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Groups > sci.physics > #828485
| Message-ID | <60F911EF.1FB6@ix.netcom.com> (permalink) |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-07-21 23:36 -0700 |
| From | The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> |
| Newsgroups | sci.physics, sci.physics.relativity, alt.fan.rush-limbaugh |
| Subject | Re: How many planets are there? |
| References | (6 earlier) <04eadbae-3b11-442d-9f23-ddaeaea44a5dn@googlegroups.com> <60F88DD6.76F9@ix.netcom.com> <60c0fc09-42b0-497e-a122-890b2cc2c763n@googlegroups.com> <60F9091F.5A8A@ix.netcom.com> <60F90DF8.3AA6@ix.netcom.com> |
Cross-posted to 3 groups.
The Starmaker wrote: > > The Starmaker wrote: > > > > Paul Alsing wrote: > > > > > > On Wednesday, July 21, 2021 at 2:12:24 PM UTC-7, The Starmaker wrote: > > > > Paul Alsing wrote: > > > > > > > > > > On Wednesday, July 21, 2021 at 10:02:33 AM UTC-7, The Starmaker wrote: > > > > > > Paul Alsing wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Tuesday, July 20, 2021 at 3:43:39 PM UTC-7, The Starmaker wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ...there is only one sun in the whole entire universe. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is only one Sun, but there are uncountable other suns in the universe. Just ask a dictionary... which, of course, tells us all just what a sun is... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > https://www.dictionary.com/browse/sun > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "a star, especially one that has planets and other celestial bodies revolving around it: > > > > > > > Many other solar systems have multiple suns, while ours has just one." > > > > > > > > > > > Strange how Paul Alsing uses 'fauci science' to get around words... > > > > > > > > > > Word salad... > > > > > > > > > > > Any intellectual honest person knows The Sun is the star at the center of the Solar System. > > > > > > > > > > That is what I said. You don't understand the written word? I said "There is only one Sun..." > > > > > > > > > > > https://www.google.com/search?q=define+sun > > > > > > > > > > > wiki (the facuci science website) reads: > > > > > > > > > > > > The Sun is the star at the center of the Solar System. > > > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun > > > > > > > > > > I doubt that anyone would argue about this... > > > > > > > > > > > But yous only counted 8 planets...and it's only in your own solar system. > > > > > > > > > > I never mentioned anything about planets... > > > > > > > > > > > Meaning...all those others stars don't have a solar system, so they are not suns, they are stars. > > > > > > > > > > Thousands and thousands of other stars, others suns, have been found to have planets... and even a star without any planets can still be referenced as a sun, as per dictionary definition. The word 'sun' is embedded ion the language and is used all the time. Get over >it. > > > > > > > There goes another fauci science guy who sez "Thousands and thousands of other stars, others suns, have been found to have planets..." > > > > > > > > but yet cannot show any proof of other stars with a planet/planets (or even name one) that truly exist. > > > > > > Oh, I can ame a lot more than just one...here is a list of planets external to our solar system that have names... > > > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_exoplanets_discovered_using_the_Kepler_space_telescope > > > > > > ... is this enough for you? > > > > > > I'm gonna guess that you have never heard of the Kepler Mission... > > > > > > https://exoplanets.nasa.gov/keplerscience/ > > > > > > " Kepler has proven there are more planets than stars in our galaxy — and knowing that revolutionizes our scientific understanding of our place in the cosmos." > > > > Oh yeah, i seen those pretty pictures of... > > > > https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/kepler186f_artistconcept.jpg > > > > and they are still using fraudlant Drake Equations to try and get past ...8 planets. > > > > An artistconcept illustration is not a photograph of a planet...it's 'fauci science'. > > > > It's Fake Science! > > > > Look, build a telescope, point it to one other star and see if you 'see' a planet...not a dot. > > > > Yous guys take a dot and the result is this? > > > > https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/kepler186f_artistconcept.jpg > > > > and then you multiply it by a million???? > > > > This is 'fauci science'... > > > > Stop taking pictures of the end of the universe and take one past the eighth planet... > > > > If Albert Einstein was alive today he would be in jail for lying to congress. > > > > -- > > The Starmaker -- To question the unquestionable, ask the unaskable, > > to think the unthinkable, mention the unmentionable, and challenge > > the unchallengeable. > > Here is a quote about ...so-called planets: > > “Kepler already told us there were billions of planets, but now we know a good chunk of those planets might be rocky and habitable. > Though this result is far from a final value, and water on a planet’s surface is only one of many factors to support life, it’s > extremely exciting that we calculated these worlds are this common with such high confidence and precision.” > > https://www.universetoday.com/148667/based-on-kepler-data-theres-a-95-chance-of-an-earth-like-planet-within-20-light-years/ > > The Headlind begins: Based on Kepler Data, ... > > Data???? wat those dat mean? > > "Though this result is far from a final value..." wat does that mean? > > "we calculated these worlds are this common..." 'we calculated'???? wat does that mean? > > That means, some fauci guy got a calculator > took the number one and mutiply it by a billion. Vola, a billion planets! > > I'll make it simple for yous fauci science guys...FUCK YOUR CALCULATIONS! > about calculations Kepler uses, Drake's Equations: "The problem, of course, is that none of the terms can be known, and most cannot even be estimated. The only way to work the equation is to fill in with guesses. And guesses-just so we’re clear-are merely expressions of prejudice. Nor can there be “informed guesses.” If you need to state how many planets with life choose to communicate, there is simply no way to make an informed guess. It’s simply prejudice. As a result, the Drake equation can have any value from “billions and billions” to zero. An expression that can mean anything means nothing. Speaking precisely, the Drake equation is literally meaningless, and has nothing to do with science. I take the hard view that science involves the creation of testable hypotheses. The Drake equation cannot be tested and therefore SETI is not science. SETI is unquestionably a religion." -- The Starmaker -- To question the unquestionable, ask the unaskable, to think the unthinkable, mention the unmentionable, and challenge the unchallengeable.
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How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-17 23:08 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid> - 2021-07-18 17:14 +1000
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-18 00:23 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Jonathan <writeInstead@Gmail.com> - 2021-07-18 17:55 -0400
Re: How many planets are there? Kurt Nicklas <kurtnicklas@gmail.com> - 2021-07-19 01:10 +0300
Re: How many planets are there? Jonathan <writeInstead@Gmail.com> - 2021-07-19 08:15 -0400
Re: How many planets are there? Kurt Nicklas <kurtnicklas@gmail.com> - 2021-07-19 15:23 +0300
Re: How many planets are there? Jonathan <writeInstead@Gmail.com> - 2021-07-19 08:38 -0400
Re: How many planets are there? Kurt Nicklas <kurtnicklas@gmail.com> - 2021-07-19 15:43 +0300
Re: How many planets are there? Jonathan <writeInstead@Gmail.com> - 2021-07-19 08:58 -0400
America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. Jeff-Relf.Me @. - 2021-07-19 11:38 -0700
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-19 23:50 -0700
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. Snit <brock.mcnuggets@gmail.com> - 2021-07-20 07:08 +0000
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> - 2021-07-20 08:52 -0500
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-20 09:27 -0700
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> - 2021-07-20 11:30 -0500
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. Clutterfreak <clutterfreakincarnate@gmail.com> - 2021-07-20 11:35 -0500
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-20 10:10 -0700
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> - 2021-07-20 12:35 -0500
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-20 10:43 -0700
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. Clutterfreak <clutterfreakincarnate@gmail.com> - 2021-07-20 13:05 -0500
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-20 13:50 -0700
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. Clutterfreak <clutterfreakincarnate@gmail.com> - 2021-07-20 20:25 -0500
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-20 19:31 -0700
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-23 14:21 -0700
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-24 12:13 -0700
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-24 18:39 -0700
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-08-03 12:08 -0700
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-08-03 12:44 -0700
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. Arindam Banerjee <banerjeeadda1234@gmail.com> - 2021-08-03 23:25 -0700
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-08-03 12:53 -0700
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-08-03 15:00 -0700
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2021-07-20 08:03 -0600
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-20 09:30 -0700
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-20 10:06 -0700
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. Clutterfreak <clutterfreakincarnate@gmail.com> - 2021-07-20 12:13 -0500
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-20 13:33 -0700
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2021-07-20 12:08 -0500
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. "Byker" <byker@do~rag.net> - 2021-07-20 14:01 -0500
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2021-07-20 21:26 -0600
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. "Byker" <byker@do~rag.net> - 2021-07-20 14:01 -0500
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2021-07-20 21:30 -0600
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. Mainspring <MSpr@zeex.net> - 2021-07-21 00:05 -0400
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> - 2021-07-21 10:09 -0500
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2021-07-21 19:45 -0600
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. Unruh <unruh@sjrb.ca> - 2021-07-22 02:02 +0000
Re: America's life expectancy is dropping like never before. rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2021-07-20 21:22 -0600
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-18 00:35 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-20 15:44 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-20 16:22 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-21 10:02 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-21 10:19 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Kurt Nicklas <kurtnicklas@gmail.com> - 2021-07-21 20:41 +0300
Re: How many planets are there? whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2021-07-21 14:05 -0500
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-21 14:04 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2021-07-21 18:39 -0500
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-21 17:22 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-21 17:31 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Jim Pennino <jimp@gonzo.specsol.net> - 2021-07-21 20:52 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-21 12:04 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-21 14:12 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-21 14:35 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-21 22:58 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-21 23:07 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-21 23:19 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-21 23:36 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-22 10:39 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-22 13:39 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-22 23:15 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-22 23:49 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-23 00:06 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-23 08:43 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-23 12:20 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-23 13:20 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-23 15:18 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-23 15:58 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-23 20:50 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-23 21:24 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-24 19:11 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2021-07-24 22:30 -0500
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-25 10:27 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? "mitchr...@gmail.com" <mitchrae3323@gmail.com> - 2021-07-25 10:37 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-26 15:17 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-26 17:03 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2021-07-26 20:55 -0400
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-26 18:50 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2021-07-27 19:08 -0400
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-26 18:48 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-26 18:54 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2021-07-26 21:38 -0500
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-26 15:23 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-26 17:09 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-26 19:03 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-28 22:12 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-28 23:14 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2021-07-29 09:39 -0400
Re: How many planets are there? Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-29 09:51 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2021-07-29 15:08 -0400
Re: How many planets are there? Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-29 12:28 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Sergio <invaled@invalid.com> - 2021-07-29 17:46 -0500
Re: How many planets are there? Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-29 16:05 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2021-07-29 18:13 -0500
Re: How many planets are there? Sergio <invaled@invalid.com> - 2021-07-29 19:18 -0500
Re: How many planets are there? whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2021-07-29 23:09 -0500
Re: How many planets are there? Jim Pennino <jimp@gonzo.specsol.net> - 2021-07-29 17:36 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2021-07-30 01:11 -0400
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-29 10:23 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2021-07-29 15:27 -0400
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-31 13:05 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2021-07-31 16:03 -0500
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-31 20:18 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-07-31 20:34 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-08-01 00:02 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-08-02 13:34 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-08-02 13:40 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Paul Alsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> - 2021-08-02 15:48 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2021-07-31 23:38 -0400
Re: How many planets are there? Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2021-07-23 09:07 -0400
Re: How many planets are there? Clutterfreak <clutterfreakincarnate@gmail.com> - 2021-07-23 12:59 -0500
Re: How many planets are there? Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid> - 2021-07-23 17:22 +1000
Re: How many planets are there? Jackson Sprat <jacksprat@kewlmail.com> - 2021-07-23 11:13 -0400
Re: How many planets are there? Clutterfreak <clutterfreakincarnate@gmail.com> - 2021-07-22 11:18 -0500
Re: How many planets are there? whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2021-07-20 22:27 -0500
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-22 23:17 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Siri Cruise <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2021-07-22 23:46 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Jackson Sprat <jacksprat@kewlmail.com> - 2021-07-23 11:13 -0400
Re: How many planets are there? whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2021-07-23 10:47 -0500
Re: How many planets are there? Vance <vancen@gmail.com> - 2021-07-26 03:22 +0000
Re: How many planets are there? Siri Cruise <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2021-07-26 01:10 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-26 09:49 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? "Byker" <byker@do~rag.net> - 2021-07-26 21:31 -0500
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-27 13:08 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2021-07-27 16:18 -0500
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-27 22:05 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2021-07-28 10:36 -0500
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-28 10:19 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2021-07-28 14:47 -0500
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-27 14:28 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-27 14:30 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Vance <vancen@gmail.com> - 2021-07-26 23:51 +0000
Re: How many planets are there? Vance <vancen@gmail.com> - 2021-08-04 03:59 +0000
Re: How many planets are there? Vance <vancen@gmail.com> - 2021-08-31 17:56 +0000
Re: How many planets are there? Vance <vancen@gmail.com> - 2021-11-16 22:39 +0000
Re: How many planets are there? Sylvia Else <sylvia@email.invalid> - 2021-07-21 10:49 +1000
Re: How many planets are there? whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2021-07-18 10:21 -0500
Re: How many planets are there? Jonathan <writeInstead@Gmail.com> - 2021-07-18 17:58 -0400
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-20 09:34 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? whodat <whodaat@void.nowgre.com> - 2021-07-20 12:02 -0500
Re: How stupid is starfucktard? Orni Thopter <flapping@wi.ngs> - 2021-07-18 13:48 -0700
What is the name of the 9th protester in Seattle ? Jeff-Relf.Me @. - 2021-07-18 14:24 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Jonathan <writeInstead@Gmail.com> - 2021-07-18 17:56 -0400
Re: How many planets are there? The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2021-07-20 09:48 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Jonathan <writeInstead@Gmail.com> - 2021-07-20 18:50 -0400
Re: How many planets are there? "mitchr...@gmail.com" <mitchrae3323@gmail.com> - 2021-07-19 11:14 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Mi Na <ya12983@mail.com> - 2021-07-22 02:28 -0700
Re: How many planets are there? Andy Everett <andyeverett57@gmail.com> - 2021-07-29 10:58 -0700
many He Llo <rob999999999@yahoo.com> - 2021-08-12 03:00 -0700
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