Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function

From	James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net>
Newsgroups	comp.lang.c
Subject	Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function
Date	2011-11-03 16:19 -0400
Organization	A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID	<4EB2F736.1060708@verizon.net> (permalink)
References	(7 earlier) <20111103131900.93@kylheku.com> <4EB2D3D3.1090705@verizon.net> <20111103135433.294@kylheku.com> <4EB2D98B.6070200@verizon.net> <20111103154625.982@kylheku.com>

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On 11/03/2011 03:47 PM, Kaz Kylheku wrote:
> On 2011-11-03, James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> wrote:
>> On 11/03/2011 01:55 PM, Kaz Kylheku wrote:
>>> On 2011-11-03, James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> wrote:
>>>> Note that an implementation doesn't need to use 6.6p10 to make &__NULL__
>>>> qualify as a constant expression; it already qualifies under the
>>>> category "address constant expression" (6.6p9).
>>>
>>> &__NULL__ can be a contant integral expression evaluating to zero, if the
>>> implementors so want.
>>
>> Perhaps, though I doubt that the fact that __NULL__ is a reserved word
>> gives an implementation permission to ignore the standard semantics of
> 
> __NULL__ being a reserved word means that demons can fly out of the
> programmer's nose when it is used.

No, that would be true only if the user code "declares or defines"
__NULL__ (7.1.3p2). Using NULL counts as neither a declaration nor a
definition of __NULL__. Since, in most contexts, using an identifier
that has neither been declared or defined is either a syntax error or a
constraint violation, user code which uses __NULL__ in any way would
also be a problem, though for a different reason.

However, for the purposes of 7.1.3p2, the expansion of NULL wouldn't
count as such a declaration or definition of __NULL__ even if the
expansion did happen to contain one, because the existence of that
feature is the implementation's responsibility, and it's the
implementation's additional responsibility to ensure that whatever NULL
expands to causes no such problems for strictly conforming code.

While that expansion may contain features that would render the behavior
undefined if they occurred in user code, when they occur in the
expansion of a C standard macro, the behavior is not allowed to be
anything inconsistent with what the C standard specifies for that macro.
What the standard specifies for NULL is a null pointer constant, and it
does not specify any relaxation of the rules determining what a null
pointer constant is.

In any event, the suggested implementation of NULL contained neither a
declaration nor a definition of __NULL__, just a use of __NULL__ as an
operand in an address constant expression. Since the suggested
implementation of NULL also specified that a  declaration for __NULL__
appeared inside the standard header, it also doesn't count as a use of
an undeclared identifier.

Thread

about NULL as a parameter to a libc function gaoqiang <gaoqiangscut@gmail.com> - 2011-10-28 01:49 -0700
  Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Mark Bluemel <mark_bluemel@pobox.com> - 2011-10-28 10:14 +0100
    Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function gaoqiang <gaoqiangscut@gmail.com> - 2011-10-28 03:22 -0700
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Mark Bluemel <mark_bluemel@pobox.com> - 2011-10-28 11:29 +0100
        Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2011-10-29 07:08 +0000
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-10-28 07:05 -0400
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-10-28 14:15 -0700
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function gordonb.4o15x@burditt.org (Gordon Burditt) - 2011-10-28 16:36 -0500
        Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2011-10-28 17:30 -0500
          Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function jgharston <jgh@arcade.demon.co.uk> - 2011-10-31 10:40 -0700
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2011-10-28 22:32 +0000
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2011-10-29 06:20 -0700
        Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2011-10-29 15:40 +0100
          Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2011-10-30 08:05 -0700
    Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-10-28 14:13 -0700
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Phil Carmody <thefatphil_demunged@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-10-29 15:11 +0300
        Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2011-10-29 06:41 -0700
        Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-10-29 11:29 -0700
  Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2011-10-28 02:36 -0700
    Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Mike Manilone <mike@laptop.mike> - 2011-10-28 12:58 +0000
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-10-28 11:00 -0400
        Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Kenneth Brody <kenbrody@spamcop.net> - 2011-11-03 11:13 -0400
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2011-10-29 06:37 -0700
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Kenneth Brody <kenbrody@spamcop.net> - 2011-11-03 11:00 -0400
        Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-11-03 12:54 -0400
          Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2011-11-03 17:08 +0000
            Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-11-03 13:18 -0400
              Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2011-11-03 17:28 +0000
                Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-11-03 13:48 -0400
                Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2011-11-03 17:55 +0000
                Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-11-03 14:12 -0400
                Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function blp@cs.stanford.edu (Ben Pfaff) - 2011-11-03 11:22 -0700
                Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-11-03 14:28 -0400
                Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2011-11-03 19:47 +0000
                Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-11-03 16:19 -0400
                Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2012-01-24 22:13 -0800
                Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Ike Naar <ike@sverige.freeshell.org> - 2011-11-03 18:20 +0000
                Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Ike Naar <ike@sverige.freeshell.org> - 2011-11-03 18:34 +0000
                Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2011-11-03 19:49 +0000
                Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-11-03 16:21 -0400
                Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Ike Naar <ike@iceland.freeshell.org> - 2011-11-03 22:19 +0000
                Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2012-01-24 22:17 -0800
          Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2012-01-24 21:19 -0800
    Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2011-10-28 14:26 +0100
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> - 2011-10-28 12:46 -0600
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-10-28 14:19 -0700
        Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-10-28 16:37 -0700
  Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-10-28 07:22 -0400
    Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Kenneth Brody <kenbrody@spamcop.net> - 2011-11-03 10:40 -0400
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2011-11-03 15:10 +0000
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2011-11-04 03:03 +0000
  Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2011-10-28 08:42 -0400
  Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2011-10-28 16:31 +0200
  Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2011-10-28 20:29 +0100
    Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Phil Carmody <thefatphil_demunged@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-10-29 14:49 +0300
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Ike Naar <ike@sverige.freeshell.org> - 2011-10-29 13:41 +0000
  Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function John Gordon <gordon@panix.com> - 2011-10-28 19:53 +0000
    Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2011-10-28 21:13 +0100
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function John Gordon <gordon@panix.com> - 2011-10-28 20:33 +0000
        Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-10-28 16:56 -0400
          Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function blp@cs.stanford.edu (Ben Pfaff) - 2011-10-28 14:30 -0700
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-10-28 16:45 -0400
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-10-28 15:35 -0700
        Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2011-10-29 13:00 +0100
          Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-10-29 11:26 -0700
            Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2011-10-29 20:24 +0100
              Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-10-29 14:03 -0700
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2011-10-29 07:30 -0700
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Kenneth Brody <kenbrody@spamcop.net> - 2011-11-03 11:26 -0400
        Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-11-03 12:59 -0400
        Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-11-03 13:42 -0700
  Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2011-10-28 20:17 +0000
    Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Richard Damon <news.x.richarddamon@xoxy.net> - 2011-10-28 18:51 -0400
  Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Nobody <nobody@nowhere.com> - 2011-10-28 21:40 +0100
    Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-10-28 17:09 -0400
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Phil Carmody <thefatphil_demunged@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-10-29 15:03 +0300
        Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-10-29 09:42 -0400
    Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2011-10-28 21:18 +0000
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2011-10-28 23:30 +0100
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-10-28 15:37 -0700
        Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2011-10-28 23:47 +0000
          Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-10-28 17:13 -0700
            Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2011-10-29 04:31 +0100
              Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2011-10-29 05:42 +0000
                Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-10-30 17:22 +0000
                Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Patrick Scheible <kkt@zipcon.net> - 2011-10-30 23:43 -0700
                Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2011-10-31 05:31 -0500
                Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Phil Carmody <thefatphil_demunged@yahoo.co.uk> - 2011-10-31 12:42 +0200
                Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2011-10-31 13:11 -0500
                Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2011-10-31 17:18 +0000
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2011-10-29 07:32 -0700
    Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2011-10-28 23:41 +0200
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2011-10-28 22:42 +0000
        Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2011-10-29 10:09 +0200
          Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Nobody <nobody@nowhere.com> - 2011-10-29 10:11 +0100
            Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Angel <angel+news@spamcop.net> - 2011-10-29 09:42 +0000
            Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2011-10-29 16:17 +0200
          Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2011-10-29 07:39 -0700
            Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2011-10-29 19:29 +0200
              Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function "io_x" <a@b.c.invalid> - 2011-10-29 20:25 +0200
              Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Nick Keighley <nick_keighley_nospam@hotmail.com> - 2011-10-30 08:14 -0700
    Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function ImpalerCore <jadill33@gmail.com> - 2011-10-31 18:30 -0700
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2012-01-24 18:21 -0800
    Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Kenneth Brody <kenbrody@spamcop.net> - 2011-11-03 11:31 -0400
      Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2011-11-03 13:45 -0700
  Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function Jonathan Leffler <jleffler@earthlink.net> - 2011-10-29 23:41 -0700
    Re: about NULL as a parameter to a libc function James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2011-10-30 07:13 -0400

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