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Groups > uk.telecom > #39349 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Codger <codger524@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2026-04-11 10:00 +0100 |
| Last post | 2026-04-16 14:42 +0100 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 160 — 25 participants |
Back to article view | Back to uk.telecom
BT Digital Voice with no router Codger <codger524@gmail.com> - 2026-04-11 10:00 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Codger <codger524@gmail.com> - 2026-04-11 10:30 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Bob Pullen <me@privacy.net> - 2026-04-11 11:02 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router angus@magsys.co.uk (Angus Robertson - Magenta Systems Ltd) - 2026-04-11 14:12 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com> - 2026-04-11 11:02 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> - 2026-04-11 11:13 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-04-11 13:54 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> - 2026-04-11 18:24 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Mike Humphrey <mail@michaelhumphrey.me.uk> - 2026-04-11 17:36 +0000
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-04-12 12:35 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2026-04-12 12:50 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-04-13 13:37 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-04-13 13:53 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2026-04-13 22:41 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-05-03 13:17 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Woolley <david@ex.djwhome.demon.invalid> - 2026-05-03 23:21 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2026-05-04 11:39 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-05-04 11:55 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2026-05-04 12:10 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> - 2026-05-04 16:41 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Nick Finnigan <nix@genie.co.uk> - 2026-05-04 17:37 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> - 2026-05-04 17:46 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-05-05 23:33 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Nick Finnigan <nix@genie.co.uk> - 2026-05-06 09:03 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-05-06 09:16 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Bob Eager <throwaway0008@eager.cx> - 2026-05-06 08:28 +0000
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Nick Finnigan <nix@genie.co.uk> - 2026-05-06 09:31 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Wade <dave@g4ugm.invalid> - 2026-05-06 10:34 +0200
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-05-06 14:34 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Woolley <david@ex.djwhome.demon.invalid> - 2026-05-06 16:16 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Wade <dave@g4ugm.invalid> - 2026-05-06 17:53 +0200
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-05-06 18:17 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Woolley <david@ex.djwhome.demon.invalid> - 2026-05-06 20:23 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Wade <dave@g4ugm.invalid> - 2026-05-06 21:41 +0200
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Woolley <david@ex.djwhome.demon.invalid> - 2026-05-07 14:14 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> - 2026-05-06 09:40 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-05-06 14:46 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Woolley <david@ex.djwhome.demon.invalid> - 2026-05-06 16:27 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2026-05-06 16:38 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-05-06 18:20 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> - 2026-05-06 19:55 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Wade <dave@g4ugm.invalid> - 2026-05-04 19:39 +0200
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> - 2026-05-04 19:07 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Wade <dave@g4ugm.invalid> - 2026-05-04 22:30 +0200
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Nick Finnigan <nix@genie.co.uk> - 2026-05-04 22:56 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> - 2026-05-05 09:07 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-05-05 23:36 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Wade <dave@g4ugm.invalid> - 2026-05-06 10:24 +0200
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-05-06 14:49 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Chris Green <cl@isbd.net> - 2026-05-04 19:26 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Nick Finnigan <nix@genie.co.uk> - 2026-05-04 20:06 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> - 2026-05-04 20:13 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-05-05 11:09 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2026-05-04 17:46 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> - 2026-05-04 17:50 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2026-05-04 17:58 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> - 2026-05-04 18:19 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Chris Green <cl@isbd.net> - 2026-05-04 19:36 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Nick Finnigan <nix@genie.co.uk> - 2026-05-04 17:59 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Chris Green <cl@isbd.net> - 2026-05-04 19:33 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2026-05-05 13:17 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Chris Green <cl@isbd.net> - 2026-05-05 14:11 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> - 2026-05-05 14:28 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-05-05 23:40 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2026-05-06 13:50 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-05-06 14:53 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2026-05-06 17:53 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Mark Carver <mark@invalid.com> - 2026-05-09 09:49 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-05-05 11:01 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-05-04 17:35 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2026-05-04 17:50 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-05-05 11:13 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-05-05 12:13 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-05-05 12:34 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> - 2026-05-05 12:39 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-05-05 17:15 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-05-05 23:29 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Woolley <david@ex.djwhome.demon.invalid> - 2026-05-06 10:13 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-05-06 17:30 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-05-06 17:24 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2026-05-06 18:04 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Davey <davey@example.invalid> - 2026-05-09 10:24 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-05-09 12:02 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Trolleybus <ken@birchanger.com> - 2026-05-10 10:56 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2026-05-10 18:50 +0100
OT: Steam (was: Re: BT Digital Voice with no router) "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-05-10 20:16 +0100
Re: OT: Steam Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2026-05-11 12:12 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-05-11 13:13 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> - 2026-05-11 18:25 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Spike <aero.spike@mail.com> - 2026-05-12 09:22 +0000
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> - 2026-05-12 13:22 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Spike <aero.spike@mail.com> - 2026-05-12 14:21 +0000
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-05-12 15:34 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Spike <aero.spike@mail.com> - 2026-05-12 14:50 +0000
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> - 2026-05-12 16:10 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Bob Latham <bob@sick-of-spam.invalid> - 2026-05-13 21:10 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-05-12 15:19 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-05-12 16:32 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-05-13 09:44 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Davey <davey@example.invalid> - 2026-05-13 10:42 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-05-13 13:09 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router grinch <grinch@somewhere.net> - 2026-05-13 14:29 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-05-13 18:51 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-05-13 20:44 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Spike <aero.spike@mail.com> - 2026-05-13 13:51 +0000
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-05-13 18:53 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Spike <aero.spike@mail.com> - 2026-05-13 21:25 +0000
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Wade <dave@g4ugm.invalid> - 2026-05-04 19:26 +0200
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-05-05 11:14 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-05-04 21:31 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Codger <codger524@gmail.com> - 2026-05-05 08:52 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-05-05 11:15 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-05-05 12:23 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com> - 2026-05-05 22:46 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-05-06 09:15 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Davey <davey@example.invalid> - 2026-05-06 11:44 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> - 2026-05-25 18:00 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2026-05-26 14:53 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-05-04 12:18 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-05-04 14:13 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-05-04 21:36 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Woolley <david@ex.djwhome.demon.invalid> - 2026-05-04 14:28 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-05-04 12:14 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-05-04 14:11 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com> - 2026-05-05 07:39 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-05-05 12:25 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2026-05-05 13:29 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-05-04 12:08 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Woolley <david@ex.djwhome.demon.invalid> - 2026-05-04 14:24 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-04-13 23:35 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-04-14 09:13 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-04-14 18:43 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2026-04-14 18:51 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-04-14 20:00 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-04-15 09:56 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-04-15 09:56 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-05-03 13:14 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-05-03 13:29 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> - 2026-05-03 14:08 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Rupert Moss-Eccardt <news@moss-eccardt.com> - 2026-05-03 16:43 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-05-03 18:39 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2026-05-03 22:39 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> - 2026-05-04 09:15 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Rupert Moss-Eccardt <news@moss-eccardt.com> - 2026-05-03 16:43 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-05-03 18:15 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> - 2026-04-12 15:40 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> - 2026-04-11 18:39 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> - 2026-04-11 19:59 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> - 2026-04-12 08:39 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> - 2026-04-12 13:08 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Rupert Moss-Eccardt <news@moss-eccardt.com> - 2026-04-19 14:29 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2026-04-11 20:55 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> - 2026-04-11 22:08 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> - 2026-04-12 08:42 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2026-04-12 09:33 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2026-04-12 13:08 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router Mark Carver <mark@invalid.com> - 2026-04-11 11:15 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> - 2026-04-11 12:43 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Woolley <david@ex.djwhome.demon.invalid> - 2026-04-16 13:59 +0100
Re: BT Digital Voice with no router David Woolley <david@ex.djwhome.demon.invalid> - 2026-04-16 14:42 +0100
Page 7 of 8 — ← Prev page 1 2 3 4 5 6 [7] 8 Next page →
| From | JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-05-04 21:36 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <10tb00i$3uvto$2@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #39449 |
On 04/05/2026 14:13, The Natural Philosopher wrote: > I remember the delicious smell of urine in the phone boxes bedecked with > adverts for French lessons... Bit like the places you often have to go to get away from street noise and use a mobile phone.
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| From | David Woolley <david@ex.djwhome.demon.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-05-04 14:28 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <10ta6tm$3mfgk$2@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #39443 |
On 04/05/2026 11:55, Liz Tuddenham wrote: > If you read through back-numbers of > POEEJ (particularly around the WWII period) If you read through them for the late 1980s, you will see a drastic change in culture, from technology related to commercial awareness related articles. At that time Mercury was noted for buying in equipment but not understanding it, but privatisation seems to have forced BT in similar directions. (I haven't seen them in more recent years.)
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| From | JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-05-04 12:14 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <10t9v2n$3k543$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #39442 |
On 04/05/2026 11:39, Theo wrote: > The PSTN phone is pretty limited - it works as long as the exchange > batteries last, but once they're flat it's useless. Don't most exchanges have a diesel? Even the small UAX's had one parked up outside for a time - I think the batteries were mot compatible with modern digital equipment. I always wondered what happened to them all because BT must have have had large numbers. Similar size to the Army "Chip Van". https://www.flickr.com/photos/doffcocker/albums/72177720303117888
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| From | The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-05-04 14:11 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <10ta5un$3m9pe$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #39442 |
On 04/05/2026 11:39, Theo wrote: > That gives additional resiliency over a > landline phone which relies on the broadband to stay operational. Or you can invest in a router that falls back to mobile if the broadband goes down -- “Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities.” ― Voltaire, Questions sur les Miracles à M. Claparede, Professeur de Théologie à Genève, par un Proposant: Ou Extrait de Diverses Lettres de M. de Voltaire
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| From | Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-05-05 07:39 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <10tc3bc$7943$2@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #39442 |
On Mon 04/05/2026 11:39, Theo wrote: > David Woolley <david@ex.djwhome.demon.invalid> wrote: >> On 03/05/2026 13:17, JMB99 wrote: >>> I was told years ago that mobile phone base stations >> >> I think they were drawing an analogy between a phone battery and its >> charger, and a UPS, not about the power at the base station. > > Yes - with a mobile you have two ways to make calls. Either via the mobile > network, or via Wifi Calling and your broadband. If either one of those > networks is up you can call. That gives additional resiliency over a > landline phone which relies on the broadband to stay operational. The phone > will stay working if the power goes off, and you have the option to take it > somewhere else that might have a working signal even if the signal at your > location is gone. Plus infrastructure to charge it is common now (can be > charged from your car, a cheap power bank, a small solar panel, a USB socket > at a shop/neighbour/etc that does have power, on a bus/train/... etc etc) > > Of course the wifi calling option requires some local battery backup at your > end, but the mobile part is still useful if not. Plus with satellite SMS > and satellite calling becoming available, you may still be able to use it > even if all the local networks are down. > > The PSTN phone is pretty limited - it works as long as the exchange > batteries last, but once they're flat it's useless. > > Theo I would have to ask Theo, have you ever seen the size of the support battery in most PSTN exchanges? Originally they were designed to support Strowger, then along came Crossbar, System X, System Y etc etc, but the battery banks were so big and heavy they just left them where they are and looked after them.
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| From | JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-05-05 12:25 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <10tck2r$chp4$2@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #39476 |
On 05/05/2026 07:39, Woody wrote: > I would have to ask Theo, have you ever seen the size of the support > battery in most PSTN exchanges? Originally they were designed to support > Strowger, then along came Crossbar, System X, System Y etc etc, but the > battery banks were so big and heavy they just left them where they are > and looked after them. And there was a diesel that would start up and take the load but could run for several weeks if necessary.
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| From | Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-05-05 13:29 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <ijD*OINFA@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk> |
| In reply to | #39476 |
Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com> wrote: > I would have to ask Theo, have you ever seen the size of the support > battery in most PSTN exchanges? Originally they were designed to support > Strowger, then along came Crossbar, System X, System Y etc etc, but the > battery banks were so big and heavy they just left them where they are > and looked after them. I haven't. Are those still operational? I'm on a UAX with a few hundred subscribers. Do they get such batteries too? Theo
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| From | JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-05-04 12:08 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <10t9uns$3k1f5$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #39438 |
On 03/05/2026 23:21, David Woolley wrote: > On 03/05/2026 13:17, JMB99 wrote: >> I was told years ago that mobile phone base stations > > I think they were drawing an analogy between a phone battery and its > charger, and a UPS, not about the power at the base station. I am not sure what that means? The mobile company were removing batteries from base stations (i.e. UPS though often not a separate UPS). There are a lot of costs with them, the batteries are normally changed regularly and they are heavy to transport to sites that often have no track. They then have to be disposed of using licensed companies which is why the mobile operator just dumped them in our building. My employer was too worried about upsetting them so eventually we removed which meant a trip by a licensed company which did not have a key to the building so despite us being told that it was not our problem, I had to go down to let them into the building (it was easier for me to then take the batteries down to the road in my van because they had a big lorry). Similarly happened very often, the site sharing department were popular with the beancounters because they earned money though we often had to do the work without being able to get a charge-code from them! Similar happened with another mobile operator, they changed the fans etc on a hilltop site on an island and just dumped all the old ones and packaging outside the building then denied it was their stuff despite plenty of evidence. At least one mobile operator got caught out on Harris, they were prosecuted.
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| From | David Woolley <david@ex.djwhome.demon.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-05-04 14:24 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <10ta6mq$3mfgk$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #39444 |
On 04/05/2026 12:08, JMB99 wrote: > I am not sure what that means? Liz and Theo seem to have understood.
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| From | "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-04-13 23:35 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <10rjr2m$2tsc0$4@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #39385 |
On 2026/4/13 13:53:51, Liz Tuddenham wrote: > The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote: > >> On 12/04/2026 12:50, Theo wrote: >>> The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote: >>>> On 11/04/2026 18:36, Mike Humphrey wrote: >>>>> How do we >>>>> "find a modern digital solution" when there is no broadband service >>>>> available from Openreach or any other supplier? >>>> >>>> If you have a copper telephone line you can at least have a modem >>>> Very few locations are totally unusable for ADSL.. >>> >>> Plus very, very few locations are simultaneously unusable for a mobile >>> connection. >>> >>> And very, very, very few locations are unusable for those and Starlink. >>> >>> Theo >> I think that is in fact the point. >> When 'powered by the exchange;' was dreamt up, many people did not have >> mains electricity let alone reliable mains > > Small business telephone exchanges were battery-powered by primary cells Not "primary", I think. > long after mains was commonly available. The 100-line exchange where I > worked until 1999 had a room full of lead-acid accumulators charged in > 'float' from the mains. In the event of a power cut, we still had a > day's worth of telephone service. Yes, I've seen rooms like that - the operative word being room; they were _big_ cells. About the size of large car or small truck batteries - until you realised that those were the individual two volt _cells_. > > During the power cuts of the 1970s, I kept an AVO connected actoss my > extension line so I could warn the switchboard if the batteries were > running dangerously low. If we had rotas of power cuts now, thousands (What could they do about it when you did tell them?) > of subscribers would be cut off for long periods and there would be > deaths as a result. > > Nobody will care until it happens, then they will say "We couldn't have > forseen it" and "Lessons will be learned". - They won't! > :-( > -- J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()ALIS-Ch++(p)Ar++T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf Try to tell me to watch something because it's brilliant and everyone says so and therefore I will love it, too, and you lose me for ever. - Alison Graham, RT 2016/2/6-12
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| From | liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-04-14 09:13 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <1rtjsox.iid83b4op6umN%liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid> |
| In reply to | #39387 |
J. P. Gilliver <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote: > On 2026/4/13 13:53:51, Liz Tuddenham wrote: > > The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote: > > > >> On 12/04/2026 12:50, Theo wrote: > >>> The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote: > >>>> On 11/04/2026 18:36, Mike Humphrey wrote: > >>>>> How do we > >>>>> "find a modern digital solution" when there is no broadband service > >>>>> available from Openreach or any other supplier? > >>>> > >>>> If you have a copper telephone line you can at least have a modem > >>>> Very few locations are totally unusable for ADSL.. > >>> > >>> Plus very, very few locations are simultaneously unusable for a mobile > >>> connection. > >>> > >>> And very, very, very few locations are unusable for those and Starlink. > >>> > >>> Theo > >> I think that is in fact the point. > >> When 'powered by the exchange;' was dreamt up, many people did not have > >> mains electricity let alone reliable mains > > > > Small business telephone exchanges were battery-powered by primary cells > > Not "primary", I think. Yes, wooden boxes full of glass Leclanché cells. My grandmother had them in the cupboard under the stairs to power the family telephone exchange. (Our family ran several businesses and, as soon as any of us children could print, we were left on duty to answer the phone and take messages) Telephones only used power when there was speech or signalling, so most of the time the batteries were unloaded. Typically an extension-to extension call would use about 40 mA from the batteries and exchange-to-extension calls would be powered from the exchange. External calls were timed and expensive, so they were kept as short as possible; that habit persisted for internal calls, so the drain on the batteries was short and infrequent. If the digital systems worked like that, emergency power would be a lot less of a problem. > > long after mains was commonly available. The 100-line exchange where I > > worked until 1999 had a room full of lead-acid accumulators charged in > > 'float' from the mains. In the event of a power cut, we still had a > > day's worth of telephone service. > > Yes, I've seen rooms like that - the operative word being room; they > were _big_ cells. About the size of large car or small truck batteries - > until you realised that those were the individual two volt _cells_. These were only about 10-inches cube, arranged on strong wooden shelving. The big ones that you remember were for powering central exchanges in major cities (the main busbars had to be interleaved, alternately positive and negative, so as to cancel the external field and minimise the physical forces pushing them apart). > > During the power cuts of the 1970s, I kept an AVO connected actoss my > > extension line so I could warn the switchboard if the batteries were > > running dangerously low. > > (What could they do about it when you did tell them?) They would go into 'emergency mode' whereby non-essential calls would be refused. Luckily the batteries were sufficient and that never happened. -- ~ Liz Tuddenham ~ (Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply) www.poppyrecords.co.uk
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| From | "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-04-14 18:43 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <10rlubf$7t30$4@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #39390 |
On 2026/4/14 9:13:31, Liz Tuddenham wrote: > J. P. Gilliver <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote: > >> On 2026/4/13 13:53:51, Liz Tuddenham wrote: >>> The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote: >>> >>>> On 12/04/2026 12:50, Theo wrote: >>>>> The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote: >>>>>> On 11/04/2026 18:36, Mike Humphrey wrote: >>>>>>> How do we >>>>>>> "find a modern digital solution" when there is no broadband service >>>>>>> available from Openreach or any other supplier? >>>>>> >>>>>> If you have a copper telephone line you can at least have a modem >>>>>> Very few locations are totally unusable for ADSL.. >>>>> >>>>> Plus very, very few locations are simultaneously unusable for a mobile >>>>> connection. >>>>> >>>>> And very, very, very few locations are unusable for those and Starlink. >>>>> >>>>> Theo >>>> I think that is in fact the point. >>>> When 'powered by the exchange;' was dreamt up, many people did not have >>>> mains electricity let alone reliable mains >>> >>> Small business telephone exchanges were battery-powered by primary cells >> >> Not "primary", I think. > > Yes, wooden boxes full of glass Leclanché cells. My grandmother had My understanding was that "primary" meant "non-rechargeable", such as zinc-carbon, and I-forget-which-chemistry "reference" cells. (Yes, I know most - certainly zinc-carbon - _can_ be recharged.) [] >>> long after mains was commonly available. The 100-line exchange where I >>> worked until 1999 had a room full of lead-acid accumulators charged in >>> 'float' from the mains. In the event of a power cut, we still had a >>> day's worth of telephone service. >> >> Yes, I've seen rooms like that - the operative word being room; they >> were _big_ cells. About the size of large car or small truck batteries - >> until you realised that those were the individual two volt _cells_. > > These were only about 10-inches cube, arranged on strong wooden > shelving. > > The big ones that you remember were for powering central exchanges in > major cities (the main busbars had to be interleaved, alternately > positive and negative, so as to cancel the external field and minimise > the physical forces pushing them apart). > I think it may actually have been somewhere in the electricity supply industry (I did my sandwich course with a switchgear company), and nothing to do with telecomms - maybe for powering switchgear? > >>> During the power cuts of the 1970s, I kept an AVO connected actoss my >>> extension line so I could warn the switchboard if the batteries were >>> running dangerously low. >> >> (What could they do about it when you did tell them?) > > They would go into 'emergency mode' whereby non-essential calls would be > refused. Luckily the batteries were sufficient and that never happened. > I didn't know that mode survived into the '70s. > -- J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()ALIS-Ch++(p)Ar++T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf
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| From | Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-04-14 18:51 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <n47d52Favt4U1@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #39395 |
"J. P. Gilliver" wrote: > I think it may actually have been somewhere in the electricity supply > industry (I did my sandwich course with a switchgear company), and > nothing to do with telecomms - maybe for powering switchgear? Edison NiFe cells?
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| From | "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-04-14 20:00 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <10rm2st$7t30$5@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #39396 |
On 2026/4/14 18:51:28, Andy Burns wrote: > "J. P. Gilliver" wrote: > >> I think it may actually have been somewhere in the electricity supply >> industry (I did my sandwich course with a switchgear company), and >> nothing to do with telecomms - maybe for powering switchgear? > > Edison NiFe cells? > May have been. I only saw such a room once, and that well over 40 years ago, so its purpose is somewhat lost in the haze of memory! I do remember they were individual cells the size of car/truck batteries, and made of glass. Another similar I remember was capacitors; that was at the British short Circuit Testing Station, in Hebburn - I was going to give you a google view, but sadly I find it was demolished in 2011. That was a building - sort of school sports hall size, IIRR; you could walk around inside when it was discharged, and it contained many structures of the sort of shape and size we've been discussing, but capacitors, not cells. The entire building could be configured in various ways, one of which was as one giant capacitor (complete with comical terminal sticking out of one side). Used for testing switchgear, I think. Ah, I've worked out how to use Google for old images: https://maps.app.goo.gl/T6rA8FyZhoZh1vnk6 - the brick building, with a terminal on its right, is a capacitor. -- J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()ALIS-Ch++(p)Ar++T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf I'm not an early bird or a night owl, I'm some sort of permanently exhausted pigeon
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| From | liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-04-15 09:56 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <1rtlpy6.78t0121iukubkN%liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid> |
| In reply to | #39397 |
J. P. Gilliver <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote: > On 2026/4/14 18:51:28, Andy Burns wrote: > > "J. P. Gilliver" wrote: > > > >> I think it may actually have been somewhere in the electricity supply > >> industry (I did my sandwich course with a switchgear company), and > >> nothing to do with telecomms - maybe for powering switchgear? > > > > Edison NiFe cells? > > > May have been. I only saw such a room once, and that well over 40 years > ago, so its purpose is somewhat lost in the haze of memory! I do > remember they were individual cells the size of car/truck batteries, and > made of glass. NiFe cells were made of metal and sealed (with a pressure-relief vent) to prevent CO2 in the air from reacting with the electrolyte. Glass cells were usually the lead-acid type. -- ~ Liz Tuddenham ~ (Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply) www.poppyrecords.co.uk
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| From | liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-04-15 09:56 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <1rtlpng.10mxj461ywxuwN%liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid> |
| In reply to | #39395 |
J. P. Gilliver <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote: [...] > >>> During the power cuts of the 1970s, I kept an AVO connected actoss my > >>> extension line so I could warn the switchboard if the batteries were > >>> running dangerously low. > >> > >> (What could they do about it when you did tell them?) > > > > They would go into 'emergency mode' whereby non-essential calls would be > > refused. Luckily the batteries were sufficient and that never happened. > > > I didn't know that mode survived into the '70s. It was simple, the operator answered the extension and said: "is this an emergency?". If the answer was "No", she asked the caller not to use the phone except for emergencies until after the end of the power cut. The site was small enough that urgent internal messages could be conveyed by walking. Incoming calls were answered as normal or may have been asked to keep the conversation brief. As the plan was never put into operation, I don't knw the details of how it would have worked - we were improvising as we went along. -- ~ Liz Tuddenham ~ (Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply) www.poppyrecords.co.uk
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| From | JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-05-03 13:14 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <10t7e6m$2sml1$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #39385 |
On 13/04/2026 13:53, Liz Tuddenham wrote: > Nobody will care until it happens, then they will say "We couldn't have > forseen it" and "Lessons will be learned". - They won't! It will be cheaper to just give a proper UPS to any vulnerable user. Didn't they hand out mobile phones to an area with a long fault so could do the same - perhaps a mobile phone restricted to emergency calls and one other number?
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| From | JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-05-03 13:29 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <10t7f37$2suev$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #39427 |
I was just thinking about the situation during long mains losses, I have not noticed any of the retailers supplying ordinary consumers who are selling proper UPS's that will run a system for any length of time. I would have thought that some would have taken the opportunity to promote the sale of UPS's
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| From | Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-05-03 14:08 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <8234084p4n.fsf@example.com> |
| In reply to | #39429 |
JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> writes: > I was just thinking about the situation during long mains losses, I > have not noticed any of the retailers supplying ordinary consumers who > are selling proper UPS's that will run a system for any length of > time. > > I would have thought that some would have taken the opportunity to > promote the sale of UPS's Virgin Media gives out these: https://www.amazon.co.uk/MOTOROLA-FW500-Landline-battery-emerges-white/dp/B0D1QZ8FT4 "Motorola Voice - FW500 Desktop Phone with SIM and Landline - 4G LTE Emergency Backup, Up to 8 Hours of Battery Life, Emergency Phone in Case of Power Outage, Large Keys", but that rather assumes 4G/3G reception.
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| From | Rupert Moss-Eccardt <news@moss-eccardt.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-05-03 16:43 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <n5p8pnF76k0U1@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #39430 |
On 3 May 2026 14:08, Richmond wrote: > JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> writes: > >> I was just thinking about the situation during long mains losses, I >> have not noticed any of the retailers supplying ordinary consumers who >> are selling proper UPS's that will run a system for any length of >> time. >> >> I would have thought that some would have taken the opportunity to >> promote the sale of UPS's > > Virgin Media gives out these: > > https://www.amazon.co.uk/MOTOROLA-FW500-Landline-battery-emerges-white/dp/B0D1QZ8FT4 > > "Motorola Voice - FW500 Desktop Phone with SIM and Landline - 4G LTE > Emergency Backup, Up to 8 Hours of Battery Life, Emergency Phone in Case > of Power Outage, Large Keys", but that rather assumes 4G/3G > reception. And, "up to 8 hours" is doing some work here.
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