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Groups > alt.folklore.computers > #152679 > unrolled thread
| Started by | jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2015-10-11 13:48 +0000 |
| Last post | 2015-10-12 19:56 +0000 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 179 — 28 participants |
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Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-11 13:48 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Bob Eager <news0005@eager.cx> - 2015-10-11 14:45 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-10-11 10:52 -0400
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-10-11 22:18 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities JimP <solosam90@gmail.com> - 2015-10-11 20:05 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Huge <Huge@nowhere.much.invalid> - 2015-10-12 05:26 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-10-12 15:59 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> - 2015-10-13 01:19 -0300
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Greymaus <mausg@mail.com> - 2015-10-13 12:27 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> - 2015-10-13 13:40 -0300
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-13 12:34 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2015-10-13 23:17 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-10-14 10:02 -0400
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-10-13 12:16 -0400
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities David Hume <David.Hume@example.com> - 2015-10-13 17:39 +0100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Dave Garland <dave.garland@wizinfo.com> - 2015-10-13 12:51 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-10-13 18:23 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-10-13 14:41 -0400
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-10-13 17:35 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-10-13 22:24 -0400
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-10-14 05:39 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-10-16 14:32 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2015-10-15 16:25 -0700
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-10-15 20:07 -0400
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities David Hume <David.Hume@example.com> - 2015-10-16 10:46 +0100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities JimP <solosam90@gmail.com> - 2015-10-16 08:58 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-10-16 13:52 -0400
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-12 13:09 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2015-10-12 08:49 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-10-12 16:41 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-13 12:34 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities JimP <solosam90@gmail.com> - 2015-10-13 10:39 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-10-13 18:23 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2015-10-13 19:03 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-14 14:02 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> - 2015-10-13 20:44 +0200
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2015-10-13 20:24 -0700
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-10-14 05:39 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-14 14:02 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2015-10-14 12:51 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2015-10-12 20:34 +0100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Stan Barr <plan.b@bluesomatic.org> - 2015-10-13 07:02 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities David Hume <David.Hume@example.com> - 2015-10-13 09:01 +0100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Dan Espen <despen@verizon.net> - 2015-10-13 09:43 -0400
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities David Hume <David.Hume@example.com> - 2015-10-13 15:19 +0100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Dan Espen <despen@verizon.net> - 2015-10-13 10:21 -0400
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities rpw3@rpw3.org (Rob Warnock) - 2015-10-13 13:12 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2015-10-12 15:14 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-13 12:38 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2015-10-13 13:17 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-10-13 12:03 -0400
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2015-10-13 20:26 -0700
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-10-14 05:47 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2015-10-15 16:27 -0700
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Stan Barr <plan.b@bluesomatic.org> - 2015-10-16 07:48 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-10-16 13:55 -0400
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-10-16 18:14 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-10-16 14:35 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Stan Barr <plan.b@bluesomatic.org> - 2015-10-17 07:02 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2015-10-19 13:09 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-10-19 15:14 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Stan Barr <plan.b@bluesomatic.org> - 2015-10-20 07:02 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-10-16 16:47 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2015-10-16 14:26 +0100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities simon@twoplaces.co.uk (Simon Turner) - 2015-10-14 13:00 +0100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-10-14 10:00 -0400
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-14 14:02 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2015-10-14 14:20 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-15 12:54 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2015-10-15 16:44 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-16 13:04 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Greymaus <mausg@mail.com> - 2015-10-16 18:48 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "78lp" <78lp@nospam.com> - 2015-10-17 15:58 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "78lp" <78lp@nospam.com> - 2015-10-18 17:37 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Greymaus <mausg@mail.com> - 2015-10-18 11:12 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-10-18 13:24 -0400
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Greymaus <mausg@mail.com> - 2015-10-18 19:21 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "78lp" <78lp@nospam.com> - 2015-10-19 15:28 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2015-10-17 15:30 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2015-10-16 06:31 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2015-10-15 09:04 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2015-10-14 12:54 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2015-10-14 12:59 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities JimP <solosam90@gmail.com> - 2015-10-12 10:22 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Bob Eager <news0005@eager.cx> - 2015-10-12 20:42 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Huge <Huge@nowhere.much.invalid> - 2015-10-12 21:40 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Bob Eager <news0005@eager.cx> - 2015-10-12 22:39 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Dave Garland <dave.garland@wizinfo.com> - 2015-10-12 18:08 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-13 12:34 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-10-13 17:15 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities JimP <solosam90@gmail.com> - 2015-10-12 20:17 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-10-13 12:12 -0400
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-10-13 17:22 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-13 12:34 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Bob Eager <news0005@eager.cx> - 2015-10-13 20:06 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2015-10-13 20:38 -0700
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-14 14:02 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Joy Beeson <jbeeson@invalid.net.invalid> - 2015-10-16 22:33 -0300
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-13 12:34 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities JimP <solosam90@gmail.com> - 2015-10-13 10:38 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2015-10-13 20:40 -0700
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-14 14:02 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-10-12 13:48 -0400
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-10-12 16:04 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Greymaus <mausg@mail.com> - 2015-10-13 12:25 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-14 14:02 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-10-14 15:49 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities JimP <solosam90@gmail.com> - 2015-10-14 11:30 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-15 12:54 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-10-16 14:38 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2015-10-15 08:51 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Dave Garland <dave.garland@wizinfo.com> - 2015-10-14 21:16 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2015-10-13 12:14 -0400
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2015-10-12 16:19 -0700
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Bob Eager <news0005@eager.cx> - 2015-10-13 00:17 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> - 2015-10-13 01:33 -0300
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-10-12 16:00 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2015-10-13 07:46 +0100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Bob Eager <news0005@eager.cx> - 2015-10-13 11:42 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-13 12:34 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2015-10-14 12:53 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2015-10-13 20:08 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Joy Beeson <jbeeson@invalid.net.invalid> - 2015-10-14 12:17 -0300
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-10-14 18:21 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-10-16 14:44 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-10-16 21:09 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-10-19 15:19 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-10-19 20:45 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-10-12 15:57 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities JimP <solosam90@gmail.com> - 2015-10-12 20:16 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-13 12:34 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2015-10-13 13:12 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities rpw3@rpw3.org (Rob Warnock) - 2015-10-13 14:02 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-14 14:02 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> - 2015-10-14 16:20 +0200
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-15 12:54 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-10-15 17:51 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-16 13:09 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> - 2015-10-16 21:33 +0200
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2015-10-16 07:03 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> - 2015-10-15 23:04 +0200
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-16 13:04 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> - 2015-10-16 20:24 +0200
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Greymaus <mausg@mail.com> - 2015-10-17 11:18 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> - 2015-10-17 19:06 +0200
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Greymaus <mausg@mail.com> - 2015-10-17 18:34 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> - 2015-10-17 21:31 +0200
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-17 13:22 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2015-10-17 15:45 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2015-10-17 06:47 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2015-10-18 05:00 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Bill Cunningham" <nospam@nspam.invalid> - 2015-10-24 15:23 -0400
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2015-10-15 08:49 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> - 2015-10-13 20:47 +0200
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-14 14:02 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2015-10-15 08:54 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-15 12:54 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2015-10-16 06:29 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2015-10-15 14:42 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2015-10-16 11:21 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-16 13:04 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2015-10-17 15:32 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Walter Banks <walter@bytecraft.com> - 2015-10-13 10:00 -0400
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-14 14:02 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-10-14 15:49 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Walter Banks <walter@bytecraft.com> - 2015-10-14 13:24 -0400
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Bob Eager <news0005@eager.cx> - 2015-10-14 17:35 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-10-14 18:21 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Bob Eager <news0005@eager.cx> - 2015-10-14 18:48 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-10-16 14:42 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Dave Garland <dave.garland@wizinfo.com> - 2015-10-14 21:20 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Bob Eager <news0005@eager.cx> - 2015-10-15 06:49 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2015-10-15 17:51 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-10-16 14:40 -0500
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> - 2015-10-17 13:22 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2015-10-14 12:47 +1100
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2015-10-11 15:11 +0000
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2015-10-11 15:01 -0400
Re: [Poll] Computing favorities pechter@S20.pechter.dyndns.org (William Pechter) - 2015-10-12 19:56 +0000
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| From | Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-10-15 23:04 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <mvg5fc-vr.ln1@sambook.reistad.name> |
| In reply to | #152955 |
In article <PM0005222472D5DAC6@aca43228.ipt.aol.com>, jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> wrote: >Morten Reistad wrote: >> In article <PM0005221105C001AD@aca479f3.ipt.aol.com>, >> jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> wrote: >>>Rob Warnock wrote: >>>> Scott Lurndal <slp53@pacbell.net> wrote: >>>> +--------------- >>>> | jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> writes: >>>> | >JimP wrote: >>>> | >> There is an app that you point your cell phone at the night sky, and >>>> | >> the app tells you the names of the constellations and some of the >>>> | >> stars. >>>> | > >>>> | >How does it do that? GPS gives a location but not a direction...right? >>>> | >>>> | Camera. >>>> +--------------- >>>> >>>> I have the Google Sky Map app on my phone, and it doesn't use >>>> the camera at all [e.g., works fine on a cloudy day or even >>>> indoors!]. Instead, it uses: >>>> >>>> 1. *Either* GPS or cell network information to find out your >>>> location [i.e., *will* work just fine with GPS turned off]. >>>> >>>> 2. *Either* GPS or cell network information to find out what >>>> the date & time are. >>>> >>>> 3. The internal 3-axis accelerometers to figure out which way >>>> is "down", and thus the attitude of the phone [where it's >>>> pointing relative to face-down]. >>>> >>>> 4. The internal 3-axis Hall-effect sensors to figure out where >>>> "North" is. [And, yes, a nearby magnet will confuse it!] >>> >>>Good thing computers don't use RP06s or RP04s anymore. >>> >>>> >>>> Given all four of the above [and its built-in database], >>>> it knows all it needs to show you what's in the sky that >>>> the phone is pointing to. Thus, as I noted above, it works >>>> fine indoors in a room with no windows. >>>> >>>> Note that if you point it at some star and then rotate the >>>> phone in the plane of the display [keeping that star centered], >>>> the displayed sky chart *doesn't* rotate w.r.t. the real sky >>>> [though the labels "pop" at times as they switch to a >>>> different rasterization(?) to remain roughly upright]. >>> >>>Does working in a power plant destroy a smart phone? >> >> Not if it is attached to a human. The exposure limits for >> humans to exposure to heat, cold, magnetism, electric fields, >> water and other liquids, non-athmospheric gases, radiation >> etc are from 4 orders of magnitude lower that what would >> damage a water-resistant smartphone. > >OK, thanks. > >> >> That said, the phone may not work as intended while in the >> plant. I had the pleasure of standing right on top of a 90MW >> generator a few months ago, around 3 feet from the stator field. >> That was a magnetic experience, and not for having any metal >> on or in your body, We had to sign several disclaimers to >> be let in, as well as get a security clearance. > >If you can answer, why did you do that? For the thrill. For a healthy person it is completely harmless, but you will sense that field permeate every cubic centimeter of your body. It is slightly diffcult to speak evenly. We were standing right next to the shaft going from the turbine, above us, to the generator, below us. It rotated at 16 2/3 rotations per second; but it is so shiny, balanced and polished that you cannot see it rotate. You have to put a nail to it (not the skin, you might get skinned, but a nail is safe.) That shaft carries 90 megawatts of energy; and the generator outputs 134 kilovolts of three-phase electricity. Still around 400 amps. >> The phones stopped working even before we put them away in the >> adjoining room. But they were not damaged. > >So how do things work if they can't use electronics. Is everything >still mechanical? Probably because of the place being a goodish faraday cage. It is around 100 meters into a mountain, where there is a hole through to the next valley 18 km away, where the river is 180 meter higher. So they divert the water, and generate electricity. It was a once-in-a-lifetime chance to see this up close. >The city is building a new power plant (gas-fired) here. So I get >to see how the things are built. They moved the [can't think of >the correct term] heat exchangers? this spring. They were shipped >via the lakes and then hauled from the lake to the construction >site on trailers which had ~40 wheels. I don't remember the >tonnage; they drove each box at 2 MPH. They spent a lot of >calculation time to ensure that the trailers had enough wheels >so that the roads and infrastructure underneath them wouldn't >collapse. Probably heat exchangers, yes. They are the heaviest single components, unless they do a multistage turbine setup; in which case the lowest pressure turbines are the heaviest. But they small turbines will generate > 2/3rds of the energy. I assume you are referring to a gas-fired steam turbine generator setup. -- mrr
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| From | jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-10-16 13:04 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <PM00052238A52073E9@aca46c82.ipt.aol.com> |
| In reply to | #152983 |
Morten Reistad wrote: > In article <PM0005222472D5DAC6@aca43228.ipt.aol.com>, > jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> wrote: >>Morten Reistad wrote: >>> In article <PM0005221105C001AD@aca479f3.ipt.aol.com>, >>> jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> wrote: >>>>Rob Warnock wrote: >>>>> Scott Lurndal <slp53@pacbell.net> wrote: >>>>> +--------------- >>>>> | jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> writes: >>>>> | >JimP wrote: >>>>> | >> There is an app that you point your cell phone at the night sky, and >>>>> | >> the app tells you the names of the constellations and some of the >>>>> | >> stars. >>>>> | > >>>>> | >How does it do that? GPS gives a location but not a direction...right? >>>>> | >>>>> | Camera. >>>>> +--------------- >>>>> >>>>> I have the Google Sky Map app on my phone, and it doesn't use >>>>> the camera at all [e.g., works fine on a cloudy day or even >>>>> indoors!]. Instead, it uses: >>>>> >>>>> 1. *Either* GPS or cell network information to find out your >>>>> location [i.e., *will* work just fine with GPS turned off]. >>>>> >>>>> 2. *Either* GPS or cell network information to find out what >>>>> the date & time are. >>>>> >>>>> 3. The internal 3-axis accelerometers to figure out which way >>>>> is "down", and thus the attitude of the phone [where it's >>>>> pointing relative to face-down]. >>>>> >>>>> 4. The internal 3-axis Hall-effect sensors to figure out where >>>>> "North" is. [And, yes, a nearby magnet will confuse it!] >>>> >>>>Good thing computers don't use RP06s or RP04s anymore. >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Given all four of the above [and its built-in database], >>>>> it knows all it needs to show you what's in the sky that >>>>> the phone is pointing to. Thus, as I noted above, it works >>>>> fine indoors in a room with no windows. >>>>> >>>>> Note that if you point it at some star and then rotate the >>>>> phone in the plane of the display [keeping that star centered], >>>>> the displayed sky chart *doesn't* rotate w.r.t. the real sky >>>>> [though the labels "pop" at times as they switch to a >>>>> different rasterization(?) to remain roughly upright]. >>>> >>>>Does working in a power plant destroy a smart phone? >>> >>> Not if it is attached to a human. The exposure limits for >>> humans to exposure to heat, cold, magnetism, electric fields, >>> water and other liquids, non-athmospheric gases, radiation >>> etc are from 4 orders of magnitude lower that what would >>> damage a water-resistant smartphone. >> >>OK, thanks. >> >>> >>> That said, the phone may not work as intended while in the >>> plant. I had the pleasure of standing right on top of a 90MW >>> generator a few months ago, around 3 feet from the stator field. >>> That was a magnetic experience, and not for having any metal >>> on or in your body, We had to sign several disclaimers to >>> be let in, as well as get a security clearance. >> >>If you can answer, why did you do that? > > For the thrill. For a healthy person it is completely harmless, > but you will sense that field permeate every cubic centimeter of > your body. It is slightly diffcult to speak evenly. Is that because the muscles of the vocal chords are affected or does the air within the field change the tone? > > We were standing right next to the shaft going from the turbine, > above us, to the generator, below us. It rotated at 16 2/3 rotations > per second; but it is so shiny, balanced and polished that you > cannot see it rotate. You have to put a nail to it (not the skin, > you might get skinned, but a nail is safe.) That shaft carries > 90 megawatts of energy; and the generator outputs 134 kilovolts > of three-phase electricity. Still around 400 amps. Kewl. Would insects dropping on the surface do any damage? > >>> The phones stopped working even before we put them away in the >>> adjoining room. But they were not damaged. >> >>So how do things work if they can't use electronics. Is everything >>still mechanical? > > Probably because of the place being a goodish faraday cage. It is > around 100 meters into a mountain, where there is a hole through to > the next valley 18 km away, where the river is 180 meter higher. So > they divert the water, and generate electricity. > > It was a once-in-a-lifetime chance to see this up close. > >>The city is building a new power plant (gas-fired) here. So I get >>to see how the things are built. They moved the [can't think of >>the correct term] heat exchangers? this spring. They were shipped >>via the lakes and then hauled from the lake to the construction >>site on trailers which had ~40 wheels. I don't remember the >>tonnage; they drove each box at 2 MPH. They spent a lot of >>calculation time to ensure that the trailers had enough wheels >>so that the roads and infrastructure underneath them wouldn't >>collapse. > > Probably heat exchangers, yes. They are the heaviest single > components, unless they do a multistage turbine setup; in which > case the lowest pressure turbines are the heaviest. But they > small turbines will generate > 2/3rds of the energy. There are 4 towers separate towers. > > I assume you are referring to a gas-fired steam turbine > generator setup. I assume that, too. I'm not sure about any of the technical details. The city decided to do this when Obama's EPA edicts denied expanding the coal-burning power plant we have. /BAH
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| From | Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-10-16 20:24 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <avr7fc-u74.ln1@sambook.reistad.name> |
| In reply to | #152992 |
In article <PM00052238A52073E9@aca46c82.ipt.aol.com>, jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> wrote: >Morten Reistad wrote: >> In article <PM0005222472D5DAC6@aca43228.ipt.aol.com>, >> jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> wrote: >>>Morten Reistad wrote: >>>> In article <PM0005221105C001AD@aca479f3.ipt.aol.com>, >>>> jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> wrote: >>>>>Rob Warnock wrote: >>>>>> Scott Lurndal <slp53@pacbell.net> wrote: >>>>>> +--------------- >>>>>> | jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> writes: >>>>>> | >JimP wrote: >>>>>> | >> There is an app that you point your cell phone at the night sky, >and >>>>>> | >> the app tells you the names of the constellations and some of the >>>>>> | >> stars. >>>>>> | > >>>>>> | >How does it do that? GPS gives a location but not a >direction...right? >>>>>> | >>>>>> | Camera. >>>>>> +--------------- >>>>>> >>>>>> I have the Google Sky Map app on my phone, and it doesn't use >>>>>> the camera at all [e.g., works fine on a cloudy day or even >>>>>> indoors!]. Instead, it uses: >>>>>> >>>>>> 1. *Either* GPS or cell network information to find out your >>>>>> location [i.e., *will* work just fine with GPS turned off]. >>>>>> >>>>>> 2. *Either* GPS or cell network information to find out what >>>>>> the date & time are. >>>>>> >>>>>> 3. The internal 3-axis accelerometers to figure out which way >>>>>> is "down", and thus the attitude of the phone [where it's >>>>>> pointing relative to face-down]. >>>>>> >>>>>> 4. The internal 3-axis Hall-effect sensors to figure out where >>>>>> "North" is. [And, yes, a nearby magnet will confuse it!] >>>>> >>>>>Good thing computers don't use RP06s or RP04s anymore. >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Given all four of the above [and its built-in database], >>>>>> it knows all it needs to show you what's in the sky that >>>>>> the phone is pointing to. Thus, as I noted above, it works >>>>>> fine indoors in a room with no windows. >>>>>> >>>>>> Note that if you point it at some star and then rotate the >>>>>> phone in the plane of the display [keeping that star centered], >>>>>> the displayed sky chart *doesn't* rotate w.r.t. the real sky >>>>>> [though the labels "pop" at times as they switch to a >>>>>> different rasterization(?) to remain roughly upright]. >>>>> >>>>>Does working in a power plant destroy a smart phone? >>>> >>>> Not if it is attached to a human. The exposure limits for >>>> humans to exposure to heat, cold, magnetism, electric fields, >>>> water and other liquids, non-athmospheric gases, radiation >>>> etc are from 4 orders of magnitude lower that what would >>>> damage a water-resistant smartphone. >>> >>>OK, thanks. >>> >>>> >>>> That said, the phone may not work as intended while in the >>>> plant. I had the pleasure of standing right on top of a 90MW >>>> generator a few months ago, around 3 feet from the stator field. >>>> That was a magnetic experience, and not for having any metal >>>> on or in your body, We had to sign several disclaimers to >>>> be let in, as well as get a security clearance. >>> >>>If you can answer, why did you do that? >> >> For the thrill. For a healthy person it is completely harmless, >> but you will sense that field permeate every cubic centimeter of >> your body. It is slightly diffcult to speak evenly. > >Is that because the muscles of the vocal chords are affected or >does the air within the field change the tone? No, it is the nerves and muscles that tend to oscillate a bit with the 50 Hz field that permeates everything. Vibrato voices. >> We were standing right next to the shaft going from the turbine, >> above us, to the generator, below us. It rotated at 16 2/3 rotations >> per second; but it is so shiny, balanced and polished that you >> cannot see it rotate. You have to put a nail to it (not the skin, >> you might get skinned, but a nail is safe.) That shaft carries >> 90 megawatts of energy; and the generator outputs 134 kilovolts >> of three-phase electricity. Still around 400 amps. > >Kewl. Would insects dropping on the surface do any damage? Probably. It is around two feet in diameter, and so polished with that flawless stainless steel look that I don't think much will stick. It has also been rotating like this since they last changed the bearings 5 years ago, and is expected to continue rotating for another 5. >>>> The phones stopped working even before we put them away in the >>>> adjoining room. But they were not damaged. >>> >>>So how do things work if they can't use electronics. Is everything >>>still mechanical? >> >> Probably because of the place being a goodish faraday cage. It is >> around 100 meters into a mountain, where there is a hole through to >> the next valley 18 km away, where the river is 180 meter higher. So >> they divert the water, and generate electricity. >> >> It was a once-in-a-lifetime chance to see this up close. >> >>>The city is building a new power plant (gas-fired) here. So I get >>>to see how the things are built. They moved the [can't think of >>>the correct term] heat exchangers? this spring. They were shipped >>>via the lakes and then hauled from the lake to the construction >>>site on trailers which had ~40 wheels. I don't remember the >>>tonnage; they drove each box at 2 MPH. They spent a lot of >>>calculation time to ensure that the trailers had enough wheels >>>so that the roads and infrastructure underneath them wouldn't >>>collapse. >> >> Probably heat exchangers, yes. They are the heaviest single >> components, unless they do a multistage turbine setup; in which >> case the lowest pressure turbines are the heaviest. But they >> small turbines will generate > 2/3rds of the energy. > >There are 4 towers separate towers. The big towers are just top pull in enough air to cool the stuff, and condense the steam back to water. The business end of generation is a turbine of a rectangle of 3-5 feet in diameter times around 10 feet, plus a slightly bigger one next to it for the generator. If this is a high pressure design there are 1-3 more turbines, each bigger than the last one, where the fist one takes the steam form ~200 to ~40 bar, the next one from ~40 to ~15 and so on. Increasing size an diminsihing output from each stage. Then you have around a square kilometer of air contact surface in the towers to vent off the heat, and heat exchangers in the furnace to heat it again. >> I assume you are referring to a gas-fired steam turbine >> generator setup. > >I assume that, too. I'm not sure about any of the technical >details. The city decided to do this when Obama's EPA >edicts denied expanding the coal-burning power plant we have. This is very good news for your neighbourhood. A normal coal fired plant outputs more radioactivity just from the coal ash than was lost at Three Mile Island, every year. And that is the smallest of the problems with the output. -- mrr
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| From | Greymaus <mausg@mail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-10-17 11:18 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrnn24es8.324.mausg@dmaus.org> |
| In reply to | #153012 |
On 2015-10-16, Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> wrote: > In article <PM00052238A52073E9@aca46c82.ipt.aol.com>, > jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> wrote: >>Morten Reistad wrote: >>> In article <PM0005222472D5DAC6@aca43228.ipt.aol.com>, >>> jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> wrote: >>>>Morten Reistad wrote: >>>>> In article <PM0005221105C001AD@aca479f3.ipt.aol.com>, >>> We were standing right next to the shaft going from the turbine, >>> above us, to the generator, below us. It rotated at 16 2/3 rotations >>> per second; but it is so shiny, balanced and polished that you >>> cannot see it rotate. You have to put a nail to it (not the skin, >>> you might get skinned, but a nail is safe.) That shaft carries >>> 90 megawatts of energy; and the generator outputs 134 kilovolts >>> of three-phase electricity. Still around 400 amps. >> >>Kewl. Would insects dropping on the surface do any damage? > > Probably. It is around two feet in diameter, and so polished > with that flawless stainless steel look that I don't think > much will stick. It has also been rotating like this since they > last changed the bearings 5 years ago, and is expected to > continue rotating for another 5. > Who made them/service them? -- greymaus . . ...
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| From | Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-10-17 19:06 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <vpbafc-og7.ln1@sambook.reistad.name> |
| In reply to | #153026 |
In article <slrnn24es8.324.mausg@dmaus.org>, Greymaus <mausg@mail.com> wrote: >On 2015-10-16, Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> wrote: >> In article <PM00052238A52073E9@aca46c82.ipt.aol.com>, >> jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> wrote: >>>Morten Reistad wrote: >>>> In article <PM0005222472D5DAC6@aca43228.ipt.aol.com>, >>>> jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> wrote: >>>>>Morten Reistad wrote: >>>>>> In article <PM0005221105C001AD@aca479f3.ipt.aol.com>, >>>> We were standing right next to the shaft going from the turbine, >>>> above us, to the generator, below us. It rotated at 16 2/3 rotations >>>> per second; but it is so shiny, balanced and polished that you >>>> cannot see it rotate. You have to put a nail to it (not the skin, >>>> you might get skinned, but a nail is safe.) That shaft carries >>>> 90 megawatts of energy; and the generator outputs 134 kilovolts >>>> of three-phase electricity. Still around 400 amps. >>> >>>Kewl. Would insects dropping on the surface do any damage? >> >> Probably. It is around two feet in diameter, and so polished >> with that flawless stainless steel look that I don't think >> much will stick. It has also been rotating like this since they >> last changed the bearings 5 years ago, and is expected to >> continue rotating for another 5. >> > >Who made them/service them? ISTR it is ABB. Hydropower has more expensive gear in their power stations, but they run for the better part of a cantury with not much else in terms of expenses. New bearings, turbine blades and general service every 10 years, change the turbine and reline the tunnels every 50. And have a man and a dog to watch that it doesn't break. -- mrr
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| From | Greymaus <mausg@mail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-10-17 18:34 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrnn258dh.36m.mausg@dmaus.org> |
| In reply to | #153032 |
On 2015-10-17, Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> wrote: > In article <slrnn24es8.324.mausg@dmaus.org>, Greymaus <mausg@mail.com> wrote: >>On 2015-10-16, Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> wrote: >>> In article <PM00052238A52073E9@aca46c82.ipt.aol.com>, >>> jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> wrote: >>>>Morten Reistad wrote: >>>>> In article <PM0005222472D5DAC6@aca43228.ipt.aol.com>, >>>>> jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> wrote: >>>>>>Morten Reistad wrote: >>>>>>> In article <PM0005221105C001AD@aca479f3.ipt.aol.com>, >> >>Who made them/service them? > > ISTR it is ABB. > > Hydropower has more expensive gear in their power stations, > but they run for the better part of a cantury with not much > else in terms of expenses. New bearings, turbine blades and > general service every 10 years, change the turbine and reline > the tunnels every 50. > > And have a man and a dog to watch that it doesn't break. > > -- mrr Krupps used to do work like that, along with _big_ guns and crappy very small cars. Installing those machines would be very precise too. I think some of the dams on the upper Indus have to get the tunnels relined very often. -- greymaus . . ...
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| From | Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-10-17 21:31 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <h9kafc-i38.ln1@sambook.reistad.name> |
| In reply to | #153035 |
In article <slrnn258dh.36m.mausg@dmaus.org>, Greymaus <mausg@mail.com> wrote: >On 2015-10-17, Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> wrote: >> In article <slrnn24es8.324.mausg@dmaus.org>, Greymaus <mausg@mail.com> wrote: >>>On 2015-10-16, Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> wrote: >>>> In article <PM00052238A52073E9@aca46c82.ipt.aol.com>, >>>> jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> wrote: >>>>>Morten Reistad wrote: >>>>>> In article <PM0005222472D5DAC6@aca43228.ipt.aol.com>, >>>>>> jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> wrote: >>>>>>>Morten Reistad wrote: >>>>>>>> In article <PM0005221105C001AD@aca479f3.ipt.aol.com>, >>> >>>Who made them/service them? >> >> ISTR it is ABB. >> >> Hydropower has more expensive gear in their power stations, >> but they run for the better part of a cantury with not much >> else in terms of expenses. New bearings, turbine blades and >> general service every 10 years, change the turbine and reline >> the tunnels every 50. >> >> And have a man and a dog to watch that it doesn't break. >> >> -- mrr > >Krupps used to do work like that, along with _big_ guns and crappy >very small cars. Installing those machines would be very precise too. >I think some of the dams on the upper Indus have to get the tunnels relined >very often. The steel for guns and big axels is very similar, very elastic. The turbine blades are very different, they are very stiff. They are worn by silt, and the operators have constructed filters at the intakes to reduce the silt in the water. Silt as in very small but hard particles. The linings are eaten by mud and chemicals, as is the rock behind it. Mud here is soft particles. -- mrr
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| From | jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-10-17 13:22 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <PM0005224CF2E454A8@aca41e6f.ipt.aol.com> |
| In reply to | #153012 |
Morten Reistad wrote: > In article <PM00052238A52073E9@aca46c82.ipt.aol.com>, > jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> wrote: >>Morten Reistad wrote: >>> In article <PM0005222472D5DAC6@aca43228.ipt.aol.com>, >>> jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> wrote: >>>>Morten Reistad wrote: >>>>> In article <PM0005221105C001AD@aca479f3.ipt.aol.com>, >>>>> jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> wrote: <snip> >>> >>>>The city is building a new power plant (gas-fired) here. So I get >>>>to see how the things are built. They moved the [can't think of >>>>the correct term] heat exchangers? this spring. They were shipped >>>>via the lakes and then hauled from the lake to the construction >>>>site on trailers which had ~40 wheels. I don't remember the >>>>tonnage; they drove each box at 2 MPH. They spent a lot of >>>>calculation time to ensure that the trailers had enough wheels >>>>so that the roads and infrastructure underneath them wouldn't >>>>collapse. >>> >>> Probably heat exchangers, yes. They are the heaviest single >>> components, unless they do a multistage turbine setup; in which >>> case the lowest pressure turbines are the heaviest. But they >>> small turbines will generate > 2/3rds of the energy. >> >>There are 4 towers separate towers. > > The big towers are just top pull in enough air to cool the stuff, > and condense the steam back to water. > > The business end of generation is a turbine of a rectangle of 3-5 > feet in diameter times around 10 feet, plus a slightly bigger one > next to it for the generator. If this is a high pressure design > there are 1-3 more turbines, each bigger than the last one, where > the fist one takes the steam form ~200 to ~40 bar, the next one > from ~40 to ~15 and so on. Increasing size an diminsihing output > from each stage. I suspect that won't be put in until there is a roof...right? > > Then you have around a square kilometer of air contact surface > in the towers to vent off the heat, and heat exchangers in the > furnace to heat it again. > >>> I assume you are referring to a gas-fired steam turbine >>> generator setup. >> >>I assume that, too. I'm not sure about any of the technical >>details. The city decided to do this when Obama's EPA >>edicts denied expanding the coal-burning power plant we have. > > This is very good news for your neighbourhood. A normal coal > fired plant outputs more radioactivity just from the coal ash > than was lost at Three Mile Island, every year. And that is > the smallest of the problems with the output. I expect the electric bills to go up. I won't miss the coal because the city mixed coal dust with the salt/sand mix for snowy roads. I ended up with a black pile where I put my snow boots. /BAH
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| From | "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-10-17 15:45 +1100 |
| Message-ID | <d8e22uF3gidU1@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #152992 |
"jmfbahciv" <See.above@aol.com> wrote in message
news:PM00052238A52073E9@aca46c82.ipt.aol.com...
> Morten Reistad wrote:
>> In article <PM0005222472D5DAC6@aca43228.ipt.aol.com>,
>> jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> wrote:
>>>Morten Reistad wrote:
>>>> In article <PM0005221105C001AD@aca479f3.ipt.aol.com>,
>>>> jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>>Rob Warnock wrote:
>>>>>> Scott Lurndal <slp53@pacbell.net> wrote:
>>>>>> +---------------
>>>>>> | jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> writes:
>>>>>> | >JimP wrote:
>>>>>> | >> There is an app that you point your cell phone at the night sky,
> and
>>>>>> | >> the app tells you the names of the constellations and some of
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> | >> stars.
>>>>>> | >
>>>>>> | >How does it do that? GPS gives a location but not a
> direction...right?
>>>>>> |
>>>>>> | Camera.
>>>>>> +---------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have the Google Sky Map app on my phone, and it doesn't use
>>>>>> the camera at all [e.g., works fine on a cloudy day or even
>>>>>> indoors!]. Instead, it uses:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1. *Either* GPS or cell network information to find out your
>>>>>> location [i.e., *will* work just fine with GPS turned off].
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2. *Either* GPS or cell network information to find out what
>>>>>> the date & time are.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 3. The internal 3-axis accelerometers to figure out which way
>>>>>> is "down", and thus the attitude of the phone [where it's
>>>>>> pointing relative to face-down].
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 4. The internal 3-axis Hall-effect sensors to figure out where
>>>>>> "North" is. [And, yes, a nearby magnet will confuse it!]
>>>>>
>>>>>Good thing computers don't use RP06s or RP04s anymore.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Given all four of the above [and its built-in database],
>>>>>> it knows all it needs to show you what's in the sky that
>>>>>> the phone is pointing to. Thus, as I noted above, it works
>>>>>> fine indoors in a room with no windows.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Note that if you point it at some star and then rotate the
>>>>>> phone in the plane of the display [keeping that star centered],
>>>>>> the displayed sky chart *doesn't* rotate w.r.t. the real sky
>>>>>> [though the labels "pop" at times as they switch to a
>>>>>> different rasterization(?) to remain roughly upright].
>>>>>
>>>>>Does working in a power plant destroy a smart phone?
>>>>
>>>> Not if it is attached to a human. The exposure limits for
>>>> humans to exposure to heat, cold, magnetism, electric fields,
>>>> water and other liquids, non-athmospheric gases, radiation
>>>> etc are from 4 orders of magnitude lower that what would
>>>> damage a water-resistant smartphone.
>>>
>>>OK, thanks.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> That said, the phone may not work as intended while in the
>>>> plant. I had the pleasure of standing right on top of a 90MW
>>>> generator a few months ago, around 3 feet from the stator field.
>>>> That was a magnetic experience, and not for having any metal
>>>> on or in your body, We had to sign several disclaimers to
>>>> be let in, as well as get a security clearance.
>>>
>>>If you can answer, why did you do that?
>>
>> For the thrill. For a healthy person it is completely harmless,
>> but you will sense that field permeate every cubic centimeter of
>> your body. It is slightly diffcult to speak evenly.
>
> Is that because the muscles of the vocal chords are affected or
> does the air within the field change the tone?
The air within the field doesn’t change and
wouldn’t affect speaking evenly even if it did.
>> We were standing right next to the shaft going from the turbine,
>> above us, to the generator, below us. It rotated at 16 2/3 rotations
>> per second; but it is so shiny, balanced and polished that you
>> cannot see it rotate. You have to put a nail to it (not the skin,
>> you might get skinned, but a nail is safe.) That shaft carries
>> 90 megawatts of energy; and the generator outputs 134 kilovolts
>> of three-phase electricity. Still around 400 amps.
> Kewl. Would insects dropping on the surface do any damage?
Nope, they are much to flimsy and light to have any effect
and wouldn’t even be able to shit on it like flys do etc.
>>>> The phones stopped working even before we put them away in the
>>>> adjoining room. But they were not damaged.
>>>
>>>So how do things work if they can't use electronics. Is everything
>>>still mechanical?
>>
>> Probably because of the place being a goodish faraday cage. It is
>> around 100 meters into a mountain, where there is a hole through to
>> the next valley 18 km away, where the river is 180 meter higher. So
>> they divert the water, and generate electricity.
>>
>> It was a once-in-a-lifetime chance to see this up close.
>>
>>>The city is building a new power plant (gas-fired) here. So I get
>>>to see how the things are built. They moved the [can't think of
>>>the correct term] heat exchangers? this spring. They were shipped
>>>via the lakes and then hauled from the lake to the construction
>>>site on trailers which had ~40 wheels. I don't remember the
>>>tonnage; they drove each box at 2 MPH. They spent a lot of
>>>calculation time to ensure that the trailers had enough wheels
>>>so that the roads and infrastructure underneath them wouldn't
>>>collapse.
>>
>> Probably heat exchangers, yes. They are the heaviest single
>> components, unless they do a multistage turbine setup; in which
>> case the lowest pressure turbines are the heaviest. But they
>> small turbines will generate > 2/3rds of the energy.
> There are 4 towers separate towers.
Yeah, they are cooling towers. All power stations have to have them.
>> I assume you are referring to a gas-fired steam turbine
>> generator setup.
>
> I assume that, too. I'm not sure about any of the technical details.
http://p21decision.com/the-new-power-plant/new-power-generation-technology/
In a Combined-Cycle Natural Gas (CCNG) system, two turbines work
in tandem to generate electricity. The first—in this case, a natural gas
turbine—generates electricity, and exhaust heat from that combustion
is used to turn a second turbine, which is typically a steam turbine.
This
reuse of excess heat provides much more efficient generation than is
provided by a natural gas turbine alone.
> The city decided to do this when Obama's EPA edicts
> denied expanding the coal-burning power plant we have.
It isn't Obama's EPA.
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| From | "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-10-17 06:47 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <d8eqqrF9e1vU1@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #153021 |
"Rod Speed" wrote: > "jmfbahciv" wrote: >> The city decided to do this when Obama's EPA edicts >> denied expanding the coal-burning power plant we have. > > It isn't Obama's EPA. It doesn't matter. He can tell his underlings which laws he wants to enforce and which ones he doesn't approve of. He has recently decided that past legislatures and presidents were wrong when they established immigration laws. So those laws effectively are treated as though they don't exist. God save the King!
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| From | "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-10-18 05:00 +1100 |
| Message-ID | <d8fgmeFf1fdU1@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #153027 |
Osmium <r124c4u102@comcast.net> wrote > Rod Speed wrote >> jmfbahciv wrote >>> The city decided to do this when Obama's EPA edicts >>> denied expanding the coal-burning power plant we have. >> It isn't Obama's EPA. > It doesn't matter. Corse it does. > He can tell his underlings which laws he wants to > enforce and which ones he doesn't approve of. That isn't what happened with Barb's new power plant. > He has recently decided that past legislatures and presidents > were wrong when they established immigration laws. So > those laws effectively are treated as though they don't exist. Bullshit. > God save the King! There is no king. And even you should have noticed that he only gets two terms at most.
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| From | "Bill Cunningham" <nospam@nspam.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-10-24 15:23 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <n0glo8$kn0$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #153033 |
"Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:d8fgmeFf1fdU1@mid.individual.net...
> Osmium <r124c4u102@comcast.net> wrote
>> Rod Speed wrote
>>> jmfbahciv wrote
>> He can tell his underlings which laws he wants to enforce and which ones
>> he doesn't approve of.
That's the executive branch for you. And you can't infringe by the other
powers. But the House doesn't use its' "power of the purse" anymore.
Bill
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| From | "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-10-15 08:49 +1100 |
| Message-ID | <d880uhFhgvkU1@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #152890 |
"jmfbahciv" <See.above@aol.com> wrote in message news:PM0005221105C001AD@aca479f3.ipt.aol.com... > Rob Warnock wrote: >> Scott Lurndal <slp53@pacbell.net> wrote: >> +--------------- >> | jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> writes: >> | >JimP wrote: >> | >> There is an app that you point your cell phone at the night sky, and >> | >> the app tells you the names of the constellations and some of the >> | >> stars. >> | > >> | >How does it do that? GPS gives a location but not a >> direction...right? >> | >> | Camera. >> +--------------- >> >> I have the Google Sky Map app on my phone, and it doesn't use >> the camera at all [e.g., works fine on a cloudy day or even >> indoors!]. Instead, it uses: >> >> 1. *Either* GPS or cell network information to find out your >> location [i.e., *will* work just fine with GPS turned off]. >> >> 2. *Either* GPS or cell network information to find out what >> the date & time are. >> >> 3. The internal 3-axis accelerometers to figure out which way >> is "down", and thus the attitude of the phone [where it's >> pointing relative to face-down]. >> >> 4. The internal 3-axis Hall-effect sensors to figure out where >> "North" is. [And, yes, a nearby magnet will confuse it!] > > Good thing computers don't use RP06s or RP04s anymore. > >> >> Given all four of the above [and its built-in database], >> it knows all it needs to show you what's in the sky that >> the phone is pointing to. Thus, as I noted above, it works >> fine indoors in a room with no windows. >> >> Note that if you point it at some star and then rotate the >> phone in the plane of the display [keeping that star centered], >> the displayed sky chart *doesn't* rotate w.r.t. the real sky >> [though the labels "pop" at times as they switch to a >> different rasterization(?) to remain roughly upright]. > > Does working in a power plant destroy a smart phone? Nope. The worst that happens is that the sensors can get fooled while there. Even with much bigger magnets like with CAT scanners, no smart phones get destroyed.
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| From | Morten Reistad <first@last.name.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-10-13 20:47 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <v700fc-111.ln1@sambook.reistad.name> |
| In reply to | #152790 |
In article <lr7Tx.16673$p53.3874@fx07.iad>, Scott Lurndal <slp53@pacbell.net> wrote: >jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> writes: >>JimP wrote: >>> On Mon, 12 Oct 2015 15:57:51 -0500, "Charles Richmond" >>> <numerist@aquaporin4.com> wrote: >>> >>>>"Charlie Gibbs" <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> wrote in message >>>>news:mven85023m7@news7.newsguy.com... >>>>> On 2015-10-11, Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> On Sun, 11 Oct 2015, jmfbahciv wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Did it include the phases of the moon? I could not find a 2015 calendar >>>>>>> which had them; I wasn't going to spend $8 on one just to see those >>>>>>> expensive calendars were real calendars. >>>>>>> >>>>>> I hadnt' thought about that. But it wasn't uncommon years back to have >>>>>> the phase of the moon on a calendar, but I havent' noticed it in some >>>>>> years. >>>>> >>>>> I suspect that most people no longer care about celestial phenomena (aside >>>>> from the Kardashians). They're too busy staring at their smartphones to >>>>> look at the sky anyway. >>>>> >>>> >>>>Anyway, I'm sure that the smart phones have an app for the phases of the >>>>moon. ;-) >>> >>> There is an app that you point your cell phone at the night sky, and >>> the app tells you the names of the constellations and some of the >>> stars. >> >>How does it do that? GPS gives a location but not a direction...right? > >Camera. No, direction sensors. Lots of them, and a gps plus a compass. A smartphone knows to within 2-3 degrees which way it is facing, and the location to within around two feet in the horizontal and the elevation to within 2 meters. -- mrr
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| From | jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-10-14 14:02 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <PM0005221107C54E0D@aca479f3.ipt.aol.com> |
| In reply to | #152790 |
Scott Lurndal wrote: > jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> writes: >>JimP wrote: >>> On Mon, 12 Oct 2015 15:57:51 -0500, "Charles Richmond" >>> <numerist@aquaporin4.com> wrote: >>> >>>>"Charlie Gibbs" <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> wrote in message >>>>news:mven85023m7@news7.newsguy.com... >>>>> On 2015-10-11, Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> On Sun, 11 Oct 2015, jmfbahciv wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Did it include the phases of the moon? I could not find a 2015 calendar >>>>>>> which had them; I wasn't going to spend $8 on one just to see those >>>>>>> expensive calendars were real calendars. >>>>>>> >>>>>> I hadnt' thought about that. But it wasn't uncommon years back to have >>>>>> the phase of the moon on a calendar, but I havent' noticed it in some >>>>>> years. >>>>> >>>>> I suspect that most people no longer care about celestial phenomena (aside >>>>> from the Kardashians). They're too busy staring at their smartphones to >>>>> look at the sky anyway. >>>>> >>>> >>>>Anyway, I'm sure that the smart phones have an app for the phases of the >>>>moon. ;-) >>> >>> There is an app that you point your cell phone at the night sky, and >>> the app tells you the names of the constellations and some of the >>> stars. >> >>How does it do that? GPS gives a location but not a direction...right? > > Camera. I thought about that but dismissed it because there isn't enough light. /BAH
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| From | "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-10-15 08:54 +1100 |
| Message-ID | <d88183FhjanU1@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #152891 |
"jmfbahciv" <See.above@aol.com> wrote in message news:PM0005221107C54E0D@aca479f3.ipt.aol.com... > Scott Lurndal wrote: >> jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> writes: >>>JimP wrote: >>>> On Mon, 12 Oct 2015 15:57:51 -0500, "Charles Richmond" >>>> <numerist@aquaporin4.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>>"Charlie Gibbs" <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> wrote in message >>>>>news:mven85023m7@news7.newsguy.com... >>>>>> On 2015-10-11, Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> On Sun, 11 Oct 2015, jmfbahciv wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Did it include the phases of the moon? I could not find a 2015 > calendar >>>>>>>> which had them; I wasn't going to spend $8 on one just to see those >>>>>>>> expensive calendars were real calendars. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> I hadnt' thought about that. But it wasn't uncommon years back to >>>>>>> have >>>>>>> the phase of the moon on a calendar, but I havent' noticed it in >>>>>>> some >>>>>>> years. >>>>>> >>>>>> I suspect that most people no longer care about celestial phenomena > (aside >>>>>> from the Kardashians). They're too busy staring at their smartphones >>>>>> to >>>>>> look at the sky anyway. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>>Anyway, I'm sure that the smart phones have an app for the phases of >>>>>the >>>>>moon. ;-) >>>> >>>> There is an app that you point your cell phone at the night sky, and >>>> the app tells you the names of the constellations and some of the >>>> stars. >>> >>>How does it do that? GPS gives a location but not a direction...right? >> >> Camera. Nope. > I thought about that but dismissed it because there isn't enough light. Modern smartphones don’t need much light at all, that would work fine light wise, but its much better to use the location and compass and orientation sensors. That works fine even inside and when the sky is covered in cloud so you know where to look in breaks in the cloud etc.
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| From | jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-10-15 12:54 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <PM000522244C48ADF8@aca43228.ipt.aol.com> |
| In reply to | #152940 |
Rod Speed wrote: > > > "jmfbahciv" <See.above@aol.com> wrote in message > news:PM0005221107C54E0D@aca479f3.ipt.aol.com... >> Scott Lurndal wrote: >>> jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> writes: >>>>JimP wrote: >>>>> On Mon, 12 Oct 2015 15:57:51 -0500, "Charles Richmond" >>>>> <numerist@aquaporin4.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>"Charlie Gibbs" <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> wrote in message >>>>>>news:mven85023m7@news7.newsguy.com... >>>>>>> On 2015-10-11, Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Sun, 11 Oct 2015, jmfbahciv wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Did it include the phases of the moon? I could not find a 2015 >> calendar >>>>>>>>> which had them; I wasn't going to spend $8 on one just to see those >>>>>>>>> expensive calendars were real calendars. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I hadnt' thought about that. But it wasn't uncommon years back to >>>>>>>> have >>>>>>>> the phase of the moon on a calendar, but I havent' noticed it in >>>>>>>> some >>>>>>>> years. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I suspect that most people no longer care about celestial phenomena >> (aside >>>>>>> from the Kardashians). They're too busy staring at their smartphones >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> look at the sky anyway. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>Anyway, I'm sure that the smart phones have an app for the phases of >>>>>>the >>>>>>moon. ;-) >>>>> >>>>> There is an app that you point your cell phone at the night sky, and >>>>> the app tells you the names of the constellations and some of the >>>>> stars. >>>> >>>>How does it do that? GPS gives a location but not a direction...right? >>> >>> Camera. > > Nope. > >> I thought about that but dismissed it because there isn't enough light. > > Modern smartphones don’t need much light at all, that would work > fine light wise, but its much better to use the location and compass > and orientation sensors. That works fine even inside and when the sky > is covered in cloud so you know where to look in breaks in the cloud etc. To detect a star's light requires a lot of time with no jiggling. /BAH >
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| From | "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-10-16 06:29 +1100 |
| Message-ID | <d8ad44F58cvU1@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #152954 |
"jmfbahciv" <See.above@aol.com> wrote in message news:PM000522244C48ADF8@aca43228.ipt.aol.com... > Rod Speed wrote: >> >> >> "jmfbahciv" <See.above@aol.com> wrote in message >> news:PM0005221107C54E0D@aca479f3.ipt.aol.com... >>> Scott Lurndal wrote: >>>> jmfbahciv <See.above@aol.com> writes: >>>>>JimP wrote: >>>>>> On Mon, 12 Oct 2015 15:57:51 -0500, "Charles Richmond" >>>>>> <numerist@aquaporin4.com> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>>"Charlie Gibbs" <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> wrote in message >>>>>>>news:mven85023m7@news7.newsguy.com... >>>>>>>> On 2015-10-11, Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Sun, 11 Oct 2015, jmfbahciv wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Did it include the phases of the moon? I could not find a 2015 >>> calendar >>>>>>>>>> which had them; I wasn't going to spend $8 on one just to see >>>>>>>>>> those >>>>>>>>>> expensive calendars were real calendars. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I hadnt' thought about that. But it wasn't uncommon years back to >>>>>>>>> have >>>>>>>>> the phase of the moon on a calendar, but I havent' noticed it in >>>>>>>>> some >>>>>>>>> years. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I suspect that most people no longer care about celestial phenomena >>> (aside >>>>>>>> from the Kardashians). They're too busy staring at their >>>>>>>> smartphones >>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>> look at the sky anyway. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Anyway, I'm sure that the smart phones have an app for the phases of >>>>>>>the >>>>>>>moon. ;-) >>>>>> >>>>>> There is an app that you point your cell phone at the night sky, and >>>>>> the app tells you the names of the constellations and some of the >>>>>> stars. >>>>> >>>>>How does it do that? GPS gives a location but not a direction...right? >>>> >>>> Camera. >> >> Nope. >> >>> I thought about that but dismissed it because there isn't enough light. >> >> Modern smartphones don’t need much light at all, that would work >> fine light wise, but its much better to use the location and compass >> and orientation sensors. That works fine even inside and when the sky >> is covered in cloud so you know where to look in breaks in the cloud etc. > > To detect a star's light requires a lot of time with no jiggling. Not with the best of the cameras which have optical image stabilisation.
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| From | "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-10-15 14:42 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <d8adtsF5f08U1@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #152978 |
"Rod Speed" wrote: > "jmfbahciv" wrote: >> To detect a star's light requires a lot of time with no jiggling. > > Not with the best of the cameras which have optical image stabilisation. This is like work with two shifts. Barb works the night shift and leaves a message in the morning as to what she discovered in her shift. Rod comes in about 2:00 PM the next day and says she was all wrong. Rinse, reapply and repeat.
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| From | "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-10-16 11:21 +1100 |
| Message-ID | <d8au8bF9c7qU1@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #152981 |
Osmium <r124c4u102@comcast.net> wrote > Rod Speed wrote >> jmfbahciv wrote >>> To detect a star's light requires a lot of time with no jiggling. >> Not with the best of the cameras which have optical image stabilisation. > This is like work with two shifts. Barb works the night shift and leaves > a message in the morning as to what she discovered in her shift. Rod > comes in about 2:00 PM the next day and says she was all wrong. Yep are on opposite sides of the world. She usenets in just one burst once a day. I don’t.
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