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Re: [ES Matrix] Suggestions

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Michael Haufe (TNO) wrote:

> Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
>> Submissions have _not_ “disappeared into the ether”.  It is unfair of you
>> to repeatedly suggest that they have, despite evidence to the contrary.
> 
> Thomas has decided to take this part of our discussion out of CLJS and
> into direct email (I agree that it is becoming off-topic for this thread).

It is a common and unfortunately growing misconception, particularly held by 
people who use Usenet only via the Web, and who are more accustomed to Web 
forums than newsgroups, that an initial thread Subject defines the whole 
content of the thread.  This leads to extreme positions suggesting that the 
OP somehow “owns” a thread, therefore can dictate what is to be discussed in 
it, and that people who prefer to discuss something else than the OP's 
problem would have “hijacked” “their” thread.

Nothing could be farther from the truth.  The newsgroup's *topic* defines 
the *subjects* that are *on topic* in the newsgroup.  Thread drift is 
considered normal and healthy, and there is the “(was: …)” convention to 
support it.

So that is _not_ the reason why I sent you an e-mail, too.  The reason is 
very simple: Misunderstandings can usually be resolved easier between two 
people than in public.  Which is why the newsgroup is the *public* part of 
Usenet, and e-mail is the *private* part.  (IOW, do not mung address header 
fields; you are hurting helpful people *and* yourself, _not_ the spammers.)

> Regardless of how that argument turns out, I still objectively stand in
> the position that he is the best person for the job.

Thank you.

> I am starting to suspect that my situation with him and the process with
> the ES-Matrix is a one-off error that won't be translated into his
> management of the FAQ.

For there to be a “one-off error” something had to went be going wrong.  
Have you considered the Occam's-razor possibility that nothing had gone 
wrong and your suggestion simply did not get noticed, especially as you are 
and probably have been posting via the borken and spammed Google Groups?

Besides, even if your submission got noticed (I honestly cannot tell), it is 
also _not_ an error if a submission was not implemented (yet).  Have you 
considered also that other submissions might be more important than yours?  
When one has a lot of different things to do, and particularly if one does 
them alone, one has to prioritize.  Of the possible submissions that you 
have mentioned here, I have no problem realizing that submissions of greater 
importance might have taken precedence over them:

- AFAIK, "\v" is almost never used.  And “older JScript implementations”
  (you mean _versions_)?  Give me a break, please.  In order to be useful,
  the ES Matrix must focus on *used* ECMAScript implementations, not on
  detailing ancient history.  AISB, it might not even be possible to write
  backwards-compatible testing code.  The line has to be drawn somewhere,
  and I am drawing it where the costs (in free time) exceed the possible
  benefits (in completeness).

- The “event namespacing mechanism in JScript” is described in an article
  published in 2001, and it is not standards-compliant.  AISB, the priority
  for the _ECMAScript_ Support Matrix from highest to lowest is the
  standard, followed by deviations from the standard, followed by
  proprietary features.  As a result, this feature would get the lowest
  priority now and it might have gotten it earlier (I have not checked
  my e-mails yet).  Besides, you cannot test it automatically which at least
  currently excludes it from the ES Matrix.  And it is actually a *DOM*
  feature in disguise, making it suitable for the yet unpublished _DOM_
  Support Matrix, not the *ES* Matrix (if anyone even cares about it
  anymore).

- Same for “sharp variables” in JavaScript up to 1.8.5.  That was Firefox 4
  and earlier; versions that have met their end-of-life more than two years
  ago and literally SHOULD NOT be in use anywhere now.

That does not mean that features like those will not eventually get 
documented in the ES Matrix (one can still download and run the old 
versions).  But as I see it you are setting the wrong priorities, and you 
want me to set the same wrong priorities.  I will not do that.  As much as I 
welcome contributions, it is (literally) *my* work and there is *my* name on 
it, not yours.

This is as far as I want to discuss the ES Matrix in this thread.  Comparing 
the *private* and *from-scratch* pet project of the ES Matrix (regardless 
how useful it may have become to others) with a FAQ that is intended to be 
the *replacement* of an *existing* *public* FAQ is just comparing apples and 
oranges.  And as I see it, there appears to be at least the misconception on 
your part that I am reading every posting that contains "ES Matrix".


And here is what is relevant about all that to FAQ maintenance:

The same misconception would be that as a FAQ editor I would read every 
posting in this newsgroup that contains "FAQ".  I just cannot do that, none 
of the previous FAQ editors promised to do anything of the sort, and AFAIK 
no publishing editor works that way either.  So it is not going to happen 
regardless who does the job – unless they have nothing else to do, and AISB 
then they are probably not the best person for the job.  (Notice that I am 
using the term “editor” instead of “maintainer” with purpose.  It is not 
enough to just keep the FAQ running; it has to be *edited*, *improved*.)

Also, crying foul (after years) because submissions have not made it (yet) 
into such a document (and in *that* way the Matrix and the FAQ are alike) 
does not help.  Making better submissions, and sending friendly reminders if 
necessary, does.  After all, if one considers one’s submission *that* 
important, sending a reminder is not too much to ask for.  The best 
submissions are those that just can be copy-pasted because they allow to get 
more work done in the same time.  The best reminders are those that 
explicitly specify when and where something was overlooked, and why that 
something is important, for the same reason.

Again I have written here more than I wanted, but on the other hand I think 
clarification is important and necessary.  Because of some notorious nay-
sayers, put politely, I have no illusions that people subscribed to this 
group will come to the consensus sought by some as to a suitable FAQ 
maintainer before hell freezes over (and as I pointed out, who could 
reasonably define what is consensus in an open set like this?).  It is more 
important to me to get things done *and* to get them done in good quality.  
I think people will realize eventually who can get things done and who can 
only put out hot air.  But I want everyone to know (or remind them of) what 
they can expect from FAQ maintainance and what they just cannot expect 
(especially not for unpaid, voluntary work).  If you still think it is 
necessary for me to respond to equally your long e-mail, please say so.  
Otherwise I will just log it away as a mutual misunderstanding.

Finally, *that* submissions get easily lost in newsgroup discussions is 
*precisely* the reason why I have suggested and requested for the FAQ for 
comp.lang.javascript that submissions be sent via e-mail (I am considering 
something easy to remember and to filter into folders, like 
faq@PointedEars.de – what do you think?).  If you do not want to do just 
that, at least Cc: me (as an exception to the rule in my sig).  It is simply 
too much to ask for to read each and every posting; particularly, to read 
(and not filter out) all postings injected via Google Groups, considering 
the low S/N ratio and violation of Internet standards there (that few Google 
Groups posters realize).
 
> I still believe my description of submissions disappearing into the ether
> is valid from my point of view though since neither a positive or negative
> response is given after a significant period of time. If past submissions
> I've forgotten about by now are sitting in an inbox somewhere and you are
> aware of them, fine; I am content.

OK.  Just a friendly reminder on how it works: If *you* claim to have made 
submissions that – for whatever reason – were not considered, *you* have to 
substantiate that claim.  And *extraordinary* claims require *extraordinary* 
evidence.

-- 
PointedEars

Twitter: @PointedEars2
Please do not Cc: me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.

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Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer dhtml <dhtmlkitchen@gmail.com> - 2013-10-06 12:37 -0700
  Re: Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer Denis McMahon <denismfmcmahon@gmail.com> - 2013-10-07 12:55 +0000
    Re: Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2013-10-07 14:02 +0100
  Re: Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer Dr J R Stockton <reply1300@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2013-10-07 19:56 +0100
    Re: Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer dhtml <dhtmlkitchen@gmail.com> - 2013-10-07 23:37 -0700
      Re: Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer Christoph Michael Becker <cmbecker69@arcor.de> - 2013-10-16 22:44 +0200
        Re: Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer "Michael Haufe (TNO)" <tno@thenewobjective.com> - 2013-10-16 14:34 -0700
          Re: Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2013-10-17 00:32 +0200
            Re: Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer "Michael Haufe (TNO)" <tno@thenewobjective.com> - 2013-10-16 18:13 -0700
              [ES Matrix] Suggestions (was: Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer) Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2013-10-17 04:20 +0200
                Re: [ES Matrix] Suggestions (was: Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer) "Michael Haufe (TNO)" <tno@thenewobjective.com> - 2013-10-16 22:04 -0700
                Re: [ES Matrix] Suggestions (was: Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer) Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2013-10-17 10:08 +0200
                Re: [ES Matrix] Suggestions (was: Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer) "Michael Haufe (TNO)" <tno@thenewobjective.com> - 2013-10-17 07:38 -0700
                Re: [ES Matrix] Suggestions Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2013-10-19 03:50 +0200
                Re: [ES Matrix] Suggestions "Michael Haufe (TNO)" <tno@thenewobjective.com> - 2013-10-21 20:54 -0700
                Re: [ES Matrix] Suggestions Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2013-10-23 21:27 +0200
                Re: [ES Matrix] Suggestions (was: Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer) Dr J R Stockton <reply1300@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2013-10-18 20:43 +0100
                Re: [ES Matrix] Suggestions Mike Duffy <md_002@videotron.ca> - 2013-10-18 21:39 -0400
  Re: Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer Cezary Tomczyk <cezary.tomczyk@gmail.com> - 2013-10-16 20:45 +0200
  Re: Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer "Qu0ll" <Qu0llSixFour@gmail.com> - 2013-10-17 09:13 +1100
  Re: Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer Adam Silver <adambsilver@gmail.com> - 2013-10-17 00:57 -0700
    Re: Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer "Mel Smith" <med_cutout_syntel@aol.com> - 2013-10-17 08:30 -0600
      Re: Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi> - 2013-10-17 20:53 +0300
        Re: Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2013-10-17 18:57 +0100
        Re: Crowdfunding for FAQ Maintainer Ed Jay <edMbj@aes-intl.com> - 2013-10-17 12:20 -0700

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