Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman

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From	Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com>
Newsgroups	comp.lang.c
Subject	Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman
Date	Sun, 06 Oct 2019 06:04:22 -0700
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Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> writes:

> On Sat, 2019-10-05, Manfred wrote:
> ...
>
>> I didn't know about these happenings with RMS before reading this
>> thread, however after reading your messages and the original email from
>> RMS as linked by Tim Rentsch,
>
> https://itsfoss.com/richard-stallman-controversy/
>
>> I think that RMS was not a victim of
>> anyone else than himself, and by the way he was not an easy target at all.
>> I agree with you that his was an attempt to defend Mr. Minsky, but, as I
>> see it, the relevant fact here is that what came out of his pen (i.e.
>> keyboard) was not a defense, it was just a sick message.
>>
>> A sensible defense would have been, for example, that there was no
>> evidence that Mr. Minsky had actually had any sex with the girl, but
>> instead RMS wanted to assert that there would have been nothing wrong
>> (not only legally, but also ethically) with a 72 old man having a
>> relationship with a 17 years old, and with this happening on Epstein's
>> private island btw.
>> That, in my opinion, is just sick.
>> I mean, in the circumstance a sane person would ask himself:  what's
>> going on here?  and stop.
>
> Did you really read the mail (linked upthread)?  Where in it does he:
>
> 1. Defend Minsky?
> 2. Say it's ethical for a 72-year old to have sex
>    with teenagers?
>
> Let me summarize it the way I read it:
>
> - He sets up a likely scenario:  Minsky was there, the girl offered
>   sex, pretended to be willing, didn't say she was underage.  They had
>   sex, and no violence was involved.
>
> - He argues that the term "sexual assault" should be reserved for
>   worse acts and writes aboid "accusation inflation".
>
> - And, that applying the term to Minsky is an "injustice".
>   He doesn't say what term should be applied instead.

My reading pretty much agrees with yours.  Stallman's email neither
condemns nor condones the supposed actions of Marvin Minsky.  The
main point of that email is that whatever language is used should
accurately reflect what (presumably) took place.  I agree with this
principle, and agree that it deserves being called out when it is
violated, which it may have been in this instance.  I also agree
with Stallman's statement that his remarks were mischaracterized.
The initial response posting to Stallman's mail clearly does this.

Thread

OT: Richard Mathew Stallman jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2019-09-27 16:14 +0200
  Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com - 2019-09-27 07:45 -0700
    Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2019-09-27 09:22 -0700
      Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com - 2019-09-27 09:48 -0700
      Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2019-09-28 08:53 -0400
        Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2019-09-28 09:01 -0400
          Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman Philipp Klaus Krause <pkk@spth.de> - 2019-09-30 19:10 +0200
            Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2019-09-30 13:54 -0400
              Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2019-10-01 16:24 +1300
                Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com - 2019-10-01 00:34 -0700
            Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman James Kuyper <jameskuyper@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2019-09-30 20:46 -0400
        Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2019-09-28 12:37 -0700
          Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2019-09-28 22:06 +0200
            Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman Manfred <noname@add.invalid> - 2019-10-05 18:49 +0200
              Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2019-10-05 18:00 +0000
                Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2019-10-05 13:38 -0700
                Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2019-10-06 11:37 +0200
                Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2019-10-06 12:42 -0700
                Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman Malcolm McLean <malcolm.arthur.mclean@gmail.com> - 2019-10-07 02:19 -0700
                Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2019-10-08 20:14 +0200
                Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2019-10-08 21:30 -0700
                Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2019-10-08 22:18 -0700
                Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman Manfred <noname@add.invalid> - 2019-10-05 23:32 +0200
                Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2019-10-06 06:04 -0700
        Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2019-09-30 12:02 -0700
    Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2019-09-27 16:31 +0000
      Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com - 2019-09-27 09:50 -0700
    Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2019-09-28 01:41 -0700
      Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2019-09-29 06:26 -0700
        Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com - 2019-09-29 07:03 -0700
      Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2019-10-01 23:42 -0700
        Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2019-10-01 23:43 -0700
        Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com - 2019-10-02 02:13 -0700
  Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman queequeg@trust.no1 (Queequeg) - 2019-09-27 14:58 +0000
  Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2019-09-27 16:30 +0000
    Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2019-09-27 19:44 +0200
    Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman Tim Rentsch <tr.17687@z991.linuxsc.com> - 2019-09-30 12:28 -0700
      Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2019-09-30 20:09 +0000
  Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2019-09-27 10:32 -0700
    Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2019-09-27 17:51 +0000
    Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2019-09-27 21:06 +0200
    Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2019-09-28 07:45 +0200
  Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2019-09-29 19:23 +0300
    Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2019-09-29 13:15 -0400
      Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.com> - 2019-10-03 18:48 +0300
        Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com - 2019-10-03 09:06 -0700
          Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2019-10-03 16:20 +0000
        Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2019-10-03 16:19 +0000
          Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com - 2019-10-03 09:24 -0700
  Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman: an exchange of emails jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2019-09-30 22:56 +0200
    Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman: an exchange of emails Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> - 2019-09-30 21:12 +0000
      Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman: an exchange of emails jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2019-09-30 23:41 +0200
        Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman: an exchange of emails David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2019-10-01 10:49 +0200
      Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman: an exchange of emails jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2019-09-30 23:58 +0200
        Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman: an exchange of emails Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> - 2019-10-01 04:17 +0000
          Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman: an exchange of emails Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2019-10-04 12:52 +0000
            Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman: an exchange of emails Jeff-Relf.Me  @. - 2019-10-04 06:10 -0700
            Re: OT: Richard Mathew Stallman: an exchange of emails jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2019-10-04 23:58 +0200

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