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Groups > sci.physics.relativity > #586180
| From | The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> |
|---|---|
| Newsgroups | sci.physics.relativity |
| Subject | Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. |
| Date | 2022-05-30 20:47 -0700 |
| Organization | The Starmaker Organization |
| Message-ID | <62958FBA.7572@ix.netcom.com> (permalink) |
| References | (21 earlier) <59b50b1b-9731-40f7-8405-6077e17f6b6dn@googlegroups.com> <629531A6.39EC@ix.netcom.com> <4793e201-09bd-4e68-95f1-2b5cd6c02e70n@googlegroups.com> <629547CD.14D0@ix.netcom.com> <acdd32b2-f8ea-423e-ac43-8e7f003479c1n@googlegroups.com> |
Paparios wrote:
>
> El lunes, 30 de mayo de 2022 a las 18:40:00 UTC-4, The Starmaker escribió:
> > Paparios wrote:
>
> > > Of course you lie and present not the complete disclaimer (related to the university which hosts the document):
> > >
> > > "The space for this page is provided by Cal Poly Pomona and is subject to its policies. Nevertheless, the opinions expressed here are my own and do not necessarily represent official policy of the University. I take full responsibility for the information presented and will appreciate being informed of errors or inaccuracies".
> > >
> > > This is quite different from your nonsensical stuff
> > another 'detaied oriented' engineer! ...
> >
> > I forgot the copyright notice!
> > ©2001 by A. John Mallinckrodt
> > ajm at cpp.edu
> >
> >
> > Hell, why don't I just post for these 'detaied oriented' mentality
> > beavers the whole website!!!!
> >
>
> And your point being what?
Not 'detailed' enough?
Here is the source code to the page also:
<html><!-- #BeginTemplate "/Templates/basic.dwt" --><!-- DW6 -->
<head>
<!-- #BeginEditable "doctitle" -->
<title>The Twin Paradox - Spacetime diagrams</title>
<!-- #EndEditable -->
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
</head>
<body bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000" link="#990000" vlink="#990000"
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<table width="95%" border="0" cellpadding="4">
<tr>
<td colspan="2" width="100%" nowrap align="left"> <!--
#BeginLibraryItem "/Library/Heading.lbi" --><font face="Verdana, Arial,
Helvetica, sans-serif" size="5" color="#000033">A.
John Mallinckrodt </font><font face="Verdana, Arial,
Helvetica, sans-serif" color="#000033" size="3"><i>Professor
Emeritus of Physics, Cal Poly Pomona</i></font><!-- #EndLibraryItem
--></td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td bgcolor="#003366" width="100" valign="middle"><!--
#BeginEditable "Title" -->
<div align="center"><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica,
sans-serif" color="#FFFFFF" size="4"><b>The <em>so-called
"</em>Twin Paradox" </b></font>
</div>
<!-- #EndEditable --></td>
<td bgcolor="#FFCC99" width="1000" valign="middle"> <!--
#BeginEditable "Remarks" -->
<div align="left"><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica,
sans-serif" size="2">An explanation using spacetime diagrams of how the
<em>so-called</em> "twin paradox" of special relativity is
resolved.</font></div>
<!-- #EndEditable --></td>
</tr>
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<p><strong><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"
size="3">Time dilation: The basis for the
<em><strong>so-called</strong></em> <strong>"twin
paradox"</strong></font> </strong><p><font face="Verdana, Arial,
Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Early in the study of special relativity
students learn about the phenomenon of time dilation, i.e., that
"moving clocks run slow." Those who have properly appreciated
the fact that all motion is relative <em>and</em> who have properly
appreciated that clocks measure the passage of physical (including
<em>biological</em>) time, ought <em>necessarily </em>to experience some
mental discomfort at this result. After all when two observers pass each
other, the prediction is that <em>both</em> will find the
<em>other</em>'s clocks to run slower than their own. This might well
<em>seem</em> to be impossible on its face and, therefore, to invalidate
the entire theory. Nevertheless, a detailed analysis that properly takes
into account two other equally peculiar relativistic effects—the
Lorentz contraction and the relativity of simultaneity—shows that
one can build a perfectly sensible relativistic world in which all
observers agree on the only things that they <em>must</em> agree on
including the details of local events (e.g., what everybody's watches
read in a group picture) and the temporal order of causal sequences
(e.g., which came first, the lightning or the thunder?)</font>
<p><font size="3" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica,
sans-serif"><strong>The statement of the
</strong><em><strong>so-called</strong></em> <strong>"twin
paradox"</strong></font>
<p><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">The
confusion caused by the phenomenon of time dilation has long been
encapsulated in the <em>so-called</em> "twin paradox" stated
as follows*:</font> <blockquote>
<p><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica,
sans-serif">One of a pair of twins (the "traveling twin")
travels to and returns from a very distant destination at a speed
approaching that of light the other (the "Earth-bound twin")
stays home. Since both twins observe the other twin to be moving, both
find that the other is aging less quickly. Thus, upon their reunion,
<em>both</em> twins will expect—<em>and find!—</em>the
<em>other</em> twin to be younger. This result violates the requirements
of a rational world and, therefore, special relativity is
wrong.</font></p>
</blockquote>
<p><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">*
Because much confusion persists to this day about the implications of
the <em>so-called</em> "twin paradox," I hasten to emphasize
<em>unequivocally</em> that the <em>so-called</em> "twin
paradox" is <strong><em>not </em></strong>a paradox, that there is
<em><strong>no</strong></em> controversy about its resolution (as we
will see), and that it does <em><strong>not </strong></em>in any way
cast suspicion on—let alone invalidate—the theory of special
relativity. </font>
<p><font size="3" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica,
sans-serif"><strong>Why there is no paradox </strong></font>
<p><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">The
<em>so-called</em> "twin paradox" is easily resolved by noting
that there <em>is</em> a physically meaningful disinction between the
experiences of the two twins during the trip. The Earth-bound twin
remains in a single constant velocity reference frame the entire time
while the traveling twin must accelerate to turn around and come home.
The acceleration causes the traveling twin to change from one constant
velocity reference frame to another and produces effects that can be
measured <em>locally</em> by the traveling twin in the form of inertial
forces that can knock things over, compress springs, and generally endow
objects with weight. As a result of the fact that their experiences
<em>are</em> different, there is no <em>a priori</em> reason for them to
come to the same conclusion. </font>
<p><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">NB:
The "same conclusion" I refer to here—the one they do
<em>not</em> come to!—is the one referred to in the penultimate
sentence of the statement of the <em>so-called </em>"twin
paradox" above, that the <em>other</em> twin will be found to be
<em>younger</em>. Indeed, it would be intolerable for special relativity
or any other physical theory to predict that utterly incomprehensible
finding. On the other hand, because both twins, in fact, <em>must</em>
agree on what they find, we demand that any successful theory should be
able to <em>account</em> for that finding from either point of
view.</font>
<p><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">As
it turns out, the result is that the <em>traveling twin</em> is younger
upon return than the Earth-bound twin. This is readily understood from
the point of view of the Earth-bound twin who remains at all time in a
single, constant velocity reference frame with respect to which the
traveling twin's clocks are always (except for one instant during the
turnaround) running slow. But how do we understand that conclusion from
the point of view of the traveling twin?</font>
<p><font size="3" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica,
sans-serif"><strong>Spacetime diagrams</strong> </font>
<p><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">One
of the most illuminating ways of understanding the resolution of the
<em>so-called</em> "twin paradox" is by analyzing carefully
drawn, detailed spacetime diagrams for specific choices of trip
distance and velocity. I have done so below for a trip of three
lightyears undertaken at a speed of 3/5 <em>c</em> (giving a
relativistic factor γ = 5/4) in both directions and with a
"turnaround time" of negligible duration. (The approximation
of negligible turnaround time may very well lead to anatomically
unrealistic "g forces" (!) and can be relaxed at the expense
of additional computational complexity, but it makes no qualititative
difference in the result.)</font>
<p><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">In
this case the Earth-bound twin (EBT) finds that it takes the traveling
twin (TT) five years to reach the destination and five years to return
for a total of ten years. During this time the TT's clocks run slow by a
factor of 1/γ = 4/5 so that the TT ages by eight years, four years
on each leg of the journey, and is, therefore, two years younger at the
reunion.</font>
<p><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica,
sans-serif"><em>The view from the reference frame of the
Earth</em></font>
<p><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">The
left panel of the figure below (which you can click on to open a larger
version in a new window), shows the worldlines of the EBT and the TT in
the reference frame of Earth. Note that the TT reaches the destination
at a distance of three lightyears after an elapsed time of five years in
this frame and that the TT has aged only four years at that point. Note
also that the scale of the <em>x</em> and <em>t</em> axes are such that
light travels along lines at a 45 degree angle, i.e., 1 year per light
year, and that the TT's worldlines have a <em>larger</em> slope
(representing a lower speed) of 5/3 years per light year. </font>
<p><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica,
sans-serif">Because the figure is drawn from the frame of reference of
Earth, horizontal lines represent collections of events that occur at
the same time, i.e., "lines of simultaneity" for the EBT. The
figure also, however, includes a few lines of simultaneity in the
reference frame of the TT as shown in gray. Because of the relativity of
simultaneity, these lines are tilted and run from lower left to upper
right during the outbound leg and from lower right to upper left during
the inbound leg. In both cases the slope is the inverse of that of the
TT's worldline, 3/5 years per light year. For instance, note that one of
these lines indicates that at the moment the TT sends the third yearly
signal, the TT would say that the EBT's clock reads 2.4 years as should
be expected since the TT says the EBT's clock is "moving" and,
therefore, running slow. Note finally that there are two lines of
simultaneity linking the turnaround point, one for the outbound leg and
one for the inbound leg. They indicate that the EBT's instant of
simultaneity <em>in the TT's frame</em> jumps quickly from 3.2 years to
6.8 years during the turnaround as the TT moves from one reference frame
to another. </font>
<p><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">
Both the EBT and the TT send light signals to each other at yearly
intervals as shown by the red and blue lines respectively and each
transmission is marked with the number of the year at which it was sent.
Note that the TT receives only the first two signals from the EBT on the
outbound leg and recieves all eight remaining signals on the inbound leg
with the final, tenth, signal received at the moment of the reunion.
Note also that the EBT receives the last of the four outbound signals
(including the fourth at the turnaround point) at year eight and
receives the four inbound signals during only the last two
years.</font>
<p><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica,
sans-serif">Thus, we see that the EBT receives signals at the rate of
one every two years for the first eight years and then at a rate of two
per year for the final two years. This amounts to a total of (1/2)*8 +
(2)*2 = 8 signals received from the TT. On the other hand the TT
receives signals <em>also</em> at the rate of one every two years for
only the first four years and then at a rate of two per year for the
final four years. This amounts to a total of (1/2)*4 + (2)*4 = 10
signals received from the EBT.</font>
<p><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">It
is well worth noting the fact that <em>both</em> twins agree that they
receive signals at a rate of 1/2 per year (low frequency) when those
signals reflect relative motion away from each other and both twins
<em>also</em> agree that they receive signals at a rate of 2 per year
(high frequency) when </font> <font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial,
Helvetica, sans-serif">those signals reflect relative motion toward each
from each other. The difference is that, for the TT, the low and high
frequency signals occupy equal portions of the trip while, for the EBT,
the low frequency signals are observed during 80% of the trip.</font><a
href="twinparadox/twins.jpg" target="_blank"><img
src="twinparadox/twins_small.jpg" width="800" height="640"
border="0"></a>
<p><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica,
sans-serif"><em>The view from the reference frame of the outbound
traveler </em></font>
<p><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">The
right panel of the figure, shows the worldlines of the EBT and the TT in
the outbound reference frame. Note that, in this reference frame, the
reunion takes place 12.5 years after the departure in keeping with the
fact that the EBT's clocks run slow the entire time. The TT, however,
leaves this reference frame at the turnaraound point four years into the
trip when the EBT's clock reads 3.2 years as previously noted. Note
also that the EBT is 2.4 lightyears away at this time, the largest
separation of the trip in this frame, properly reflecting the Lorentz
contraction of the 3 lightyear distance observed in the reference frame
of Earth.</font>
<p><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">On
the inbound leg, the TT moves at a speed of -15/17<em> c</em> as
obtained from the relativistic addition of the speeds -3/5 <em>c</em>
and -3/5 <em>c</em>. During this time the TT's clocks run slow by a
factor of 1/γ = 17/8, which is reflected in the fact that it takes
just over two years for the TT's clock to advance each additional year.
The worldlines for the light signals are again shown along with the
lines of simultaneity for the TT and they confirm every feature
previously noted in the spacetime diagram for the reference frame of
Earth</font>.
<p><font size="3"><strong><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica,
sans-serif">Relationship to the relativistic Doppler effect and another
way to predict the amount of differential aging</font></strong></font>
<p><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">It
is most interesting to note that, <em>no matter what</em> speed is used
for the outbound and inbound legs, the TT will receive signals at a rate
of <em>f</em><sub>out</sub> < <em>f</em><sub>o</sub> (the
transmission frequency) for half the trip and at a rate of
<em>f</em><sub>in</sub> = 1/<em>f</em><sub>out</sub> >
<em>f</em><sub>o</sub> for the other half. Thus, the average frequency
is (<em>f</em><sub>out</sub>+<em>f</em><sub>in</sub>)/2 which is readily
shown to be greater than <em>f</em><sub>o</sub>. This insures that the
TT will <em>receive</em> more signals during the trip then he
<em>sends</em> and will, therefore, expect to find the EBT to be
<em>older</em> at the reunion, in perfect harmony with what the EBT
expects to find.</font>
<p><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica,
sans-serif">Indeed, one can use the relativistic Doppler formula
<em>f</em><sub>out</sub> = <em>f</em><sub>o</sub>
[(1-v/c)/(1+v/c)]<sup>1/2</sup> <em>directly</em> to predict the
relative age differential. For instance, at a speed of 12/13 <em>c</em>,
<em>f</em><sub>out</sub> = <em>f</em><sub>o</sub>
[(1-v/c)/(1+v/c)]<sup>1/2</sup> = (1/5)<em>f</em><sub>o</sub>.
Accordingly, the average frequency received by the TT is
(1/5+5)<em>f</em><sub>o</sub>/2 = (13/5)<em>f</em><sub>o</sub> implying
(correctly) that the EBT will have aged 13/5 as much as the
TT.</font>
<p>
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<p><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"
size="1">©2001
by A. John Mallinckrodt<br>
</font><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"
size="1">ajm
at cpp.edu<br>
<a href="http://www.cpp.edu/%7Eajm">http://www.cpp.edu/~ajm
</a> </font></p>
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<p><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="1">The
space
for this page is provided by <a href="http://www.cpp.edu">Cal
Poly
Pomona</a> and is subject to its policies.
Nevertheless, the opinions expressed here are my own and do not
necessarily
represent official policy of the University. I take full
responsibility
for the information presented and will appreciate being informed
of errors
or inaccuracies.</font></p>
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--
The Starmaker -- To question the unquestionable, ask the unaskable,
to think the unthinkable, mention the unmentionable, say the unsayable,
and challenge
the unchallengeable.
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Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-05-26 21:17 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. "mitchr...@gmail.com" <mitchrae3323@gmail.com> - 2022-05-26 21:19 -0700
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Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. "mitchr...@gmail.com" <mitchrae3323@gmail.com> - 2022-05-28 12:34 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-28 13:18 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2022-05-28 18:03 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-29 09:53 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2022-05-29 12:10 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-29 13:09 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2022-05-29 16:17 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-30 09:00 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2022-05-30 09:25 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-30 09:51 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-30 11:19 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-30 13:20 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-30 14:05 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2022-05-30 14:40 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-30 15:40 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2022-05-30 16:58 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-30 20:47 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Stan Fultoni <fultonistan@gmail.com> - 2022-05-31 00:51 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-31 10:02 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-31 10:24 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-31 07:21 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-31 10:27 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2022-05-31 10:54 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-05-31 11:10 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-31 13:08 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-31 12:52 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-31 13:13 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-31 14:08 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2022-05-31 14:31 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-29 12:18 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-28 23:45 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-29 11:42 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-29 12:51 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. "mitchr...@gmail.com" <mitchrae3323@gmail.com> - 2022-05-29 13:05 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-29 13:22 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Aldo <aldo.mayme.11084@cap.edu.mx> - 2022-05-29 19:45 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. "mitchr...@gmail.com" <mitchrae3323@gmail.com> - 2022-05-29 20:23 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Aldo <aldo.mayme.11084@cap.edu.mx> - 2022-05-29 21:50 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Stan Fultoni <fultonistan@gmail.com> - 2022-05-28 09:38 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-28 10:35 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2022-05-28 11:08 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-28 12:52 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2022-05-28 15:02 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. "mitchr...@gmail.com" <mitchrae3323@gmail.com> - 2022-05-28 15:00 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Stan Fultoni <fultonistan@gmail.com> - 2022-05-28 11:14 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-28 13:00 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Stan Fultoni <fultonistan@gmail.com> - 2022-05-28 13:46 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-28 14:10 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Stan Fultoni <fultonistan@gmail.com> - 2022-05-28 14:49 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-29 09:10 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Stan Fultoni <fultonistan@gmail.com> - 2022-05-29 10:20 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-29 12:42 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Stan Fultoni <fultonistan@gmail.com> - 2022-05-29 14:44 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-30 09:15 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Stan Fultoni <fultonistan@gmail.com> - 2022-05-30 10:01 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-30 13:17 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Stan Fultoni <fultonistan@gmail.com> - 2022-05-30 13:58 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Stan Fultoni <fultonistan@gmail.com> - 2022-05-31 00:47 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2022-05-29 17:10 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Aldo <aldo.mayme.11084@cap.edu.mx> - 2022-05-29 20:03 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-05-29 21:16 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Aldo <aldo.mayme.11084@cap.edu.mx> - 2022-05-29 21:43 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-05-30 02:29 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> - 2022-05-31 12:06 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-31 13:03 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-31 13:43 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Python <python@python.invalid> - 2022-05-31 23:10 +0200
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Al Coe <coeal5136@gmail.com> - 2022-06-02 12:10 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2022-06-02 15:35 -0500
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Al Coe <coeal5136@gmail.com> - 2022-06-02 15:55 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2022-06-02 21:03 -0500
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. patdolan <patdolan@comcast.net> - 2022-06-02 19:07 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2022-06-03 06:04 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-06-03 07:02 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2022-06-03 10:05 -0500
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-06-03 10:50 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Al Coe <coeal5136@gmail.com> - 2022-06-02 19:47 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2022-06-03 10:43 -0500
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Al Coe <coeal5136@gmail.com> - 2022-06-03 08:50 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-06-02 22:43 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-03 07:08 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Al Coe <coeal5136@gmail.com> - 2022-06-03 08:44 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-03 09:06 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Al Coe <coeal5136@gmail.com> - 2022-06-03 11:40 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-03 12:39 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Al Coe <coeal5136@gmail.com> - 2022-06-03 14:37 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-04 07:30 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Al Coe <coeal5136@gmail.com> - 2022-06-04 07:53 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-04 08:54 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2022-06-04 09:14 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-06-04 09:29 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-04 10:12 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-06-04 11:32 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2022-06-04 12:32 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-06-04 14:33 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2022-06-04 15:49 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-06-04 17:18 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Al Coe <coeal5136@gmail.com> - 2022-06-04 09:18 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> - 2022-06-04 12:25 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-04 13:10 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Al Coe <coeal5136@gmail.com> - 2022-06-04 14:00 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> - 2022-06-03 12:08 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-03 13:06 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> - 2022-06-01 14:18 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-02 07:20 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2022-06-02 14:55 -0500
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ken Seto <setoken47@gmail.com> - 2022-06-02 21:19 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-03 07:49 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-03 08:08 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-06-03 10:38 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2022-06-03 10:51 -0500
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-03 09:59 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> - 2022-06-03 11:59 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-03 12:55 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> - 2022-06-04 12:33 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2022-06-03 13:01 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-03 13:47 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2022-06-03 14:27 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-06-03 23:17 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-04 07:26 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2022-06-04 08:50 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-04 10:01 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-06-04 11:17 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-04 12:20 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Al Coe <coeal5136@gmail.com> - 2022-06-04 12:42 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-06-04 14:00 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-04 14:19 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Al Coe <coeal5136@gmail.com> - 2022-06-04 14:37 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-05 07:27 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Al Coe <coeal5136@gmail.com> - 2022-06-05 08:46 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-05 09:04 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Al Coe <coeal5136@gmail.com> - 2022-06-05 09:39 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Dirk Van de moortel <dirkvandemoortel@notmail.com> - 2022-06-05 19:52 +0200
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Al Coe <coeal5136@gmail.com> - 2022-06-05 11:30 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Dirk Van de moortel <dirkvandemoortel@notmail.com> - 2022-06-05 20:47 +0200
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> - 2022-06-08 13:21 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Al Coe <coeal5136@gmail.com> - 2022-06-08 21:30 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> - 2022-06-09 10:57 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Al Coe <coeal5136@gmail.com> - 2022-06-09 12:07 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. nospam@de-ster.demon.nl (J. J. Lodder) - 2022-06-09 14:36 +0200
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-06-09 05:44 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> - 2022-06-09 10:38 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. nospam@de-ster.demon.nl (J. J. Lodder) - 2022-06-09 22:36 +0200
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-06-04 15:12 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-06-04 19:25 -0500
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-06-04 17:40 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-06-04 21:00 -0500
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-06-04 21:13 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-05 07:41 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-06-05 13:14 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2022-06-04 12:48 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-06-05 15:49 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2022-06-05 20:53 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-06-05 23:07 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2022-06-06 13:55 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. "mitchr...@gmail.com" <mitchrae3323@gmail.com> - 2022-06-06 16:53 -0700
Ed Lake's confusions (was: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again.) Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2022-06-04 14:01 -0500
Re: Ed Lake's confusions (was: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again.) Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-04 12:58 -0700
Re: Ed Lake's confusions (was: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again.) "Kevin Aylward" <kevinRemoveandReplaceATkevinaylward.co.uk> - 2022-07-13 16:57 +0100
Re: Ed Lake's confusions (was: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again.) Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2022-07-14 08:20 -0500
Re: Ed Lake's confusions (was: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again.) Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2022-07-14 21:19 -0500
Re: Ed Lake's confusions (was: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again.) RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> - 2022-07-16 15:49 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Volney <volney@invalid.invalid> - 2022-06-04 18:36 -0400
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-06-04 22:32 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-06-04 22:42 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2022-06-05 09:47 -0500
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-05 08:19 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-06-05 09:32 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. nospam@de-ster.demon.nl (J. J. Lodder) - 2022-06-05 21:41 +0200
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-06-05 13:15 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> - 2022-06-03 12:32 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-06-03 13:24 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-05-31 21:35 -0500
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-05-28 14:32 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Stan Fultoni <fultonistan@gmail.com> - 2022-05-28 14:53 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-05-28 14:58 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-29 08:32 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-05-29 09:16 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-29 12:03 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-29 12:46 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-29 13:14 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-29 23:05 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-05-29 23:42 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-30 11:24 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2022-05-28 17:53 -0500
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-29 09:19 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-28 23:53 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-29 12:01 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-30 11:44 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-05-30 11:52 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. RichD <r_delaney2001@yahoo.com> - 2022-05-28 17:29 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-05-28 18:11 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. "mitchr...@gmail.com" <mitchrae3323@gmail.com> - 2022-05-28 20:18 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-05-28 20:31 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ed Lake <detect@outlook.com> - 2022-05-29 09:33 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2022-05-27 07:39 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Maciej Wozniak <maluwozniak@gmail.com> - 2022-05-27 08:39 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2022-05-27 09:23 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-05-27 09:14 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2022-05-27 09:33 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-05-27 09:57 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2022-05-27 10:19 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-05-27 10:35 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. rotchm <rotchm@gmail.com> - 2022-05-27 11:10 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. "Paul B. Andersen" <paul.b.andersen@paulba.no> - 2022-05-27 21:49 +0200
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-05-27 17:16 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-05-27 12:38 -0500
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-05-29 11:02 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-05-29 11:37 -0700
Re: Do you feel the pass of time? Really? Think again. Ken Seto <setoken47@gmail.com> - 2022-06-01 07:51 -0700
Absolute time Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2022-06-01 15:43 +0000
Re: Absolute time Ken Seto <setoken47@gmail.com> - 2022-06-02 07:56 -0700
Re: Absolute time whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2022-06-02 12:05 -0500
Re: Absolute time Ken Seto <setoken47@gmail.com> - 2022-06-02 20:58 -0700
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