Groups > comp.lang.python > #92050

Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class

From	Laura Creighton <lac@openend.se>
Subject	Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class
References	(10 earlier) <98Ibx.766729$kA6.22200@fx46.am4> <mailman.127.1433365118.13271.python-list@python.org> <cpKbx.674783$ob3.28981@fx47.am4> <mailman.131.1433368169.13271.python-list@python.org><EJLbx.765869$qW.326303@fx20.am4> <mailman.155.1433412387.13271.python-list@python.org><16Xbx.946577$396.102361@fx12.am4>
Date	2015-06-04 15:39 +0200
Newsgroups	comp.lang.python
Message-ID	<mailman.158.1433425154.13271.python-list@python.org> (permalink)

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In a message of Thu, 04 Jun 2015 13:01:00 +0100, BartC writes:
>On 04/06/2015 11:06, Laura Creighton wrote:
>> In a message of Thu, 04 Jun 2015 00:04:04 +0100, BartC writes:
>>> Mainly the language itself. But I've also been looking at the workings
>>> of CPython. (Also PyPy but obviously I'm not going to get anywhere
>>> there, although RPython sounds intriguing.)
>>
>> Why not?  We built the thing for people like you who want to design
>> their own language.
>
>(I thought you wrote bookkeeping systems?)

Yes, but I have to do something for fun, now, too don't I?  There is only
so much fun you can get out of a bookkeeping system.

>> This makes me sad.  What are we doing wrong
>> that you think you won't get anywhere there?

snip

>To make use of PyPy, I understand that I have to code my interpreter in 
>RPython, with various hints, and it is the execution paths in this code 
>that are somehow optimised at runtime.
>
>However, I've seen at the video someone posted of the keynote talk about 
>PyPy (https://youtu.be/l_HBRhcgeuQ), and it does look a rather 
>intimidating process (apparently taking several hours to compile the 
>smallest code tweak; currently it takes me about 1 second to try 
>something new).

We have a way to run the tests without compiling the whole thing every
time.  Not quite the same, but not quite as horrible as you might imagine.
And, happy news, Armin has had a new idea.
https://mail.python.org/pipermail/pypy-dev/2015-February/013085.html
When this goes in, warmup times will get much faster, which will mean
that everyting goes a lot faster.  (We think.  In theory.  We will
see.)

>Also, I'm using Windows where even ordinary Python development doesn't 
>really work; I had to use Ubuntu (a completely alien environment to me) 
>to attempt compiling Cpython).

PyPy development on Windows has gotten a whole lot better since that
keynote -- what it took was getting some PyPy developers who use
windows.  But they are still in short supply.  And yes, it is probably
still easier for linux people.

But if one of your goals is better performance, well, python-list
isn't the place to find the people who spend most of their lives
thinking about such things.  Whereas pypy-dev is one such place.

>-- 
>Bartc
>-- 

At any rate, if there is any interest you can come visit the irc channel
on freenode, or send mail to pypy-dev, which isn't gatewayed to usenet
anywhere.  https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev

You won't get philosophical notes about the meaning of objects
and the like there.  It's a pretty down-to-earth-and-here-is-the-code
and 'you are slow because you do X do Y instead' sort of place.  But
polite and friendly.

Laura

Thread

Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Eddilbert Macharia <edd.cowan@gmail.com> - 2015-05-31 07:34 -0700
  Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Marco Buttu <marco.buttu@gmail.com> - 2015-05-31 17:13 +0200
  Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2015-05-31 11:37 -0400
  Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2015-06-01 04:00 +1000
    Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class "Dr. Bigcock" <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-06-01 10:35 -0700
  Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Eddilbert Macharia <edd.cowan@gmail.com> - 2015-05-31 17:29 -0700
    Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2015-06-01 14:09 +1000
  Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Eddilbert Macharia <edd.cowan@gmail.com> - 2015-05-31 20:09 -0700
    Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2015-06-01 14:24 +1000
  Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Eddilbert Macharia <edd.cowan@gmail.com> - 2015-06-01 05:03 -0700
    Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-01 23:59 +0100
      Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-02 11:45 +0100
        Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 04:16 -0700
      Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 09:09 -0600
    Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class TheDoctor <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-06-01 17:24 -0700
      Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 10:32 +1000
        Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class TheDoctor <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-06-01 18:02 -0700
          Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2015-06-02 16:30 +1000
        Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class TheDoctor <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-06-01 18:15 -0700
          Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 11:30 +1000
          Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class random832@fastmail.us - 2015-06-02 00:13 -0400
          Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2015-06-02 16:23 +1000
      Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2015-06-01 20:15 -0700
        Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2015-06-02 04:46 +0100
        Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class TheDoctor <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-06-01 21:47 -0700
          Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2015-06-01 22:01 -0700
            Religion [was Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class] Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2015-06-02 16:04 +1000
              Re: Religion [was Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class] Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2015-06-01 23:17 -0700
              Re: Religion [was Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class] Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2015-06-02 07:20 +0100
      Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class random832@fastmail.us - 2015-06-02 00:08 -0400
        Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class TheDoctor <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-06-01 21:54 -0700
      Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2015-06-02 17:12 +1000
        Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 00:44 -0700
          Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 18:37 +1000
            Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 02:18 -0700
            Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2015-06-02 12:23 +0300
  Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class vern.muhr@gmail.com - 2015-06-01 14:12 -0700
  Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Eddilbert Macharia <edd.cowan@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 03:36 -0700
    Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2015-06-02 12:11 +0100
    Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2015-06-02 21:27 +1000
      Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 04:40 -0700
        Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2015-06-03 01:08 +1000
          Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Rustom Mody <rustompmody@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 09:14 -0700
      Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-02 13:49 +0100
        Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2015-06-02 16:13 +0300
        Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2015-06-03 03:00 +1000
          Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-02 18:59 +0100
            Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class random832@fastmail.us - 2015-06-02 14:07 -0400
            Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Ned Batchelder <ned@nedbatchelder.com> - 2015-06-02 11:10 -0700
              Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 13:36 -0600
            Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.co.uk> - 2015-06-02 18:10 +0000
            Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class "Dr. Bigcock" <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 11:22 -0700
              Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.co.uk> - 2015-06-02 18:47 +0000
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class "Dr. Bigcock" <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 12:00 -0700
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.co.uk> - 2015-06-02 19:31 +0000
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 13:50 -0600
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2015-06-02 21:19 +0000
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2015-06-03 01:33 +0300
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class "Dr. Bigcock" <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 15:49 -0700
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2015-06-03 18:13 +1000
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class "Dr. Bigcock" <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-06-03 21:38 -0700
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2015-06-03 18:24 +1000
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2015-06-03 11:57 +0300
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2015-06-03 07:57 -0600
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class "Dr. Bigcock" <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-06-03 21:42 -0700
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class "Dr. Bigcock" <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 12:58 -0700
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2015-06-02 22:47 +0100
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 18:49 -0600
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2015-06-03 18:32 +1000
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Ian Kelly <ian.g.kelly@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 13:37 -0600
            Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Steven D'Aprano <steve+comp.lang.python@pearwood.info> - 2015-06-03 18:08 +1000
          Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class "Dr. Bigcock" <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 11:00 -0700
      Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Eddilbert Macharia <edd.cowan@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 21:16 -0700
        Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2015-06-03 06:23 +0100
        Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-03 11:20 +0100
          Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2015-06-03 20:38 +1000
            Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-03 12:08 +0100
              Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2015-06-03 15:08 +0300
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-03 17:00 +0100
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2015-06-03 17:29 +0100
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-03 19:59 +0100
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2015-06-03 21:58 +0100
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-03 22:33 +0100
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Mark Lawrence <breamoreboy@yahoo.co.uk> - 2015-06-03 22:49 +0100
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-04 00:04 +0100
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Laura Creighton <lac@openend.se> - 2015-06-04 12:06 +0200
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-04 13:01 +0100
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Laura Creighton <lac@openend.se> - 2015-06-04 15:39 +0200
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class "Dr. Bigcock" <dreamingforward@gmail.com> - 2015-06-03 21:50 -0700
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Eddilbert Macharia <edd.cowan@gmail.com> - 2015-06-03 22:43 -0700
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Michael Torrie <torriem@gmail.com> - 2015-06-03 10:36 -0600
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-03 18:26 +0100
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Steven D'Aprano <steve@pearwood.info> - 2015-06-05 00:11 +1000
                Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2015-06-03 13:17 -0400
              Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Chris Angelico <rosuav@gmail.com> - 2015-06-03 22:19 +1000
              Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Marco Buttu <marco.buttu@gmail.com> - 2015-06-03 14:10 +0200
          Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-03 12:13 +0100
          Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2015-06-03 13:05 -0400
    Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Terry Reedy <tjreedy@udel.edu> - 2015-06-02 12:23 -0400
  Re: Everything is an object in python - object class and type class Eddilbert Macharia <edd.cowan@gmail.com> - 2015-06-03 06:17 -0700

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