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Re: Windows 32-bit

From "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk>
Newsgroups comp.os.ms-windows.misc, alt.comp.os.windows-xp, alt.windows7.general, microsoft.public.windowsxp.general
Subject Re: Windows 32-bit
Date 2023-12-29 19:07 +0000
Organization 255 software
Message-ID <AvORUBn4jxjlFwEZ@255soft.uk> (permalink)
References (1 earlier) <uj8760.gr8.1@ID-201911.user.individual.net> <qj4jlilucaviemtconeh4qis7jh585q917@4ax.com> <ujdrgd.b4k.1@ID-201911.user.individual.net> <f2usoi10fo0tv1v1npe4v2lijp8g2vqe9a@4ax.com> <umms19.i7o.1@ID-201911.user.individual.net>

Cross-posted to 4 groups.

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In message <umms19.i7o.1@ID-201911.user.individual.net> at Fri, 29 Dec 
2023 15:27:29, Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> writes
>Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> wrote:
>> On 19 Nov 2023 19:34:29 GMT, Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> wrote:
>> >> On 17 Nov 2023 16:16:59 GMT, Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid>
>> >> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> wrote:
>> >> >> Someone stole my laptop computer, and I'm beginning to be concerned
>> >> >> that it may be irreplaceable.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> It was running Windows 7, 32-bit, and it seems that most, if not all,
>> >> >> laptops sold nowadays with Windows installed are 64-bit, which means
>> >> >> they won't run a lot of my software, and that means that they won't
>> >> >> allow me to access a lot of the research data I have collected over
>> >> >> the last 30 years.
>> >> >
>> >> >  64-bit Windows systems can run 32-bit software/programs just fine, so
>> >> >I think you mean you (also) have *16-bit* software/programs which you
>> >> >need to run. Correct?
>> >>
>> >> Yes, and 8-bit ones too. 32-bit Windows runs those just fine, at least
>> >> all the ones I use regularly. There are some it doesn't, but that's a
>> >> hardware rather than an O/S problem, something to do with clock speed.
>> >> Programs written in TurboPascal, for example, won't run on faster
>> >> machines.
>> >
>> >  "8-bit ones" sounds a bit strange, because all (IBM-like) PCs have
>> >always been 16-bit. But perhaps you mean byte-level interpretive code or
>> >some such. Can you give some more details about these "8-bit ones"?
>>
>> I think early programs running on IBM PC DOS or MS DOS were 8-bit,
>> running on 8088 processors. The 286 and 386 ones were 16-bit.
>
>  The usual confusion about the 'bit-ness'! :-)
>
>  The 8088 is actually a 16-bit processor, because it has 16-bit
>registers, etc.. But the width of the *data* bus is 8-bit. The
>instruction set is named 'x86-16'.
>
><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_8088>

I'm pretty sure the original IBM PC used the 8086, which was a 16-bit 
processor (though in some incarnations took two goes to get 16-bit data 
or instructions, over an 8-bit bus). The 8086 came _after_ the 8088; not 
sure what the 8088 was. The 6 in 8086 meant 16 bit, I'm pretty sure.

The 80186 was a rare beast - I don't think the core processor was much 
if any more powerful (by whatever mention you like), but the chip had 
some on-board bits that were normally implemented externally. The BBC 
Micro "second processor" board used it, offering a weird sort of PC 
(using Dr. DOS, IIRR); I don't know any other machine that used it.
>
>  Likewise, the 80286 is also a 16-bit processor, but with a 16-bit data
>bus and also a 'x86-16' instruction set (with extensions).
>
><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_80286>
>
>  The 80386 is a 32-bit processor, with a 16-bit or 32-bit databus and a
>'x86-32' instruction set.
>
><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I386>
>
>  As far as I know, none of the x86 processors were 8-bit processors.

For 386 and 486, the confusingly changed what "SX" and "DX" meant; on 
one (I forget which), SX meant it _didn't_ have a floating-point maths 
co-processor on board, DX meant it did. On the other, SX meant it had a 
half-width (so 16?) bus outside the chip (so requiring two fetches to 
get a word), DX had more pins on the chip. Motherboards for the one that 
might or might not have the co-processor on chip often had a socket for 
an external co-processor - I think that was the '387, so it's probably 
the 3 series that was that. There were rumours as the time that 386SX 
and 387 chips were actually 386DX chips that had failed at final test 
but where the main processor or the co-processor part had passed; I've 
no idea if there was any truth in that. (Certainly, a few years earlier, 
the same sort of principle _had_ been used with SRAM chips - ones of a 
certain size were available in two versions, one with one of the enable 
pins active high and one active low, which were actually SRAMs of twice 
the size which had failed final test but either the upper or lower half 
worked.)
>
>  So consequently, also the IBM PC DOS and MS-DOS programs were 16-bit.
>
>[No longer relevant stuff deleted.]
>
>> Anyway, I have now acquired a 2nd-hand Dell with a 30-bit Windows 10
>> OS, and my DOS programs appear to run on it, so I'm not going to need
>> VirtualBox just yet.
>
>  Great! Good outcome!

Indeed! (32 bit I presume!)
>
>> But thanks to everyone who replied on the Windows question (the time
>> discussion was less useful).
>
>  You're welcome.
-- 
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

he was eventually struck off by the BMA in 1968 for not knowing his gluteus
maximus from his humerus.

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Thread

Windows 32-bit Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2023-11-17 15:02 +0200
  Re: Windows 32-bit Marco Moock <mm+usenet-es@dorfdsl.de> - 2023-11-17 14:06 +0100
    Re: Windows 32-bit Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2023-11-17 11:37 -0600
      Re: Windows 32-bit "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2023-11-17 18:04 +0000
        Re: Windows 32-bit Daniel65 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2023-11-18 19:28 +1100
          Re: Windows 32-bit John Hall <john_nospam@jhall.co.uk> - 2023-11-18 10:13 +0000
            Re: Windows 32-bit Daniel65 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2023-11-18 22:49 +1100
            Re: Windows 32-bit Char Jackson <none@none.invalid> - 2023-11-18 13:28 -0600
              Re: Windows 32-bit John Hall <john_nospam@jhall.co.uk> - 2023-11-19 08:55 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Daniel65 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2023-11-19 23:01 +1100
                Re: Windows 32-bit "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2023-11-19 12:58 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2023-11-19 10:44 -0600
                Re: Windows 32-bit Bob F <bobnospam@gmail.com> - 2023-11-19 11:32 -0800
                Re: Windows 32-bit John Hall <john_nospam@jhall.co.uk> - 2023-11-19 21:38 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Daniel65 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2023-11-20 20:40 +1100
                Re: Windows 32-bit "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2023-11-20 10:07 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Daniel65 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2023-11-21 00:26 +1100
                Re: Windows 32-bit "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2023-11-20 14:11 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Daniel65 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2023-11-21 20:20 +1100
                Re: Windows 32-bit "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2023-11-21 10:08 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Daniel65 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2023-11-21 23:15 +1100
                Re: Windows 32-bit John Hall <john_nospam@jhall.co.uk> - 2023-11-20 18:23 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Char Jackson <none@none.invalid> - 2023-11-20 23:00 -0600
                Re: Windows 32-bit "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2023-11-21 10:12 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Char Jackson <none@none.invalid> - 2023-11-21 20:59 -0600
                Re: Windows 32-bit "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2023-11-22 05:02 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Char Jackson <none@none.invalid> - 2023-11-22 02:38 -0600
                Re: Windows 32-bit John Hall <john_nospam@jhall.co.uk> - 2023-11-22 10:11 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Char Jackson <none@none.invalid> - 2023-11-22 23:08 -0600
                Re: Windows 32-bit "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2023-11-22 10:28 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2023-11-22 10:12 -0500
                Re: Windows 32-bit Daniel65 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2023-11-21 20:22 +1100
                Re: Windows 32-bit Char Jackson <none@none.invalid> - 2023-11-20 14:45 -0600
        Re: Windows 32-bit Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2023-11-18 11:37 -0600
          Re: Windows 32-bit Zaidy036 <Zaidy036@air.isp.spam> - 2023-11-18 15:00 -0500
            Re: Windows 32-bit Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2023-11-18 20:38 +0000
              Re: Windows 32-bit John Hall <john_nospam@jhall.co.uk> - 2023-11-19 08:57 +0000
            Re: Windows 32-bit Daniel65 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2023-11-19 20:00 +1100
            Re: Windows 32-bit Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2023-11-19 10:47 -0600
        Re: Windows 32-bit Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2023-11-18 13:10 -0800
          Re: Windows 32-bit John Hall <john_nospam@jhall.co.uk> - 2023-11-19 09:00 +0000
            Re: Windows 32-bit Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2023-11-19 13:45 -0800
              Re: Windows 32-bit John Hall <john_nospam@jhall.co.uk> - 2023-11-20 08:46 +0000
      Re: Windows 32-bit Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2023-11-19 06:12 +0200
        Re: Windows 32-bit Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2023-11-19 10:54 -0600
  Re: Windows 32-bit "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2023-11-17 13:36 +0000
    Re: Windows 32-bit GlowingBlueMist <zapbot@truely.invalid> - 2023-11-17 09:05 -0600
    Re: Windows 32-bit Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2023-11-19 06:43 +0200
      Re: Windows 32-bit Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2023-11-19 11:28 -0500
  Re: Windows 32-bit Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2023-11-17 16:16 +0000
    Re: Windows 32-bit Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2023-11-19 07:01 +0200
      Re: Windows 32-bit Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2023-11-19 19:34 +0000
        Re: Windows 32-bit Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2023-12-29 09:49 +0200
          Re: Windows 32-bit Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2023-12-29 15:27 +0000
            Re: Windows 32-bit "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2023-12-29 19:07 +0000
              Re: Windows 32-bit Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2023-12-29 19:56 +0000
              Re: Windows 32-bit Tim Slattery <TimSlattery@utexas.edu> - 2023-12-30 12:10 -0500
                Re: Windows 32-bit "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2023-12-30 20:27 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2023-12-30 23:14 -0500
                Re: Windows 32-bit "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2023-12-31 05:12 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Daniel65 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2023-12-31 23:17 +1100
                Re: Windows 32-bit "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2023-12-31 12:37 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2023-12-31 11:35 -0500
                Re: Windows 32-bit "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2023-12-31 19:15 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2023-12-31 14:43 -0600
                Re: Windows 32-bit Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2024-01-01 11:25 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Daniel65 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> - 2024-01-01 21:04 +1100
                Re: Windows 32-bit Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2023-12-31 14:39 -0600
                Re: Windows 32-bit Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2023-12-31 22:11 -0500
          Re: Windows 32-bit Tim Slattery <TimSlattery@utexas.edu> - 2023-12-29 11:31 -0500
            Re: Windows 32-bit "Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2024-01-02 13:22 +0000
  Re: Windows 32-bit Ralph Fox <-rf-nz-@-.invalid> - 2023-11-18 06:56 +1300
    Re: Windows 32-bit Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2023-11-19 07:07 +0200
      Re: Windows 32-bit Ralph Fox <-rf-nz-@-.invalid> - 2023-11-19 21:07 +1300
      Re: Windows 32-bit Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2023-11-19 13:52 -0500
        Re: Windows 32-bit Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2023-12-29 09:54 +0200
  Re: Windows 32-bit Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2023-11-18 06:53 -0500
    Re: Windows 32-bit Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2023-11-19 07:41 +0200
      Re: Windows 32-bit Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2023-11-19 03:17 -0500
        Re: Windows 32-bit Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2023-11-19 16:57 +0000
          Re: Windows 32-bit Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2023-11-19 13:57 -0500
          Re: Windows 32-bit Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2023-11-19 14:21 -0500
            Re: Windows 32-bit Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2023-11-19 21:22 +0000
              Re: Windows 32-bit Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2023-11-19 17:56 -0500
                Re: Windows 32-bit Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2023-11-19 23:59 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2023-11-20 12:45 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2023-11-20 15:19 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2024-06-07 00:39 +0100
                Re: Windows 32-bit "Auric__" <not.my.real@email.address> - 2024-06-07 14:50 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2024-06-07 11:33 -0400
                Re: Windows 32-bit Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2024-06-07 16:50 +0100
                Re: Windows 32-bit "Auric__" <not.my.real@email.address> - 2024-06-08 16:34 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2024-06-08 18:09 +0100
                Re: Windows 32-bit Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2024-06-09 19:03 -0400
                Re: Windows 32-bit "Auric__" <not.my.real@email.address> - 2024-06-11 06:16 +0000
        Re: Windows 32-bit Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2023-12-29 09:59 +0200
      Re: Windows 32-bit "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2023-11-19 13:32 +0000
  Re: Windows 32-bit Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> - 2023-11-19 13:59 +0000
    Re: Windows 32-bit Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2023-12-29 10:07 +0200
      Re: Windows 32-bit Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2023-12-29 04:21 -0500
        Re: Windows 32-bit "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2023-12-29 11:56 +0000
          Re: Windows 32-bit Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2023-12-29 12:26 -0600
            Re: Windows 32-bit Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2023-12-29 22:38 -0500
              Re: Windows 32-bit "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2023-12-30 08:30 +0000
                Re: Windows 32-bit Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2023-12-30 15:26 -0600
        Re: Windows 32-bit Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> - 2024-01-04 17:48 +0200

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