number: ");
>>if (!ans)
>
> It is possibly because it pleased Brendan Eich to define
> JavaScript this way, possibly inspired by prior art (as
> in the language C for example).
>
> The result of »prompt« is a string containing the text
> entered by the user, or »null«. If the user clicks OK
> without entering any text, an empty string is returned.
> If the user clicks the Cancel button, it returns null.
>
> The operator »!« will convert its argument to Boolean,
> and then yield »true« if the result of the conversion
> was »false«, and vice versa.
>
> The conversion of »null« to Boolean is »false«.
>
> »!« is not required to determine whether a string is
> »null«, other »Boolean contexts« can be used too because
> they will also convert »null« to »false«.
I think you kinda missed out the most important bit there,
which is that the empty string is false in a boolean
context, and any other string is true.
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| From | Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-08-08 21:38 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <31cc7ff5-d8ad-4dd6-a22b-5bdbbc36a054@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #33717 |
On Tuesday, August 8, 2017 at 7:45:17 PM UTC+2, Jon Ribbens wrote:
> On 2017-08-08, Stefan Ram <ram@zedat.fu-berlin.de> wrote:
> > Xue Feng <xf.lotus@yahoo.com> writes:
> >>var ans = prompt("Enter a number: ");
> >>if (!ans)
> >
> > It is possibly because it pleased Brendan Eich to define
> > JavaScript this way, possibly inspired by prior art (as
> > in the language C for example).
> >
> > The result of »prompt« is a string containing the text
> > entered by the user, or »null«. If the user clicks OK
> > without entering any text, an empty string is returned.
> > If the user clicks the Cancel button, it returns null.
> >
> > The operator »!« will convert its argument to Boolean,
> > and then yield »true« if the result of the conversion
> > was »false«, and vice versa.
> >
> > The conversion of »null« to Boolean is »false«.
> >
> > »!« is not required to determine whether a string is
> > »null«, other »Boolean contexts« can be used too because
> > they will also convert »null« to »false«.
>
> I think you kinda missed out the most important bit there,
> which is that the empty string is false in a boolean
> context, and any other string is true.
He's kinda missed that he does not know shit about JS or programming in
general, and not even about CS at that point: typical computer science
"experts", yet not surprisingly as that's what people are taught nowadays,
to observe and conform, to the massive bullshit, the ugliest speculations,
and the flat EEG's... Anyway, the so called software crisis is just yet
another sign of our demented times.
Julio
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| From | John G Harris <niam@jghnorth.org.uk.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-08-09 14:51 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <un4moc10er603uieo54748rkpi6v56v9ic@4ax.com> |
| In reply to | #33722 |
On Tue, 8 Aug 2017 21:38:43 -0700 (PDT), Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> wrote: <snip> >He's kinda missed that he does not know shit about JS or programming in >general, and not even about CS at that point: typical computer science >"experts", Here you condemn someone for saying something, then later on praise someone else for saying the same thing. What should we call people who are inconsistent ? John
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| From | Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-08-09 11:01 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrnoolr4r.303.jon+usenet@sable.unequivocal.eu> |
| In reply to | #33717 |
On 2017-08-08, Stefan Ram <ram@zedat.fu-berlin.de> wrote: > Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> writes: >>On 2017-08-08, Stefan Ram <ram@zedat.fu-berlin.de> wrote: >>>The conversion of »null« to Boolean is »false«. >>I think you kinda missed out the most important bit there, >>which is that the empty string is false in a boolean >>context, and any other string is true. > > You are right insofar as I indeed should have mentioned this. > > But I was primed by the > > Subject: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null? > > which explicitly asked for the case of »null«. Unfortunately people tend to be very imprecise as to the meaning of the phrase "null string", and may variously mean either the actual null value or an empty string.
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| From | "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-08-09 16:17 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <XnsA7CCA5CE3CA47eejj99@194.109.6.166> |
| In reply to | #33726 |
Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> wrote on 09 Aug 2017 in comp.lang.javascript: > Unfortunately people tend to be very imprecise as to the meaning of > the phrase "null string", and may variously mean either the actual > null value or an empty string. Indeed, a string is NEVER null, because then it is NOT a string. However, a variable which you intend to contain a string, can be null, but thren that is an object, not a string. 'use strict'; let myString; alert(myString === undefined); // true alert(myString === null); // false alert(myString === ''); // false alert(typeof myString); // undefined myString = null; alert(myString === undefined); // false alert(myString === null); // true alert(myString === ''); // false alert(typeof myString); // object myString = ""; alert(myString === undefined); // false alert(myString === null); // false alert(myString === ''); // true alert(typeof myString); // string ***** -- Evertjan. The Netherlands. (Please change the x'es to dots in my emailaddress)
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| From | Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-08-09 16:14 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <87zib8g4eb.fsf@bsb.me.uk> |
| In reply to | #33729 |
"Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> writes: > Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> wrote on 09 Aug 2017 in > comp.lang.javascript: > >> Unfortunately people tend to be very imprecise as to the meaning of >> the phrase "null string", and may variously mean either the actual >> null value or an empty string. > > Indeed, > a string is NEVER null, > because then it is NOT a string. Further complicated by the fact that there is a character called null (sometimes Null, Nul or NULL) so a string can "be null" in that it contains just that character. It's not a clear way to speak about such things but we're all guilty of using short-hands now and again. <snip> -- Ben.
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| From | Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-08-09 10:25 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <873e9645-1173-403d-bf7f-08ddcb17c057@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #33730 |
On Wednesday, August 9, 2017 at 5:14:14 PM UTC+2, Ben Bacarisse wrote: > "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> writes: > > Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> wrote on 09 Aug 2017 in > > comp.lang.javascript: > > > >> Unfortunately people tend to be very imprecise as to the meaning of > >> the phrase "null string", and may variously mean either the actual > >> null value or an empty string. > > > > Indeed, > > a string is NEVER null, > > because then it is NOT a string. > > Further complicated by the fact that there is a character called null > (sometimes Null, Nul or NULL) so a string can "be null" in that it > contains just that character. Nope, no programmer would call that a null string: that would be *empty* in languages where the NUL character is a terminator, not in JS anyway: <https://stackoverflow.com/a/13698720> > It's not a clear way to speak about such > things but we're all guilty of using short-hands now and again. Speak for yourself, and RTFM. Julio
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| From | Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-08-09 21:04 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <87bmnofqyu.fsf@bsb.me.uk> |
| In reply to | #33733 |
Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> writes: > On Wednesday, August 9, 2017 at 5:14:14 PM UTC+2, Ben Bacarisse wrote: >> "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> writes: >> > Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> wrote on 09 Aug 2017 in >> > comp.lang.javascript: >> > >> >> Unfortunately people tend to be very imprecise as to the meaning of >> >> the phrase "null string", and may variously mean either the actual >> >> null value or an empty string. >> > >> > Indeed, >> > a string is NEVER null, >> > because then it is NOT a string. >> >> Further complicated by the fact that there is a character called null >> (sometimes Null, Nul or NULL) so a string can "be null" in that it >> contains just that character. > > Nope, no programmer would call that a null string: that would be *empty* > in languages where the NUL character is a terminator, not in JS anyway: > > <https://stackoverflow.com/a/13698720> I'm not sure what the purpose of the link is other than to delay by one post your insulting and then pretending to plonk me. Obviously it's not a null string but it is a string with just a null. In a language with no character type (like ECMAScript), strings of length one are often used for the same sort of purpose so what we both note is an incorrect use of the term is not unlikely to occur. >> It's not a clear way to speak about such >> things but we're all guilty of using short-hands now and again. > > Speak for yourself, and RTFM. He says, using a shorthand! :-) -- Ben.
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| From | Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-08-09 13:11 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <74abab16-a893-4724-832b-c108adccb51e@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #33738 |
On Wednesday, August 9, 2017 at 10:04:17 PM UTC+2, Ben Bacarisse wrote: > Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> writes: > > On Wednesday, August 9, 2017 at 5:14:14 PM UTC+2, Ben Bacarisse wrote: > >> "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> writes: > >> > Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> wrote on 09 Aug 2017 in > >> > comp.lang.javascript: > >> > > >> >> Unfortunately people tend to be very imprecise as to the meaning of > >> >> the phrase "null string", and may variously mean either the actual > >> >> null value or an empty string. > >> > > >> > Indeed, > >> > a string is NEVER null, > >> > because then it is NOT a string. > >> > >> Further complicated by the fact that there is a character called null > >> (sometimes Null, Nul or NULL) so a string can "be null" in that it > >> contains just that character. > > > > Nope, no programmer would call that a null string: that would be *empty* > > in languages where the NUL character is a terminator, not in JS anyway: > > > > <https://stackoverflow.com/a/13698720> > > I'm not sure what the purpose of the link is other than to delay by one > post your insulting and then pretending to plonk me. Self-fulfilling prophecies. > Obviously it's not a null string but it is a string with just a null. > In a language with no character type (like ECMAScript), strings of > length one are often used for the same sort of purpose so what we both > note is an incorrect use of the term is not unlikely to occur. The only thing I note is that you keep talking bullshit. > >> It's not a clear way to speak about such > >> things but we're all guilty of using short-hands now and again. > > > > Speak for yourself, and RTFM. > > He says, using a shorthand! :-) *Plonk* Julio
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| From | Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-08-10 00:59 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <87d184e1iu.fsf@bsb.me.uk> |
| In reply to | #33739 |
Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> writes: <snip> > *Plonk* When might you get round to doing this? I'd be grateful if it were sooner rather than later. You've said it several times now. -- Ben.
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| From | Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-08-10 05:06 +0200 |
| Subject | [ANN] Spam filter for Google Groups (was: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null?) |
| Message-ID | <4309688.GXAFRqVoOG@PointedEars.de> |
| In reply to | #33745 |
Ben Bacarisse wrote: > Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> writes: >> *Plonk* > > When might you get round to doing this? I'd be grateful if it were > sooner rather than later. You've said it several times now. I think you are expecting too much from him. You see, he is *trolling* here using the technically flawed *Google Groups* Web interface to Usenet. As Google Groups has no built-in killfile, for him to have a killfile that works with the *current* version Google Groups, he would need to write one. And for that he would need to know what he is talking about, which is evidently not the case. However, I have written and recently published as free software (licensed under GPLv3+) a customizable spam filter for Google Groups that could be adapted to be used as a killfile/scorefile: <https://github.com/PointedEars/userscripts> <https://github.com/PointedEars/userscripts/raw/master/ggSpamFilter.user.js> [Tested with Tampermonkey 4.3.6 in Chromium 57.0.2987.98 on Debian GNU/Linux 8.7 stretch/sid (64-bit).] HTH ;-) -- PointedEars FAQ: <http://PointedEars.de/faq> | <http://PointedEars.de/es-matrix> <https://github.com/PointedEars> | <http://PointedEars.de/wsvn/> Twitter: @PointedEars2 | Please do not cc me./Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.
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| From | Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-08-10 01:00 -0700 |
| Subject | Re: [ANN] Spam filter for Google Groups (was: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null?) |
| Message-ID | <17a5e74e-7034-4254-8ccd-ff18d3b0f8f5@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #33752 |
On Thursday, August 10, 2017 at 5:06:23 AM UTC+2, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: > Ben Bacarisse wrote: > > Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> writes: > >> *Plonk* > > > > When might you get round to doing this? I'd be grateful if it were > > sooner rather than later. You've said it several times now. > > I think you are expecting too much from him. You see, he is *trolling* Nah, it's just that you too are just full of shit... *Plonk* Julio
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| From | John G Harris <niam@jghnorth.org.uk.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-08-10 09:40 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: [ANN] Spam filter for Google Groups (was: why the ! operator can be used to determine a string is null?) |
| Message-ID | <ju6ooctmil7n3qe7koqiun1ma33s0v944e@4ax.com> |
| In reply to | #33755 |
On Thu, 10 Aug 2017 01:00:28 -0700 (PDT), Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> wrote: <snip> >*Plonk* > >Julio This confirms it. You really are a plonker. John
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| From | Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-08-10 00:56 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <1b4e5ab5-445e-44dc-bbc1-77792f1a3f68@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #33745 |
On Thursday, August 10, 2017 at 1:59:14 AM UTC+2, Ben Bacarisse wrote: > Julio Di Egidio <julio@diegidio.name> writes: > <snip> > > > *Plonk* > > When might you get round to doing this? I'd be grateful if it were > sooner rather than later. You've said it several times now. Yet it's you who keep attacking me, you retarded moron but also lying piece of shit: and you'll keep getting back what you deserve, you incompetent lying piece of shit. BTW, I have also already explained to you and some other retards here that plonking is not the same as kill-filing is not te same as an EOD: fucking retarded pieces of shit, the less you know... *Plonk* Julio
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| From | "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-08-09 22:01 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <XnsA7CCE017B2F9eejj99@194.109.6.166> |
| In reply to | #33730 |
Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> wrote on 09 Aug 2017 in comp.lang.javascript: > "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> writes: > >> Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> wrote on 09 Aug 2017 in >> comp.lang.javascript: >> >>> Unfortunately people tend to be very imprecise as to the meaning of >>> the phrase "null string", and may variously mean either the actual >>> null value or an empty string. >> >> Indeed, >> a string is NEVER null, >> because then it is NOT a string. > > Further complicated by the fact that there is a character called null > (sometimes Null, Nul or NULL) so a string can "be null" in that it > contains just that character. It's not a clear way to speak about such > things but we're all guilty of using short-hands now and again. Not true. Whoever "speaks" in code anyway? let myString = null; ...is not a character, not is it the number zero. -- Evertjan. The Netherlands. (Please change the x'es to dots in my emailaddress)
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| From | Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-08-09 23:35 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <87zib8e5dl.fsf@bsb.me.uk> |
| In reply to | #33737 |
"Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> writes: > Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> wrote on 09 Aug 2017 in > comp.lang.javascript: > >> "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> writes: >> >>> Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> wrote on 09 Aug 2017 in >>> comp.lang.javascript: >>> >>>> Unfortunately people tend to be very imprecise as to the meaning of >>>> the phrase "null string", and may variously mean either the actual >>>> null value or an empty string. >>> >>> Indeed, >>> a string is NEVER null, >>> because then it is NOT a string. >> >> Further complicated by the fact that there is a character called null >> (sometimes Null, Nul or NULL) so a string can "be null" in that it >> contains just that character. It's not a clear way to speak about such >> things but we're all guilty of using short-hands now and again. > > Not true. > > Whoever "speaks" in code anyway? No one. I said a "way to speak about such things". > let myString = null; > > ...is not a character, not is it the number zero. Of course not. I was talking about a string with a single NULL character in it (was the not clear?). For example: let myString = "\u0000"; Note that all I am saying is that the presence of a character called NULL (or null, etc.) complicates things even more, and leads some (bad, very bad!) people to use incorrect language. I get the feeling this is contentious because I've said it, rather than there being any real disagreement. People might, in an off-hand sort of way say "here is is a question-mark: var s = '?';" and they might also so say "here is a null: var s = '\0';". Of course they are very, very wrong to even think of saying that, but to suggest that they might is not outrageous, much less to say that doing so would add to the confusion already noted. -- Ben.
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| From | "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-08-10 10:05 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <XnsA7CD66B0DE917eejj99@194.109.6.166> |
| In reply to | #33743 |
Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> wrote on 10 Aug 2017 in comp.lang.javascript: > Of course not. I was talking about a string with a single NULL > character in it (was the not clear?). Indeed, you were. But that does not change the meaning of a null-string, which in Javascript does not exist, since the value of a variable being null is an object, not a string. I doubt that there is a "null-character" anyway, as it forgoes on the idea of a character in the same way. -- Evertjan. The Netherlands. (Please change the x'es to dots in my emailaddress)
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| From | Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2017-08-10 15:08 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <87efsjcy6v.fsf@bsb.me.uk> |
| In reply to | #33756 |
"Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> writes: > Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> wrote on 10 Aug 2017 in > comp.lang.javascript: > >> Of course not. I was talking about a string with a single NULL >> character in it (was the not clear?). > > Indeed, you were. > > But that does not change the meaning of a null-string, > which in Javascript does not exist, > since the value of a variable being null is an object, > not a string. Of course not. No one has argued otherwise. All I said was that the presence of yet another meaning for the word "null" adds to the confusion (for some people). > I doubt that there is a "null-character" anyway, > as it forgoes on the idea of a character in the same way. Unicode uses the term "character" for all sorts of things you might not consider characters. NULL is only one of these peculiar creatures. -- Ben.
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