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Re: Philosophy and physics

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Richard Hertz wrote:
> 
> On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 1:19:39 AM UTC-3, The Starmaker wrote:
> > The Starmaker wrote:
> > >
> > > Richard Hertz wrote:
> > > >
> > > > On Thursday, March 3, 2022 at 1:16:32 AM UTC-3, The Starmaker wrote:
> > > > > Richard Hertz wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Tuesday, March 1, 2022 at 12:13:19 PM UTC-3, bodk...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > <snip>
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > No, you’re not following. I use aoie AND a home VPN.
> > > > > > > Whenever I connect to aoie, which is only for this purpose, I use a remote routing IP.
> > > > > > > For other connections, say for banking, I use a different routing IP.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I understand that you have two ISP: one for normal use (DSL, cable, FO) and another for Usenet (mobile ISP),
> > > > > > and that you use an IPad for the last service, with your VPN access to a remote NNTP server.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Each ISP has to give you, when you just connect, an IP address provided by their DNS or it could be impossible to route your
> > > > > > packets through the Internet.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Any ISP that want to connect to an NNTP server (through a VPN) has to offer a FIXED IP address to such server. This is the IP
> > > > > > that is public, even when spoofed your real IP. The ISP has to do so because routers can't route encrypted IP addresses.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The injection point of your traffic to the VPN tunnel toward the NNTP server vary with each ISP. Unless you specifically contract
> > > > > > a service with an arbitrary spoofed IP address, chosen by you (county, state, country), the ISP will use its nearest NNTP injection
> > > > > > point, which is seen by aioe.org as a fixed (not switched) IP address.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The VPN tunneling between your VPN client (on your IPad) occurs because the ISP knows how to translate your traffic over his
> > > > > > connection to the NNTP Server, even when your ISP can't see anything of it, except some elementary data from the header of the
> > > > > > IP Packet. Your data, above IP is fully encrypted.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > But, as the aioe.org server only establish connections with registered fixed address ranges, the location of the injection point will
> > > > > > be always the same, and linked to any given ISP. This could be secret (with a paid VPN service), but aioe.org publishes the IP of
> > > > > > the OUTPUT of the ISP that you use. So, unless you contract a service to spoof your local IP (to other state or country), there is
> > > > > > a fixed pattern of traffic that relates the IP of the injection point and the NNTP server, which is always the same.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I don't know how to explain this more clearly. That's why I gave you instructions about how to read traffic data from aioe.org, which
> > > > > > they make public (data accummulated in the last 24 hours, or 86400 sec). As aioe.org, a free service, only allows 86400 sec/day
> > > > > > connections, and then reset the distant fixed IP and ban it for 24 hours as a penalty (also count the connections/day, traffic, etc.),
> > > > > > you have to be aware of these limitations or will be banned for 1 day.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > For most users of aioe.org, this is much more than enought but many agencies establish NNTP connections over the given IP
> > > > > > in excess of time, amount of data and simultaneous groups. Then they are banned for 1 day, and you can read that list.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > If you use any IP locator, you'll see that the IP correspond to ISP, not final users. But, as most of them don't want to spoof origin,
> > > > > > is not rocket science to relate ISP IP with geographical are that's served by that IP address.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Of course, such task is formidable because involve table lookups of millions of IP ranges and thousands of ISP, but it's possible.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > However, there are other means, like search of patterns in connections IF you access to an Usenet provider that allows searching
> > > > > > on their database of articles (or posts).
> > > > > >
> > > > > > You should analyze the difference between aioe.org and any paid VPN provider with NNTP gateways for Usenet. You have a LOT at US,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Here, there are only two, very expensive and with restrictions to access to 100% of Usenet servers worldwide.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Hope this clumsy explanation can help you.
> > > > > Do you know How to do a UDP?
> > > > > --
> > > > > The Starmaker -- To question the unquestionable, ask the unaskable,
> > > > > to think the unthinkable, mention the unmentionable, say the unsayable,
> > > > > and challenge
> > > > > the unchallengeable.
> > > >
> > > > Bodkin doesn't use UDP for NNTP connections. TCP is required.
> > > >
> > > > Anyways, the first link explains how to do it:
> > > >
> > > > https://docs.intersystems.com/irislatest/csp/docbook/DocBook.UI.Page.cls?KEY=GIOD_UDP
> > > > https://www.techtarget.com/searchnetworking/definition/UDP-User-Datagram-Protocol
> > >
> > > I meant this UDP...
> > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usenet_Death_Penalty
> > I didn't meant you should do a UDP on anyone here...I meant do you know
> > how
> > to work a UDP program? Are you familiar with UDP programs, or have you
> > ever used one?
> > --
> > The Starmaker -- To question the unquestionable, ask the unaskable,
> > to think the unthinkable, mention the unmentionable, say the unsayable,
> > and challenge
> > the unchallengeable.
> 
> Not in the last 30 years. It was used to analyze network survivability in connectionless links between
> unix hosts, with several routing protocols.
> Internet was in its infancy by then. I didn't follow the work after my involvement, but was used to send real time data
> In the last 15-20 years it started to be replaced by TCP, for streaming audio & video, as Internet complexity and bandwidth grew.


WOW, this is like a Twilight Zone post!

Step by step here...

UDP stands for Usenet Death Penalty.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usenet_Death_Penalty

One of the earliest uses of UDP was by microbiology professor Richard
DePew, to remove/cancel postings in science newsgroups.  

You run UDP and the other people's post...disapears forever. 

A cancel bot.

In other words, if I didn't want you to post into this newsgroup
anymore, I just run a UDP/canelbot program...and none of your posts will
ever shop up on Usenet.

UDP stands for Usenet Death Penalty.

here's a sample"


Xref: feenix.metronet.com news.admin.technical:179
Path:
feenix.metronet.com!news.utdallas.edu!hermes.chpc.utexas.edu!cs.utexas.edu!uunet!not-for-mail
From: rsalz@uunet.uu.net (Rich Salz)
Newsgroups: news.admin.technical
Subject: Usenet Death Penalty
Date: 18 Aug 1993 20:06:50 -0400
Organization: UUNET Communications
Lines: 85
Sender: zorch@ftp.UU.NET
Approved: zorch@uunet.UU.NET
Distribution: world
Message-ID: <24ug6qINN1f1@ftp.UU.NET>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ftp.uu.net

Cancel wars seem to be on the rise.  It's too bad people aren't more
mature -- it's on the same level as urinating in the public swimming
pool.  At the risk of adding to the amount of waste, here is what some
might consider to be the final word on the matter.  It's a Perl script
intended to be run as a real-time feed by INN.  It should be able to
cancel articles within seconds after they hit your site.
	/r$

#! /usr/bin/perl
##  Usenet death penalty; Rich $alz <rsalz@uunet.uu.net>, April 93.
##  Original name and concept by Eliot Lear, years ago.
##
##  Typical use is via this entry in newsfeeds file:
##	udp:*:Tc,WO:.../udp [flags] 'rsalz@.*.uu.net'
##  Flags are '-global' to post cancel messages (default just removes
##  articles from your local spool) and '-debug' to send cancels to
##  stdout.  First (and only) arg is Perl regexp to match against From
##  line; to kill multiple people use the | meta-char.


##  Parse JCL.
$local = 1;
$production = 1;
args: while ( $_ = $ARGV[0], /^-/ ) {
    shift;
    if ( $_ eq '-debug' ) {
	$production = 0;
	next args;
    }
    if ( $_ eq '-global' ) {
	$local = 0;
	next args;
    }
    die 'Bad flag\n';
}
$who = shift || die 'Not enough args.\n';
shift && die 'Too many args.\n';


##  Set header values if we're going to be posting.
if ( $local == 0 ) {
    $pathhost = `innconfval pathhost`;
    chop($pathhost);
    @pw = getpwuid($<);
    $canceller = $pathhost . '!' . $pw[0];
    ($sec, $min, $hour, $mday, $mon, $year, $wday, $yday, $isdst) =
gmtime;
    $year += 1900;
    $monthname = substr('JanFebMarAprMayJunJulAugSepOctNovDec', $mon *
3, 3);
    $date = "$mday $monthname $year $hour:$min:$sec GMT";
}


##  Main loop; process each line.
line: while ( <STDIN> ) {
    next line unless ( $paths, $subj, $from, $xdate, $msgid ) =
split('\t', $_);
    next line unless $from =~ /$who/io;

    if ( $local ) {
	foreach ( split(' ', $paths) ) {
	    unlink $_
		|| warn "Can't unlink $_ $!";
	}
    } else {
	open(FH, '|rnews') && select FH
	    if $production;
	$myid = $msgid;
	$myid =~ s/</<cancel-/;
	print 'Newsgroups: news.admin
Path: ', $canceller, '
Subject: cmsg cancel ', $msgid, '
Control: cancel ', $msgid, '
From: ', $from, '
Date: ', $date, '
Message-ID: ', $myid, '

';
	close(FH)
	    if $production;
    }
}
exit(0);

##  lint noise:
print $isdst + $wday + $yday + $subj + $xdate;







-- 
The Starmaker -- To question the unquestionable, ask the unaskable,
 to think the unthinkable, mention the unmentionable, say the unsayable,
and challenge
 the unchallengeable.

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Philosophy and physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-02-27 17:02 -0800
  Re: Philosophy and physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-02-27 21:05 -0800
    Re: Philosophy and physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-02-27 22:38 -0800
      Re: Philosophy and physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-02-27 23:33 -0800
        Re: Philosophy and physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-02-28 05:36 -0800
          Re: Philosophy and physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-02-28 18:51 +0000
          Re: Philosophy and physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-02-28 21:09 -0800
            Re: Philosophy and physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-02-28 22:03 -0800
              Re: Philosophy and physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-02-28 22:33 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-02-28 22:45 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-01 13:12 +0000
                Re: Philosophy and physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-02-28 23:01 -0800
              Re: Philosophy and physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-01 12:23 +0000
                Re: Philosophy and physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-03-01 04:43 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-01 13:12 +0000
                Re: Philosophy and physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-03-01 05:22 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-03-01 05:29 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-01 13:47 +0000
                Re: Philosophy and physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-03-01 06:09 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-01 15:13 +0000
                Re: Philosophy and physics "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2022-03-01 09:24 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-03-01 21:58 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-03-02 20:16 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-03-02 21:12 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-03-02 23:47 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-03-03 20:20 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-03-03 20:38 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-03-03 22:11 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-03-04 17:15 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-03-05 15:08 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-03-05 15:55 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-03-05 23:22 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-06 12:32 +0000
                Re: Philosophy and physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-03-06 13:18 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-03-07 13:48 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-03-07 13:56 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-03-08 01:25 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-03-08 10:58 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2022-03-08 15:19 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics Richard Hachel <r.hachel@tiscali.fr> - 2022-03-08 23:40 +0000
                Re: Philosophy and physics The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2022-03-08 16:14 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2022-03-09 06:09 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2022-03-05 04:41 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-03-05 09:05 -0500
                Re: Philosophy and physics Darin Herr <dh@yahoo.com> - 2022-03-05 18:22 +0000
                Re: Philosophy and physics Paparios <mrios@ing.puc.cl> - 2022-03-05 10:47 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics Darin Herr <dh@yahoo.com> - 2022-03-05 19:13 +0000
                Re: Philosophy and physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-03-05 11:31 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics Darin Herr <dh@yahoo.com> - 2022-03-05 20:03 +0000
                Re: Philosophy and physics Michael Moroney <moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com> - 2022-03-06 14:10 -0500
                Re: Philosophy and physics Ober Corn <nm@cvslm.ca> - 2022-03-06 21:12 +0000
                Re: Philosophy and physics "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2022-03-06 14:09 -0800
        Re: Philosophy and physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-02-28 15:54 +0000
          Re: Philosophy and physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-03-06 23:08 -0800
            Re: Philosophy and physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-03-06 23:10 -0800
              Re: Philosophy and physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-07 15:01 +0000
                Re: Philosophy and physics "Ross A. Finlayson" <ross.finlayson@gmail.com> - 2022-03-07 07:19 -0800
            Re: Philosophy and physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-07 15:01 +0000
              Re: Philosophy and physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-03-08 03:28 -0800
                Re: Philosophy and physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-08 14:06 +0000
    Re: Philosophy and physics "Paul B. Andersen" <paul.b.andersen@paulba.no> - 2022-02-28 22:24 +0100
  Re: Philosophy and physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-02-27 21:15 -0800
  Re: Philosophy and physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-02-28 15:54 +0000
  Re: Philosophy and physics Richard Hertz <hertz778@gmail.com> - 2022-02-28 20:42 -0800
    Re: Philosophy and physics Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2022-03-01 12:23 +0000

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