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Backup

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  Backup pablito <abc@abc.bom> - 2025-06-07 12:23 +0200
    Re: Backup NFN Smith <worldoff9908@gmail.com> - 2025-06-07 09:10 -0700
      Re: Backup "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2025-06-07 21:01 +0100
        Re: Backup Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2025-06-07 18:00 -0400
        Re: Backup NFN Smith <worldoff9908@gmail.com> - 2025-06-08 21:03 -0700
          Re: Backup Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2025-06-09 00:39 -0400
            Re: Backup "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2025-06-09 11:52 +0100
              Re: Backup Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2025-06-09 14:09 -0400
      Re: Backup Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2025-06-07 16:04 -0400
    Re: Backup "David E. Ross" <nobody@nowhere.invalid> - 2025-06-07 09:22 -0700
    Re: Backup "Alan K." <alan@invalid.com> - 2025-06-07 16:38 -0400
      Re: Backup "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-06-08 00:10 +0200
        Re: Backup Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2025-06-07 18:20 -0400
          Re: Backup "Alan K." <alan@invalid.com> - 2025-06-07 18:29 -0400
          Re: Backup Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2025-06-08 04:21 +0100
            Re: Backup Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2025-06-08 00:13 -0400

#16874 — Backup

Is it possible to configure TB to do an automatic backup at a certain time ?
TNX
-- 
Onus probandi incumbit ei qui dicit

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#16875

pablito wrote:
> Is it possible to configure TB to do an automatic backup at a certain 
> time ?
> TNX

Not within Thunderbird.  For that, the best bet is with some sort of 
external tool that supports scheduling.

If you're working in Windows, what you want to get backed up is the 
contents of %APPDATA%\Thunderbird.  You don't have to copy to a 
different drive, just another location locally, although it's a good 
idea to make sure that Thunderbird is closed when you do it, so that 
you're not trying to make backups of open files.

Smith

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#16878

On 2025/6/7 17:10:47, NFN Smith wrote:
> pablito wrote:
>> Is it possible to configure TB to do an automatic backup at a certain 
>> time ?
>> TNX
> 
> Not within Thunderbird.  For that, the best bet is with some sort of 
> external tool that supports scheduling.

(Would be a good thing for the dev.s to add - especially to avoid the 
"running" aspect, and for those less savvy who don't know about things 
like %APPDATA%.)>
> If you're working in Windows, what you want to get backed up is the 
> contents of %APPDATA%\Thunderbird.  You don't have to copy to a 
> different drive, just another location locally, although it's a good 
> idea to make sure that Thunderbird is closed when you do it, so that 
> you're not trying to make backups of open files.

While we're stuck with using something external, is there some simple 
command (that could be put in a batch file) that will tell TB to shut 
itself down cleanly? (I envisage the batch file - which could then be 
scheduled - having the shutdown command, if we can contrive one, 
followed by the backup instruction.)>
> Smith
> 


-- 
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf


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#16881

On Sat, 6/7/2025 4:01 PM, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
> On 2025/6/7 17:10:47, NFN Smith wrote:
>> pablito wrote:
>>> Is it possible to configure TB to do an automatic backup at a certain time ?
>>> TNX
>>
>> Not within Thunderbird.  For that, the best bet is with some sort of external tool that supports scheduling.
> 
> (Would be a good thing for the dev.s to add - especially to avoid the "running" aspect, and for those less savvy who don't know about things like %APPDATA%.)>
>> If you're working in Windows, what you want to get backed up is the contents of %APPDATA%\Thunderbird.  You don't have to copy to a different drive, just another location locally, although it's a good idea to make sure that Thunderbird is closed when you do it, so that you're not trying to make backups of open files.
> 
> While we're stuck with using something external, is there some simple command (that could be put in a batch file) that will tell TB to shut itself down cleanly? (I envisage the batch file - which could then be scheduled - having the shutdown command, if we can contrive one, followed by the backup instruction.)>
>> Smith
>>
> 
> 

https://superuser.com/questions/959364/on-windows-how-can-i-gracefully-ask-a-running-program-to-terminate

    taskkill /im notepad.exe     # graceful (see if Notepad asks to save edited changes? It does ask.)
                                 # Maybe a Draft window will stay open on Thunderbird if you try this?

    taskkill /f /im notepad.exe  # should drop notepad like a rock, even with changes present.
                                 # Don't do this to thunderbird. Naughty.

Check how many processes Thunderbird runs, before doing this.
There could be an issue with parents or children. In some
contexts, the difference between "kill" and "killall" handles
this, but I don't know if Windows has that. Sending the signal
to the parent for example, should be enough to stop a Firefox team.
You can use Sysinternals Process Explorer, which uses a nested listing,
the parent is left-most, the children are indented, and this makes
it easy to figure out who is the PPID (Parent Process ID).

Processes should have a PID (who am I?) and a PPID (who is my parent?).
The parent of a process, should eventually be the equivalent of INIT(1)
or so. Some process is considered the "first parent". You would
not try to kill the first parent, as that could cause your session
to drop or something.

Those are some concepts, still some details to flush out.

But generally, this topic has rough edges, and who knows what will happen.

   Paul

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#16902

J. P. Gilliver wrote:
> On 2025/6/7 17:10:47, NFN Smith wrote:
>> pablito wrote:
>>> Is it possible to configure TB to do an automatic backup at a certain 
>>> time ?
>>> TNX
>>
>> Not within Thunderbird.  For that, the best bet is with some sort of 
>> external tool that supports scheduling.
> 
> (Would be a good thing for the dev.s to add - especially to avoid the 
> "running" aspect, and for those less savvy who don't know about things 
> like %APPDATA%.)
>

That would be nice, but I think that's one of the many things that won't 
appear in Thunderbird unless it first appears in Firefox.

In any case, the rule of thumb is that whether you're working in 
Thunderbird or Firefox (or for that matter, any other Mozilla-derived 
projects), it's always a good idea to shut down the app before you 
tinker with data inside a profile.

I've always been annoyed with locating profiles in %APPDATA% (or in 
Linux, $HOME/thunderbird or in MacOS, ~/Library/Thunderbird, all hidden 
folders), although I get the rationale that because that's all data 
that's intended to be interacted with through the relevant application, 
rather than directly. However, with Mozilla apps, there reasons to 
tinker with profile data, although something to go about carefully.

>> If you're working in Windows, what you want to get backed up is the 
>> contents of %APPDATA%\Thunderbird.  You don't have to copy to a 
>> different drive, just another location locally, although it's a good 
>> idea to make sure that Thunderbird is closed when you do it, so that 
>> you're not trying to make backups of open files.
> 
> While we're stuck with using something external, is there some simple 
> command (that could be put in a batch file) that will tell TB to shut 
> itself down cleanly? (I envisage the batch file - which could then be 
> scheduled - having the shutdown command, if we can contrive one, 
> followed by the backup instruction.)>

There are a variety of approaches, and Paul has suggested more than one 
down-thread.  Although I've suggested copying, Paul correctly suggests 
that putting into a .ZIP archive is a good way.  Besides just getting a 
backup, that's an ideal approach if you're moving a profile to a new 
computer.

I agree that you don't have to use a formal backup tool, and depending 
on your skills with something like batch file programming in Windows or 
bash scripting in Linux or MacOS, it's not too hard to set up, including 
setting a script that will run through the Windows scheduler or a 
crontab job, including making sure you kill any active processes before 
you begin.

One consideration is that if your regular computer backups don't include 
all of your user data (even if you're not doing full system or bootable 
backups), because your Thunderbird data is in a hidden folder, then you 
have to explicitly include the Thunderbird data as part of your backup 
jobs.  In Linux, it's easy enough to get all of that data by specifying 
the $HOME directory, but you have to work harder for Windows and MacOS. 
For Windows, you can specify the absolute path to your profile (even if 
it doesn't show up when you're browsing from the Explorer), but the nice 
thing about using the %APPDATA% variable (or %APPDATA%\Thunderbird), it 
will always resolve to the correct location, and where you don't have to 
account for how your username is defined.

For what it's worth, I use Duplicati for backups of all of my platforms, 
Windows, Linux and MacOS, where they run late at night (when I'm not at 
the computer) off the appropriate schedulers. For Linux and Mac, I don't 
use them frequently enough that I normally leave applications open, but 
on Windows, I sometimes will leave an app (whether Thunderbird, Firefox 
or most likely, Seamonkey) open overnight, and I have never seen any 
issues with running a scheduled backup against an open profile.  By 
contrast, there are other applications, where if I happen to have them 
open when Duplicati runs, I get warning messages about files that are 
open (usually status files) and where those files don't get backed up. 
But I don't think I've seen any warnings about open files with any 
Mozilla apps.

For copying a profile that is a backup, it may not be a big thing to 
have an app open. On the other hand, for other tinkering inside a 
profile (i.e., changing file contents) it is advisable to close an app 
first. But if I'm making a backup manually, then I close the app as a 
matter of habit.

Smith

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#16904

On Mon, 6/9/2025 12:03 AM, NFN Smith wrote:
> J. P. Gilliver wrote:
>> On 2025/6/7 17:10:47, NFN Smith wrote:
>>> pablito wrote:
>>>> Is it possible to configure TB to do an automatic backup at a certain time ?
>>>> TNX
>>>
>>> Not within Thunderbird.  For that, the best bet is with some sort of external tool that supports scheduling.
>>
>> (Would be a good thing for the dev.s to add - especially to avoid the "running" aspect, and for those less savvy who don't know about things like %APPDATA%.)
>>
> 
> That would be nice, but I think that's one of the many things that won't appear in Thunderbird unless it first appears in Firefox.
> 
> In any case, the rule of thumb is that whether you're working in Thunderbird or Firefox (or for that matter, any other Mozilla-derived projects), it's always a good idea to shut down the app before you tinker with data inside a profile.
> 
> I've always been annoyed with locating profiles in %APPDATA% (or in Linux, $HOME/thunderbird or in MacOS, ~/Library/Thunderbird, all hidden folders), although I get the rationale that because that's all data that's intended to be interacted with through the relevant application, rather than directly. However, with Mozilla apps, there reasons to tinker with profile data, although something to go about carefully.
> 
>>> If you're working in Windows, what you want to get backed up is the contents of %APPDATA%\Thunderbird.  You don't have to copy to a different drive, just another location locally, although it's a good idea to make sure that Thunderbird is closed when you do it, so that you're not trying to make backups of open files.
>>
>> While we're stuck with using something external, is there some simple command (that could be put in a batch file) that will tell TB to shut itself down cleanly? (I envisage the batch file - which could then be scheduled - having the shutdown command, if we can contrive one, followed by the backup instruction.)>
> 
> There are a variety of approaches, and Paul has suggested more than one down-thread.  Although I've suggested copying, Paul correctly suggests that putting into a .ZIP archive is a good way.  Besides just getting a backup, that's an ideal approach if you're moving a profile to a new computer.
> 
> I agree that you don't have to use a formal backup tool, and depending on your skills with something like batch file programming in Windows or bash scripting in Linux or MacOS, it's not too hard to set up, including setting a script that will run through the Windows scheduler or a crontab job, including making sure you kill any active processes before you begin.
> 
> One consideration is that if your regular computer backups don't include all of your user data (even if you're not doing full system or bootable backups), because your Thunderbird data is in a hidden folder, then you have to explicitly include the Thunderbird data as part of your backup jobs.  In Linux, it's easy enough to get all of that data by specifying the $HOME directory, but you have to work harder for Windows and MacOS. For Windows, you can specify the absolute path to your profile (even if it doesn't show up when you're browsing from the Explorer), but the nice thing about using the %APPDATA% variable (or %APPDATA%\Thunderbird), it will always resolve to the correct location, and where you don't have to account for how your username is defined.
> 
> For what it's worth, I use Duplicati for backups of all of my platforms, Windows, Linux and MacOS, where they run late at night (when I'm not at the computer) off the appropriate schedulers. For Linux and Mac, I don't use them frequently enough that I normally leave applications open, but on Windows, I sometimes will leave an app (whether Thunderbird, Firefox or most likely, Seamonkey) open overnight, and I have never seen any issues with running a scheduled backup against an open profile.  By contrast, there are other applications, where if I happen to have them open when Duplicati runs, I get warning messages about files that are open (usually status files) and where those files don't get backed up. But I don't think I've seen any warnings about open files with any Mozilla apps.
> 
> For copying a profile that is a backup, it may not be a big thing to have an app open. On the other hand, for other tinkering inside a profile (i.e., changing file contents) it is advisable to close an app first. But if I'm making a backup manually, then I close the app as a matter of habit.
> 
> Smith
> 

I considered one other approach, but didn't put it in a post.

You can set a VSS Shadow Copy on Windows and that is what some
commercial backup software does. There are executables which
do not release their data files within the 10 second period,
and their files might not get backed up properly.

However, when I googled that, someone mentioned that a malformed
.sbd in Thunderbird, stopped that from working. My guess is,
the Thunderbird software may have been attempting to open the file,
and the operation never completed. Then, when the shadow was asserted
(and programs are expected to respond), there was an error indicating
that Thunderbird could not comply at the moment. The person reporting
this, had Thunderbird "repair" the .sbd and after that, the
shadow copy attempt started working again.

The complexity of the thing bothers me a bit. anybody could hit
the poor thing with a hammer, but you have to gather up the guts in
a bucket afterwards.

If Thunderbird is to be filled with "limitless wonders" as it is,
constantly changing and surprising us, maybe it needs

   thunderbird.exe --shutdown

added to the repertoire so that we make the application responsible
for our clean getaways.

I think the idea Andy posted, is pretty close, but I have to
set that up somewhere and play with it a bit, to make sure the
thing that has the "Write" compose window open, is the one being
hit and not the ContentProc. On Linux, you would have a PPID to work
with. My Windows tools are kinda divided on whether the platform has
a PPID (Parent Process ID). I don't see such a column choice in
Task Manager. I expect Microsoft isn't putting that in Task Manager,
to make it harder for us to kill MSEdge :-)

Now, this was a bit humorous. Points given for using a small mallet
and multiple whacks.

https://www.infopackets.com/news/10237/how-fix-gracefully-close-thunderbird-using-batch-script

   "You can use the following batch script to gracefully close 10 Thunderbird windows, then forcefully close it:

    @echo off

    for /l %%x in (1, 1, 10) do (
      rem echo Loop iteration count %%x
      taskkill /im thunderbird.exe       # The author of it, must be getting the "Write:" to close without saving ???
    )

    taskkill /f /im thunderbird.exe

I have a suspicion that would race as given, and maybe a few sleep(1)
should be put in there. You can never be too careful when working
with mallets.

   Paul

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#16907

On 2025/6/9 5:39:15, Paul wrote:
> On Mon, 6/9/2025 12:03 AM, NFN Smith wrote:
>> J. P. Gilliver wrote:
>>> On 2025/6/7 17:10:47, NFN Smith wrote:
>>>> pablito wrote:
>>>>> Is it possible to configure TB to do an automatic backup at a certain time ?
>>>>> TNX
>>>>
>>>> Not within Thunderbird.  For that, the best bet is with some sort of external tool that supports scheduling.
>>>
>>> (Would be a good thing for the dev.s to add - especially to avoid the "running" aspect, and for those less savvy who don't know about things like %APPDATA%.)
>>>
>>
>> That would be nice, but I think that's one of the many things that won't appear in Thunderbird unless it first appears in Firefox.

You're probably right, but that means it's unlikely, as backing up 
Firefox is something fewer people are likely to think of doing. (Yes, 
there are things - passwords and lots of settings, and open tabs, but 
generally, email is something people are _more_ likely to think of 
backing up. [For that matter, a "backup" option within TB - ideally 
schedulable! - would be the obvious if the developers are listening …])>>
>> In any case, the rule of thumb is that whether you're working in Thunderbird or Firefox (or for that matter, any other Mozilla-derived projects), it's always a good idea to shut down the app before you tinker with data inside a profile.

Indeed.>>
>> I've always been annoyed with locating profiles in %APPDATA% (or in Linux, $HOME/thunderbird or in MacOS, ~/Library/Thunderbird, all hidden folders), although I get the rationale that because that's all data that's intended to be interacted with through the relevant application, rather than directly. However, with Mozilla apps, there reasons to tinker with profile data, although something to go about carefully.

Agreed.>>
>>>> If you're working in Windows, what you want to get backed up is the contents of %APPDATA%\Thunderbird.  You don't have to copy to a different drive, just another location locally, although it's a good idea to make sure that Thunderbird is closed when you do it, so that you're not trying to make backups of open files.
[]
>> For what it's worth, I use Duplicati for backups of all of my platforms, Windows, Linux and MacOS, where they run late at night (when I'm not at the computer) off the appropriate schedulers. For Linux and Mac, I don't use them frequently enough that I normally leave applications open, but on Windows, I sometimes will leave an app (whether Thunderbird, Firefox or most likely, Seamonkey) open overnight, and I have never seen any issues with running a scheduled backup against an open profile.  By contrast, there are other applications, where if I happen to have them open when Duplicati runs, I get warning messages about files that are open (usually status files) and where those files don't get backed up. But I don't think I've seen any warnings about open files with any Mozilla apps.

The trouble with any automatic backup is I _do_ tend to leave my email 
app. open.[]
> If Thunderbird is to be filled with "limitless wonders" as it is,
> constantly changing and surprising us, maybe it needs
> 
>     thunderbird.exe --shutdown
> 
> added to the repertoire so that we make the application responsible
> for our clean getaways.

Yes, that would seem an obvious - though as you say, NGTH (not going to 
happen). Or, even better, a "--backup <parameter>" option (where 
<parameter> is an optional location, or even [.zip for example] file).[]
> I have a suspicion that would race as given, and maybe a few sleep(1)
> should be put in there. You can never be too careful when working
> with mallets.

(-:>
>     Paul
> 
[Compared to Turnpike, I'm finding huge numbers of blank lines - 
_before_ my .sig - are appearing when I reply, or post a followup, in 
TB. Any idea what's causing them? (This post is an example.)]

-- 
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf


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#16910

On Mon, 6/9/2025 6:52 AM, J. P. Gilliver wrote:

>>
> [Compared to Turnpike, I'm finding huge numbers of blank lines - _before_ my .sig - are appearing when I reply, or post a followup, in TB. Any idea what's causing them? (This post is an example.)]
> 

You can pop the MID of your message (this whole string)

   <1026edn$fj3g$5@dont-email.me>

into   http://al.howardknight.net/   and
see how many blank lines are there. That is in case there
is some difference caused by your newsreader itself.

I don't see anything in your post that is concerning.

   https://al.howardknight.net/?STYPE=msgid&MSGI=%3C1026edn%24fj3g%245%40dont-email.me%3E

If you're curious about these things, you can also look at any MBOX that is
relevant, and you should notice some small number of blank lines between
posts, and the RFCs may be able to explain where and why the sum total of
those are present. In this example, I'm finding one blank line, but I've
seen as many as four lines.

************************* MBOX sample of area between posts *********************
My array is initialized to 0xFF by erasing the Flash sectors where it is
saved in non-volatile way. When a new entry is generated, the struct is
written to the Flash.
                                   <=== One blank line at end of post.
From - Fri Nov 17 22:17:58 2023
X-Mozilla-Status: 0001             <=== These lines added by Thunderbird or Seamonkey
X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000        <=== as posts are added to the MBOX (via offline sync)
************************* MBOX sample of area between posts *********************

I have seen plenty of blank lines added while I'm composing a post, and
I try my best to clean that up before clicking Send. I would have to shoot
video of the screen, to try to catch what is going on to make them. I
don't think you are imagining things. Maybe it's something that
happens when I'm editing.

This is an example of making a screen recording. in Linux, it is "X11grab",
in Windows it is "GDIgrab". On the Linux side, for the newer Wayland/Weston,
the ffmpeg team will have to add another grab to work with that. Firefox
already has three options for working under Linux with the various options now.
This means that occasionally in Linux, the "X11grab" might not work.
In this example, the quality setting of "1" is top quality or minimal compression.
Using H264 provides tremendous compression, so the file generation rate won't be
all that high (compared to storing frames as .bmp which is lossless but wasteful).

ffmpeg.exe -framerate 30 -f gdigrab -i desktop -q:v 1 -vcodec h264 out.mp4

This is taking one frame a second and storing as a series of BMP files.

ffmpeg.exe -framerate 1 -f gdigrab -i desktop -f image2 L:\TEMP\a%05d.bmp

   Paul

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#16879

On Sat, 6/7/2025 12:10 PM, NFN Smith wrote:
> pablito wrote:
>> Is it possible to configure TB to do an automatic backup at a certain time ?
>> TNX
> 
> Not within Thunderbird.  For that, the best bet is with some sort of external tool that supports scheduling.
> 
> If you're working in Windows, what you want to get backed up is the contents of %APPDATA%\Thunderbird.  You don't have to copy to a different drive, just another location locally, although it's a good idea to make sure that Thunderbird is closed when you do it, so that you're not trying to make backups of open files.
> 
> Smith
> 

You can use a ZIP utility, to ZIP up the profile when Thunderbird is exited.
This is an example of my last backup.

Name: 4zqwo50y.default.May27.2025.7z
Size: 325,790,045 bytes (310 MiB)
SHA256: BEE9748E95ED191720651B2B59A2D61A15D641CDD9AE9BCA61FC5FF7644CC039

The size of the profile folder right now is 2,218,192,165 bytes.
The savings are about a factor of six or so.

Using 7ZIP, I can even make a TAR file of the folder.
The format doesn't have to be compressed. The resulting output
file    4zqwo50y.default.tar   would be as big as the
actual folder.

Locating the "profiles.ini" and making sure it belongs to Thunderbird,
can help you find the profile folder. The profile folders are in the same area.
I can use Agent Ransack to zero in on the location.

   %APPDATA%\Roaming\Thunderbird\profiles.ini       <=== found the marker, path says Thunderbird.
   %APPDATA%\Roaming\Thunderbird\profiles\          <=== folder with the profiles, the largest folder
                                                         is likely to be the "working" profile.

  Paul


   Paul

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#16876

On 6/7/2025 3:23 AM, pablito wrote:
> Is it possible to configure TB to do an automatic backup at a certain time ?
> TNX

Why only Thunderbird?  Should you not backup your entire system?  Do you
not have critical data files that you must preserve?

I backup every week.  See my
<http://www.rossde.com/computer/computer_backup.html>.  Yes, it takes
time; and you should do it only when nothing else is happening.

-- 
David E. Ross
<http://www.rossde.com/>

President Trump wants all Palestinians to leave Gaza and
relocate elsewhere.  How many will he accept to relocate
in the United States?

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#16880

On 6/7/25 6:23 AM, pablito wrote:
> Is it possible to configure TB to do an automatic backup at a certain time ?
> TNX
As for backup, as others have said, a simple batch file will suffice for TB.
Then if you get one working the way you want it, just put it in the scheduler.

You could maybe go as far as killing TB as part of that batch file?
     taskkill /IM "thunderbird.exe" /F

-- 
Linux Mint 22.1,  Thunderbird 128.11.0esr,  Mozilla Firefox 139.0.1
     Alan K.

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#16882

On 2025-06-07 22:38, Alan K. wrote:
> On 6/7/25 6:23 AM, pablito wrote:
>> Is it possible to configure TB to do an automatic backup at a certain 
>> time ?
>> TNX
> As for backup, as others have said, a simple batch file will suffice for 
> TB.
> Then if you get one working the way you want it, just put it in the 
> scheduler.
> 
> You could maybe go as far as killing TB as part of that batch file?
>      taskkill /IM "thunderbird.exe" /F

Careful. He could be composing an email and it be destroyed.

-- 
Cheers, Carlos.

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#16883

On Sat, 6/7/2025 6:10 PM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
> On 2025-06-07 22:38, Alan K. wrote:
>> On 6/7/25 6:23 AM, pablito wrote:
>>> Is it possible to configure TB to do an automatic backup at a certain time ?
>>> TNX
>> As for backup, as others have said, a simple batch file will suffice for TB.
>> Then if you get one working the way you want it, just put it in the scheduler.
>>
>> You could maybe go as far as killing TB as part of that batch file?
>>      taskkill /IM "thunderbird.exe" /F
> 
> Careful. He could be composing an email and it be destroyed.
> 

Yes.

Don't use the /F unless there is a way of determining draft windows
are not open.

I tested with Notepad.exe , to see what happens if there
are edits in a window about to be lost. If you do this

   taskkill /IM "notepad.exe"

then it will ask whether you want to save the changes.

If you do this

   taskkill /IM "notepad.exe" /F

the changes are lost. Other files may not get
put away properly. The database journal files will be
left behind.

That's the thing about graceful changes, it gives a signal handler
an opportunity to "clean up". And that behavior is not convenient
to deal with. The programs need an option to "save my changes
in a temp file", to automate a graceful exit.

   Paul

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#16884

On 6/7/25 6:20 PM, Paul wrote:
> I tested with Notepad.exe , to see what happens if there
> are edits in a window about to be lost. If you do this
> 
>     taskkill /IM "notepad.exe"
> 
> then it will ask whether you want to save the changes.
That's better.   (oops, missed the /F flag)

-- 
Linux Mint 22.1,  Thunderbird 128.11.0esr,  Mozilla Firefox 139.0.1
     Alan K.

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#16886

Paul wrote:

> Carlos E.R. wrote:
>>> Alan K. wrote:
>>
>>> You could maybe go as far as killing TB as part of that batch file?
>>>       taskkill /IM "thunderbird.exe" /F
>>
>> Careful. He could be composing an email and it be destroyed.
> 
> Yes.
> Don't use the /F unless there is a way of determining draft windows
> are not open.
>

untested suggestion ...

	taskkill /IM "thunderbird.exe" /F /FI "WINDOWTITLE ne Write:*"

translate "Write:*" according to language

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#16887

On Sat, 6/7/2025 11:21 PM, Andy Burns wrote:
> Paul wrote:
> 
>> Carlos E.R. wrote:
>>>> Alan K. wrote:
>>>
>>>> You could maybe go as far as killing TB as part of that batch file?
>>>>       taskkill /IM "thunderbird.exe" /F
>>>
>>> Careful. He could be composing an email and it be destroyed.
>>
>> Yes.
>> Don't use the /F unless there is a way of determining draft windows
>> are not open.
>>
> 
> untested suggestion ...
> 
>     taskkill /IM "thunderbird.exe" /F /FI "WINDOWTITLE ne Write:*"
> 
> translate "Write:*" according to language
> 

That's a good catch. I didn't check for Window filters.

I've got a 128.11 ESR on the other machine, and it
has two Thunderbird processes. One is unadorned
(the parent). The second is a ContentProc, presumably
for an HTML:JS purpose. (When Firefox runs, it has
more flavours of these things. Sysinternals Process Explorer,
holding your mouse over a process, shows the arguments.)

If I test this:

   TASKKILL /IM msedge.exe

that seems to attempt to kill the five msedge.exe processes
in some random order. Things like contentProc in a case like
that, are re-forked, so the house of cards rebuilds itself.
To kill MSEdge cleanly, you can use Sysinternals Process Explorer
to identify the parent, and taking a whack at that usually works.

In the case of Thunderbird, which process will it attack first,
and which process would "own" the "Write:*" window ?

I would almost have to back up the profile and start hammering
at it, to see if a useful pattern emerges :-)

   Paul

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