Re: Is multi-level function return possible?

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From	anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl)
Newsgroups	comp.compilers
Subject	Re: Is multi-level function return possible?
Date	Tue, 18 Mar 2014 17:36:46 GMT
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Bill Findlay <yaldnif.w@blueyonder.co.uk> writes:
>On 16/03/2014 19:45, "Andy Walker" <news@cuboid.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> On 16/03/14 17:19, Anton Ertl wrote:
>>> Language design note: Given that nested functions have fallen out of
>>> favour in the Algol-family world (in C and its offspring), I wonder if
>>> they only really gain usefulness when combined with first-class
>>> closures.
>
>It would be wrong to imply that "the Algol-family world" consists of "C and
>its offspring".  Algol has many descendants that have have remained more
>loyal to their family traditions, Ada 2012 first among them.

True.  But I find it more revealing what features were added back in
after the C branch of the family went through the B bottleneck.
Keeping a feature may just be loyalty, but adding it back after it had
been removed says something about what the language designer thought
about the usefulness of the feature.

Ok, let's look at the arguments I have seen until now:

Name management (information hiding, variable hiding): Languages like
Modula-2 added additional mechanisms for that despite having nested
procedures; C++ did not add nested functions, but did add name spaces.
That argument is not very convincing to me.

"Parameters have a run-time cost": So has access to non-local
variables.  Languages that put high priority on run-time cost like C
and C++ did not add that feature (except GNU C), so this argument did
not convince their designers.  And it does not convince me.

Hassle when converting Algol to C: I can believe that, but that does
not tell me about the value of the feature in other contexts.

Did I miss any arguments?

- anton
--
M. Anton Ertl
anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at
http://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/anton/

Thread

Is multi-level function return possible? noitalmost <noitalmost@cox.net> - 2014-03-10 15:46 -0400
  Re: Is multi-level function return possible? Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2014-03-11 05:20 +0000
  Re: Is multi-level function return possible? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2014-03-11 13:04 +0000
    Re: Is multi-level function return possible? Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2014-03-11 22:15 +0000
      Re: Is multi-level function return possible? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2014-03-13 17:05 +0000
        Re: Is multi-level function return possible? Bill Findlay <yaldnif.w@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2014-03-14 01:28 +0000
        Re: Is multi-level function return possible? Ivan Godard <ivan@ootbcomp.com> - 2014-03-13 18:32 -0700
          Re: Is multi-level function return possible? glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2014-03-14 20:27 +0000
      Re: Is multi-level function return possible? George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2014-03-14 02:39 -0400
        Re: Is multi-level function return possible? Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2014-03-14 21:34 +0000
          Re: Is multi-level function return possible? Marco van de Voort <marcov@toad.stack.nl> - 2014-03-14 22:59 +0000
        Re: Is multi-level function return possible? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2014-03-16 17:19 +0000
          Re: Is multi-level function return possible? Marco van de Voort <marcov@toad.stack.nl> - 2014-03-16 18:39 +0000
          Re: Is multi-level function return possible? Andy Walker <news@cuboid.co.uk> - 2014-03-16 19:45 +0000
            Re: Is multi-level function return possible? Bill Findlay <yaldnif.w@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2014-03-17 16:15 +0000
              Re: Is multi-level function return possible? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2014-03-18 17:36 +0000
                Re: Is multi-level function return possible? Andy Walker <news@cuboid.co.uk> - 2014-03-21 02:04 +0000
                Re: Is multi-level function return possible? glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2014-03-21 02:50 +0000
                Re: design of PL/I, was Is multi-level function return possible? glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2014-03-21 06:43 +0000
                Re: design of PL/I, was Is multi-level function return possible? noitalmost <noitalmost@cox.net> - 2014-03-26 14:16 -0400
                Re: exception catching in PL/I, was Is multi-level function return possible? "Robin Vowels" <robin51@dodo.com.au> - 2014-03-27 21:08 +1100
                Re: Is multi-level function return possible? anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2014-03-24 17:06 +0000
                Re: Is multi-level function return possible? glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2014-03-24 20:01 +0000
                Re: Is multi-level function return possible? George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2014-03-26 04:00 -0400
                Re: Is multi-level function return possible? Hans-Peter Diettrich <DrDiettrich1@aol.com> - 2014-03-27 01:58 +0100
                Re: Is multi-level function return possible? Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2014-04-07 14:48 -0400
                Re: Is multi-level function return possible? Andy Walker <news@cuboid.co.uk> - 2014-03-26 12:16 +0000
                Re: Is multi-level function return possible? Andy Walker <news@cuboid.co.uk> - 2014-03-26 17:34 +0000
                Re: history of C, was Is multi-level function return possible? glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2014-03-27 00:05 +0000
      Re: Is multi-level function return possible? Bakul Shah <usenet@bitblocks.com> - 2014-03-15 10:28 -0700
    Re: Is multi-level function return possible? George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2014-03-14 02:44 -0400
      Re: Is multi-level function return possible? Marco van de Voort <marcov@toad.stack.nl> - 2014-03-14 19:38 +0000
      Re: Is multi-level function return possible? Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2014-03-14 21:36 +0000
      Re: Is multi-level function return possible? glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2014-03-14 21:47 +0000
        Re: Is multi-level function return possible? Hans-Peter Diettrich <DrDiettrich1@aol.com> - 2014-03-15 13:34 +0100
      Re: Is multi-level function return possible? Ian Lance Taylor <ian@airs.com> - 2014-03-14 16:55 -0700
  Re: Is multi-level function return possible? George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2014-03-11 13:56 -0400
    Re: Is multi-level function return possible? federation2005@netzero.com - 2014-03-26 17:39 -0700
      Re: catch and throw, was Is multi-level function return possible? rpw3@rpw3.org (Rob Warnock) - 2014-03-27 04:23 +0000
        Re: catch and throw, was Is multi-level function return possible? Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2014-03-27 05:44 +0000
        Re: catch and throw, was Is multi-level function return possible? Bakul Shah <usenet@bitblocks.com> - 2014-03-26 23:20 -0700
          Re: catch and throw, was Is multi-level function return possible? glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2014-03-27 19:21 +0000
          Re: exception catching in PL/I "Robin Vowels" <robin51@dodo.com.au> - 2014-03-28 10:50 +1100
            Re: exception catching in PL/I Martin Ward <martin@gkc.org.uk> - 2014-04-16 14:32 +0100
          Re: catch and throw, was Is multi-level function return possible? mac <acolvin@efunct.com> - 2014-03-28 23:08 +0000
            Re: catch and throw, was Is multi-level function return possible? Ivan Godard <ivan@ootbcomp.com> - 2014-03-28 18:24 -0700
              Re: catch and throw, was Is multi-level function return possible? Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2014-03-29 02:47 +0000
                Re: catch and throw, was Is multi-level function return possible? Ivan Godard <ivan@ootbcomp.com> - 2014-03-28 21:32 -0700
              Re: catch and throw, was Is multi-level function return possible? glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2014-03-29 03:38 +0000
                Re: precise and imprecise, was catch and throw, was Is multi-level function return possible? Ivan Godard <ivan@ootbcomp.com> - 2014-03-28 22:12 -0700
            Re: catch and throw, was Is multi-level function return possible? Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2014-03-29 02:07 +0000
              Re: catch and throw, was Is multi-level function return possible? Alan Bawden <alan@scooby-doo.csail.mit.edu> - 2014-03-29 02:44 -0400
            Re: PL/I exceptions, was catch and throw, was Is multi-level function return possible? glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2014-03-29 02:40 +0000
              Re: PL/I exceptions "Robin Vowels" <robin51@dodo.com.au> - 2014-03-30 01:58 +1100
      Re: catch and throw, was Is multi-level function return possible? George Neuner <gneuner2@comcast.net> - 2014-03-28 03:52 -0400
  Re: Is multi-level function return possible? Louis Krupp <lkrupp@pssw.com> - 2014-03-11 15:16 -0600
  Re: Is multi-level function return possible? noitalmost <noitalmost@cox.net> - 2014-03-15 12:21 -0400

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