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Groups > comp.lang.c++ > #117659 > unrolled thread

A Java- / .NET-like monitor

Started byBonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com>
First post2023-11-08 15:56 +0100
Last post2023-11-13 22:46 -0800
Articles 20 on this page of 259 — 9 participants

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Contents

  A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 15:56 +0100
    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 19:31 +0100
      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 20:56 +0100
        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-08 23:25 +0000
          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 05:33 +0100
            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 20:36 -0800
              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 05:38 +0100
                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 20:42 -0800
                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 06:08 +0100
                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:11 -0800
                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:12 -0800
                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 06:17 +0100
                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:35 -0800
                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 06:39 +0100
                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:40 -0800
                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:41 -0800
                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 06:42 +0100
                                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:44 -0800
                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:44 -0800
                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 06:45 +0100
                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:48 -0800
                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:50 -0800
                                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:58 -0800
                                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 22:46 -0800
                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 06:52 +0100
                                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-14 21:10 -0500
                                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-15 06:07 +0100
                                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-17 21:16 -0500
                                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-18 04:06 +0100
                                                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-18 12:53 -0500
                                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-18 20:04 +0100
                                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-11-18 19:24 +0000
                                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-18 20:29 +0000
                                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-11-18 21:46 +0000
                                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-18 20:18 -0500
                                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2023-11-24 01:14 +0200
                                                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-23 21:35 -0800
                                                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-24 08:59 +0100
                                                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-24 01:17 -0800
                                                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-24 10:25 +0100
                                                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-11-24 15:59 +0000
                                                                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-24 18:33 +0000
                                                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-24 15:39 -0800
                                                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-11-25 00:08 +0000
                                                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-24 16:27 -0800
                                                                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-25 14:47 -0800
                                                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2023-11-25 13:02 +0100
                                                                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-11-25 17:28 +0000
                                                                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-25 18:48 +0100
                                                                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-11-25 18:09 +0000
                                                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-25 13:12 +0100
                                                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-25 18:10 +0000
                                                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-11-25 19:30 +0000
                                                                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-25 14:57 -0800
                                                                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Michael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com> - 2023-11-26 01:29 +0200
                                                                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-25 15:56 -0800
                                                                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2023-11-26 13:54 +0100
                                                                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-26 14:38 +0100
                                                                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2023-11-26 16:28 +0100
                                                                                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-26 18:51 +0100
                                                                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2023-11-26 20:27 +0100
                                                                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-26 14:38 -0800
                                                                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-26 15:00 -0800
                                                                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-27 05:23 +0100
                                                                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2023-11-27 10:38 +0100
                                                                                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-27 10:55 +0100
                                                                                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2023-11-27 11:19 +0100
                                                                                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-27 12:32 +0100
                                                                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-11-26 22:55 +0000
                                                                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-27 15:15 -0800
                                                                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2023-11-28 09:03 +0100
                                                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2023-11-25 13:58 +0100
                                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-18 20:09 -0500
                                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-19 05:58 +0100
                                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-19 05:02 +0000
                                                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-19 07:00 +0100
                                                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-19 06:08 +0000
                                                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-19 12:05 +0100
                                                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-19 12:08 -0800
                                                                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-19 12:11 -0800
                                                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-19 12:17 -0800
                                                                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-20 13:26 +0100
                                                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-20 12:18 -0800
                                                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-21 10:25 +0100
                                                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-23 21:38 -0800
                                                                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-24 08:56 +0100
                                                                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-24 01:22 -0800
                                                                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-24 19:10 +0100
                                                                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-24 15:43 -0800
                                                                                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-25 13:04 +0100
                                                                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-25 15:06 -0800
                                                                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-26 11:35 +0100
                                                                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-26 15:45 -0800
                                                                                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-27 05:24 +0100
                                                                                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-26 22:22 -0800
                                                                                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-27 08:57 +0100
                                                                                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-27 00:28 -0800
                                                                                                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-27 09:34 +0100
                                                                                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-27 14:59 -0800
                                                                                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-27 14:59 -0800
                                                                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-27 15:19 -0800
                                                                                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-28 15:13 -0800
                                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-18 12:46 -0800
                                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-11-18 21:47 +0000
                                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-18 14:02 -0800
                                                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-18 20:20 -0500
                                                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-20 13:12 -0800
                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 08:01 +0100
                                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 08:01 +0100
                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 06:50 +0100
                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-11 17:45 -0500
                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-12 05:43 +0100
                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-12 05:02 +0000
                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-12 11:00 +0100
                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-12 17:18 +0000
                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-13 07:33 +0100
                                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-13 07:47 +0100
                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-13 12:50 -0800
                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 06:20 +0100
                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-13 21:21 -0800
                                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 07:44 +0100
                                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-13 22:51 -0800
                                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-13 22:55 -0800
                                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 08:00 +0100
                                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 08:07 +0100
                                                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-13 23:08 -0800
                                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-13 23:07 -0800
                                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-11-14 15:18 +0000
                                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 16:46 +0100
                                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-11-14 16:09 +0000
                                                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 17:41 +0100
                                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 18:41 +0100
                                                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 12:25 -0800
                                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 14:25 -0800
                                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-11-14 22:50 +0000
                                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-15 12:07 -0800
                                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-15 05:57 +0100
                                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-15 12:08 -0800
                                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-16 03:59 +0100
                                                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-11-16 15:02 +0000
                                                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-16 18:12 +0100
                                                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-11-16 17:45 +0000
                                                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-27 15:24 -0800
                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-11-12 17:53 +0000
                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-12 12:51 -0800
                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-12 19:33 -0500
                                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-13 04:50 +0000
                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-13 22:05 -0500
                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-14 03:30 +0000
                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-13 22:35 -0800
                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-14 20:26 -0500
                                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-15 12:11 -0800
                                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-15 23:07 -0500
                                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-16 06:39 +0000
                                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-16 21:48 -0500
                                                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-11-17 16:29 +0000
                                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-17 10:22 -0800
                                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-17 18:37 +0000
                                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-11-18 00:45 +0000
                                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-18 02:30 +0000
                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-16 11:11 +0100
                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-13 07:35 +0100
                                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-11-13 15:05 +0000
                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-13 16:36 +0100
                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-13 17:24 +0100
                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-12 12:48 -0800
                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-12 19:29 -0500
                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-12 16:44 -0800
                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-16 14:16 -0800
                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-13 04:48 +0000
                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-13 14:32 -0800
                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-13 21:27 -0500
                                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2023-11-14 15:12 +0000
                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-14 20:35 -0500
                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-13 21:58 -0500
                                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-14 03:27 +0000
                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-13 21:28 -0800
                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-13 21:29 -0800
                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-14 20:47 -0500
                                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-15 12:18 -0800
                                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-15 12:20 -0800
                                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-15 21:26 +0000
                                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-16 00:25 -0500
                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-14 20:42 -0500
                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-28 15:32 -0800
                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-12 19:17 -0500
            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-09 05:17 +0000
              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:18 -0800
                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:20 -0800
              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 06:19 +0100
                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:20 -0800
        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-08 23:51 +0000
          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:10 -0800
        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 15:32 -0800
          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 05:35 +0100
            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:17 -0800
              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 06:22 +0100
                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:27 -0800
                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 06:29 +0100
                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:31 -0800
                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 06:34 +0100
                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:36 -0800
                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 06:40 +0100
                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:42 -0800
                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 07:32 +0100
                                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 22:54 -0800
                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 23:01 -0800
                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 23:03 -0800
                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:30 -0800
                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 21:32 -0800
        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 14:59 -0800
      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-08 19:49 +0000
    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 18:16 +0100
      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 13:49 -0800
        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 05:37 +0100
          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 20:40 -0800
        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 20:39 -0800
      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 13:41 -0800
        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 05:36 +0100
          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-08 20:41 -0800
    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-08 18:16 +0000
    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 10:07 +0100
      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 01:11 -0800
        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 10:17 +0100
          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 01:22 -0800
            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-09 01:23 -0800
      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Branimir Maksimovic <branimir.maksimovic@icloud.com> - 2023-11-10 13:56 +0000
        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-10 15:08 +0100
          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-10 15:15 +0100
            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Branimir Maksimovic <branimir.maksimovic@icloud.com> - 2023-11-11 02:59 +0000
          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-10 12:44 -0800
            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-11 04:53 +0100
              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-10 20:09 -0800
              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Branimir Maksimovic <branimir.maksimovic@icloud.com> - 2023-11-11 04:25 +0000
                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-11 07:07 +0100
    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-11 11:41 +0100
      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-11 16:39 +0100
        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-11 11:42 -0800
          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Pavel <pauldontspamtolk@removeyourself.dontspam.yahoo> - 2023-11-11 17:49 -0500
          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-12 05:40 +0100
            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-12 12:46 -0800
              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-13 23:13 -0800
              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 10:04 +0100
                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 01:21 -0800
                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 11:00 +0100
                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 02:08 -0800
                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 11:23 +0100
                        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 12:27 -0800
                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 12:29 -0800
                          Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-15 05:54 +0100
                            Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-15 12:21 -0800
                              Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-16 04:00 +0100
                                Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-15 19:10 -0800
                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> - 2023-11-16 03:21 +0000
                                  Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-16 06:36 +0100
                                    Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-16 13:06 -0800
                                      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> - 2023-11-17 06:57 +0100
      Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-11 11:41 -0800
        Re: A Java- / .NET-like monitor "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> - 2023-11-13 22:46 -0800

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#117952

Fromscott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
Date2023-11-24 15:59 +0000
Message-ID<bL38N.65219$cAm7.33028@fx18.iad>
In reply to#117947
"Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> writes:
>On 11/23/2023 11:59 PM, Bonita Montero wrote:
>> Am 24.11.2023 um 06:35 schrieb Chris M. Thomasson:
>> 
>>> On 11/23/2023 3:14 PM, Michael S wrote:
>> 
>>>> Which, I would guess, never used by 99.9% of programs that were not
>>>> ported to Windows from some other platform.
>> 
>>> Fwiw, check this out:
>>> https://sourceware.org/pthreads-win32/
>> 
>> Am 24.11.2023 um 06:35 schrieb Chris M. Thomasson:
>> 
>> That's an unnecessary discussion for a C++ programmer since the RAII-ish
>> mutexes and condition variables since C++11 are more convenient to use.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>
>Have you ever wrapped up a C API in C++ using RAII before?

I generally consider using RAII for synchronization primitives
to be counterindicated.    Amongst the reasons:
 1) The critical sections usually end up being far to large
 2) It makes reasoning about the synchronization code and
    potential nested locking  more difficult.

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#117955

FromKaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com>
Date2023-11-24 18:33 +0000
Message-ID<20231124102842.71@kylheku.com>
In reply to#117952
On 2023-11-24, Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:
> "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> writes:
>>On 11/23/2023 11:59 PM, Bonita Montero wrote:
>>> Am 24.11.2023 um 06:35 schrieb Chris M. Thomasson:
>>> 
>>>> On 11/23/2023 3:14 PM, Michael S wrote:
>>> 
>>>>> Which, I would guess, never used by 99.9% of programs that were not
>>>>> ported to Windows from some other platform.
>>> 
>>>> Fwiw, check this out:
>>>> https://sourceware.org/pthreads-win32/
>>> 
>>> Am 24.11.2023 um 06:35 schrieb Chris M. Thomasson:
>>> 
>>> That's an unnecessary discussion for a C++ programmer since the RAII-ish
>>> mutexes and condition variables since C++11 are more convenient to use.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>
>>Have you ever wrapped up a C API in C++ using RAII before?
>
> I generally consider using RAII for synchronization primitives
> to be counterindicated.    Amongst the reasons:
>  1) The critical sections usually end up being far to large

Use braces?

   {
      mutex_locker m(obj);


   }

>  2) It makes reasoning about the synchronization code and
>     potential nested locking  more difficult.

It's just a syntactic sugar to avoid forgetting to unlock.

The thing is, you need a complementary unlocker to
avoid the nesting:

   {
      mutex_locker m(obj);

      // ...

      if (obj.situation()) {
        mutex_unlocker u(obj); // temporarily give up mutex
        other_obj.method();    // this can call us back again
      }
   }


-- 
TXR Programming Language: http://nongnu.org/txr
Cygnal: Cygwin Native Application Library: http://kylheku.com/cygnal
Mastodon: @Kazinator@mstdn.ca
NOTE: If you use Google Groups, I don't see you, unless you're whitelisted.

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#117958

From"Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com>
Date2023-11-24 15:39 -0800
Message-ID<ujrc8c$2gjhg$3@dont-email.me>
In reply to#117955
On 11/24/2023 10:33 AM, Kaz Kylheku wrote:
> On 2023-11-24, Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:
>> "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> writes:
>>> On 11/23/2023 11:59 PM, Bonita Montero wrote:
>>>> Am 24.11.2023 um 06:35 schrieb Chris M. Thomasson:
>>>>
>>>>> On 11/23/2023 3:14 PM, Michael S wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> Which, I would guess, never used by 99.9% of programs that were not
>>>>>> ported to Windows from some other platform.
>>>>
>>>>> Fwiw, check this out:
>>>>> https://sourceware.org/pthreads-win32/
>>>>
>>>> Am 24.11.2023 um 06:35 schrieb Chris M. Thomasson:
>>>>
>>>> That's an unnecessary discussion for a C++ programmer since the RAII-ish
>>>> mutexes and condition variables since C++11 are more convenient to use.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Have you ever wrapped up a C API in C++ using RAII before?
>>
>> I generally consider using RAII for synchronization primitives
>> to be counterindicated.    Amongst the reasons:
>>   1) The critical sections usually end up being far to large
> 
> Use braces?
> 
>     {
>        mutex_locker m(obj);
> 
> 
>     }

DING!!! :^)


> 
>>   2) It makes reasoning about the synchronization code and
>>      potential nested locking  more difficult.
> 
> It's just a syntactic sugar to avoid forgetting to unlock.
> 
> The thing is, you need a complementary unlocker to
> avoid the nesting:
> 
>     {
>        mutex_locker m(obj);
> 
>        // ...
> 
>        if (obj.situation()) {
>          mutex_unlocker u(obj); // temporarily give up mutex
>          other_obj.method();    // this can call us back again
>        }
>     }
> 
> 

:^)

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#117960

Fromscott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
Date2023-11-25 00:08 +0000
Message-ID<3Wa8N.2235$PJoc.2084@fx04.iad>
In reply to#117958
"Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> writes:
>On 11/24/2023 10:33 AM, Kaz Kylheku wrote:
>> On 2023-11-24, Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:
>>> "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> writes:
>>>> On 11/23/2023 11:59 PM, Bonita Montero wrote:
>>>>> Am 24.11.2023 um 06:35 schrieb Chris M. Thomasson:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 11/23/2023 3:14 PM, Michael S wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Which, I would guess, never used by 99.9% of programs that were not
>>>>>>> ported to Windows from some other platform.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Fwiw, check this out:
>>>>>> https://sourceware.org/pthreads-win32/
>>>>>
>>>>> Am 24.11.2023 um 06:35 schrieb Chris M. Thomasson:
>>>>>
>>>>> That's an unnecessary discussion for a C++ programmer since the RAII-ish
>>>>> mutexes and condition variables since C++11 are more convenient to use.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Have you ever wrapped up a C API in C++ using RAII before?
>>>
>>> I generally consider using RAII for synchronization primitives
>>> to be counterindicated.    Amongst the reasons:
>>>   1) The critical sections usually end up being far to large
>> 
>> Use braces?
>> 
>>     {
>>        mutex_locker m(obj);
>> 
>> 
>>     }
>
>DING!!! :^)

No, not really.  It's not always that
easy, and sometimes programmers even use 'goto'.

That's certainly no more readable than

   pthread_lock(obj);

   do something

   pthread_unlock(obj);

I'd argue the RAII solution is less readable.

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#117961

From"Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com>
Date2023-11-24 16:27 -0800
Message-ID<ujrf2b$2gqoe$2@dont-email.me>
In reply to#117960
On 11/24/2023 4:08 PM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
> "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> writes:
>> On 11/24/2023 10:33 AM, Kaz Kylheku wrote:
>>> On 2023-11-24, Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:
>>>> "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>> On 11/23/2023 11:59 PM, Bonita Montero wrote:
>>>>>> Am 24.11.2023 um 06:35 schrieb Chris M. Thomasson:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 11/23/2023 3:14 PM, Michael S wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Which, I would guess, never used by 99.9% of programs that were not
>>>>>>>> ported to Windows from some other platform.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Fwiw, check this out:
>>>>>>> https://sourceware.org/pthreads-win32/
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Am 24.11.2023 um 06:35 schrieb Chris M. Thomasson:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That's an unnecessary discussion for a C++ programmer since the RAII-ish
>>>>>> mutexes and condition variables since C++11 are more convenient to use.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Have you ever wrapped up a C API in C++ using RAII before?
>>>>
>>>> I generally consider using RAII for synchronization primitives
>>>> to be counterindicated.    Amongst the reasons:
>>>>    1) The critical sections usually end up being far to large
>>>
>>> Use braces?
>>>
>>>      {
>>>         mutex_locker m(obj);
>>>
>>>
>>>      }
>>
>> DING!!! :^)
> 
> No, not really.  It's not always that
> easy, and sometimes programmers even use 'goto'.
> 
> That's certainly no more readable than
> 
>     pthread_lock(obj);
> 
>     do something
> 
>     pthread_unlock(obj);
> 
> I'd argue the RAII solution is less readable.

RAII can come in handy. I don't think its all that bad. Humm...
_______________________
{
    mutex_raii_lock(my_lock);
}
_______________________

vs:
_______________________
my_lock.lock();
my_lock.unlock();
_______________________

Btw, wrt C++, RAII tends to work rather well with exceptions... ;^)

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#117973

From"Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com>
Date2023-11-25 14:47 -0800
Message-ID<ujtti0$2v76e$3@dont-email.me>
In reply to#117961
On 11/24/2023 4:27 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
> On 11/24/2023 4:08 PM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
>> "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> writes:
>>> On 11/24/2023 10:33 AM, Kaz Kylheku wrote:
>>>> On 2023-11-24, Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:
>>>>> "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>>> On 11/23/2023 11:59 PM, Bonita Montero wrote:
>>>>>>> Am 24.11.2023 um 06:35 schrieb Chris M. Thomasson:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 11/23/2023 3:14 PM, Michael S wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Which, I would guess, never used by 99.9% of programs that were 
>>>>>>>>> not
>>>>>>>>> ported to Windows from some other platform.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Fwiw, check this out:
>>>>>>>> https://sourceware.org/pthreads-win32/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Am 24.11.2023 um 06:35 schrieb Chris M. Thomasson:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That's an unnecessary discussion for a C++ programmer since the 
>>>>>>> RAII-ish
>>>>>>> mutexes and condition variables since C++11 are more convenient 
>>>>>>> to use.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Have you ever wrapped up a C API in C++ using RAII before?
>>>>>
>>>>> I generally consider using RAII for synchronization primitives
>>>>> to be counterindicated.    Amongst the reasons:
>>>>>    1) The critical sections usually end up being far to large
>>>>
>>>> Use braces?
>>>>
>>>>      {
>>>>         mutex_locker m(obj);
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>      }
>>>
>>> DING!!! :^)
>>
>> No, not really.  It's not always that
>> easy, and sometimes programmers even use 'goto'.
>>
>> That's certainly no more readable than
>>
>>     pthread_lock(obj);
>>
>>     do something
>>
>>     pthread_unlock(obj);
>>
>> I'd argue the RAII solution is less readable.
> 
> RAII can come in handy. I don't think its all that bad. Humm...
> _______________________
> {
>     mutex_raii_lock(my_lock);
^^^^^^^^^^^^^

OOPS!
  mutex_raii_lock lock(my_lock);


> }
> _______________________
> 
> vs:
> _______________________
> my_lock.lock();
> my_lock.unlock();
> _______________________
> 
> Btw, wrt C++, RAII tends to work rather well with exceptions... ;^)

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#117962

From"Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl>
Date2023-11-25 13:02 +0100
Message-ID<ujsnp1$2poh8$3@dont-email.me>
In reply to#117960
Op 25.nov.2023 om 01:08 schreef Scott Lurndal:
> "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> writes:
>> On 11/24/2023 10:33 AM, Kaz Kylheku wrote:
>>> On 2023-11-24, Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:
>>>> "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>> On 11/23/2023 11:59 PM, Bonita Montero wrote:
>>>>>> Am 24.11.2023 um 06:35 schrieb Chris M. Thomasson:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 11/23/2023 3:14 PM, Michael S wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Which, I would guess, never used by 99.9% of programs that were not
>>>>>>>> ported to Windows from some other platform.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Fwiw, check this out:
>>>>>>> https://sourceware.org/pthreads-win32/
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Am 24.11.2023 um 06:35 schrieb Chris M. Thomasson:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That's an unnecessary discussion for a C++ programmer since the RAII-ish
>>>>>> mutexes and condition variables since C++11 are more convenient to use.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Have you ever wrapped up a C API in C++ using RAII before?
>>>>
>>>> I generally consider using RAII for synchronization primitives
>>>> to be counterindicated.    Amongst the reasons:
>>>>    1) The critical sections usually end up being far to large
>>>
>>> Use braces?
>>>
>>>      {
>>>         mutex_locker m(obj);
>>>
>>>
>>>      }
>>
>> DING!!! :^)
> 
> No, not really.  It's not always that
> easy, and sometimes programmers even use 'goto'.
> 
> That's certainly no more readable than
> 
>     pthread_lock(obj);
> 
>     do something
> 
>     pthread_unlock(obj);
> 
> I'd argue the RAII solution is less readable.

In many cases it is not that simple.
It is more like:

      {
         mutex_locker m(obj);
	do something
	if (....) continue;
	if (....) break;
         if (...) return;
         do something else
      }

vs.:

     pthread_lock(obj);
     {
       do something
       if (...) {
         pthread_unlock(obj);
         continue;
       }
       if (...) {
         pthread_unlock(obj);
         break;
       }
       if (....) {
         pthread_unlock(obj);
         return;
       }
       do something else
     } catch (...) {
       pthread_unlock(obj);
       throw;
     }
     pthread_unlock(obj);

Personally I find the first way more readable and easier to maintain.

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#117967

Fromscott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
Date2023-11-25 17:28 +0000
Message-ID<S8q8N.22591$yAie.14909@fx44.iad>
In reply to#117962
"Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> writes:
>Op 25.nov.2023 om 01:08 schreef Scott Lurndal:
>> "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> writes:
>>> On 11/24/2023 10:33 AM, Kaz Kylheku wrote:
>>>> On 2023-11-24, Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:
>>>>> "Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>>> On 11/23/2023 11:59 PM, Bonita Montero wrote:
>>>>>>> Am 24.11.2023 um 06:35 schrieb Chris M. Thomasson:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 11/23/2023 3:14 PM, Michael S wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Which, I would guess, never used by 99.9% of programs that were not
>>>>>>>>> ported to Windows from some other platform.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Fwiw, check this out:
>>>>>>>> https://sourceware.org/pthreads-win32/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Am 24.11.2023 um 06:35 schrieb Chris M. Thomasson:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That's an unnecessary discussion for a C++ programmer since the RAII-ish
>>>>>>> mutexes and condition variables since C++11 are more convenient to use.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Have you ever wrapped up a C API in C++ using RAII before?
>>>>>
>>>>> I generally consider using RAII for synchronization primitives
>>>>> to be counterindicated.    Amongst the reasons:
>>>>>    1) The critical sections usually end up being far to large
>>>>
>>>> Use braces?
>>>>
>>>>      {
>>>>         mutex_locker m(obj);
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>      }
>>>
>>> DING!!! :^)
>> 
>> No, not really.  It's not always that
>> easy, and sometimes programmers even use 'goto'.
>> 
>> That's certainly no more readable than
>> 
>>     pthread_lock(obj);
>> 
>>     do something
>> 
>>     pthread_unlock(obj);
>> 
>> I'd argue the RAII solution is less readable.
>
>In many cases it is not that simple.
>It is more like:
>
>      {
>         mutex_locker m(obj);
>	do something
>	if (....) continue;
>	if (....) break;
>         if (...) return;
>         do something else
>      }
>
>vs.:
>
>     pthread_lock(obj);
>     {
>       do something
>       if (...) {
>         pthread_unlock(obj);
>         continue;
>       }
>       if (...) {
>         pthread_unlock(obj);
>         break;
>       }
>       if (....) {
>         pthread_unlock(obj);
>         return;
>       }
>       do something else
>     } catch (...) {
>       pthread_unlock(obj);
>       throw;
>     }
>     pthread_unlock(obj);
>
>Personally I find the first way more readable and easier to maintain.

I'd argue that the critical region may be too large if all those
checks are required within.

I've used both, but in code (bare metal os/hv) compiled with
-fno-exceptions the following is preferable to RAII.

  pthread_lock(obj);

  if (xxx) goto unlock;

  do something

  if (yyy) goto unlock;

  do something else

unlock:
  pthread_unlock(obj);

six of one, half dozen of the other. This solution doesn't have
magic behavior and can more easily be reasoned to be correct.

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#117968

FromBonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com>
Date2023-11-25 18:48 +0100
Message-ID<ujtc1t$2sp67$1@raubtier-asyl.eternal-september.org>
In reply to#117967
Am 25.11.2023 um 18:28 schrieb Scott Lurndal:

> I've used both, but in code (bare metal os/hv) compiled with
> -fno-exceptions the following is preferable to RAII.
> 
>    pthread_lock(obj);
> 
>    if (xxx) goto unlock;
> 
>    do something
> 
>    if (yyy) goto unlock;
> 
>    do something else
> 
> unlock:
>    pthread_unlock(obj);

Why do you disable exceptions with code that doesn't throw ?

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#117969

Fromscott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
Date2023-11-25 18:09 +0000
Message-ID<NLq8N.65597$cAm7.60868@fx18.iad>
In reply to#117968
Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> writes:
>Am 25.11.2023 um 18:28 schrieb Scott Lurndal:
>
>> I've used both, but in code (bare metal os/hv) compiled with
>> -fno-exceptions the following is preferable to RAII.
>> 
>>    pthread_lock(obj);
>> 
>>    if (xxx) goto unlock;
>> 
>>    do something
>> 
>>    if (yyy) goto unlock;
>> 
>>    do something else
>> 
>> unlock:
>>    pthread_unlock(obj);
>
>Why do you disable exceptions with code that doesn't throw ?

To prevent the code from ever throwing, of course and to ensure
that no exception infrastructure gets generated into the object
files.

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#117965

FromBonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com>
Date2023-11-25 13:12 +0100
Message-ID<ujsobk$2ps2p$1@raubtier-asyl.eternal-september.org>
In reply to#117955
Am 24.11.2023 um 19:33 schrieb Kaz Kylheku:

> It's just a syntactic sugar to avoid forgetting to unlock ...

RAII is magnitudes more convenient and lass error-prone
than manual resource handling.

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#117970

FromKaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com>
Date2023-11-25 18:10 +0000
Message-ID<20231125100947.641@kylheku.com>
In reply to#117965
On 2023-11-25, Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> wrote:
> Am 24.11.2023 um 19:33 schrieb Kaz Kylheku:
>
>> It's just a syntactic sugar to avoid forgetting to unlock ...
>
> RAII is magnitudes more convenient and lass error-prone
> than manual resource handling.

Sure, but that's not necessarily an effective way to "sell" it to
someone who is being skeptical.


-- 
TXR Programming Language: http://nongnu.org/txr
Cygnal: Cygwin Native Application Library: http://kylheku.com/cygnal
Mastodon: @Kazinator@mstdn.ca
NOTE: If you use Google Groups, I don't see you, unless you're whitelisted.

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#117971

Fromscott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
Date2023-11-25 19:30 +0000
Message-ID<%Wr8N.40010$zh16.35086@fx48.iad>
In reply to#117970
Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> writes:
>On 2023-11-25, Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Am 24.11.2023 um 19:33 schrieb Kaz Kylheku:
>>
>>> It's just a syntactic sugar to avoid forgetting to unlock ...
>>
>> RAII is magnitudes more convenient and lass error-prone
>> than manual resource handling.
>
>Sure, but that's not necessarily an effective way to "sell" it to
>someone who is being skeptical.

I would argue that is is not 'less error-prone' than
explicit locking, properly written and unit tested.

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#117974

From"Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com>
Date2023-11-25 14:57 -0800
Message-ID<ujtu5d$2v76e$4@dont-email.me>
In reply to#117971
On 11/25/2023 11:30 AM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
> Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> writes:
>> On 2023-11-25, Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Am 24.11.2023 um 19:33 schrieb Kaz Kylheku:
>>>
>>>> It's just a syntactic sugar to avoid forgetting to unlock ...
>>>
>>> RAII is magnitudes more convenient and lass error-prone
>>> than manual resource handling.
>>
>> Sure, but that's not necessarily an effective way to "sell" it to
>> someone who is being skeptical.
> 
> I would argue that is is not 'less error-prone' than
> explicit locking, properly written and unit tested.

It can create a dog with different fleas in some cases.

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#117976

FromMichael S <already5chosen@yahoo.com>
Date2023-11-26 01:29 +0200
Message-ID<20231126012940.00001397@yahoo.com>
In reply to#117971
On Sat, 25 Nov 2023 19:30:03 GMT
scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) wrote:

> Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> writes:
> >On 2023-11-25, Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> wrote:  
> >> Am 24.11.2023 um 19:33 schrieb Kaz Kylheku:
> >>  
> >>> It's just a syntactic sugar to avoid forgetting to unlock ...  
> >>
> >> RAII is magnitudes more convenient and lass error-prone
> >> than manual resource handling.  
> >
> >Sure, but that's not necessarily an effective way to "sell" it to
> >someone who is being skeptical.  
> 
> I would argue that is is not 'less error-prone' than
> explicit locking, properly written and unit tested.

RAII is horrible, but unfortunately necessary in big undisciplined C++
projects.
The root bug in C++ language design are constructors that can fail, but
can't return error code.
That problem begot exceptions. And the presence of exceptions begot
RAII. RAII is bad, but less bad than other solutions.


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#117977

From"Chris M. Thomasson" <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com>
Date2023-11-25 15:56 -0800
Message-ID<uju1ij$2voqe$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#117976
On 11/25/2023 3:29 PM, Michael S wrote:
> On Sat, 25 Nov 2023 19:30:03 GMT
> scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) wrote:
> 
>> Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> writes:
>>> On 2023-11-25, Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Am 24.11.2023 um 19:33 schrieb Kaz Kylheku:
>>>>   
>>>>> It's just a syntactic sugar to avoid forgetting to unlock ...
>>>>
>>>> RAII is magnitudes more convenient and lass error-prone
>>>> than manual resource handling.
>>>
>>> Sure, but that's not necessarily an effective way to "sell" it to
>>> someone who is being skeptical.
>>
>> I would argue that is is not 'less error-prone' than
>> explicit locking, properly written and unit tested.
> 
> RAII is horrible, but unfortunately necessary in big undisciplined C++
> projects.

Horrible? It's not that bad.



> The root bug in C++ language design are constructors that can fail, but
> can't return error code.
> That problem begot exceptions. And the presence of exceptions begot
> RAII. RAII is bad, but less bad than other solutions.
> 
> 
> 

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#117979

FromDavid Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no>
Date2023-11-26 13:54 +0100
Message-ID<ujvf5l$3934n$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#117976
On 26/11/2023 00:29, Michael S wrote:
> On Sat, 25 Nov 2023 19:30:03 GMT
> scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) wrote:
> 
>> Kaz Kylheku <864-117-4973@kylheku.com> writes:
>>> On 2023-11-25, Bonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Am 24.11.2023 um 19:33 schrieb Kaz Kylheku:
>>>>   
>>>>> It's just a syntactic sugar to avoid forgetting to unlock ...
>>>>
>>>> RAII is magnitudes more convenient and lass error-prone
>>>> than manual resource handling.
>>>
>>> Sure, but that's not necessarily an effective way to "sell" it to
>>> someone who is being skeptical.
>>
>> I would argue that is is not 'less error-prone' than
>> explicit locking, properly written and unit tested.
> 
> RAII is horrible, but unfortunately necessary in big undisciplined C++
> projects.
> The root bug in C++ language design are constructors that can fail, but
> can't return error code.

That's easily solved in cases like this - write constructors that can't 
fail.

In the kind of systems I work with, something like acquiring a mutex 
cannot fail unless there is a major system failure that renders it 
unsafe to run anything - the system then turns off all the machinery it 
controls, logs everything it can, and alerts the user to the failure. 
That applies equally to a free-standing "lock" function or an RAII 
constructor solution.  There is no need for exceptions, error codes, or 
anything of that sort.

> That problem begot exceptions. And the presence of exceptions begot
> RAII. RAII is bad, but less bad than other solutions.
> 

I am not a fan of exceptions in low-level code or control code.  They 
are fine in high-level PC stuff when dealing with things that can 
reasonably fail but where you don't want to bother with all the details 
all the time - such as a constructor for opening a handle to a database. 
  (I mostly use Python for that kind of thing anyway, but that's just 
personal choice.)

Once you stop thinking that code can fail, and write code that doesn't 
fail, it all becomes much easier, and RAII is just another useful tool. 
(And you can compile with exceptions fully disabled.)

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#117980

FromBonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com>
Date2023-11-26 14:38 +0100
Message-ID<ujvhph$39dt7$1@raubtier-asyl.eternal-september.org>
In reply to#117979
Am 26.11.2023 um 13:54 schrieb David Brown:

> Once you stop thinking that code can fail, and write code that doesn't 
> fail, it all becomes much easier, and RAII is just another useful tool. 
> (And you can compile with exceptions fully disabled.)

With exceptions and RAII failures are also very easy to handle because
you handle them only at a few places and not where they happen or in
the call levels between.
Avoiding exceptions looks hard to me because the runtime can throw a
lot of exceptions, mostly bad_alloc()s or system_error()s.

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#117981

FromDavid Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no>
Date2023-11-26 16:28 +0100
Message-ID<ujvo70$3adcv$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#117980
On 26/11/2023 14:38, Bonita Montero wrote:
> Am 26.11.2023 um 13:54 schrieb David Brown:
> 
>> Once you stop thinking that code can fail, and write code that doesn't 
>> fail, it all becomes much easier, and RAII is just another useful 
>> tool. (And you can compile with exceptions fully disabled.)
> 
> With exceptions and RAII failures are also very easy to handle because
> you handle them only at a few places and not where they happen or in
> the call levels between.

No, exceptions do not make things easier - they make them /different/. 
Sometimes it might be helpful to move failure handling to a different 
part of the code, sometimes it makes things harder.  Sometimes it is 
best to have a failure handling solution that does not care what can 
fail, or how it can fail, and only think about failures when you have a 
way to deal with them (that's exceptions).  Sometimes it is best to be 
entirely sure about wait failures can occur at the point of failure, and 
deal with them or pass them on explicitly (that's error returns, 
std::expect, railway programming, etc.).  Sometimes it is best to ensure 
failure is not possible within the scope of the software, so that no 
failure handling is needed (or nothing beyond abort(), kernel panic, etc.)

The only thing you can be sure about with failure handling is that 
anyone who says they know the perfect answer, or that their preferred 
method is always far better than others, is wrong.

> Avoiding exceptions looks hard to me because the runtime can throw a
> lot of exceptions, mostly bad_alloc()s or system_error()s.
> 

Any code that sees a "bad_alloc" exception is already borked.  It is not 
failing because of the exception, it is failing because of the bad 
programming.

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#117982

FromBonita Montero <Bonita.Montero@gmail.com>
Date2023-11-26 18:51 +0100
Message-ID<uk00ih$3bl9e$1@raubtier-asyl.eternal-september.org>
In reply to#117981
Am 26.11.2023 um 16:28 schrieb David Brown:

> No, exceptions do not make things easier - they make them /different/. 

Without exceptions you'd have to deal with return codes at each call
level; this *is* much more work.

> Sometimes it might be helpful to move failure handling to a different 
> part of the code, sometimes it makes things harder.

In C++ exceptions are mostly used for resource collapse situations, i.e.
out of memory errors, network errors of filesystem failures. With that
exceptions are the most convenient way to handle that. These types of
errors are handled in most cases.

> Any code that sees a "bad_alloc" exception is already borked.

With exceptions you can handle such situations in a clean way with
a small effort.

> It is not failing because of the exception, it is failing because
> of the bad programming.

bad_alloc doesn't depend on the programming but rather how much memory
you have. You might ignore bad_alloc for small allocations since they're
unlikely to happen, but not for large allocations.
I don't understand your attitude while programming with C++ because the
runtime uses exceptions so much.

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