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Groups > comp.lang.forth > #43487 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Unknown <dog@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2015-11-12 02:37 +0000 |
| Last post | 2015-11-12 02:24 -0800 |
| Articles | 5 — 5 participants |
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rainbowforth ? Unknown <dog@gmail.com> - 2015-11-12 02:37 +0000
Re: rainbowforth ? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-11 19:49 -0800
Re: rainbowforth ? Raimond Dragomir <raimond.dragomir@gmail.com> - 2015-11-11 23:46 -0800
Re: rainbowforth ? WhoCares@gmail.com - 2015-11-26 06:56 +0000
Re: rainbowforth ? Pablo Hugo Reda <pabloreda@gmail.com> - 2015-11-12 02:24 -0800
| From | Unknown <dog@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-11-12 02:37 +0000 |
| Subject | rainbowforth ? |
| Message-ID | <pan.2015.11.12.02.37.46@gmail.com> |
It seems that the forth community mocks colorforth?
IMO color is a cheap way to reduce the initial mental load; like menus.
I fetched colorforth, but I don't have W32 access, so I noticed that
rainbowforth claims to run on linux.
After compiling, running ./rainbowforth displays a nice 'frame'
block=0 column=0 row=0
+----------------------------------------------------------------+
|MASTER LOAD BLOCK |
| |
|1 22 thru Load basic system |
| |
| |
| |
| |
| |
| |
| |
| |
| |
| |
| |
| |
| |
+----------------------------------------------------------------+
F2=create F3=execute F4=compile F5=inline F6=lookup F7=variable
F8=comment
Ctrl-X=cut Ctrl-C=copy Ctrl-V=paste
Ctrl-G=goto Ctrl-R=run Ctrl-Q=quit
I don't know why/what the initial text in the editor means.
-----------------
Appropriatly colored, I entered:
pi 22 7 dup ;
[red yellow grn] and Ctrl-R=run gives: unknown word 'dup'
It looks as if it hasn't got access to 'the primitives'.
Just to confirm my expectations of the interpreter loop,
I ran gforth:---
-> chroot /mnt/hdc6 gforth ==
Gforth 0.6.2, Copyright (C) 1995-2003 Free Software Foundation, Inc.
Gforth comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY; for details type `license'
Type `bye' to exit
2 3 + . 5 ok
7 4 - . 3 ok
bye
In principle, the mental aid from color-info would allow one to
start using forth, without first getting-married-to-it.
You'll build fluency by usage, like a child learns.
That's cost effective.
How do I make this baby talk ?
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| From | Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-11-11 19:49 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <87k2pnri5k.fsf@nightsong.com> |
| In reply to | #43487 |
Unknown <dog@gmail.com> writes: > It seems that the forth community mocks colorforth? I wouldn't say that. Colorforth went in its own direction but has good ideas. > I fetched colorforth, but I don't have W32 access, so I noticed that > rainbowforth claims to run on linux. > After compiling, running ./rainbowforth displays a nice 'frame' Oh interesting, I hadn't heard of Rainbowforth: http://rainbowforth.sourceforge.net/ Implementation notes: https://github.com/flagxor/rainbowforth/blob/master/web/svfig_jan2008.pdf The original Colorforth was written in x86 assembler by Chuck Moore, and ran on a real or emulated PC with no operating system at all. Rainbowforth is a dialect/reimplementation done by Brad Nelson in C. > In principle, the mental aid from color-info would allow one to start > using forth, without first getting-married-to-it. You'll build > fluency by usage, like a child learns. That's cost effective. > How do I make this baby talk ? Rainbowforth looks like fun but I'd say you're better off starting out with a conventional Forth.
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| From | Raimond Dragomir <raimond.dragomir@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-11-11 23:46 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <3ed7871b-b4f4-4b6d-9b1d-9fce8fefd023@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #43488 |
I always wondered: How can you have in colorforth bigger ram buffers (than a single magenta variable)? Something like: CREATE 128 ALLOT for example...
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| From | WhoCares@gmail.com |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-11-26 06:56 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <n36af1$qak$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #43488 |
In article <87k2pnri5k.fsf@nightsong.com>, Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> Unknown <dog@gmail.com> writes:
> > It seems that the forth community mocks colorforth?
>
> I wouldn't say that. Colorforth went in its own direction but has good
> ideas.
>
> > I fetched colorforth, but I don't have W32 access, so I noticed that
> > rainbowforth claims to run on linux.
> > After compiling, running ./rainbowforth displays a nice 'frame'
>
> Oh interesting, I hadn't heard of Rainbowforth:
> http://rainbowforth.sourceforge.net/
> Implementation notes:
> https://github.com/flagxor/rainbowforth/blob/master/web/svfig_jan2008.pdf
>
> The original Colorforth was written in x86 assembler by Chuck Moore, and
> ran on a real or emulated PC with no operating system at all.
> Rainbowforth is a dialect/reimplementation done by Brad Nelson in C.
>
Can you explain his presentation headlines:-------------
Implementation Overview.
< 2,000 total lines of C
< 600 lines in compiler harness
No register assumptions made
Dictionary format is fixed
22 blocks in core system
------------------------------
Compiler Harness.
C code compiles by calling a few Forth words. <-?!
These Forth words are defined using a small
set of built-in words.
Small table of C entry points allow Forth to
access system resources.
-----------------------------
Harness Required Words.
execute-forth
literal
compile,
variable
-----------------------------
Harness Supplied Words.
macro
forth
smudge
unsmudge
b,
windows?
load
thru
heap-dump
word-dump
-------------------------------
Harness Supplied Entry Points.
load
print_number
key
emit
library_load
library_symbol
-------------- End of extract.
How/what is this "harness" ?
? what means:
"C code compiles by calling a few Forth words."
It's NOT a Forth-based-system to compile C-source.
> > In principle, the mental aid from color-info would allow one to start
> > using forth, without first getting-married-to-it. You'll build
> > fluency by usage, like a child learns. That's cost effective.
> > How do I make this baby talk ?
>
> Rainbowforth looks like fun but I'd say you're better off starting out
> with a conventional Forth.
No!
If you familiarise yourself with the terain, during daylight,
you can easier navigate in darkness.
You don't *start* learning in darkness, and *later* use
the facility of light.
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| From | Pablo Hugo Reda <pabloreda@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-11-12 02:24 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <8088fd5d-94a9-40b6-b3e4-0acbb52b5350@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #43487 |
El miércoles, 11 de noviembre de 2015, 23:40:09 (UTC-3), Unknown escribió: > It seems that the forth community mocks colorforth? > IMO color is a cheap way to reduce the initial mental load; like menus. > > I fetched colorforth, but I don't have W32 access, so I noticed that > rainbowforth claims to run on linux. > > After compiling, running ./rainbowforth displays a nice 'frame' > > block=0 column=0 row=0 > +----------------------------------------------------------------+ > |MASTER LOAD BLOCK | > | | > |1 22 thru Load basic system | > | | > | | > | | > | | > | | > | | > | | > | | > | | > | | > | | > | | > | | > +----------------------------------------------------------------+ > F2=create F3=execute F4=compile F5=inline F6=lookup F7=variable > F8=comment > Ctrl-X=cut Ctrl-C=copy Ctrl-V=paste > Ctrl-G=goto Ctrl-R=run Ctrl-Q=quit > > > I don't know why/what the initial text in the editor means. > ----------------- > Appropriatly colored, I entered: > pi 22 7 dup ; > [red yellow grn] and Ctrl-R=run gives: unknown word 'dup' > > It looks as if it hasn't got access to 'the primitives'. > > Just to confirm my expectations of the interpreter loop, > I ran gforth:--- > -> chroot /mnt/hdc6 gforth == > Gforth 0.6.2, Copyright (C) 1995-2003 Free Software Foundation, Inc. > Gforth comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY; for details type `license' > Type `bye' to exit > 2 3 + . 5 ok > 7 4 - . 3 ok > bye > > In principle, the mental aid from color-info would allow one to > start using forth, without first getting-married-to-it. > You'll build fluency by usage, like a child learns. > That's cost effective. > > How do I make this baby talk ? I use colorForth ideas for :r4, but change the colors by prefixes, Moore talk about this in some place. colorForth has some good ideas inside, array dictionary, avoid create does>, no state, etc
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