Re: for your languages

From	Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org>
Newsgroups	comp.lang.c
Subject	Re: for your languages
Date	2011-05-31 10:34 -0700
Organization	None to speak of
Message-ID	<ln1uzercxy.fsf@nuthaus.mib.org> (permalink)
References	(1 earlier) <4de0c923$0$16160$a729d347@news.telepac.pt> <lnlixqtzjf.fsf@nuthaus.mib.org> <4de22bd1$0$16159$a729d347@news.telepac.pt> <slrniu5518.1vua.usenet-nospam@guild.seebs.net> <4de42836$0$16796$a729d347@news.telepac.pt>

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Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> writes:
> Seebs wrote:
>> I don't think I buy that.  Macro assemblers are still fundamentally
>> manipulating stuff which is basically tied to the CPU architecture. 
>> Whether the machine has one general purpose register or 128 will affect
>> the code you write.
>
> Let's put it this way: we develop a C compiler which performs no 
> optimization whatsoever and therefore is able to bijectively map C code to 
> code in any other lower level language, which may be an assembly language 
> or even object code.  If that map only covers a specific CPU architecture, 
> and therefore it is basically tied to that particular CPU architecture, 
> does that mean that this particular hypothetical compiler is a macro 
> assembler? 

In the very narrowly contrived circumstances you postulate, the
programmer is using a superset of C which, in addition to specifying
the behavior of a C program, also specifies the CPU instructions to
be used to achieve that behavior.  This might reasonably be thought
of as an unusually high-level macro assembler.

If, on the other hand, the compiler can choose to generate a
different instruction sequence while still being considered correct
(say, by performing operations in a different order), then it's
just a C compiler, not an assembler.

Optimizing assemblers might be an interesting border case.
I've never used such a thing, but I presume that the input program
specifies (directly or indirectly) a specific instruction sequence,
and the output is an instruction sequence with the same run-time
behavior.  This has very little to do with C.

There's a big difference between assemblers and compilers.  In some
cases, the line between them can be a bit blurry.  Why are you
trying to erase it?

-- 
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) kst-u@mib.org  <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst>
Nokia
"We must do something.  This is something.  Therefore, we must do this."
    -- Antony Jay and Jonathan Lynn, "Yes Minister"

Thread

for your languages "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2011-05-28 09:08 +0200
  Re: for your languages BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2011-05-28 02:48 -0700
    Re: for your languages "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2011-05-29 17:51 +0200
      Re: for your languages Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2011-06-16 15:39 -0700
        Re: for your languages "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2011-06-17 09:55 +0200
          Re: for your languages Shao Miller <sha0.miller@gmail.com> - 2011-06-19 22:21 -0500
            Re: for your languages "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2011-06-20 09:51 +0200
              Re: for your languages "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2011-06-20 12:06 +0200
              Re: for your languages Shao Miller <sha0.miller@gmail.com> - 2011-06-20 10:08 -0500
                Re: for your languages "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2011-07-08 20:06 +0200
  Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-05-28 11:06 +0100
    Re: for your languages BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2011-05-28 03:38 -0700
    Re: for your languages "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2011-05-28 16:01 +0100
      Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-05-28 19:36 +0100
        Re: for your languages "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2011-05-28 21:18 +0100
          Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-05-29 12:33 +0100
            Re: for your languages James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-05-29 08:31 -0400
              Re: for your languages China Blue Angels <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2011-05-29 05:37 -0700
                Re: for your languages James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-05-29 09:09 -0400
                Re: for your languages China Blue Angels <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2011-05-29 07:00 -0700
                Re: for your languages "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2011-05-29 16:52 +0100
                Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-05-31 02:18 +0100
                Re: for your languages James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-05-30 22:21 -0400
                Re: for your languages China Blue Angels <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2011-05-30 20:39 -0700
                Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-05-29 12:44 -0700
                Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-05-31 02:12 +0100
                Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-05-31 10:44 -0700
              Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-05-31 02:05 +0100
            Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-05-29 12:34 -0700
              Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-05-31 02:00 +0100
                Re: for your languages "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2011-05-31 13:10 +0100
                Re: for your languages China Blue Angels <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2011-05-31 06:20 -0700
                Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-05-31 11:53 -0700
                Re: for your languages Angel <angel+news@spamcop.net> - 2011-05-31 12:23 +0000
                Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-05-31 17:46 +0100
                Re: for your languages Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-05-31 17:05 +0000
                Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-06-01 15:39 +0100
                Re: for your languages Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-06-01 17:53 +0000
                Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-06-02 22:18 +0100
                Re: for your languages Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-06-03 00:44 +0000
                Re: for your languages Angel <angel+news@spamcop.net> - 2011-05-31 19:04 +0000
                Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-06-01 15:44 +0100
                Re: for your languages Angel <angel+news@spamcop.net> - 2011-06-01 19:40 +0000
                Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-06-02 21:58 +0100
                Re: for your languages Angel <angel+news@spamcop.net> - 2011-06-02 23:09 +0000
                Re: for your languages Shao Miller <sha0.miller@gmail.com> - 2011-06-02 21:28 -0500
                Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-05-31 10:41 -0700
    Re: for your languages Uncle Steve <stevet810@gmail.com> - 2011-05-28 11:15 -0400
      Re: for your languages Lorenzo Villari <vlllnz@tiscali.it> - 2011-05-28 20:05 +0200
        Re: for your languages Uncle Steve <stevet810@gmail.com> - 2011-05-28 14:16 -0400
    Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-05-28 12:07 -0700
      Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-05-29 12:19 +0100
        Re: for your languages James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-05-29 08:59 -0400
          Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-05-31 01:50 +0100
        Re: for your languages Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-05-29 20:36 +0000
          Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-05-31 00:28 +0100
            Re: for your languages Michael Press <rubrum@pacbell.net> - 2011-05-30 17:21 -0700
              Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-05-31 01:58 +0100
                Re: for your languages Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-05-31 01:27 +0000
                Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-05-31 10:37 -0700
                Re: for your languages Michael Press <rubrum@pacbell.net> - 2011-05-31 18:34 -0700
                Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-06-01 15:06 +0100
                Re: for your languages James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-06-01 10:30 -0400
                Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-06-02 21:36 +0100
                Re: for your languages James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-06-02 22:06 -0400
                Re: for your languages Michael Press <rubrum@pacbell.net> - 2011-06-01 18:19 -0700
                Re: for your languages Shao Miller <sha0.miller@gmail.com> - 2011-06-02 01:06 -0500
                Re: for your languages Michael Press <rubrum@pacbell.net> - 2011-06-03 12:02 -0700
                Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-06-02 21:34 +0100
                Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-06-02 15:53 -0700
                Re: for your languages Michael Press <rubrum@pacbell.net> - 2011-06-03 12:24 -0700
            Re: for your languages Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-05-31 01:10 +0000
            Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-05-31 10:34 -0700
              Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-06-01 14:58 +0100
                Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-06-02 21:18 +0100
                Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-06-02 13:40 -0700
                Re: for your languages Billy Mays <noway@nohow.com> - 2011-06-02 17:31 -0400
                Re: for your languages Michael Press <rubrum@pacbell.net> - 2011-06-03 10:39 -0700
                Re: for your languages James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-06-02 22:19 -0400
                Re: for your languages China Blue Angels <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2011-06-02 19:36 -0700
                Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-06-03 08:44 -0700
                Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-06-04 14:41 +0100
                Re: for your languages Angel <angel+news@spamcop.net> - 2011-06-04 16:31 +0000
                Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-06-04 09:51 -0700
                Re: for your languages Angel <angel+news@spamcop.net> - 2011-06-05 00:05 +0000
                Re: for your languages China Blue Angels <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2011-06-04 18:31 -0700
                Re: for your languages "Kleuskes & Moos" <kleuske@xs4all.nl> - 2011-06-04 10:02 -0700
                Re: for your languages cri@tiac.net (Richard Harter) - 2011-06-04 22:10 +0000
                Re: for your languages China Blue Angels <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2011-06-04 18:26 -0700
                Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-06-05 13:40 +0100
                Re: for your languages Angel <angel+news@spamcop.net> - 2011-06-05 15:47 +0000
                Re: for your languages "Kleuskes & Moos" <kleuske@xs4all.nl> - 2011-06-05 10:16 -0700
                Re: for your languages "Kleuskes & Moos" <kleuske@xs4all.nl> - 2011-06-05 10:30 -0700
                Re: for your languages Heikki Kallasjoki <see@end.of.message.invalid> - 2011-06-05 17:38 +0000
                Re: for your languages "Kleuskes & Moos" <kleuske@xs4all.nl> - 2011-06-05 10:49 -0700
                Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-06-04 09:50 -0700
                Re: for your languages Michael Press <rubrum@pacbell.net> - 2011-06-04 13:23 -0700
                Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-06-05 12:32 +0100
                Re: for your languages "Kleuskes & Moos" <kleuske@xs4all.nl> - 2011-06-05 07:15 -0700
                Re: for your languages "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2011-06-06 18:18 +0200
                Re: for your languages "Kleuskes & Moos" <kleuske@xs4all.nl> - 2011-06-06 11:40 -0700
                Re: for your languages "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2011-06-07 16:57 +0200
                Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-06-07 08:36 -0700
                Re: for your languages "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2011-06-07 18:19 +0200
                Re: for your languages "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2011-06-07 18:32 +0200
                Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-06-05 12:33 -0700
                Re: for your languages China Blue Angels <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2011-06-05 13:08 -0700
                Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-06-05 13:54 -0700
                Re: for your languages China Blue Angels <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2011-06-05 18:57 -0700
                Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-06-05 20:37 -0700
                Re: for your languages China Blue Angels <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2011-06-05 20:58 -0700
                Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-06-05 21:49 -0700
                Re: for your languages China Blue Angels <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2011-06-05 22:05 -0700
                Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-06-06 09:11 -0700
                Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-06-16 13:00 -0700
                Re: for your languages Michael Press <rubrum@pacbell.net> - 2011-06-06 02:04 -0700
                Re: for your languages "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2011-06-06 10:21 +0100
                Re: for your languages "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2011-06-05 22:47 +0100
                Re: for your languages China Blue Angels <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2011-06-05 18:25 -0700
                Re: for your languages Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2011-06-06 13:41 +1200
                Re: for your languages "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2011-06-06 10:06 +0100
                Re: for your languages Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-06-06 15:39 +0000
                Re: for your languages Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-06-06 15:39 +0000
        Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-05-31 00:44 +0100
          Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-05-31 18:09 +0100
            Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-05-31 12:00 -0700
              Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-06-01 15:33 +0100
                Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-06-01 09:07 -0700
                Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-06-01 10:12 -0700
                Re: for your languages BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2011-06-01 12:45 -0700
                Re: for your languages "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2011-06-03 15:41 +0100
                Re: for your languages Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2011-06-05 13:30 +0100
                Re: for your languages Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-06-06 15:39 +0000
  Re: for your languages "Kleuskes & Moos" <kleuske@xs4all.nl> - 2011-05-28 03:34 -0700
    Re: for your languages "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2011-05-29 08:42 +0200
  Re: for your languages Anders Wegge Keller <wegge@wegge.dk> - 2011-05-29 01:00 +0200
    Re: for your languages Angel <angel+news@spamcop.net> - 2011-05-28 23:49 +0000
      Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-05-28 18:42 -0700
    Re: for your languages Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-05-28 18:42 -0700

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