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What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs?

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  What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Andrew <andrew@spam.net> - 2024-09-02 16:11 +0000
    Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Andrew <andrew@spam.net> - 2024-09-03 02:20 +0000
      Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? David Brooks <BDB@nomail.afraid.org> - 2024-09-03 08:28 +0100
        Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Andrew <andrew@spam.net> - 2024-09-03 16:13 +0000
          Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? David Brooks <BDB@nomail.afraid.org> - 2024-09-03 19:08 +0100
            Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Andrew <andrew@spam.net> - 2024-09-03 20:33 +0000
              Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? David Brooks <BDB@nomail.afraid.org> - 2024-09-03 21:38 +0100
                Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Andrew <andrew@spam.net> - 2024-09-05 14:53 +0000
                  Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? David Brooks <BDB@nomail.afraid.org> - 2024-09-05 23:17 +0100
    Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Andrew <andrew@spam.net> - 2024-09-03 02:20 +0000
      Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? David Brooks <BDB@nomail.afraid.org> - 2024-09-03 20:21 +0100
        Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Andrew <andrew@spam.net> - 2024-09-03 20:28 +0000
          Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? David Brooks <BDB@nomail.afraid.org> - 2024-09-03 21:40 +0100
    Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Andrew <andrew@spam.net> - 2024-09-03 20:17 +0000
      Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2024-09-04 02:45 +0000
        Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Andrew <andrew@spam.net> - 2024-09-04 05:11 +0000
          Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> - 2024-09-03 22:18 -0700
            Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2024-09-04 15:15 +0000
              Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Andrew <andrew@spam.net> - 2024-09-04 19:33 +0000
    Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Tom Elam <thomas.e.elam@gmail.com> - 2024-09-03 18:22 -0400
      Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> - 2024-09-03 15:32 -0700
      Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Andrew <andrew@spam.net> - 2024-09-04 05:19 +0000
    Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Tom Elam <thomas.e.elam@gmail.com> - 2024-09-10 19:07 -0400
      Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Andrew <andrew@spam.net> - 2024-09-11 16:26 +0000
        Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> - 2024-09-11 14:07 -0700
        Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Tom Elam <thomas.e.elam@gmail.com> - 2024-11-19 10:31 -0500
          Re: What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs? Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> - 2024-11-19 13:02 -0500

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#47267 — What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs?

What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs?

The fact is of all common consumer operating systems, as of February 2023,
only Apple *requires* you to completely lose your privacy by forcing you to
use 2FA (which, for most people, is accomplished by their personal phone).

Obviously I'm aghast that only Apple completely ignores any request for
privacy, but I can't fight it and still log into my Apple ID on my iPads.

While I gave Apple my personal very private cell phone number, because I
was forced to do it in order to create the new Apple ID, my question here
is how can we avoid giving Apple our privacy for the rest of our lives?

What other forms of 2FA can we give Apple to log into new Apple accounts?

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#47275

badgolferman wrote on Mon, 2 Sep 2024 16:44:04 -0000 (UTC) :

>> What other forms of 2FA can we give Apple to log into new Apple accounts?
>> 
> 
> I'm not entirely sure, but it seems you can get a different trusted device.
> https://support.apple.com/en-us/102660
> 
> If you don't want to give out your personal phone number maybe a Google
> Voice number would work. Use a Google solution to authenticate with Apple!

Apple murdered privacy.

I've seen that support article and it doesn't answer the question.
 <https://support.apple.com/en-us/102660>

It's ironic that Apple is (yet again) the worst of all in terms of privacy.
Anyway, Apple lies about privacy. But we're stuck with what it is.

Even as there is no company worse than Apple for privacy, I'm stuck with
having to use the only 2FV in my life, just to install apps on my iPads.

Even though Apple murdered privacy, we're stuck with figuring out options.
 <https://www.google.com/search?q=appleid+2sv+verification+options>

You can't use a "trusted device" with a new AppleID as no other device has
that AppleID (for privacy - that's why). Apple murdered privacy after all.

You have to use a phone or something else.
And you don't want to use a phone as that's the worst (for privacy).

So what else can be used to avoid Apple from murdering your privacy?

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#47277

On 03/09/2024 03:20, Andrew wrote:
> badgolferman wrote on Mon, 2 Sep 2024 16:44:04 -0000 (UTC) :
> 
>>> What other forms of 2FA can we give Apple to log into new Apple accounts?
>>>
>>
>> I'm not entirely sure, but it seems you can get a different trusted device.
>> https://support.apple.com/en-us/102660
>>
>> If you don't want to give out your personal phone number maybe a Google
>> Voice number would work. Use a Google solution to authenticate with Apple!
> 
> Apple murdered privacy.
> 
> I've seen that support article and it doesn't answer the question.
>   <https://support.apple.com/en-us/102660>
> 
> It's ironic that Apple is (yet again) the worst of all in terms of privacy.
> Anyway, Apple lies about privacy. But we're stuck with what it is.
> 
> Even as there is no company worse than Apple for privacy, I'm stuck with
> having to use the only 2FV in my life, just to install apps on my iPads.
> 
> Even though Apple murdered privacy, we're stuck with figuring out options.
>   <https://www.google.com/search?q=appleid+2sv+verification+options>
> 
> You can't use a "trusted device" with a new AppleID as no other device has
> that AppleID (for privacy - that's why). Apple murdered privacy after all.
> 
> You have to use a phone or something else.
> And you don't want to use a phone as that's the worst (for privacy).
> 
> So what else can be used to avoid Apple from murdering your privacy?

Just how much does it matter?

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#47278

David Brooks wrote on Tue, 3 Sep 2024 08:28:13 +0100 :

>> So what else can be used to avoid Apple from murdering your privacy?
> 
> Just how much does it matter?

It doesn't matter to you that Apple lies about privacy?

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#47280

On 03/09/2024 17:13, Andrew wrote:
> David Brooks wrote on Tue, 3 Sep 2024 08:28:13 +0100 :
> 
>>> So what else can be used to avoid Apple from murdering your privacy?
>>
>> Just how much does it matter?
> 
> It doesn't matter to you that Apple lies about privacy?

It matters to me that folk on the Apple Support Community forum tried to 
pressure someone into installing EtreCheck onto their computer.

See:- https://discussions.apple.com/thread/255742536?sortBy=rank

Have YOU ever installed EtreCheck?

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#47286

David Brooks wrote on Tue, 3 Sep 2024 19:08:03 +0100 :

>>>> So what else can be used to avoid Apple from murdering your privacy?
>>>
>>> Just how much does it matter?
>> 
>> It doesn't matter to you that Apple lies about privacy?
> 
> It matters to me that folk on the Apple Support Community forum tried to 
> pressure someone into installing EtreCheck onto their computer.
> 
> See:- https://discussions.apple.com/thread/255742536?sortBy=rank
> 
> Have YOU ever installed EtreCheck?

Bearing in mind no other common consumer operating system vendor requires
you to provide them with your phone number just to use their product... 

And, perhaps worse, for the rest of your life, you can never log into your
Apple ID without having to have that extra personal device by your side...

      *What do you think about Apple murdering privacy?*

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#47287

On 03/09/2024 21:33, Andrew wrote:
> David Brooks wrote on Tue, 3 Sep 2024 19:08:03 +0100 :
> 
>>>>> So what else can be used to avoid Apple from murdering your privacy?
>>>>
>>>> Just how much does it matter?
>>>
>>> It doesn't matter to you that Apple lies about privacy?
>>
>> It matters to me that folk on the Apple Support Community forum tried to
>> pressure someone into installing EtreCheck onto their computer.
>>
>> See:- https://discussions.apple.com/thread/255742536?sortBy=rank
>>
>> Have YOU ever installed EtreCheck?
> 
> Bearing in mind no other common consumer operating system vendor requires
> you to provide them with your phone number just to use their product...
> 
> And, perhaps worse, for the rest of your life, you can never log into your
> Apple ID without having to have that extra personal device by your side...
> 
>        *What do you think about Apple murdering privacy?*


There *IS* no privacy anywhere - nothing to do with Apple!

You should ask your questions on the Apple Support Communities forums.

https://discussions.apple.com/welcome

Watch out for the 'bad guys' though!

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#47318

David Brooks wrote on Thu, 5 Sep 2024 14:04:10 +0100 :

> Btw, things might improve if you got yourself an iPhone!

Heh heh heh... I have plenty of iPhones. Probably more than you do.
And I have plenty of iPads. Plus plenty of Androids. And PCs too.

While most Apple sheep are completely on only one platform, I'm not.
Remember.... I use these devices to test the *truth* about products.

Which is why I set up the new iPads first, without an Apple ID.
Which was to *test* the *truth* about how it works without an Apple ID.
Which - let's be frank - is an iPad is worthless without an Apple ID.

Which proves the point that Apple designed iOS as a dumb terminal.
Devoid of even the most basic of functionality without logging into Apple.

Having proved that fact, I decided to add an Apple ID to that new iPad.
That's when I found out you *must* add 2FA (since Feb2023).

Only Apple forces you to murder your privacy.
Nobody else does. Only Apple.

Moving forward, since the iPad is a dumb terminal, I added a new Apple ID.
My daily drive is an Android phone. So that's the phone number I used.

Sure, it worked.
But now I have to have Android with me just to log into my Apple device.

That's absurd.
Only Apple could come up with such a ridiculously absurd policy.

Because most Apple customers are ignorant sheep the policy will remain.
Apple customers will put up with anything - they're all ignorant sheep.

The fact is Apple murdered privacy.
And, for me, I have to carry two devices just to log into the Apple one.

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#47323

On 05/09/2024 15:53, Andrew wrote:
> David Brooks wrote on Thu, 5 Sep 2024 14:04:10 +0100 :
> 
>> Btw, things might improve if you got yourself an iPhone!
> 
> Heh heh heh... I have plenty of iPhones. Probably more than you do.
> And I have plenty of iPads. Plus plenty of Androids. And PCs too.
> 
> While most Apple sheep are completely on only one platform, I'm not.
> Remember.... I use these devices to test the *truth* about products.
> 
> Which is why I set up the new iPads first, without an Apple ID.
> Which was to *test* the *truth* about how it works without an Apple ID.
> Which - let's be frank - is an iPad is worthless without an Apple ID.
> 
> Which proves the point that Apple designed iOS as a dumb terminal.
> Devoid of even the most basic of functionality without logging into Apple.
> 
> Having proved that fact, I decided to add an Apple ID to that new iPad.
> That's when I found out you *must* add 2FA (since Feb2023).
> 
> Only Apple forces you to murder your privacy.
> Nobody else does. Only Apple.
> 
> Moving forward, since the iPad is a dumb terminal, I added a new Apple ID.
> My daily drive is an Android phone. So that's the phone number I used.
> 
> Sure, it worked.
> But now I have to have Android with me just to log into my Apple device.
> 
> That's absurd.
> Only Apple could come up with such a ridiculously absurd policy.
> 
> Because most Apple customers are ignorant sheep the policy will remain.
> Apple customers will put up with anything - they're all ignorant sheep.
> 
> The fact is Apple murdered privacy.
> And, for me, I have to carry two devices just to log into the Apple one.

Have you ever visited www.etresoft.com ?

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#47276

badgolferman wrote on Tue, 3 Sep 2024 01:16:18 -0000 (UTC) :

>> By the way, as a normal consumer, can you explain how you can set up a 
>> Windows 11 PC without setting up a Microsoft account?
>> 
> 
> https://www.tomshardware.com/how-to/install-windows-11-without-microsoft-account

Hi badgolferman,

It's ironic that Apple is (yet again) the worst of all in terms of privacy.

As an actual adult, you'll understand that the point of this thread is to
figure out how to satisfy Apple's new 2FV mandatory requirement WITHOUT
giving Apple your very private phone number and without having to carry
that second device with you whenever you need to log into your Apple
device... for the entirety of the rest of your worldly natural life.

For Apple to require two devices just to log in, is patently absurd.
And I don't have to explain to you how brain dead iOS is w/o logging in.

None of the other operating systems are brain dead if you don't log in.
Only Apple operating systems are brain dead if you don't constantly log in.

Anyway, the goal here is to find another method for Apple's absurd
requirement for 2FV (which robs you naked in terms of loss of privacy).

See my other response to you showing Google Voice won't work with Apple.
If we can't figure out a solution, then it's true: Apple murdered privacy.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#47281

On 03/09/2024 03:20, Andrew wrote:
> badgolferman wrote on Tue, 3 Sep 2024 01:16:18 -0000 (UTC) :
> 
>>> By the way, as a normal consumer, can you explain how you can set up a
>>> Windows 11 PC without setting up a Microsoft account?
>>>
>>
>> https://www.tomshardware.com/how-to/install-windows-11-without-microsoft-account
> 
> Hi badgolferman,
> 
> It's ironic that Apple is (yet again) the worst of all in terms of privacy.
> 
> As an actual adult, you'll understand that the point of this thread is to
> figure out how to satisfy Apple's new 2FV mandatory requirement WITHOUT
> giving Apple your very private phone number and without having to carry
> that second device with you whenever you need to log into your Apple
> device... for the entirety of the rest of your worldly natural life.
> 
> For Apple to require two devices just to log in, is patently absurd.
> And I don't have to explain to you how brain dead iOS is w/o logging in.
> 
> None of the other operating systems are brain dead if you don't log in.
> Only Apple operating systems are brain dead if you don't constantly log in.
> 
> Anyway, the goal here is to find another method for Apple's absurd
> requirement for 2FV (which robs you naked in terms of loss of privacy).
> 
> See my other response to you showing Google Voice won't work with Apple.
> If we can't figure out a solution, then it's true: Apple murdered privacy.

May I respectfully suggest that you watch and listen here?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJZ5YcMsgD4

Enjoy! 😀

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#47285

David Brooks wrote on Tue, 3 Sep 2024 20:21:14 +0100 :

> May I respectfully suggest that you watch and listen here?
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJZ5YcMsgD4

As you duly noted, Apple and Big Tobacco have a lot in common.

For example, both Big Tobacco & Apple spend the least in R&D and the most
in Marketing than any company in the technology sector in the entire world.

All Marketing.
No R&D.

Big Tobacco called "Virginia Slims" an "innovation" just like Apple does.
They marketed those copies to gullible uneducated people; just like Apple.

Which is exactly why their customer base is exactly what it happens to be.
Remember, Big Tobacco highly marketed Virginia Slims. And it worked.

Just like Apple's strategy is to copy what other people innovate first.
But the fact Apple can't innovate is why 3/4 of the world is on Android.

For Big Tobacco to simply copy cigarettes is one thing - but for Apple to
only be able to copy innovation means Apple will always lag far behind.

As a direct result of Apple being incapable of doing anything but copying,
you do realize Apple is 5 to 10 years behind the competition, don't you?

If not, tell me how far behind Qualcomm Apple is on 5G modems.
And how many generations behind Google Apple is on AI.
Or how many years behind Hauwei Apple is on just integrating a 5G modem.
etc.

The main reason Apple is five to ten years behind is that Apple long ago
lost the ability to innovate to the point all Apple can do, today, is copy.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#47288

On 03/09/2024 21:28, Andrew wrote:
> David Brooks wrote on Tue, 3 Sep 2024 20:21:14 +0100 :
> 
>> May I respectfully suggest that you watch and listen here?
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJZ5YcMsgD4
> 
> As you duly noted, Apple and Big Tobacco have a lot in common.
> 
> For example, both Big Tobacco & Apple spend the least in R&D and the most
> in Marketing than any company in the technology sector in the entire world.
> 
> All Marketing.
> No R&D.
> 
> Big Tobacco called "Virginia Slims" an "innovation" just like Apple does.
> They marketed those copies to gullible uneducated people; just like Apple.
> 
> Which is exactly why their customer base is exactly what it happens to be.
> Remember, Big Tobacco highly marketed Virginia Slims. And it worked.
> 
> Just like Apple's strategy is to copy what other people innovate first.
> But the fact Apple can't innovate is why 3/4 of the world is on Android.
> 
> For Big Tobacco to simply copy cigarettes is one thing - but for Apple to
> only be able to copy innovation means Apple will always lag far behind.
> 
> As a direct result of Apple being incapable of doing anything but copying,
> you do realize Apple is 5 to 10 years behind the competition, don't you?
> 
> If not, tell me how far behind Qualcomm Apple is on 5G modems.
> And how many generations behind Google Apple is on AI.
> Or how many years behind Hauwei Apple is on just integrating a 5G modem.
> etc.
> 
> The main reason Apple is five to ten years behind is that Apple long ago
> lost the ability to innovate to the point all Apple can do, today, is copy.


Apple is like Marmite - do you know what that is?

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#47284

Jolly Roger wrote on 3 Sep 2024 17:24:11 GMT :

>> Google controls its operating system just as Apple controls its OS.
>> And Google is not requiring MFV for use of their Android operating system.
> 
> Your entire argument is based on a false narrative that 2FA is
> undesirable.

Facts.

No other common consumer operating system vendor does what Apple did.
   *Only Apple*

Unless we can find a way around giving Apple your private identifiers...
   *What is undesirable is Apple murdered privacy*

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#47293

On 2024-09-03, Andrew <andrew@spam.net> wrote:
> Jolly Roger wrote on 3 Sep 2024 17:24:11 GMT :
>
>>> Google controls its operating system just as Apple controls its OS.
>>> And Google is not requiring MFV for use of their Android operating system.
>> 
>> Your entire argument is based on a false narrative that 2FA is
>> undesirable.
>
> Facts.

Nothing you have said proves your implied assumption that 2FA is
undesirable.

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#47294

Jolly Roger wrote on 4 Sep 2024 02:45:28 GMT :

> Nothing you have said proves your implied assumption that 2FA is
> undesirable.

How is being forced to carry your Android phone with you for the rest of
your life just so that you can log into your Apple ID, desirable?

In addition, how is being forced to give Apple your private cell phone
number desirable? 

What's desirable about having to have TWO devices just to log into Apple's
operating system when no other operating system vendor stoops that low?

For the rest of your life (as Apple's 2FA is mandatory & can't be removed).

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#47295

On 2024-09-03 22:11, Andrew wrote:
> Jolly Roger wrote on 4 Sep 2024 02:45:28 GMT :
> 
>> Nothing you have said proves your implied assumption that 2FA is
>> undesirable.
> 
> How is being forced to carry your Android phone with you for the rest of
> your life just so that you can log into your Apple ID, desirable?

That is in no way a description of what is required.

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#47298

On 2024-09-04, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
> On 2024-09-03 22:11, Andrew wrote:
>> Jolly Roger wrote on 4 Sep 2024 02:45:28 GMT :
>> 
>>> Nothing you have said proves your implied assumption that 2FA is
>>> undesirable.
>> 
>> How is being forced to carry your Android phone with you for the rest
>> of your life just so that you can log into your Apple ID, desirable?
>
> That is in no way a description of what is required.

He knows that. He's trolling. The truth is you only need 2FA the *first*
time you sign in on a *new* device. After that, the device is trusted.
And he still hasn't proven his assumed claim that 2FA is supposedly
undesirable or supposedly violates your privacy - both ludicrous claims
on their face. And BGM will claim *we* are the "real trolls" for
pointing these things out, because "success" to BGM and Arlen is lying
without ever being questioned or corrected.

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#47300

Jolly Roger wrote on 4 Sep 2024 15:15:12 GMT :

>>> How is being forced to carry your Android phone with you for the rest
>>> of your life just so that you can log into your Apple ID, desirable?
>>
>> That is in no way a description of what is required.
> 
> He knows that. He's trolling. The truth is you only need 2FA the *first*
> time you sign in on a *new* device. After that, the device is trusted.
> And he still hasn't proven his assumed claim that 2FA is supposedly
> undesirable or supposedly violates your privacy - both ludicrous claims
> on their face. And BGM will claim *we* are the "real trolls" for
> pointing these things out, because "success" to BGM and Arlen is lying
> without ever being questioned or corrected.

Jolly Roger - why is it you brazenly lie when you *hate* what Apple does?
 <https://i.postimg.cc/Y9kkj19v/appleid12.jpg>

FACT:
Apple often requires logging into your Apple ID and we've proved that with
incontrovertible proof, e.g., when Apple changes the terms and conditions.
 <https://i.postimg.cc/LXzB3Lc0/appleid01.jpg>

Assessment of that fact:
The fact you're completely ignorant of that fact doesn't make it a troll.
 <https://i.postimg.cc/hhFNJ5mq/appleid010.jpg> 

FACT:
There are *many* (very many!) other times Apple requires a re-login into
your Apple ID that I'm aware of because I don't do it - and so I am well
aware that Apple will nag you five, ten, fifteen times a day to re login.
 <https://i.postimg.cc/8k3GQyj4/appleid09.jpg>

ASSESSMENT of that fact:
The fact you lie about what Apple does indicates how much you *hate* Apple.
 <https://i.postimg.cc/nrFHSvby/appleid11.jpg>

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#47289

On 9/2/2024 12:11 PM, Andrew wrote:
> What "forms" of 2FA is Apple requiring for all new Apple IDs?
> 
> The fact is of all common consumer operating systems, as of February 2023,
> only Apple *requires* you to completely lose your privacy by forcing you to
> use 2FA (which, for most people, is accomplished by their personal phone).
> 
> Obviously I'm aghast that only Apple completely ignores any request for
> privacy, but I can't fight it and still log into my Apple ID on my iPads.
> 
> While I gave Apple my personal very private cell phone number, because I
> was forced to do it in order to create the new Apple ID, my question here
> is how can we avoid giving Apple our privacy for the rest of our lives?
> 
> What other forms of 2FA can we give Apple to log into new Apple accounts?

You can use a Security Key too. No phone number required.

I fail to see a problem. Online we give out email addresses, phone 
numbers, addresses, SSN, and many other identifying details to obtain 
all kinds of services. All that is a risk of a hack. Why are you picking 
on Apple? Why not your Quicken, your bank, brokerage house, Western 
Union, the IRS, Amazon and so, so, many more?

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