Re: Centos stream of batpiss

Subject	Re: Centos stream of batpiss
Newsgroups	comp.os.linux.misc
References	<v04g5g$3hofl$1@paganini.bofh.team> <v05kel$uh9t$1@dont-email.me> <1cednanf4p_sOsf7nZ2dnZfqn_WdnZ2d@earthlink.com> <slrnv5m5tm.4td.rotflol2@geidiprime.bvh>
From	"26xh.0717" <26xh.0718@e6t4y.net>
Organization	snippy grate
Date	2024-06-11 22:31 -0400
Message-ID	<ZxKdnRxS2dwAlfT7nZ2dnZfqn_SdnZ2d@earthlink.com> (permalink)

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On 6/1/24 8:44 AM, Borax Man wrote:
> On 2024-06-01, 26xh.0717 <26xh.0718@e6t4y.net> wrote:
>> On 4/22/24 8:16 AM, John McCue wrote:
>>> Mich <mich@none.edu> wrote:
>>>> I dug out an old workstation with Centos 8 stream. (...snip)
>>>> It is more or less going to remove KDE Plasma if I say y.
>>>
>>> Not a big surprise to me :(
>>>
>>> When I had a RHEL Workstation, when I upgraded from 7 to 8
>>> (or 8-9?), KDE was broken during that upgrade and Fluxbox
>>> started to have issues too.
>>>
>>> Seems RHEL wants you to use GNOME or nothing.  On Fluxbox
>>> some applications and almost all proprietary applications I
>>> had to use at work would fail unless you are running GNOME 3.
>>> Same with KDE, but pieces of KDE would also fail.
>>>
>>> At the time, I did a search and seems Red Hat is doing all
>>> it can to prevent the use of KDE on RHEL.  Maybe that
>>> philosophy moved to CentOS.
>>>
>>> Sad to say, may be time to move to another distro.
>>
>>     Look, it's not JUST RHEL/Centos/Etc (though now you
>>     are kinda being a beta-tester for IBM by using
>>     Centos).
>>
>>     One of the biggest issues with Linux is the "dependencies
>>     problem". Everything is writ to use THE existing versions
>>     of libs and such and you can't update one thing without
>>     parallel updates on everything downstream, and downstream
>>     from them and ....
>>
>>     As the OS and selection of apps got much bigger, this
>>     problem became much bigger. It's almost in an 'exponential'
>>     phase now. SOMEWHERE you're gonna run into a missing
>>     dependency.
>>
>>     For all its crappiness, DOS/Winders is MUCH better in
>>     this respect. Hell, I've got an old Core-2-Quad board
>>     that will still run 8/16 DOS apps from the Ancient Days.
>>     Anybody remember ".COM" files ?  :-)
>>
>>     Library writers are expected to maintain backwards
>>     compatibility, so it doesn't matter if your app is 2024
>>     and yer libs are 1994. So long as they exist, things
>>     generally work pretty well. This has changed a bit
>>     for Win 11/12 ... dem bastards ... but still most of
>>     yer older apps will still run fine.
>>
>>     Linux needs a new paradigm, kind of like with Win.
>>     Alas I think Linux is too set-in-stone and this
>>     will never happen. We will have to wait for some
>>     whole new OS.
>>
>>     As for RHEL/etc and Gnome ... it's a HORRIBLE
>>     GUI ! Don't know WHY they're so stuck on it.
> 
> I will say this is one thing that I do think Microsoft have done very
> well, backwards binary compatibility.  It has come at a cost, the OS
> has to have cruft to support these old programs, but binary backward
> compatibility IS important.  Linux doesn't fare as well, mostly
> because the libraries break.  But then again, DOS programs are self
> contained, they are statically linked and always contain the library
> code within the application, whereas with Unix, theyve used system
> libraries from the start, and this makes backwards compatibility more complex.
> 
> I have been able to keep the same Linux binaries running for years and
> years, as long as they are just linked against glibc.  Those
> statically linked, or pure assembler have no issues continuing to run.
> 
> I guess its swings and roundabouts as they say, how often do you NEED
> to run, natively, a really old binary?  Today, I run old .COM files in
> DosBox, which gives me a better chance than Windows or even FreeDOS if
> that .COM needs EGA or CGA graphics.  DosBox runs fine on Linux.


   DosBox is good, as are KVM and VirtualBox. However none
   are QUITE as good as running native on the hardware.

   I do have a few DOS apps I still use - but I long since
   went all Linux/Unix so I don't have to run 'em under
   Winders. I also have some DOS apps I just *like* to
   run - the old multi-pass 'C' and Pascal compilers
   plus Turbo. Wrote a lot of apps for those and it's
   fun to bring 'em up and play around. Even have
   CP/M-86 and Winders-1 running in VirtualBox.

   Still, at least until quite recently, M$ and Intel
   DID maintain impressive backwards compatibility.
   Linux, except maybe those simpler 'core' type
   utilities, has more problems here. TOO many
   versions of TOO many libs. It's become a MESS
   and an IMPEDIMENT.

   Is there a fix ?

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Centos stream of batpiss Mich <mich@none.edu> - 2024-04-22 09:57 +0800
  Re: Centos stream of batpiss Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-04-22 04:15 +0000
    Re: Centos stream of batpiss "26xh.0717" <26xh.0718@e6t4y.net> - 2024-06-01 00:59 -0400
  Re: Centos stream of batpiss John McCue <jmccue@fuzzball.jmcunx.com> - 2024-04-22 12:16 +0000
    Re: Centos stream of batpiss Marco Moock <mm+usenet-es@dorfdsl.de> - 2024-04-22 16:55 +0200
      Re: Centos stream of batpiss John McCue <jmccue@fuzzball.jmcunx.com> - 2024-04-22 19:33 +0000
    Re: Centos stream of batpiss Mich <mich@none.edu> - 2024-04-23 20:11 +0800
    Re: Centos stream of batpiss "26xh.0717" <26xh.0718@e6t4y.net> - 2024-06-01 00:45 -0400
      Re: Centos stream of batpiss Borax Man <rotflol2@hotmail.com> - 2024-06-01 12:44 +0000
        Re: Centos stream of batpiss Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-02 23:15 +0000
          Re: Centos stream of batpiss Borax Man <rotflol2@hotmail.com> - 2024-06-03 03:25 +0000
            Re: Centos stream of batpiss Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-16 02:46 +0000
        Re: Centos stream of batpiss "26xh.0717" <26xh.0718@e6t4y.net> - 2024-06-11 22:31 -0400
      Re: Centos stream of batpiss Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-02 23:15 +0000
        Re: Centos stream of batpiss Bud Frede <frede@mouse-potato.com> - 2024-06-07 07:44 -0400
          Re: Centos stream of batpiss Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2024-06-07 18:09 +0000
            Re: Centos stream of batpiss Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2024-06-16 02:49 +0000
              Re: Centos stream of batpiss Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2024-06-16 22:44 +0100
                Re: Centos stream of batpiss not@telling.you.invalid (Computer Nerd Kev) - 2024-06-17 08:55 +1000
                Re: Centos stream of batpiss Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2024-06-17 07:47 +0100

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