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Please help me choose a window manager

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  Please help me choose a window manager root <NoEMail@home.org> - 2016-04-13 16:42 +0000
    Re: Please help me choose a window manager notbob <notbob@nothome.com> - 2016-04-13 17:10 +0000
      Re: Please help me choose a window manager root <NoEMail@home.org> - 2016-04-13 17:53 +0000
        Re: Please help me choose a window manager notbob <notbob@nothome.com> - 2016-04-13 18:24 +0000
          Re: Please help me choose a window manager root <NoEMail@home.org> - 2016-04-13 20:20 +0000
            Re: Please help me choose a window manager notbob <notbob@nothome.com> - 2016-04-13 20:42 +0000
            Re: Please help me choose a window manager root <NoEMail@home.org> - 2016-04-13 21:31 +0000
              Re: Please help me choose a window manager notbob <notbob@nothome.com> - 2016-04-13 23:29 +0000
    Re: Please help me choose a window manager Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2016-04-13 17:26 +0000
      Re: Please help me choose a window manager root <NoEMail@home.org> - 2016-04-13 19:01 +0000
        Re: Please help me choose a window manager Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2016-04-13 21:25 +0000
          Re: Please help me choose a window manager root <NoEMail@home.org> - 2016-04-13 21:57 +0000
            Re: Please help me choose a window manager root <NoEMail@home.org> - 2016-04-13 22:41 +0000
              Re: Please help me choose a window manager Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2016-04-13 22:40 +0000
              Re: Please help me choose a window manager root <NoEMail@home.org> - 2016-04-14 01:20 +0000
            Re: Please help me choose a window manager Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2016-04-13 22:39 +0000
              Re: Please help me choose a window manager root <NoEMail@home.org> - 2016-04-14 01:28 +0000
                Re: Please help me choose a window manager root <NoEMail@home.org> - 2016-04-14 03:13 +0000
                  Re: Please help me choose a window manager Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2016-04-14 11:56 +0000
        Re: Please help me choose a window manager Henrik Carlqvist <Henrik.Carlqvist@deadspam.com> - 2016-04-14 05:34 +0000
    Re: Please help me choose a window manager Chick Tower <c.tower@deadspam.com> - 2016-04-14 01:50 +0000
      Re: Please help me choose a window manager root <NoEMail@home.org> - 2016-04-14 03:20 +0000
    Re: Please help me choose a window manager JohnF <john@please.see.sig.for.email.com> - 2016-04-14 07:02 +0000
      Re: Please help me choose a window manager root <NoEMail@home.org> - 2016-04-14 14:45 +0000
        Re: Please help me choose a window manager Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2016-04-14 16:28 +0000
          Re: Please help me choose a window manager root <NoEMail@home.org> - 2016-04-14 17:31 +0000

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#26654 — Please help me choose a window manager

I have been supporting several A/V servers running 32 bit Slackware versions
13.37 to 14.1. These servers use the fvwm95 window manager. All the servers use
Nvidia video cards. All the systems utilize both vga and hdmi outputs.

I have run into a problem trying to upgrade to 64 bit multilib. Using fvwm95,
the 64 bit Nvidia driver shows the task bar of the display on the vga monitor,
and the buttons on the hdmi display.

Since the fvwm95 manager is quite old, I first tried to fetch an updated version
from Slackbuild but that version would not build for 14.1 multilib.

I then went back to Slackware source for Slack 9 and recompiled that source
using the 64 bit compiler which did work. However that did not fix or even
change the display problem.

I spent a good part of a day experimenting with the fvwm manager trying to get
an acceptible environment but I have not been successful.

I need a very simple display: half a dozen or so full screen xterms, and the
ability to click and select among these displays. fvwm95 is perfect for this
since the TaskBar allows allows the selection and a small collection of buttons
allows other functions such as pulling up Chrome.

I can get fvwm to bring up the xterms and Chrome but these are all lying on top
of one-another and I can't see a way to bring a preferred one to the top.

I would appreciate any suggestion for a solution using a more modern window
manager. I really want to avoid a solution that involves multiple clicks to
switch between functions.

Thanks.

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#26655

On 2016-04-13, root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:

> I would appreciate any suggestion for a solution using a more modern window
> manager. I really want to avoid a solution that involves multiple clicks to
> switch between functions.

I always do a full load when installing Slackware.  This includes KDE,
which I seldom use.  Instead, I use fluxbox.  FB menus are easily
customized tweaking plain text files and many of FBs menu choices
already include existing KDE programs.  Not all.  Newer KDE apps, like
gwenview and okular, must be added.  Trivial, even fer me.  ;)

Still, FB is painfully minimalist and those KDE pains, oh-so-nasty and
newpuke, do not even boot when opening fluxbox.  Have yer cake and eat
it, too!

BTW, my system is 32-bit and I've not fiddled with anything 64-bit.

nb  

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#26657

notbob <notbob@nothome.com> wrote:
> On 2016-04-13, root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:
> 
>> I would appreciate any suggestion for a solution using a more modern window
>> manager. I really want to avoid a solution that involves multiple clicks to
>> switch between functions.
> 
> I always do a full load when installing Slackware.  This includes KDE,
> which I seldom use.  Instead, I use fluxbox.  FB menus are easily
> customized tweaking plain text files and many of FBs menu choices
> already include existing KDE programs.  Not all.  Newer KDE apps, like
> gwenview and okular, must be added.  Trivial, even fer me.  ;)
> 
> Still, FB is painfully minimalist and those KDE pains, oh-so-nasty and
> newpuke, do not even boot when opening fluxbox.  Have yer cake and eat
> it, too!
> 
> BTW, my system is 32-bit and I've not fiddled with anything 64-bit.
> 
> nb  

Thanks for responding. I will try fluxbox, but there seems to be
significant learning problems getting anything started.

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#26659

On 2016-04-13, root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:

> Thanks for responding. I will try fluxbox, but there seems to be
> significant learning problems getting anything started.

I start from a command line.  I use startx to boot to my fave windows
manager and I've chosen fluxbox from this setup script, which is
included in all releases of Slackware.  As a user, enter this command:

$ xwmconfig

......It will provide an ncurses menu from which to choose which
window manager you prefer to use.  After you choose fluxbox, it will
return you to yer primary terminal command line (tt1) and you only
need enter the command "startx" (lose the quotes) to boot up fluxbox.

The xwmconfig command only needs to be invoked once.  Yer window
manager will remain the same until you change it.  The command
"startx" will need to be invoked each time you want to fire up fluxbox
unless you have yer box set up to boot directly to a WM.  I'll leave
that to you.

nb
 

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#26664

notbob <notbob@nothome.com> wrote:
> On 2016-04-13, root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:
> 
>> Thanks for responding. I will try fluxbox, but there seems to be
>> significant learning problems getting anything started.
> 
> I start from a command line.  I use startx to boot to my fave windows
> manager and I've chosen fluxbox from this setup script, which is
> included in all releases of Slackware.  As a user, enter this command:
> 
> $ xwmconfig
> 
> ......It will provide an ncurses menu from which to choose which
> window manager you prefer to use.  After you choose fluxbox, it will
> return you to yer primary terminal command line (tt1) and you only
> need enter the command "startx" (lose the quotes) to boot up fluxbox.
> 
> The xwmconfig command only needs to be invoked once.  Yer window
> manager will remain the same until you change it.  The command
> "startx" will need to be invoked each time you want to fire up fluxbox
> unless you have yer box set up to boot directly to a WM.  I'll leave
> that to you.
> 
> nb

Thanks, that makes it easy to find and experiment with various
window managers.
>  

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#26665

On 2016-04-13, root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:

> Thanks, that makes it easy to find and experiment with various
> window managers.

I found this:

http://www.slackware.com/config/x.php

Scroll to bottom to see the xwmconfig menu.

nb 

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#26667

root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:
> notbob <notbob@nothome.com> wrote:
>> On 2016-04-13, root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:
>> 
>>> Thanks for responding. I will try fluxbox, but there seems to be
>>> significant learning problems getting anything started.
>> 
>> I start from a command line.  I use startx to boot to my fave windows
>> manager and I've chosen fluxbox from this setup script, which is
>> included in all releases of Slackware.  As a user, enter this command:
>> 
>> $ xwmconfig
>> 
>> ......It will provide an ncurses menu from which to choose which
>> window manager you prefer to use.  After you choose fluxbox, it will
>> return you to yer primary terminal command line (tt1) and you only
>> need enter the command "startx" (lose the quotes) to boot up fluxbox.
>> 
>> The xwmconfig command only needs to be invoked once.  Yer window
>> manager will remain the same until you change it.  The command
>> "startx" will need to be invoked each time you want to fire up fluxbox
>> unless you have yer box set up to boot directly to a WM.  I'll leave
>> that to you.
>> 
>> nb
> 
> Thanks, that makes it easy to find and experiment with various
> window managers.

I feel stupid. xwmconfig is what comes up when we install Slackware.
I haven't thought of using it after that.
>>  

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#26672

On 2016-04-13, root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:

> I feel stupid. xwmconfig is what comes up when we install Slackware.
> I haven't thought of using it after that.

Unnerstan.

It's been over 2 yrs since I last installed 14.1.  Heck, I kin hardly
remember how!  ;)

nb

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#26656

root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:
> I have run into a problem trying to upgrade to 64 bit multilib. Using
> fvwm95, the 64 bit Nvidia driver shows the task bar of the display on
> the vga monitor, and the buttons on the hdmi display.

It is likely that the version of fvwm95 you are using does not have
support for multi-monitor setups, given this result.

> Since the fvwm95 manager is quite old, I first tried to fetch an
> updated version from Slackbuild but that version would not build for
> 14.1 multilib.

> I then went back to Slackware source for Slack 9 and recompiled that
> source using the 64 bit compiler which did work. However that did not
> fix or even change the display problem.

The source in Slack9 is probably also old enough to not have any code
to support multi-monitor configurations.

> I spent a good part of a day experimenting with the fvwm manager
> trying to get an acceptible environment but I have not been
> successful.

Clarification - on modern Slackwares, this is actually the fvwm2 window
manager.  Is that the one you are using?  (there was also an actual
"fvwm" years ago, which is why I'm asking).

> I need a very simple display: half a dozen or so full screen xterms,
> and the ability to click and select among these displays. fvwm95 is
> perfect for this since the TaskBar allows allows the selection and a
> small collection of buttons allows other functions such as pulling up
> Chrome.

If you are in fact using fvwm2 (this is likely, but only you can
confirm), then you are likely looking for the fvwm2 extension modules
[1] FvwmIconMan and/or FvwmTaskBar.

  man FvwmIconMan
  man FvwmTaskBar

If you actually have fvwm2 and you can read the man pages for both. 
One of those two, maybe with some configuration tweaking, will likely
create something that if not matches will closefully enough approixmate
your description above to get you going again.



[1] a lot of the quasi 'desktop environment' aspects of fvwm2 is
provided by extension modules, rather than directly by fvwm2 itself.

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#26662

Rich <rich@example.invalid> wrote:
> root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:
>> I have run into a problem trying to upgrade to 64 bit multilib. Using
>> fvwm95, the 64 bit Nvidia driver shows the task bar of the display on
>> the vga monitor, and the buttons on the hdmi display.
> 
> It is likely that the version of fvwm95 you are using does not have
> support for multi-monitor setups, given this result.
> 

fvwm95 has worked for quite a few years in the vga/hdmi mode using
32 bit Slackware.

>> Since the fvwm95 manager is quite old, I first tried to fetch an
>> updated version from Slackbuild but that version would not build for
>> 14.1 multilib.
> 
>> I then went back to Slackware source for Slack 9 and recompiled that
>> source using the 64 bit compiler which did work. However that did not
>> fix or even change the display problem.
> 
> The source in Slack9 is probably also old enough to not have any code
> to support multi-monitor configurations.

It is the video card that dictates what outputs go where. As far as
I can see the problem most likely arises in the Nvidia driver and
not the window manager, I am clutching at straws. Before committing
to Nvidia cards I experimented with AMD/ATI cards also. Neither the
radeon or nouveau drivers were capable of piping sound out to the
hdmi channel. Both the Nvidia and ATI drivers handled hdmi sound,
but the ATI driver would drop hdmi sound rather frequently which
would require restarting X to regain sound. AMD/ATI was not responsive
when I reported the sound dropouts so I went with Nvidia. I have
reported my current problem to Nvidia, but I do not expect any
solution from them.

NB: while composing this response I got a response back from
Nvidia (only hours after I sent the report). They offer some
suggestions and ask for more information. Surprise to me.

In order to respond to Nvidia I tried starting kde instead of
fvwm95: the problem was the same, different parts of the
display appear separately. The hdmi display only contained the
kde background, and the vga monitor contained the normal display.

In all cases, which display gets which parts of the overall display
depends upon which display is connected at boot. Everything works
as desired for a 32 bit system, and not for a 64 bit system.
I think this proves that the problem is in the Nvidia driver
and I will have to wait for further developments.

I think it is futile for me to continue work with different
window managers.


> Clarification - on modern Slackwares, this is actually the fvwm2 window
> manager.  Is that the one you are using?  (there was also an actual
> "fvwm" years ago, which is why I'm asking).

The fvwm I used seems to be both fvwm and fvwm2. It accepts a
.fvwm2rc which is what I used to get the display.

> 
>> I need a very simple display: half a dozen or so full screen xterms,
>> and the ability to click and select among these displays. fvwm95 is
>> perfect for this since the TaskBar allows allows the selection and a
>> small collection of buttons allows other functions such as pulling up
>> Chrome.
> 
> If you are in fact using fvwm2 (this is likely, but only you can
> confirm), then you are likely looking for the fvwm2 extension modules
> [1] FvwmIconMan and/or FvwmTaskBar.
> 
>   man FvwmIconMan
>   man FvwmTaskBar

For completeness I will read these man pages to bring up some
useable (for me) fvwm(2) display. Thanks for the suggestion.

Right off the bat I got this from man FvwmTaskbar:
BUGS
       At present the FvwmTaskBar works only with fvwm95.

So that makes fvwm2 off the table.

> 
> If you actually have fvwm2 and you can read the man pages for both. 
> One of those two, maybe with some configuration tweaking, will likely
> create something that if not matches will closefully enough approixmate
> your description above to get you going again.
> 
> 
> 
> [1] a lot of the quasi 'desktop environment' aspects of fvwm2 is
> provided by extension modules, rather than directly by fvwm2 itself.

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#26666

root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:
> > If you are in fact using fvwm2 (this is likely, but only you can
> > confirm), then you are likely looking for the fvwm2 extension
> > modules [1] FvwmIconMan and/or FvwmTaskBar.
> > 
> >   man FvwmIconMan
> >   man FvwmTaskBar

> For completeness I will read these man pages to bring up some useable
> (for me) fvwm(2) display. Thanks for the suggestion.

> Right off the bat I got this from man FvwmTaskbar:
> BUGS
>        At present the FvwmTaskBar works only with fvwm95.

> So that makes fvwm2 off the table.

What is the age of your fvwm2 installation?

The man page for FvwmTaskBar that ships with Slackware 13.37 says this
under BUGS:

       There is a bug report that FvwmTaskBar doesn't work well with
       auto hide turned on.

And there is exactly zero mention of fvwm95.  And test starting
FvwmTaskBar, I get a win95 style task bar along the bottom of my
screen.

For yours to mention fvwm95 implies it is older than the version
shipped with Slackware 13.37.  Which is fvwm2.4.20.

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#26668

Rich <rich@example.invalid> wrote:
> root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:
>> > If you are in fact using fvwm2 (this is likely, but only you can
>> > confirm), then you are likely looking for the fvwm2 extension
>> > modules [1] FvwmIconMan and/or FvwmTaskBar.
>> > 
>> >   man FvwmIconMan
>> >   man FvwmTaskBar
> 
>> For completeness I will read these man pages to bring up some useable
>> (for me) fvwm(2) display. Thanks for the suggestion.
> 
>> Right off the bat I got this from man FvwmTaskbar:
>> BUGS
>>        At present the FvwmTaskBar works only with fvwm95.
> 
>> So that makes fvwm2 off the table.
> 
> What is the age of your fvwm2 installation?
> 
> The man page for FvwmTaskBar that ships with Slackware 13.37 says this
> under BUGS:
> 
>        There is a bug report that FvwmTaskBar doesn't work well with
>        auto hide turned on.
> 
> And there is exactly zero mention of fvwm95.  And test starting
> FvwmTaskBar, I get a win95 style task bar along the bottom of my
> screen.

How did you test start TaskBar, what did you add to .fvwm2rc?

> 
> For yours to mention fvwm95 implies it is older than the version
> shipped with Slackware 13.37.  Which is fvwm2.4.20.

My fvwm package is what comes with 14.1 Slack 64:
fvwm-2.6.5-x86_64-6
I presume the man page corresponds.

My man page for fvwm(2) runs to over 9000 lines.

The man fvwm does talk about TaskBar but also adds taskbar
compliant to the description, as if there are versions of
fvmw(2) that do not support a task bar.

This .fvwm2rc gives what I want, but no taskbar:

Exec /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm -geometry 100x37+0+100 -sl 500 -rv -sb -fn -*-lucidatypewriter-bold-r-*-*-*-140-*-*-*-*-iso8859-* -ms yellow
Exec    /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm -geometry 185x50+0+37 \
-sl 500 -rv -sb -fn 10x20 -title "secondary xterm"  &
Exec    /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm -geometry 185x50+0+37 \
-sl 500 -rv -sb -fn 10x20 -title "secondary xterm"  &
Exec    /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm -geometry 185x50+0+37 \
-sl 500 -rv -sb -fn 10x20 -title "secondary xterm"  &
Exec    /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm -geometry 185x50+0+37 \
-sl 500 -rv -sb -fn 10x20 -title "secondary xterm"  &
Exec    /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm -geometry 185x50+0+37 \
-sl 500 -rv -sb -fn 10x20 -title "secondary xterm"  &
> 

Further discussion with Nvidia more surely confirms the problem
I am having is caused by the driver. For my graphics card
the latest Nvidia driver is 361.42 and I have both the
32 bit version and 64 bit versions of this driver. The
32 bit version works with Slack 14.1 32 bit, while the
64 bit version does not work with Slack 14.1 64 bit.

I would still like to know how to bring up a task bar
under fvwm. Please show me what you added to your
rc file.
Thanks

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#26669

root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:
> 
> I would still like to know how to bring up a task bar
> under fvwm. Please show me what you added to your
> rc file.
> Thanks

I find I can get a task bar under fvwm by adding this line
at the start of the rc file:
+ I Module FvwmTaskBar

The task bar doesn't appear on startup but it does pop up
after I click on something else.

Under fvwm95 I saw how to add a menu of items under the
task bar and I haven't figured out how to do that as yet.

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#26671

root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:
> root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:
> > 
> > I would still like to know how to bring up a task bar
> > under fvwm. Please show me what you added to your
> > rc file.
> > Thanks

> I find I can get a task bar under fvwm by adding this line
> at the start of the rc file:
> + I Module FvwmTaskBar

> The task bar doesn't appear on startup but it does pop up
> after I click on something else.

> Under fvwm95 I saw how to add a menu of items under the
> task bar and I haven't figured out how to do that as yet.

How to do that is likely documented in the FvwmTaskBar man page.

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#26673

root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:
> root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:
>> 
>> I would still like to know how to bring up a task bar
>> under fvwm. Please show me what you added to your
>> rc file.
>> Thanks
> 
> I find I can get a task bar under fvwm by adding this line
> at the start of the rc file:
> + I Module FvwmTaskBar
> 
> The task bar doesn't appear on startup but it does pop up
> after I click on something else.
> 
> Under fvwm95 I saw how to add a menu of items under the
> task bar and I haven't figured out how to do that as yet.

OK, I got the taskbar to start up correctly. The proper
line is simply:
Module FvwmTaskBar

Now I just have to work out buttons and fvwm is all set.

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#26670

root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:
> Rich <rich@example.invalid> wrote:
> > root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:
> >> > If you are in fact using fvwm2 (this is likely, but only you can
> >> > confirm), then you are likely looking for the fvwm2 extension
> >> > modules [1] FvwmIconMan and/or FvwmTaskBar.
> >> > 
> >> >   man FvwmIconMan
> >> >   man FvwmTaskBar
> > 
> >> For completeness I will read these man pages to bring up some useable
> >> (for me) fvwm(2) display. Thanks for the suggestion.
> > 
> >> Right off the bat I got this from man FvwmTaskbar:
> >> BUGS
> >>        At present the FvwmTaskBar works only with fvwm95.
> > 
> >> So that makes fvwm2 off the table.
> > 
> > What is the age of your fvwm2 installation?
> > 
> > The man page for FvwmTaskBar that ships with Slackware 13.37 says this
> > under BUGS:
> > 
> >        There is a bug report that FvwmTaskBar doesn't work well with
> >        auto hide turned on.
> > 
> > And there is exactly zero mention of fvwm95.  And test starting
> > FvwmTaskBar, I get a win95 style task bar along the bottom of my
> > screen.

> How did you test start TaskBar, what did you add to .fvwm2rc?

I have this definition in my .fvwm2rc:

AddToMenu Module-Popup  FvwmModules     Title
+                       Identify        Module  FvwmIdent
+                       Talk            Module  FvwmTalk
+                       ""              Nop
+                       Button-Bar      Module  FvwmButtons
+                       Pager           Module  FvwmPager 0 0
+                       "Pager (2 desks)" Module  FvwmPager 0 1
+                       WinList         Module  FvwmWinList
+                       "Task bar"      Module FvwmTaskBar
+                       ""              Nop
+                       Banner          Module  FvwmBanner
+                       ScrollBar       Module  FvwmScroll 50 50
+                       Background      Module  FvwmBacker
+                       AutoRaise       Module  FvwmAuto 200 Raise Nop
+                       "Stop AutoRaise" KillModule FvwmAuto
+                       ""              Nop
+                       IconBox         Module  FvwmIconBox
+                       IconMan         Module  FvwmIconMan
+                       ""              Nop
+                       "Form - Rlogin"      Module FvwmForm Rlogin
+                       "Form - MyFvwmTalk"  Module FvwmForm MyFvwmTalk
+                       "Form - QuitVerify"  Module FvwmForm QuitVerify

Which I think was a default supplied by an old version of Slackware. 
Then in both my left and right mouse click menus I have:

+                       "Modules"       Popup Module-Popup

Here's the entire right click menu:

DestroyMenu Window-Ops
AddToMenu Window-Ops    "Window Ops"    Title           
+                       &Move           Move-or-Raise2
+                       Resize          Resize-or-Raise2
+                       Raise           Raise
+                       Lower           Lower 
+                       (De)&Iconify    Iconify
+                       (Un)Stick       Stick           
+                       (Un)Maximize    maximize_func
+                       ""              Nop
+                       Modules         Popup Module-Popup
+                       ""              Nop  
+                       Destroy         Destroy
+                       Close           Close    
+                       ""              Nop             
+                       "Refresh Screen"        Refresh

Then, from my left-click or right-click root menus, I've got a
"Modules" submenu, which lists the above modules, and I can pick one to
start it up, without having to restart fvwm2.  So I tested by clicking
on the "Task Bar" entry, which loaded the module, and I got a task bar. 
After I saw it had worked, I right-clicked, picked the "Close" entry,
and clicked on the task bar, and it went away.

> > For yours to mention fvwm95 implies it is older than the version
> > shipped with Slackware 13.37.  Which is fvwm2.4.20.

> My fvwm package is what comes with 14.1 Slack 64:
> fvwm-2.6.5-x86_64-6
> I presume the man page corresponds.

Same version as is on my Slack64-14.1 system (which is not the system
I'm typing this on at the moment).

> My man page for fvwm(2) runs to over 9000 lines.

> The man fvwm does talk about TaskBar but also adds taskbar
> compliant to the description, as if there are versions of
> fvmw(2) that do not support a task bar.

> This .fvwm2rc gives what I want, but no taskbar:

> Exec /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm -geometry 100x37+0+100 -sl 500 -rv -sb -fn -*-lucidatypewriter-bold-r-*-*-*-140-*-*-*-*-iso8859-* -ms yellow
> Exec    /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm -geometry 185x50+0+37 \
> -sl 500 -rv -sb -fn 10x20 -title "secondary xterm"  &
> Exec    /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm -geometry 185x50+0+37 \
> -sl 500 -rv -sb -fn 10x20 -title "secondary xterm"  &
> Exec    /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm -geometry 185x50+0+37 \
> -sl 500 -rv -sb -fn 10x20 -title "secondary xterm"  &
> Exec    /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm -geometry 185x50+0+37 \
> -sl 500 -rv -sb -fn 10x20 -title "secondary xterm"  &
> Exec    /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm -geometry 185x50+0+37 \
> -sl 500 -rv -sb -fn 10x20 -title "secondary xterm"  &
> > 

That gives you nothing but starting a bunch of xterms.  No menus, no
nothing (although you might have the fvwm2 default built in menus,
unless they only appear when there's no .fvwm2rc file found at all.

Your Slackware 14.1 system should have these two:

/etc/system.fvwm2rc
/usr/share/fvwm/system.fvwm2rc-sample-95

The /etc file is a reasonable default file, you can copy it to
~/.fvwm/.fvwm2rc for local changes.

The one in /usr/share/fvwm/ purports to provide a very windows-95 look
and feel, and the top of the file is a large comment describing how to
make use of it.  You might try giving it a try, it might just give you
the 'look' you want, then you can edit in your "Exec" lines in the
AddToFunc InitFunction section to have them executed at startup time.


> Further discussion with Nvidia more surely confirms the problem
> I am having is caused by the driver. For my graphics card
> the latest Nvidia driver is 361.42 and I have both the
> 32 bit version and 64 bit versions of this driver. The
> 32 bit version works with Slack 14.1 32 bit, while the
> 64 bit version does not work with Slack 14.1 64 bit.

> I would still like to know how to bring up a task bar
> under fvwm. Please show me what you added to your
> rc file.

Done, although I'd recommend you start from one of the two provided
files, as they will provide a much more complete environment at the
outset.

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#26674

Rich <rich@example.invalid> wrote:
> root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:
>> Rich <rich@example.invalid> wrote:
>> > root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:
>> >> > If you are in fact using fvwm2 (this is likely, but only you can
>> >> > confirm), then you are likely looking for the fvwm2 extension
>> >> > modules [1] FvwmIconMan and/or FvwmTaskBar.
>> >> > 
>> >> >   man FvwmIconMan
>> >> >   man FvwmTaskBar
>> > 
>> >> For completeness I will read these man pages to bring up some useable
>> >> (for me) fvwm(2) display. Thanks for the suggestion.
>> > 
>> >> Right off the bat I got this from man FvwmTaskbar:
>> >> BUGS
>> >>        At present the FvwmTaskBar works only with fvwm95.
>> > 
>> >> So that makes fvwm2 off the table.
>> > 
>> > What is the age of your fvwm2 installation?
>> > 
>> > The man page for FvwmTaskBar that ships with Slackware 13.37 says this
>> > under BUGS:
>> > 
>> >        There is a bug report that FvwmTaskBar doesn't work well with
>> >        auto hide turned on.
>> > 
>> > And there is exactly zero mention of fvwm95.  And test starting
>> > FvwmTaskBar, I get a win95 style task bar along the bottom of my
>> > screen.
> 
>> How did you test start TaskBar, what did you add to .fvwm2rc?
> 
> I have this definition in my .fvwm2rc:
> 
> AddToMenu Module-Popup  FvwmModules     Title
> +                       Identify        Module  FvwmIdent
> +                       Talk            Module  FvwmTalk
> +                       ""              Nop
> +                       Button-Bar      Module  FvwmButtons
> +                       Pager           Module  FvwmPager 0 0
> +                       "Pager (2 desks)" Module  FvwmPager 0 1
> +                       WinList         Module  FvwmWinList
> +                       "Task bar"      Module FvwmTaskBar
> +                       ""              Nop
> +                       Banner          Module  FvwmBanner
> +                       ScrollBar       Module  FvwmScroll 50 50
> +                       Background      Module  FvwmBacker
> +                       AutoRaise       Module  FvwmAuto 200 Raise Nop
> +                       "Stop AutoRaise" KillModule FvwmAuto
> +                       ""              Nop
> +                       IconBox         Module  FvwmIconBox
> +                       IconMan         Module  FvwmIconMan
> +                       ""              Nop
> +                       "Form - Rlogin"      Module FvwmForm Rlogin
> +                       "Form - MyFvwmTalk"  Module FvwmForm MyFvwmTalk
> +                       "Form - QuitVerify"  Module FvwmForm QuitVerify
> 
> Which I think was a default supplied by an old version of Slackware. 
> Then in both my left and right mouse click menus I have:
> 
> +                       "Modules"       Popup Module-Popup
> 
> Here's the entire right click menu:
> 
> DestroyMenu Window-Ops
> AddToMenu Window-Ops    "Window Ops"    Title           
> +                       &Move           Move-or-Raise2
> +                       Resize          Resize-or-Raise2
> +                       Raise           Raise
> +                       Lower           Lower 
> +                       (De)&Iconify    Iconify
> +                       (Un)Stick       Stick           
> +                       (Un)Maximize    maximize_func
> +                       ""              Nop
> +                       Modules         Popup Module-Popup
> +                       ""              Nop  
> +                       Destroy         Destroy
> +                       Close           Close    
> +                       ""              Nop             
> +                       "Refresh Screen"        Refresh
> 
> Then, from my left-click or right-click root menus, I've got a
> "Modules" submenu, which lists the above modules, and I can pick one to
> start it up, without having to restart fvwm2.  So I tested by clicking
> on the "Task Bar" entry, which loaded the module, and I got a task bar. 
> After I saw it had worked, I right-clicked, picked the "Close" entry,
> and clicked on the task bar, and it went away.
> 
>> > For yours to mention fvwm95 implies it is older than the version
>> > shipped with Slackware 13.37.  Which is fvwm2.4.20.
> 
>> My fvwm package is what comes with 14.1 Slack 64:
>> fvwm-2.6.5-x86_64-6
>> I presume the man page corresponds.
> 
> Same version as is on my Slack64-14.1 system (which is not the system
> I'm typing this on at the moment).
> 
>> My man page for fvwm(2) runs to over 9000 lines.
> 
>> The man fvwm does talk about TaskBar but also adds taskbar
>> compliant to the description, as if there are versions of
>> fvmw(2) that do not support a task bar.
> 
>> This .fvwm2rc gives what I want, but no taskbar:
> 
>> Exec /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm -geometry 100x37+0+100 -sl 500 -rv -sb -fn -*-lucidatypewriter-bold-r-*-*-*-140-*-*-*-*-iso8859-* -ms yellow
>> Exec    /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm -geometry 185x50+0+37 \
>> -sl 500 -rv -sb -fn 10x20 -title "secondary xterm"  &
>> Exec    /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm -geometry 185x50+0+37 \
>> -sl 500 -rv -sb -fn 10x20 -title "secondary xterm"  &
>> Exec    /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm -geometry 185x50+0+37 \
>> -sl 500 -rv -sb -fn 10x20 -title "secondary xterm"  &
>> Exec    /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm -geometry 185x50+0+37 \
>> -sl 500 -rv -sb -fn 10x20 -title "secondary xterm"  &
>> Exec    /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm -geometry 185x50+0+37 \
>> -sl 500 -rv -sb -fn 10x20 -title "secondary xterm"  &
>> > 
> 
> That gives you nothing but starting a bunch of xterms.  No menus, no
> nothing (although you might have the fvwm2 default built in menus,
> unless they only appear when there's no .fvwm2rc file found at all.
> 
> Your Slackware 14.1 system should have these two:
> 
> /etc/system.fvwm2rc
> /usr/share/fvwm/system.fvwm2rc-sample-95
> 
> The /etc file is a reasonable default file, you can copy it to
> ~/.fvwm/.fvwm2rc for local changes.

Armed with what I have learned I think I should start with
the canned rc file. Thanks for the pointer.

> 
> The one in /usr/share/fvwm/ purports to provide a very windows-95 look
> and feel, and the top of the file is a large comment describing how to
> make use of it.  You might try giving it a try, it might just give you
> the 'look' you want, then you can edit in your "Exec" lines in the
> AddToFunc InitFunction section to have them executed at startup time.
> 
> 
>> Further discussion with Nvidia more surely confirms the problem
>> I am having is caused by the driver. For my graphics card
>> the latest Nvidia driver is 361.42 and I have both the
>> 32 bit version and 64 bit versions of this driver. The
>> 32 bit version works with Slack 14.1 32 bit, while the
>> 64 bit version does not work with Slack 14.1 64 bit.
> 
>> I would still like to know how to bring up a task bar
>> under fvwm. Please show me what you added to your
>> rc file.
> 
> Done, although I'd recommend you start from one of the two provided
> files, as they will provide a much more complete environment at the
> outset.

Thanks again.

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#26677

root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:
> 
> Armed with what I have learned I think I should start with
> the canned rc file. Thanks for the pointer.
> 

The canned rc file, as well as that generated by the script-95
function are a joke. The intent should be as an example, not
defining a assembly of options of little overall interest.

The script-95 function changes a single, incomprehensible, file
into six similarly incomprehensible files.

If, for instance, you want to eliminate gimp, you have to
wade through all these files.

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#26681

root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:
> root <NoEMail@home.org> wrote:
> > 
> > Armed with what I have learned I think I should start with the
> > canned rc file. Thanks for the pointer.
> > 

> The canned rc file, as well as that generated by the script-95
> function are a joke. The intent should be as an example, not defining
> a assembly of options of little overall interest.

Actually, the canned rc file (/etc/system.fvwm2rc) is a fully
functional (albiet basic) fvwm2 configuration file.

Fvwm2 is a highly configurable window manager.  That is where its
extreme power and flexibility arises from.  However, that extreme
flexibility to be nearly anything you might want comes at a cost of a
more complicated configuration.  The items in the file are not an
"assembly of options of little overall interest" - they are the
configuration settings necessary to get a useful Fvwm2 configuration
instead of the built-in default (which is minimal).

> The script-95 function changes a single, incomprehensible, file
> into six similarly incomprehensible files.

Never used the fvwm2-95 file (and wouldn't myself, I dislike the win95+
style metaphor, but that's just my opinion).  I simply stumbled upon it
looking for provided default configuration files for fvwm2, and as you
liked fvwm95, it sounded like a good possibility for your starting
point.

> If, for instance, you want to eliminate gimp, you have to
> wade through all these files.

Except that you don't need to eliminate gimp, other than not to see it
in the menus.  If you never click on it, you'll never launch it.

Also, the 'grep' tool is your friend in this instance.  

In the location where the six files are located, if you run:

  grep -ni gimp *

Then grep will search for the string "gimp" (case insensitive, the i
option) in all the files, and output which file contains "gimp", and
where (line number, the n option) within the file.

I.e., running the above against the sample file returns this:

  $ grep -ni gimp /usr/share/fvwm/system.fvwm2rc-sample-95
  43:# I've tried to use very common apps (like Gimp or Netscape) so that this
  616:Style "The GIMP"    MiniIcon mini.gimp.xpm, Icon gimp.xpm #!E gimp
  617:Style "Gimp"                MiniIcon mini.gimp.xpm, Icon gimp.xpm #!E gimp
  1723:+ "The &Gimp%mini.gimp.xpm%"               Exec exec gimp
  2585:*BarButtons: (1x2, Title Gimp,    Icon gimp.xpm,   Action 'Exec exec gimp', \
  2994:*FvwmWharf gimp         gimp.xpm        Exec exec gimp

So, in the sample file, the menu item that launches gimp is at line
1723, commenting that one line (adding a # at the front) would remove
gimp from the menu.  The rest of the gimp items could be left alone
(the last two are for two different modules, so they would only need to
be modified if you were to use one of those two modules.

For the six files, grep would have reported exactly which file of the
six contained what is line 1723 in the sample, and at what line it was
in that one of six file.  Then you just edit that one file, jump to
that line number, add a # at the front of the line, save the file, and
you are done.

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#26679

On Wed, 13 Apr 2016 19:01:59 +0000, root wrote:
> In all cases, which display gets which parts of the overall display
> depends upon which display is connected at boot. Everything works as
> desired for a 32 bit system, and not for a 64 bit system. I think this
> proves that the problem is in the Nvidia driver and I will have to wait
> for further developments.

To me it rather sounds like a proof of different configurations in your 
32 bit system and your 64 bit system.

Could you compare the contents of /etc/X11 between your installations 
with some tool like kdiff3? Unfortunately, kdiff3 is not included in 
Slackware, but there is a slackbuild at 
https://slackbuilds.org/repository/14.1/development/kdiff3/?search=kdiff3

Or, if you prefer a terminal command, something like:

diff -ruN /path/to/32-bit/etc/X11 /path/to/64-bit/etc/X11

regards Henrik
-- 
The address in the header is only to prevent spam. My real address is:
hc351(at)poolhem.se Examples of addresses which go to spammers:
root@localhost postmaster@localhost

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