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Re: Strange range

From Stephen Hansen <me+python@ixokai.io>
Newsgroups comp.lang.python
Subject Re: Strange range
Date 2016-04-02 23:43 -0700
Message-ID <mailman.391.1459665795.28225.python-list@python.org> (permalink)
References (4 earlier) <87lh4xjt37.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <1671ea2b-09ff-4745-a6e7-d2c57864cba3@googlegroups.com> <87zitbpwpr.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net> <mailman.375.1459631138.28225.python-list@python.org> <87vb3zpu49.fsf@elektro.pacujo.net>

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On Sat, Apr 2, 2016, at 02:40 PM, Marko Rauhamaa wrote:
> That's why I was looking for counterexamples in the standard library

This entire bent of an argument seems flawed to me.

The standard library has never been a beacon for best practices or
idiomatic uses of Python. That a use exists in the standard library, or
that one does not, doesn't really tell you anything meaningful about
Python itself or good practices with the language. The standard library
is under uniquely conservative constraints that enshrine compatibility
and reliability from one point release to another over any kind of
innovation. 

That code exists in the standard library is, itself, an incredibly
strong reason why it should stay as IS: changes for style, idiom, best
practices, modern techniques, those are all valid but *weak* arguments
to change the standard library. 

The stdlib works and its continuing to work tomorrow is its most
important burden. Just look at how much of the stdlib is not PEP8
compliant. Changing it to be PEP8 compliant is seen as a worse thing to
do then the possibility of introducing bugs by doing such a sweeping
change in the interest of good practices and style.

The stdlib exists as a bastion of stability above all else. Its
standards aren't a reason to make a change (or, not to make a change,
either). That doesn't mean its not useful to look at the standard
library, but you should not enshrine it as the example of good or
idiomatic code to measure decisions against. Most code exists outside
the stdlib. 

---
Stephen Hansen
  m e @ i x o k a i . i o

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Thread

Strange range Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2016-04-01 16:15 +0300
  Re: Strange range Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2016-04-02 00:24 +1100
  Re: Strange range Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2016-04-02 00:26 +1100
    Re: Strange range Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2016-04-01 17:12 +0300
      Re: Strange range Random832 <random832@fastmail.com> - 2016-04-01 10:39 -0400
    Re: Strange range Fabien <fabien.maussion@gmail.com> - 2016-04-01 16:16 +0200
      Re: Strange range Jussi Piitulainen <jussi.piitulainen@helsinki.fi> - 2016-04-01 17:28 +0300
      Re: Strange range Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2016-04-02 01:31 +1100
        Re: Strange range Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2016-04-01 17:34 +0300
          Re: Strange range Jussi Piitulainen <jussi.piitulainen@helsinki.fi> - 2016-04-01 17:44 +0300
          Re: Strange range Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2016-04-02 01:45 +1100
            Re: Strange range Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2016-04-01 18:43 +0300
          Re: Strange range Erik <python@lucidity.plus.com> - 2016-04-01 20:58 +0100
            Re: Strange range Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2016-04-01 23:14 +0300
              Re: Strange range Rob Gaddi <rgaddi@highlandtechnology.invalid> - 2016-04-01 20:21 +0000
                Re: Strange range Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2016-04-01 23:44 +0300
              Re: Strange range Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2016-04-02 21:09 +1100
                Re: Strange range Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2016-04-02 13:48 +0300
          Re: Strange range Ned Batchelder <ned@nedbatchelder.com> - 2016-04-02 12:47 -0700
            Re: Strange range Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2016-04-02 23:44 +0300
              Re: Strange range Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2016-04-03 07:05 +1000
                Re: Strange range Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2016-04-03 00:40 +0300
                Re: Strange range Ned Batchelder <ned@nedbatchelder.com> - 2016-04-02 14:50 -0700
                Re: Strange range Stephen Hansen <me+python@ixokai.io> - 2016-04-02 23:43 -0700
                Re: Strange range Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2016-04-03 09:58 +0300
                Re: Strange range Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2016-04-03 17:10 +1000
                Re: Strange range Ethan Furman <ethan@stoneleaf.us> - 2016-04-03 09:28 -0700
                Re: Strange range Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2016-04-04 13:21 +0100
                Re: Strange range Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2016-04-03 17:08 +1000
              Re: Strange range Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2016-04-03 14:43 +1000
                Re: Strange range Random832 <random832@fastmail.com> - 2016-04-03 01:20 -0400
                Re: Strange range Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2016-04-03 15:28 +1000
      Re: Strange range Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2016-04-01 17:32 +0300
  Re: Strange range Random832 <random832@fastmail.com> - 2016-04-01 10:42 -0400
  Re: Strange range Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2016-04-02 01:50 +1100
  Re: Strange range Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2016-04-01 08:52 -0600

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