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Live boot wifi handling

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  Live boot wifi handling Mike Easter <MikeE@ster.invalid> - 2019-07-18 10:49 -0700
    Re: Live boot wifi handling Mike Easter <MikeE@ster.invalid> - 2019-07-18 11:06 -0700
      Re: Live boot wifi handling "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2019-07-18 23:07 +0200
        Re: Live boot wifi handling Mike Easter <MikeE@ster.invalid> - 2019-07-18 14:31 -0700
          Re: Live boot wifi handling Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2019-07-18 17:51 -0400
            Re: Live boot wifi handling "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2019-07-20 12:58 +0200
              Re: Live boot wifi handling Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2019-07-20 11:22 -0400
                Re: Live boot wifi handling "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2019-07-20 22:31 +0200
                  Re: Live boot wifi handling Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2019-07-20 18:14 -0400
          Re: Live boot wifi handling "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2019-07-20 12:46 +0200
    Re: Live boot wifi handling Mike Easter <MikeE@ster.invalid> - 2019-07-18 12:29 -0700
      Re: Live boot wifi handling Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2019-07-18 16:52 -0400
      Re: Live boot wifi handling Mike Easter <MikeE@ster.invalid> - 2019-07-19 11:40 -0700
        Re: Live boot wifi handling Mike Easter <MikeE@ster.invalid> - 2019-07-19 12:41 -0700
        Re: Live boot wifi handling Mike Easter <MikeE@ster.invalid> - 2019-07-19 16:06 -0700
      Re: Live boot wifi handling Mike Easter <MikeE@ster.invalid> - 2019-07-20 10:45 -0700
        Re: Live boot wifi handling Mike Easter <MikeE@ster.invalid> - 2019-07-20 20:39 -0700
        Re: Live boot wifi handling Mike Easter <MikeE@ster.invalid> - 2019-07-21 03:27 -0700
    Re: Live boot wifi handling Mike Easter <MikeE@ster.invalid> - 2019-07-18 14:07 -0700
      Re: Live boot wifi handling Mike Easter <MikeE@ster.invalid> - 2019-07-18 14:54 -0700
      Re: Live boot wifi handling Mike Easter <MikeE@ster.invalid> - 2019-07-18 15:51 -0700
        Re: Live boot wifi handling Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2019-07-18 22:53 -0400
        Re: Live boot wifi handling Mike Easter <MikeE@ster.invalid> - 2019-07-19 10:55 -0700
          Re: Live boot wifi handling Bit Twister <BitTwister@mouse-potato.com> - 2019-07-19 13:08 -0500
            Re: Live boot wifi handling Mike Easter <MikeE@ster.invalid> - 2019-07-19 11:16 -0700

Page 1 of 2  [1] 2  Next page →

#57705 — Live boot wifi handling

I have a 'new' refurb Lenovo laptop x131e (BIOS date 2013 Aug) which 
hardware is AMD E2-1800 APU with Radeon HD 7340 Graphics w/ 4G DDR3 ram, 
whose wifi is Broadcom BCM43228 802.11a/b/g/n which wants driver: 
bcma-pci-bridge.  I like to boot various live linux from USB.  This 
would be easiest to do using its ethernet, because some linux distros 
don't recognize the wifi properly in order to provide a view of the 
available SSID, so I would like to develop my skills at enabling the 
wifi if the default boot doesn't get it.  I would like to learn to do it 
w/ the available graphical network manager as well as command line if 
practical.  I understand/ suppose/ that sometimes it will be necessary 
to boot w/ ethernet to get the wifi working properly.

Recently the wifi was handled properly by Peppermint, MX 18, and Slax, 
but not Xubuntu, Bluebuntu, Neon, or q4OS (w/ Plasma not Trinity DE).

Also, I have another story about related hardware and cpu heating.

-- 
Mike Easter

[toc] | [next] | [standalone]

#57707

Mike Easter wrote:
> I have a 'new' refurb Lenovo laptop x131e 
> 
> Also, I have another story about related hardware and cpu heating.
> 
This refurb hardware was on sale at Fry's which I like to buy 'dicey' 
type stuff at a storefront like Fry's or WalMart because they have 
excellent return policies.  Some refurbs are shabby, beat-up, or b0rken 
in some way.  Mail-order gets you into RMA return blues/hell.

In any case, I confirmed the hardware availability at Fry's and picked 
it up and brought it home and charged it up and booted into the Win10 
and activated that, no problem.  The condition was excellent; it 
appeared unused.  Then I started trying to boot up some linux live.  I 
would get some alert such as 'no IRQ handler for vector' which might 
progress to a boot or the machine might just shut down.

This performance was inconsistent; sometimes it might boot.  On the 
occasions which it would boot, maybe its wifi would be working and maybe 
not.  Mostly there was way too much not booting caused by shutdown.

Occasionally during a boot failure some distros would give me a thermal 
warning.  This led to further investigation which showed me that on the 
successful boots I could use something like inxi -s to tell me that the 
CPU was running about 90 C, but the fan wasn't all that fast, less than 
500 rpm.  It was never 'noisy'.

Then I started trying to check the temp in the BIOS (nope, nothing 
there) or w/ Win (nope, nothing in the default) so I installed a Core 
Temp app in Win and discovered that altho' Win consistently booted, it 
was also consistently about 90 C just quiet at the desktop.

If I were going to troubleshoot it, I would be removing the battery so I 
could see if the cpu cooler was 'adherent' properly or the vents were 
clear or whatever, but as a brand new machine, I decided to just return 
it and swap it for one which wasn't like that.

I am now doing my testing w/ its replacement, which is doing just fine 
in that regard.

-- 
Mike Easter

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#57715

On 18/07/2019 20.06, Mike Easter wrote:
> Mike Easter wrote:
>> I have a 'new' refurb Lenovo laptop x131e
>> Also, I have another story about related hardware and cpu heating.
>>
> This refurb hardware was on sale at Fry's which I like to buy 'dicey'
> type stuff at a storefront like Fry's or WalMart because they have
> excellent return policies.  Some refurbs are shabby, beat-up, or b0rken
> in some way.  Mail-order gets you into RMA return blues/hell.
> 
> In any case, I confirmed the hardware availability at Fry's and picked
> it up and brought it home and charged it up and booted into the Win10
> and activated that, no problem.  The condition was excellent; it
> appeared unused.  Then I started trying to boot up some linux live.  I
> would get some alert such as 'no IRQ handler for vector' which might
> progress to a boot or the machine might just shut down.
> 
> This performance was inconsistent; sometimes it might boot.  On the
> occasions which it would boot, maybe its wifi would be working and maybe
> not.  Mostly there was way too much not booting caused by shutdown.
> 
> Occasionally during a boot failure some distros would give me a thermal
> warning.  This led to further investigation which showed me that on the
> successful boots I could use something like inxi -s to tell me that the
> CPU was running about 90 C, but the fan wasn't all that fast, less than
> 500 rpm.  It was never 'noisy'.
> 
> Then I started trying to check the temp in the BIOS (nope, nothing
> there) or w/ Win (nope, nothing in the default) so I installed a Core
> Temp app in Win and discovered that altho' Win consistently booted, it
> was also consistently about 90 C just quiet at the desktop.
> 
> If I were going to troubleshoot it, I would be removing the battery so I
> could see if the cpu cooler was 'adherent' properly or the vents were
> clear or whatever, but as a brand new machine, I decided to just return
> it and swap it for one which wasn't like that.

Did you tell them? Or some poor sod will get a too hot machine. :-p

> I am now doing my testing w/ its replacement, which is doing just fine
> in that regard.
> 

What temp?

-- 
Cheers, Carlos.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#57716

Carlos E.R. wrote:
> Mike Easter wrote:

>> If I were going to troubleshoot it, I would be removing the battery so I
>> could see if the cpu cooler was 'adherent' properly or the vents were
>> clear or whatever, but as a brand new machine, I decided to just return
>> it and swap it for one which wasn't like that.
> 
> Did you tell them? Or some poor sod will get a too hot machine. :-p

Oh, yeah.  On this return/exchange business one needs to convince the 
techs at the desks why you want a refund or exchange.  I gave enough 
story that he accepted my explanation w/o even looking at what the 
little Core Temp app in Win10 was saying.

I don't know whether the guys in the back will check it out or whether 
they'll just return it to the refurb/er w/ a note.  I guess it depends 
on the 'deal' between Fry's and either the refurb/er or some 3rd party. 
I think refurb should be responsible; if they get the troubleshooting 
info, it wouldn't be hard to checkout/fix.

>> I am now doing my testing w/ its replacement, which is doing just fine
>> in that regard.
> 
> What temp?

Well, let's see.  Right after booting a live MX it is in the high 50s, 
but as it sits there doing nothing, it is slowly dropping to mid 50s

Incidentally, at these more acceptable temps, the fan is quietly running 
faster close to 600 rpm than it was at 90-100 C before, less than 500.



-- 
Mike Easter

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#57718

Mike Easter wrote:
> Carlos E.R. wrote:
>> Mike Easter wrote:
> 
>>> If I were going to troubleshoot it, I would be removing the battery so I
>>> could see if the cpu cooler was 'adherent' properly or the vents were
>>> clear or whatever, but as a brand new machine, I decided to just return
>>> it and swap it for one which wasn't like that.
>>
>> Did you tell them? Or some poor sod will get a too hot machine. :-p
> 
> Oh, yeah.  On this return/exchange business one needs to convince the 
> techs at the desks why you want a refund or exchange.  I gave enough 
> story that he accepted my explanation w/o even looking at what the 
> little Core Temp app in Win10 was saying.
> 
> I don't know whether the guys in the back will check it out or whether 
> they'll just return it to the refurb/er w/ a note.  I guess it depends 
> on the 'deal' between Fry's and either the refurb/er or some 3rd party. 
> I think refurb should be responsible; if they get the troubleshooting 
> info, it wouldn't be hard to checkout/fix.
> 
>>> I am now doing my testing w/ its replacement, which is doing just fine
>>> in that regard.
>>
>> What temp?
> 
> Well, let's see.  Right after booting a live MX it is in the high 50s, 
> but as it sits there doing nothing, it is slowly dropping to mid 50s
> 
> Incidentally, at these more acceptable temps, the fan is quietly running 
> faster close to 600 rpm than it was at 90-100 C before, less than 500.

It's possible some previous owner hacked the fan control.
In an attempt to make a "quieter" machine. (Run fan off 5V
instead of from a modulated fan header.)

The CPU is still protected by THERMTRIP, so if
the temperature goes too high, the machine just...
shuts off. That would usually be at ThrottleTemp+20C.

Sometimes fan control is achieved by the BIOS using
the "automation" in the SuperI/O hardware monitor.
On some of those, you used to be able to "bind"
a certain thermal sensor, to a "fan curve" for a
particular fan. And the fan would speed up using
nothing more than SuperI/O logic.

If the heatpipe joining the chips to the ventilated
heatsink leaks and runs out of fluid, then an increased
fan speed will help little. You might feel a good
flow of air... but no heat. There was a time when
heatpipe leaks were a little more common.

The TIM used from the factory, is normally pretty
good. It's when people take the heatpipe assembly off,
clean it and butter it with enthusiast stuff, that
maybe a couple years later it potentially needs work
again. By comparison, some of the factory TIM products
melt and reflow to make good contact, and they don't tend
to move once things settle in.

In some cases, the thermals use a SIL-Pad, but you need
a pretty thin one for an application like this. A SIL-Pad
can have an adhesive on one side, to keep the thing in
position. They vary over about a factor of 10 on performance.
(In other words, if you were to buy a replacement, you
might well buy an inferior one.) Whereas enthusiast pastes
are all pretty good. Some enthusiast pastes are hard to
spread (like they were breadcrumbs), and the application
technique is a distinguishing factor when buying some.

I use the "dot" technique, and squash it to spread it
around. The spreading pattern is a circle, if the
surfaces are planar and not too damaged. You do a test
dot first, to gauge how much it will spread, then
scale up the dot of material to get good coverage.
When the material wets the edges of the joint, you
can see the color of it, from the outside. Too much,
and it oozes all over the place (bad).

    Paul

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#57743

On 18/07/2019 23.51, Paul wrote:
> Mike Easter wrote:
>> Carlos E.R. wrote:
>>> Mike Easter wrote:
>>
>>>> If I were going to troubleshoot it, I would be removing the battery
>>>> so I
>>>> could see if the cpu cooler was 'adherent' properly or the vents were
>>>> clear or whatever, but as a brand new machine, I decided to just return
>>>> it and swap it for one which wasn't like that.
>>>
>>> Did you tell them? Or some poor sod will get a too hot machine. :-p
>>
>> Oh, yeah.  On this return/exchange business one needs to convince the
>> techs at the desks why you want a refund or exchange.  I gave enough
>> story that he accepted my explanation w/o even looking at what the
>> little Core Temp app in Win10 was saying.
>>
>> I don't know whether the guys in the back will check it out or whether
>> they'll just return it to the refurb/er w/ a note.  I guess it depends
>> on the 'deal' between Fry's and either the refurb/er or some 3rd
>> party. I think refurb should be responsible; if they get the
>> troubleshooting info, it wouldn't be hard to checkout/fix.
>>
>>>> I am now doing my testing w/ its replacement, which is doing just fine
>>>> in that regard.
>>>
>>> What temp?
>>
>> Well, let's see.  Right after booting a live MX it is in the high 50s,
>> but as it sits there doing nothing, it is slowly dropping to mid 50s
>>
>> Incidentally, at these more acceptable temps, the fan is quietly
>> running faster close to 600 rpm than it was at 90-100 C before, less
>> than 500.
> 
> It's possible some previous owner hacked the fan control.
> In an attempt to make a "quieter" machine. (Run fan off 5V
> instead of from a modulated fan header.)
> 
> The CPU is still protected by THERMTRIP, so if
> the temperature goes too high, the machine just...
> shuts off. That would usually be at ThrottleTemp+20C.

Shouldn't it drop CPU speed first?  I don't know if the CPUs can do that
by themselves or if it is the OS who does that. The OS can also put a
core to idle for a while.

I remember, maybe two decades ago, that the AMD processors of the era
would self destroy if the heat sink was removed, and fast.

I also remember that a machine of mine with a Pentium could be set to
sleep in RAM. But the CPU became burning hot (the fan stopped), one day
I put my finger on it. I decided not to ever suspend.

> 
> Sometimes fan control is achieved by the BIOS using
> the "automation" in the SuperI/O hardware monitor.
> On some of those, you used to be able to "bind"
> a certain thermal sensor, to a "fan curve" for a
> particular fan. And the fan would speed up using
> nothing more than SuperI/O logic.
> 
> If the heatpipe joining the chips to the ventilated
> heatsink leaks and runs out of fluid, then an increased
> fan speed will help little. You might feel a good
> flow of air... but no heat. There was a time when
> heatpipe leaks were a little more common.

I was surprised the first time I saw a heatpipe. Till I learned how they
worked. Then I wondered about possible leaks.

> 
> The TIM used from the factory, is normally pretty
> good. It's when people take the heatpipe assembly off,
> clean it and butter it with enthusiast stuff, that
> maybe a couple years later it potentially needs work
> again. By comparison, some of the factory TIM products
> melt and reflow to make good contact, and they don't tend
> to move once things settle in.
> 
> In some cases, the thermals use a SIL-Pad, but you need
> a pretty thin one for an application like this. A SIL-Pad
> can have an adhesive on one side, to keep the thing in
> position. They vary over about a factor of 10 on performance.
> (In other words, if you were to buy a replacement, you
> might well buy an inferior one.) Whereas enthusiast pastes
> are all pretty good. Some enthusiast pastes are hard to
> spread (like they were breadcrumbs), and the application
> technique is a distinguishing factor when buying some.
> 
> I use the "dot" technique, and squash it to spread it
> around. The spreading pattern is a circle, if the
> surfaces are planar and not too damaged. You do a test
> dot first, to gauge how much it will spread, then
> scale up the dot of material to get good coverage.
> When the material wets the edges of the joint, you
> can see the color of it, from the outside. Too much,
> and it oozes all over the place (bad).

You make me wonder. I have to upgrade my machine, and if I buy by parts
I may have to do that. I don't like the idea. Yes, I have worked with
thermal paste, but long ago when it was not that sophisticated and
critical. Ie, on Pentiums, or transistors and analog chips.

-- 
Cheers, Carlos.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#57752

Carlos E.R. wrote:

> You make me wonder. I have to upgrade my machine, and if I buy by parts
> I may have to do that. I don't like the idea. Yes, I have worked with
> thermal paste, but long ago when it was not that sophisticated and
> critical. Ie, on Pentiums, or transistors and analog chips.

That's back in the "Zinc Oxide in silicon oil" era.

Radioshack used to carry that stuff.

It separates and the joint buttered with the material
can push out. Some of the Zinc Oxide stays behind,
but the treatment will be "patchy" (patches of zinc oxide)
and not very efficient.

Zinc Oxide is also a protectant from UV rays from the sun,
which is why you've heard of it before. That white stuff
you put on the tip of your nose to stop sunburn, is an example.

Today, they use Boron Nitride or other ceramics, mixed
with an organic carrier (something viscous). Synthetic
diamond also works. For the specialty materials
that mention "X" (some magical material like silver particles),
you might find a large percentage of the active material
is just Boron Nitride.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boron_nitride

    "The thermal conductivity of BN is among the
     highest of all electric insulators (see table)."

For paste products with conductive particles mixed into them,
you don't want to get the material on anything
except the surface to be cooled. Don't get thermal
paste into any CPU sockets for example. You might
be able to upset the bias on a PLL or something.
(Many contacts on a CPU are relatively low
impedance, but not all of them. Some can be
"pushed around" by electrical leakage from a
conductive paste.)

    Paul

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#57776

On 20/07/2019 17.22, Paul wrote:
> Carlos E.R. wrote:
> 
>> You make me wonder. I have to upgrade my machine, and if I buy by parts
>> I may have to do that. I don't like the idea. Yes, I have worked with
>> thermal paste, but long ago when it was not that sophisticated and
>> critical. Ie, on Pentiums, or transistors and analog chips.
> 
> That's back in the "Zinc Oxide in silicon oil" era.
> 
> Radioshack used to carry that stuff.
> 
> It separates and the joint buttered with the material
> can push out. Some of the Zinc Oxide stays behind,
> but the treatment will be "patchy" (patches of zinc oxide)
> and not very efficient.
> 
> Zinc Oxide is also a protectant from UV rays from the sun,
> which is why you've heard of it before. That white stuff
> you put on the tip of your nose to stop sunburn, is an example.
> 
> Today, they use Boron Nitride or other ceramics, mixed
> with an organic carrier (something viscous). Synthetic
> diamond also works. For the specialty materials
> that mention "X" (some magical material like silver particles),
> you might find a large percentage of the active material
> is just Boron Nitride.
> 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boron_nitride
> 
>    "The thermal conductivity of BN is among the
>     highest of all electric insulators (see table)."
> 
> For paste products with conductive particles mixed into them,
> you don't want to get the material on anything
> except the surface to be cooled. Don't get thermal
> paste into any CPU sockets for example. You might
> be able to upset the bias on a PLL or something.
> (Many contacts on a CPU are relatively low
> impedance, but not all of them. Some can be
> "pushed around" by electrical leakage from a
> conductive paste.)

Yeah... which is why I don't like the idea of doing it myself.

-- 
Cheers, Carlos.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#57782

Carlos E.R. wrote:
> On 20/07/2019 17.22, Paul wrote:
>> Carlos E.R. wrote:
>>
>>> You make me wonder. I have to upgrade my machine, and if I buy by parts
>>> I may have to do that. I don't like the idea. Yes, I have worked with
>>> thermal paste, but long ago when it was not that sophisticated and
>>> critical. Ie, on Pentiums, or transistors and analog chips.
>> That's back in the "Zinc Oxide in silicon oil" era.
>>
>> Radioshack used to carry that stuff.
>>
>> It separates and the joint buttered with the material
>> can push out. Some of the Zinc Oxide stays behind,
>> but the treatment will be "patchy" (patches of zinc oxide)
>> and not very efficient.
>>
>> Zinc Oxide is also a protectant from UV rays from the sun,
>> which is why you've heard of it before. That white stuff
>> you put on the tip of your nose to stop sunburn, is an example.
>>
>> Today, they use Boron Nitride or other ceramics, mixed
>> with an organic carrier (something viscous). Synthetic
>> diamond also works. For the specialty materials
>> that mention "X" (some magical material like silver particles),
>> you might find a large percentage of the active material
>> is just Boron Nitride.
>>
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boron_nitride
>>
>>    "The thermal conductivity of BN is among the
>>     highest of all electric insulators (see table)."
>>
>> For paste products with conductive particles mixed into them,
>> you don't want to get the material on anything
>> except the surface to be cooled. Don't get thermal
>> paste into any CPU sockets for example. You might
>> be able to upset the bias on a PLL or something.
>> (Many contacts on a CPU are relatively low
>> impedance, but not all of them. Some can be
>> "pushed around" by electrical leakage from a
>> conductive paste.)
> 
> Yeah... which is why I don't like the idea of doing it myself.
> 

The "dot" method is completely safe.

Apply a small dot.
Squish the heatsink assembly into the material.
Disassemble and eyeball the paste diameter.
Clean off the material.
Apply a "scaled" dot, so the stuff will spread
to the edges. Don't be stingy, or it won't
"wet the edge". Because you know how much it
spreads, there is less tendency to apply an excess
on the second try.

You're basically calibrating the planarity of the
surfaces and the material consistency, when you do
your first test run.

    Paul

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#57742

On 18/07/2019 23.31, Mike Easter wrote:
> Carlos E.R. wrote:
>> Mike Easter wrote:
> 
>>> If I were going to troubleshoot it, I would be removing the battery so I
>>> could see if the cpu cooler was 'adherent' properly or the vents were
>>> clear or whatever, but as a brand new machine, I decided to just return
>>> it and swap it for one which wasn't like that.
>>
>> Did you tell them? Or some poor sod will get a too hot machine. :-p
> 
> Oh, yeah.  On this return/exchange business one needs to convince the
> techs at the desks why you want a refund or exchange.  I gave enough
> story that he accepted my explanation w/o even looking at what the
> little Core Temp app in Win10 was saying.
> 
> I don't know whether the guys in the back will check it out or whether
> they'll just return it to the refurb/er w/ a note.  I guess it depends
> on the 'deal' between Fry's and either the refurb/er or some 3rd party.
> I think refurb should be responsible; if they get the troubleshooting
> info, it wouldn't be hard to checkout/fix.
> 
>>> I am now doing my testing w/ its replacement, which is doing just fine
>>> in that regard.
>>
>> What temp?
> 
> Well, let's see.  Right after booting a live MX it is in the high 50s,
> but as it sits there doing nothing, it is slowly dropping to mid 50s

Very different.

> Incidentally, at these more acceptable temps, the fan is quietly running
> faster close to 600 rpm than it was at 90-100 C before, less than 500.

Curious that. Ah, I see Paul has an hypothesis for that. Yes, that fan
on the first machine should be roaring.

-- 
Cheers, Carlos.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#57710

Mike Easter wrote:

> wifi is Broadcom BCM43228 802.11a/b/g/n which wants driver: 
> bcma-pci-bridge.

> Recently the wifi was handled properly by Peppermint, MX 18, and Slax, 
> but not Xubuntu, Bluebuntu, Neon, or q4OS (w/ Plasma not Trinity DE).
> 
Using the Xub as an example; I can't 'get' some nmcli outputs.

nmcli r all wifi types enabled
nmcli d doesn't show the wifi
lspci sees/id/s the Broadcom, but doesn't call it a wifi, just 'network 
controller'
inxi -N sees the Broadcom and the bcm-pci-bridge driver, (but it isn't 
'working').
nmcli d wifi list doesn't see anything


-- 
Mike Easter

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#57713

Mike Easter wrote:
> Mike Easter wrote:
> 
>> wifi is Broadcom BCM43228 802.11a/b/g/n which wants driver: 
>> bcma-pci-bridge.
> 
>> Recently the wifi was handled properly by Peppermint, MX 18, and Slax, 
>> but not Xubuntu, Bluebuntu, Neon, or q4OS (w/ Plasma not Trinity DE).
>>
> Using the Xub as an example; I can't 'get' some nmcli outputs.
> 
> nmcli r all wifi types enabled
> nmcli d doesn't show the wifi
> lspci sees/id/s the Broadcom, but doesn't call it a wifi, just 'network 
> controller'
> inxi -N sees the Broadcom and the bcm-pci-bridge driver, (but it isn't 
> 'working').
> nmcli d wifi list doesn't see anything
> 
> 

I just ran the "Bcma-pci-bridge" through Google, and a familiar "aroma" arose.
This isn't for your distro, but it's likely the same driver
"constellation" issue. I see the evil number "B43",
which I've seen in a few posts in the past.

https://forum.manjaro.org/t/broadcom-wifi-driver-fails-to-install-properly/46316/2

    Paul

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#57733

Mike Easter wrote:

>> wifi is Broadcom BCM43228 802.11a/b/g/n which wants driver: 
>> bcma-pci-bridge.
> 
>> Recently the wifi was handled properly by Peppermint, MX 18, and Slax, 
>> but not Xubuntu, Bluebuntu, Neon, or q4OS (w/ Plasma not Trinity DE).
>>
> Using the Xub as an example; I can't 'get' some nmcli outputs.
> 
> nmcli r all wifi types enabled
> nmcli d doesn't show the wifi
> lspci sees/id/s the Broadcom, but doesn't call it a wifi, just 'network 
> controller'
> inxi -N sees the Broadcom and the bcm-pci-bridge driver, (but it isn't 
> 'working').
> nmcli d wifi list doesn't see anything

I think that when the boot algo is surveying the hardware, it sees and 
recognizes the broadcom and provides a correct driver for it, but does 
NOT properly recognize it as a wifi.  No wlan0 results, eg in the nmcli 
d or ifconfig.

I don't believe the discussions which try to solve the bcm-pci-bridge 
not being the correct driver are applicable, because those distros which 
work OOTB are using that driver, just as the example above which was 
using the driver but it didn't work.

I once was using a distro in some other hardware which had a similar 
problem on live boot; maybe it was AntiX, and it had a GUI tool with 
which I was able to 'guide' it to using the 'network card' as a wifi. 
That might've been a broadcom (or maybe intel) on an ancient Dell laptop.

I'll check out that machine and antiX on the lenovo.


-- 
Mike Easter

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#57735

Mike Easter wrote:
> I once was using a distro in some other hardware which had a similar 
> problem on live boot; maybe it was AntiX, and it had a GUI tool with 
> which I was able to 'guide' it to using the 'network card' as a wifi. 
> That might've been a broadcom (or maybe intel) on an ancient Dell laptop.

That didn't actually help me yet.  The ancient dell used Broadcom for 
the ethernet and Intel for the wifi.  AntiX on the lenovo recognizes the 
broadcom and uses the wl driver instead of the bcm-pci-bridge and finds 
the SSID.  Oops.  I guess I should've checked to see if it could connect 
properly.  Later.

-- 
Mike Easter

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#57737

Mike Easter wrote:
> 
>>> wifi is Broadcom BCM43228 802.11a/b/g/n which wants driver: 
>>> bcma-pci-bridge.

Altho' that driver works for some distro live boots; I'm not sure it is 
the best

> I think that when the boot algo is surveying the hardware, it sees and 
> recognizes the broadcom and provides a correct driver for it, but does 
> NOT properly recognize it as a wifi.  No wlan0 results, eg in the nmcli 
> d or ifconfig.
> 
> I don't believe the discussions which try to solve the bcm-pci-bridge 
> not being the correct driver are applicable, because those distros which 
> work OOTB are using that driver, just as the example above which was 
> using the driver but it didn't work.

Now I'm not sure how much of the above par is correct.

I'm almost certain the 'best' driver or package for the BCM43228 is 
Broadcom-sta which is in the repos.  My Mint/Ub repos say:

// Broadcom STA is a binary-only device driver to support the following IEEE
802.11a/b/g/n wireless network cards: BCM4311-, BCM4312-, BCM4313-,
BCM4321-, BCM4322-, BCM43142-, BCM43224-, BCM43225-, BCM43227-, BCM43228-,
BCM4331-, BCM4360-, and BCM4352-based hardware.

This package contains the common files and it should not be installed 
manually
(it will be installed automatically as needed). //


Now I'm trying to figure out some kind of modprobe boot parameter to use 
to try to help the live hardware id process do the right thing.



-- 
Mike Easter

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#57765

Mike Easter wrote:
> Using the Xub as an example; I can't 'get' some nmcli outputs.
> 
> nmcli r all wifi types enabled
> nmcli d doesn't show the wifi
> lspci sees/id/s the Broadcom, but doesn't call it a wifi, just 'network 
> controller'
> inxi -N sees the Broadcom and the bcm-pci-bridge driver, (but it isn't 
> 'working').
> nmcli d wifi list doesn't see anything

I fixed this problem above (in a Mint Cinn instead of Xub)

The live Mint had the same problem as Xub, but I followed these steps 
using the ethernet connectivity on the Mint live on USB w/ persistence:

Modified from a Deb page 
https://wiki.debian.org/wl#Switch_between_wl.2FOSS_drivers

I tried to just install the broadcom-sta-common and then the wl driver, 
but that didn't work.  It was necessary to use the broadcom-sta-dkms 
(also in the repos) as the page said:

The important modprobe remove was the one for bcma; because when I tried 
to do it as a regular user the error was only for the bcma.  So I used 
sudo for that, and sudo for the modprobe wl.

synaptic install broadcom-sta-dkms

tried $ modprobe -r b44 b43 b43legacy ssb brcmsmac bcma but got 'not 
allowed' only on the bcma, so I used

sudo modprobe -r bcma

Then I used sudo modprobe wl

to install the driver from the broadcom-sta package.  Then I just logged 
out and back in to let the system handle the wifi situation.  Prior to 
the installation of wl, the driver had been bcm-pci-bridge but the nmcli 
d didn't show any wifi nor did iwconfig.

After getting the wl driver installed in Mint, which is also the driver 
used by such as MX and AntiX, there was a wifi in nmcli d which was 
wlp2s0 (not wlan0) and I could see the local SSIDs and connect.

So, that is one way to fix the problem for those Ub or Deb related 
distros which don't work w/ the bcm-pci-bridge driver; replace it w/ the 
proprietary wl driver.  Some distros work OK w/ that b-p-b driver.  Some 
other distros automatically use the wl driver w/o help.

My next plan is to create a persistent Mint Cinn w/ mk-usb instead of w/ 
Yumi and to put it on a USB3 instead of 2 and then to enable the wl 
driver and then to boot the live Mint w/ persistence off the USB3 port 
on the Lenovo, to make a faster boot.


-- 
Mike Easter

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#57792

Mike Easter wrote:
> My next plan is to create a persistent Mint Cinn w/ mk-usb instead of w/ 
> Yumi and to put it on a USB3 instead of 2 and then to enable the wl 
> driver and then to boot the live Mint w/ persistence off the USB3 port 
> on the Lenovo, to make a faster boot.

Well, this works, but not 'seamlessly' or perfectly.

My current method is to install the bcmwl-kernel-source from the repos 
using ethernet.  This fixes up a blacklist for the 'string' of possible 
broadcom drivers in the modprobe.d dir and installs the wl driver.

However, the 'persistence' angle doesn't work perfectly.  Sometimes the 
'old'/wrong bcma driver which is bcma-pci-bridge shows up in inxi -N 
instead and there's no operational wifi.  Then it is necessary to 
modprobe -r bcma it away and replace modprobe the wl driver which should 
have been automatic.

Sometimes the wl driver doesn't show or work.  In that case inxi -N 
shows the broadcom having no driver and there's no wifi.  The key to 
fixing that is to -r the the wl and then to put it back.  The nmcli -d 
is right and inxi -N is right and the SSIDs show up again.

But, w/ the persistence, none of the above requires any other type of 
'connecting' such as is used w/ the ethernet to fetch the 
bcmwl-kernel-source from the repos at the beginning.

If someone had to use another machine to fetch that package from the 
repos, they could transport it to the laptop.

-- 
Mike Easter

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#57795

Mike Easter wrote:
> The live Mint had the same problem as Xub, but I followed these steps 
> using the ethernet connectivity on the Mint live on USB w/ persistence:
> 
> Modified from a Deb page 
> https://wiki.debian.org/wl#Switch_between_wl.2FOSS_drivers

Another useful page for Ub related distros is this: 
https://askubuntu.com/questions/55868/installing-broadcom-wireless-drivers 
  Installing Broadcom Wireless Drivers

... where the #1 answer, w/ hundreds of votes and an extensive table of 
broadcom categorized by PCI ID, and further by recommendations for the 
Ubs 16.04 vs 17.10+ v/s and special cases.  It includes offline 
installation instr.

-- 
Mike Easter

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#57714

Mike Easter wrote:
> Recently the wifi was handled properly by Peppermint, MX 18, and Slax, 
> but not Xubuntu, Bluebuntu, Neon, or q4OS (w/ Plasma not Trinity DE).

None of these 17.10 'buntu/s work OOTB: Ub, Kub, Budgie, Mate, Xub, Lub; 
nor these 19.04s Ub, Kub.  But SolydX 201902 does.

So, in this brief survey so far, usually 17.10 and 19.04 'buntu/s don't 
work (except Peppermint on 18.04), and 2 Deb/s did MX & Solyd, and 1 Slack.

But I'm not yet getting any better at improving what I see OOTB.

-- 
Mike Easter

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#57719

Mike Easter wrote:
> So, in this brief survey so far, usually 17.10 and 19.04 'buntu/s don't 
> work (except Peppermint on 18.04), and 2 Deb/s did MX & Solyd, and 1 Slack.
> 
> But I'm not yet getting any better at improving what I see OOTB.

Historically, Robolinux had a tool*  "Hardware Information + Profiler" 
which would enable one to implement Broadcom wireless; but I just booted 
the Robolinux Cinnamon 10.5 and it doesn't have such a program 
(anymore).  Maybe I should try the XFCE for some reason.  He has a lot 
of 'stuff' in his .iso which I don't want which makes the .iso over 3.3 
G while the XFCE weighs 2.0.

* https://www.robolinux.org/x-faq/1.html  How do I install video & 
wireless drivers in Robolinux XFCE - In this example we are installing a 
BCM wifi driver.

-- 
Mike Easter

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