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CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS

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  CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS  duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> - 2015-08-02 11:11 -0500
    Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS Davej <galt_57@hotmail.com> - 2015-08-02 09:15 -0700
      Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS Christopher A. Lee <c.lee@fairpoint.net> - 2015-08-02 12:21 -0500
      Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> - 2015-08-02 16:34 -0500
        Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS nature bats last <seqklogw@gmail.com> - 2015-08-02 18:16 -0700
          Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> - 2015-08-03 16:56 -0500
            Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS nature bats last <seqklogw@gmail.com> - 2015-08-03 16:24 -0700
              Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> - 2015-08-05 14:33 -0500
    YOU CANNOT BE A REPUBLICAN AND A CHRISTIAN Paul <papa_fox@cybertown.com> - 2015-08-02 11:11 -0700
      Re: YOU CANNOT BE A REPUBLICAN AND A CHRISTIAN bilgat@m.nu - 2015-08-02 16:09 -0500
    Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS Malcolm McMahon <malcolm.mc74@googlemail.com> - 2015-08-04 03:15 -0700
      Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS Jeanne Douglas <hlwdjsd2@NOSPAMgmail.com> - 2015-08-04 03:42 -0700
        Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS Paul <papa_fox@cybertown.com> - 2015-08-04 08:54 -0700
        Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS "Alex W." <ingilt@yahoo.co.uk> - 2015-08-05 13:28 +0200
      Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS Kurt Kurt <passerby31416@gmail.com> - 2015-08-05 10:49 -0700
        Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS Malcolm McMahon <malcolm.mc74@googlemail.com> - 2015-08-06 03:59 -0700
          Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS "Alex W." <ingilt@yahoo.co.uk> - 2015-08-06 14:06 +0200
            Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS Malcolm McMahon <malcolm.mc74@googlemail.com> - 2015-08-06 07:01 -0700
              Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS Christopher A. Lee <c.lee@fairpoint.net> - 2015-08-06 11:04 -0500
              Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS "Alex W." <ingilt@yahoo.co.uk> - 2015-08-06 18:52 +0200
                Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS Jeanne Douglas <hlwdjsd2@NOSPAMgmail.com> - 2015-08-06 17:59 -0700
                  Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS "Alex W." <ingilt@yahoo.co.uk> - 2015-08-07 10:37 +0200
    Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS default <default@defaulter.net> - 2015-08-04 09:03 -0400
    Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS Wexford Eire <wexford.eire.1798@gmail.com> - 2015-08-05 07:03 -0700
      Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS "Alex W." <ingilt@yahoo.co.uk> - 2015-08-05 18:56 +0200
      Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS nature bats last <seqklogw@gmail.com> - 2015-08-05 10:40 -0700
        Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS Wexford Eire <wexford.eire.1798@gmail.com> - 2015-08-05 20:57 -0700
      Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> - 2015-08-05 14:36 -0500
        Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS Wexford Eire <wexford.eire.1798@gmail.com> - 2015-08-05 21:00 -0700
          Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> - 2015-08-07 17:19 -0500
            Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS "Syd M." <pauldavidwright@yahoo.com> - 2015-08-07 15:27 -0700
        Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS Wexford Eire <wexford.eire.1798@gmail.com> - 2015-08-06 08:52 -0700
          Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS nature bats last <seqklogw@gmail.com> - 2015-08-06 11:10 -0700
            Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS "Alex W." <ingilt@yahoo.co.uk> - 2015-08-07 10:36 +0200
          Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> - 2015-08-07 17:21 -0500
            Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS David Harmon <source@netcom.com> - 2015-08-10 17:02 -0700
              Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> - 2015-08-11 13:31 -0500
    Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS The Chief Castrator Of The Jews <Codebreaker@bigsecret.com> - 2015-08-05 10:21 -0700
      Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS WeHang FagZ <macabbeus@gmail.com> - 2015-08-05 11:42 -0700
      Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> - 2015-08-05 14:39 -0500
        Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS Woza Africa <kolwezzi@astromail.com> - 2015-08-05 12:57 -0700
          Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> - 2015-08-07 17:23 -0500
        Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS Wexford Eire <wexford.eire.1798@gmail.com> - 2015-08-05 21:03 -0700
          Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> - 2015-08-07 17:25 -0500
        Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS nature bats last <seqklogw@gmail.com> - 2015-08-06 11:05 -0700
          Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> - 2015-08-07 17:26 -0500
            Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS "Syd M." <pauldavidwright@yahoo.com> - 2015-08-07 15:29 -0700
            Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS nature bats last <seqklogw@gmail.com> - 2015-08-07 16:17 -0700
              Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> - 2015-08-08 13:46 -0500
                Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS "Syd M." <pauldavidwright@yahoo.com> - 2015-08-08 13:24 -0700
                Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS nature bats last <seqklogw@gmail.com> - 2015-08-08 15:36 -0700
                  Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> - 2015-08-09 10:09 -0500
                    Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS nature bats last <seqklogw@gmail.com> - 2015-08-09 12:06 -0700
                      Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> - 2015-08-11 13:08 -0500
                        Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS nature bats last <seqklogw@gmail.com> - 2015-08-11 12:44 -0700
                          Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS duke <duckgumbo32@cox.net> - 2015-08-15 12:15 -0500
                            Re: CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS nature bats last <seqklogw@gmail.com> - 2015-08-15 15:34 -0700

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#1951869 — CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS

CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS 

This is very interesting and we all need to read it from start to finish.  And
send it on to everyone.  Maybe this is why our  Muslims are so quiet and not
speaking out about any atrocities.  

Can a good Muslim be a good American or a good Canadian ? 
   
This question was forwarded to a friend who worked in Saudi Arabia for 20 years.
The following is his reply: 
   
Theologically - no. Because his allegiance is to Allah, The moon god of Arabia.
Religiously - no. Because no other religion is accepted by His Allah except
Islam. (Quran,2:256)(Koran)   
    
Scripturally - no. Because his allegiance is to the five Pillars of Islam and
the Quran.
  
Geographically - no. Because his allegiance is to Mecca, to which he turns in
prayer five times a day. 
   
Socially - no. Because his allegiance to Islam forbids him to make friends with
Christians or Jews. 
   
Politically - no. Because he must submit to the mullahs (spiritual leaders), who
teach annihilation of Israel and destruction of America, the great Satan. 
   
Domestically - no. Because he is instructed to marry four Women and beat and
scourge his wife when she disobeys him. (Quran 4:34 ) 
   
Intellectually - no. Because he cannot accept the American Constitution since it
is based on Biblical principles and he believes the Bible to be corrupt. 
   
Philosophically - no. Because Islam, Muhammad, and the Quran do not allow
freedom of religion and expression. Democracy and Islam cannot co-exist. Every
Muslim government is either dictatorial or  autocratic.   
    
Spiritually - no. Because when we declare 'one nation under God,' The
Christian's God is loving and kind, while Allah is NEVER referred to as Heavenly
father, nor is he ever called love in the Quran's 99 excellent names.   
    
Therefore, after much study and deliberation... Perhaps we should be very
suspicious of ALL MUSLIMS in this country. They obviously cannot be both 'good'
Muslims and 'good' Americans. Call it what you wish it's still the truth. You
had better believe it. The more who understand this, the better it will be for
our country and our future. 
       
The religious war is bigger than we know or understand! 
   
  Footnote: The Muslims have said they will destroy us from within.  SO FREEDOM
IS NOT FREE.     
THE UNITED STATES MARINES WANT THIS TO ROLL ALL OVER THE U.S. 

the dukester, American-American

*****
"The Mass is the most perfect form of Prayer."
Pope Paul VI
*****

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#1951873

On Sunday, August 2, 2015 at 11:11:45 AM UTC-5, duke wrote:
> CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS 
> 

Why don't you go ask Bill Donohue?

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#1951924

On Sun, 2 Aug 2015 09:15:53 -0700 (PDT), Davej <galt_57@hotmail.com>
wrote:

>On Sunday, August 2, 2015 at 11:11:45 AM UTC-5, duke wrote:
>> CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS 
>
>Why don't you go ask Bill Donohue?

Far too many Christians can't.

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#1952004

On Sun, 2 Aug 2015 09:15:53 -0700 (PDT), Davej <galt_57@hotmail.com> wrote:

>On Sunday, August 2, 2015 at 11:11:45 AM UTC-5, duke wrote:
>> CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS 
>> 
>
>Why don't you go ask Bill Donohue?

He's not a muslim.  He's a Roman Catholic.

the dukester, American-American

*****
"The Mass is the most perfect form of Prayer."
Pope Paul VI
*****

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#1952153

On Sunday, August 2, 2015 at 2:34:39 PM UTC-7, duke wrote:
> On Sun, 2 Aug 2015 09:15:53 -0700 (PDT), Davej <galt_57@hotmail.com> wrote:
> 
> >On Sunday, August 2, 2015 at 11:11:45 AM UTC-5, duke wrote:
> >> CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS 
> >> 
> >


.> >Why don't you go ask Bill Donohue?

.> He's not a muslim.  He's a Roman Catholic.

WHOOOOSH!


> the dukester, American-American

Also Plagiarist-American

-- http://beforeitsnews.com/alternative/2015/03/can-a-good-muslim-be-a-good-american-or-a-good-canadian-3120096.html


Seth

> 
> *****
> "The Mass is the most perfect form of Prayer."
> Pope Paul VI
> *****

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#1952591

On Sun, 2 Aug 2015 18:16:00 -0700 (PDT), nature bats last <seqklogw@gmail.com>
wrote:

>On Sunday, August 2, 2015 at 2:34:39 PM UTC-7, duke wrote:
>> On Sun, 2 Aug 2015 09:15:53 -0700 (PDT), Davej <galt_57@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> >On Sunday, August 2, 2015 at 11:11:45 AM UTC-5, duke wrote:
>> >> CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS 

>.> >Why don't you go ask Bill Donohue?

He's a Christian.

>.> He's not a muslim.  He's a Roman Catholic.
>WHOOOOSH!

Haahaahaa.

the dukester, American-American

*****
"The Mass is the most perfect form of Prayer."
Pope Paul VI
*****

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#1952611

On Monday, August 3, 2015 at 2:56:01 PM UTC-7, duke wrote:
> On Sun, 2 Aug 2015 18:16:00 -0700 (PDT), nature bats last <seqklogw@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> 
> >On Sunday, August 2, 2015 at 2:34:39 PM UTC-7, duke wrote:
> >> On Sun, 2 Aug 2015 09:15:53 -0700 (PDT), Davej <galt_57@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >> 
> >> >On Sunday, August 2, 2015 at 11:11:45 AM UTC-5, duke wrote:
> >> >> CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS 
> 
> >.> >Why don't you go ask Bill Donohue?
> 
> He's a Christian.
> 
> >.> He's not a muslim.  He's a Roman Catholic.
> >WHOOOOSH!
> 
> Haahaahaa.
> 
> the dukester, American-American
> 
> *****
> "The Mass is the most perfect form of Prayer."
> Pope Paul VI
> *****

I must admit, your ability to miss the point
is impressive.

Or to pretend to be missing the point...



Seth

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#1953579

On Mon, 3 Aug 2015 16:24:26 -0700 (PDT), nature bats last <seqklogw@gmail.com>
wrote:

>On Monday, August 3, 2015 at 2:56:01 PM UTC-7, duke wrote:
>> On Sun, 2 Aug 2015 18:16:00 -0700 (PDT), nature bats last <seqklogw@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> 
>> >On Sunday, August 2, 2015 at 2:34:39 PM UTC-7, duke wrote:
>> >> On Sun, 2 Aug 2015 09:15:53 -0700 (PDT), Davej <galt_57@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> >> 
>> >> >On Sunday, August 2, 2015 at 11:11:45 AM UTC-5, duke wrote:
>> >> >> CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS 
>> 
>> >.> >Why don't you go ask Bill Donohue?
>> 
>> He's a Christian.
>> 
>> >.> He's not a muslim.  He's a Roman Catholic.
>> >WHOOOOSH!
>> 
>> Haahaahaa.
>> 
>> the dukester, American-American
>> 
>> *****
>> "The Mass is the most perfect form of Prayer."
>> Pope Paul VI
>> *****
>
>I must admit, your ability to miss the point
>is impressive.
>
>Or to pretend to be missing the point...

It's your pencil, but the point is broken.

>Seth

the dukester, American-American

*****
"The Mass is the most perfect form of Prayer."
Pope Paul VI
*****

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#1951944 — YOU CANNOT BE A REPUBLICAN AND A CHRISTIAN

On Sunday, August 2, 2015 at 12:11:45 PM UTC-4, duke wrote:
> CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS 


YOU CANNOT BE A REPUBLICAN AND A CHRISTIAN

The modern Republican Party's hell-bent embodiment of nearly everything Christ warned against has become so serious that we have to call it out.

No one in American life today proclaims their allegiance to Christ more conspicuously than those who have rejected most of what Christ actually taught: Republicans. The modern Republican Party's hell-bent embodiment of nearly everything Christ warned against has become so serious that we have to call it out. You cannot be a Republican and a Christian.

Of course, it wasn't always this way. There was a time, maybe even as recently as the early 1990s, when to support the Republican Party was not altogether evil. And further back, of course, things were even more different. As Garrison Keillor once reminisced, Republicans used to be:

moderate, business-minded civic boosters and unapologetic patriots who were the linchpins and bulwarks of small towns across the Midwest, the enthusiastic backers of projects for the civic good, usually in partnership with the town liberals (the librarian, the bar owner, a lawyer or two, the Methodist minister, the banker's wife). These Republicans were uniters and diehard optimists and persons of compassionate conscience, inveterate doers of good deeds.

Even today, there are probably some Republicans who still fit that description. The problem is that they are for all practical purposes invisible in American public life, and if their party found out about them, they would be hounded out of it. If they dared to compete in the lunatic talent show of Republican primary politics, they wouldn't stand a chance.

The reason that you cannot be a Republican and a Christian is that today's Republican Party doesn't appear to stand for anything but what Christ strenuously rejected, like organized violence, self-righteous division, and greed. To say the least, this is hard to square with Christ's teachings and example. I am not a Christian, and I'm certainly no Biblical scholar, but you don't have to be. It's not hard to tell the difference between who is and isn't really a Christian, and Republicans, you're not.


- In Christ, we're talking about someone who said turn the other cheek (Matthew 5:39) and that all those who take the sword will perish with the sword (Matthew 26:52).

- We're talking about someone who warned "judge not, that ye be not judged" (Matthew 7:1) and urged people not to look for a mote in someone else's eye while they have a beam stuck in their own (Matthew 7:3).

- We're talking about someone who said, "woe unto you that are rich!" (Luke 6:24) and, "It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God." (Mark 10:25) Did Jesus ever have anything good to say about people who hoard wealth?


I know that many of Christ's teachings are open to interpretation, but so many of the people who make a point of asking "What would Jesus do?" seem to have no interest at all in the most likely answers. It's ironic that they have sometimes been referred to as "values voters," since their values are so devoid of value, at least from the Christian point of view. Their main interest in Christianity seems to be an expectation of being rewarded in the afterlife despite bad behavior while alive. And as for their leaders, beware wolves in sheep's clothing (Matthew 7:15). Most atheists and agnostics are truer Christians than this crew.

The impossibility of squaring what Christ actually taught with the words and deeds of today's Republican so-called Christians is what makes this all fair game. These people are hypocrites. These people conveniently ignore most of what Christ actually said. Christ would scold and hold these people accountable for their reckless and downright evil behavior--and many of them, given a chance, would re-crucify Christ if he came back today and taught the still-radical ideas he apparently advocated.

You can't have it both ways. You have to choose, because, today, you cannot be both a Republican and a Christian.

http://www.alternet.org/you-cannot-be-republican-and-christian

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#1951976 — Re: YOU CANNOT BE A REPUBLICAN AND A CHRISTIAN

On Sun, 2 Aug 2015 11:11:28 -0700 (PDT), Paul <papa_fox@cybertown.com>
wrote:

>On Sunday, August 2, 2015 at 12:11:45 PM UTC-4, duke wrote:
>> CAN MUSLIMS BE GOOD AMERICANS OR GOOD CANADIANS 
>
>
>YOU CANNOT BE A REPUBLICAN AND A CHRISTIAN
>

you can not be an idiot UNLESS you are a christian

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#1952852

On Sunday, 2 August 2015 17:11:45 UTC+1, duke  wrote:

As I understand it the saner versions of Islam have quite a lot to say about living in non-Muslim countries, and respecting the local laws etc..

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#1952863

In article <b0f698e2-7d7a-4195-aa4e-b46dc4ae166e@googlegroups.com>,
 Malcolm McMahon <malcolm.mc74@googlemail.com> wrote:

> On Sunday, 2 August 2015 17:11:45 UTC+1, duke  wrote:
> 
> As I understand it the saner versions of Islam have quite a lot to say about 
> living in non-Muslim countries, and respecting the local laws etc..


We have a couple of million good American Muslims living average 
American lives, whether working class, middle class, or something 
richer. They're exposed to the entire crazy American culture and they 
are part of it. I assume things are the same in Canada.

-- 

JD

Išve officially given up trying to find the bottom 
of the barrel that is Republican depravity.--Jidyom 
Rosario, Addicting Info

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#1952916

On Tuesday, August 4, 2015 at 6:42:32 AM UTC-4, Jeanne Douglas wrote:
> In article <b0f698e2-7d7a-4195-aa4e-b46dc4ae166e@googlegroups.com>,
>  Malcolm McMahon <malcolm.mc74@googlemail.com> wrote:
> 
> > On Sunday, 2 August 2015 17:11:45 UTC+1, duke  wrote:
> > 
> > As I understand it the saner versions of Islam have quite a lot to say about 
> > living in non-Muslim countries, and respecting the local laws etc..
> 
> 
> We have a couple of million good American Muslims living average 
> American lives, whether working class, middle class, or something 
> richer. They're exposed to the entire crazy American culture and they 
> are part of it. I assume things are the same in Canada.
> 


Millions, yes, MILLION OF AMERICAN MUSLIMS...





... killed absolutely nobody today.

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#1953339

On 04/08/2015 12:42, Jeanne Douglas wrote:
> In article <b0f698e2-7d7a-4195-aa4e-b46dc4ae166e@googlegroups.com>,
>   Malcolm McMahon <malcolm.mc74@googlemail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Sunday, 2 August 2015 17:11:45 UTC+1, duke  wrote:
>>
>> As I understand it the saner versions of Islam have quite a lot to say about
>> living in non-Muslim countries, and respecting the local laws etc..
>
>
> We have a couple of million good American Muslims living average
> American lives, whether working class, middle class, or something
> richer. They're exposed to the entire crazy American culture and they
> are part of it. I assume things are the same in Canada.
>

Do note that the majority of Muslims in the US are American born and bred.

Note also that the majority of Arab-Americans are NOT Muslim but 
Christians!  Only a quarter of American Muslims are ethnically Arab, 
whereas a full third are African-Americans.

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#1953489

What saner versions of Islam is that? 

You just made that up, because it sounds good to you.

On Tuesday, August 4, 2015 at 6:15:38 AM UTC-4, Malcolm McMahon wrote:
> On Sunday, 2 August 2015 17:11:45 UTC+1, duke  wrote:
> 
> As I understand it the saner versions of Islam have quite a lot to say about living in non-Muslim countries, and respecting the local laws etc..

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#1954013

On Wednesday, 5 August 2015 18:49:42 UTC+1, Kurt Kurt  wrote:
> What saner versions of Islam is that? 
> 

There are as many versions of Islam as there are Muslims, even more so that with Christianity because there's no official authority for Islam. No Magesterium.

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#1954031

On 06/08/2015 12:59, Malcolm McMahon wrote:
> On Wednesday, 5 August 2015 18:49:42 UTC+1, Kurt Kurt  wrote:
>> What saner versions of Islam is that?
>>
>
> There are as many versions of Islam as there are Muslims, even more so that with Christianity because there's no official authority for Islam. No Magesterium.
>

Plus a long-standing tradition of personal religious authority: 
individual mullahs interpreting the Q'ran and Haddith, and accumulating 
adherents depending on how persuasive they are.

Also an equally long tradition which separates Muslims by country even 
when they are of the same denomination.  Turkish sunnis worship 
differently and have different practices from Iraqi sunnis or American 
sunnis.

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#1954073

On Thursday, 6 August 2015 13:06:58 UTC+1, Alex W.  wrote:
> On 06/08/2015 12:59, Malcolm McMahon wrote:
> > On Wednesday, 5 August 2015 18:49:42 UTC+1, Kurt Kurt  wrote:
> >> What saner versions of Islam is that?
> >>
> >
> > There are as many versions of Islam as there are Muslims, even more so that with Christianity because there's no official authority for Islam. No Magesterium.
> >
> 
> Plus a long-standing tradition of personal religious authority: 
> individual mullahs interpreting the Q'ran and Haddith, and accumulating 
> adherents depending on how persuasive they are.
> 
> Also an equally long tradition which separates Muslims by country even 
> when they are of the same denomination.  Turkish sunnis worship 
> differently and have different practices from Iraqi sunnis or American 
> sunnis.

Exactly. Which it's also why when people say that ISIS are "not true Muslims" they show how little they are aware of this diversity. There is no "true Islam".

"True Islam" just means the version the speaker believes in.

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#1954115

On Thu, 6 Aug 2015 07:01:24 -0700 (PDT), Malcolm McMahon
<malcolm.mc74@googlemail.com> wrote:

>On Thursday, 6 August 2015 13:06:58 UTC+1, Alex W.  wrote:
>> On 06/08/2015 12:59, Malcolm McMahon wrote:
>> > On Wednesday, 5 August 2015 18:49:42 UTC+1, Kurt Kurt  wrote:
>> >> What saner versions of Islam is that?
>> >>
>> >
>> > There are as many versions of Islam as there are Muslims, even 
>> > more so that with Christianity because there's no official authority 
>> > for Islam. No Magesterium.
>> 
>> Plus a long-standing tradition of personal religious authority: 
>> individual mullahs interpreting the Q'ran and Haddith, and accumulating 
>> adherents depending on how persuasive they are.
>> 
>> Also an equally long tradition which separates Muslims by country even 
>> when they are of the same denomination.  Turkish sunnis worship 
>> differently and have different practices from Iraqi sunnis or American 
>> sunnis.
>
>Exactly. Which it's also why when people say that ISIS are "not true 
>Muslims" they show how little they are aware of this diversity. There 
>is no "true Islam".

And no "true Christianity", either,

>"True Islam" just means the version the speaker believes in.

Likewise pretty well every other religion.

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#1954134

On 06/08/2015 16:01, Malcolm McMahon wrote:
> On Thursday, 6 August 2015 13:06:58 UTC+1, Alex W.  wrote:
>> On 06/08/2015 12:59, Malcolm McMahon wrote:
>>> On Wednesday, 5 August 2015 18:49:42 UTC+1, Kurt Kurt  wrote:
>>>> What saner versions of Islam is that?
>>>>
>>>
>>> There are as many versions of Islam as there are Muslims, even more so that with Christianity because there's no official authority for Islam. No Magesterium.
>>>
>>
>> Plus a long-standing tradition of personal religious authority:
>> individual mullahs interpreting the Q'ran and Haddith, and accumulating
>> adherents depending on how persuasive they are.
>>
>> Also an equally long tradition which separates Muslims by country even
>> when they are of the same denomination.  Turkish sunnis worship
>> differently and have different practices from Iraqi sunnis or American
>> sunnis.
>
> Exactly. Which it's also why when people say that ISIS are "not true Muslims" they show how little they are aware of this diversity. There is no "true Islam".
>
> "True Islam" just means the version the speaker believes in.
>

The amusing part is that in the West, people will generally be aware of 
such divisions within Christianity (and to some extent in Judaism -- 
Hasidim are pretty hard to overlook) and will make accommodation for 
such complexity, at least in principle.  But the same people will 
happily treat Islam as some monolithic uniform faith, the same from 
Turkey to Indonesia to the US.  They will laugh at the suggestion that 
Baptists are the same as Episcopalians but when it is pointed out that 
Wahhabis are massively distinct from Sufis they shrug.

This peculiar blind spot even extends to our elected critters in 
government, which helps explain why we keep landing up to our next in 
every unholy mess bubbling up in the Middle East....

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