Groups > comp.lang.java.programmer > #7835

Re: Style Police (a rant)

Newsgroups	comp.lang.java.programmer
From	Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at>
Subject	Re: Style Police (a rant)
References	(2 earlier) <MPG.28d509bfb828d36d9896ad@202.177.16.121> <slrnj6mj4j.6gl.avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> <d056de37-3406-4ea1-950e-cd762fa35b6b@glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com> <slrnj6pg53.6gl.avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> <MPG.28d727a0ecb36f769896b4@202.177.16.121>
Message-ID	<slrnj6qgcp.6gl.avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> (permalink)
Date	2011-09-11 23:17 +0000

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Wanja Gayk <brixomatic@yahoo.com> wrote:
> avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at says...
>> >   I agree that the evidence for the advantage of a 'var' keyword
>> > over a 'final' is lacking,
>> That Wanja suggested the "var" keyword is an indication of that he has
>> a bias towards functional programming. 
> Hm, I can't really say that this is the case. It's just in the past few 
> years that I'm adopting rather functional paradigms, But using "final"
> a lot has hardly anything to do with functional programming in my opinion.

Creating new (final) variables all the way, rather than reusing/overwriting
existing ones appears to me typical for functional paradigms...

Actually that is merely a consequence of FP's avoiding of side effects,
so my reverse assumption (lotsa final's => FP) was no more sound than
concluding a past rain from seeing a wet road - merely a rather safe
bet, but not necessarily always true.

> which means I can forget about most of the variables when 
> analyzing code.

To me, making a reference to a mutable type (like Iterator) final
is rather harmful than good. Ok, the iterator won't be replaced by 
another one, but I wouldn't expect that to happen anyway in that 
code. The mutable state within the iterator is essentially part
of the mutable state of that piece of code, thus cannot be
"forgotten" during analysis of the code.

>> I just disagree with Wanja as to making "final" the default: it's
>> like bullying others to functional style in Java.
> The above code is by no means functional, is it?

You're right.  Afterall, it didn't contain all that many finals.
That probably wasn't yet the kind of code that would convince one to
have "final" as default and another keyword for non-final variables.

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Style Police (a rant) Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2011-08-26 20:56 -0400
  Re: Style Police (a rant) Robert Klemme <shortcutter@googlemail.com> - 2011-08-27 09:58 +0200
  Re: Style Police (a rant) Rajiv Gupta <rajiv@invalid.com> - 2011-08-27 18:02 +1000
    Re: Style Police (a rant) v_borchert@despammed.com (Volker Borchert) - 2011-08-27 08:40 +0000
  Re: Style Police (a rant) Jan Burse <janburse@fastmail.fm> - 2011-08-27 13:27 +0200
    Re: Style Police (a rant) Jan Burse <janburse@fastmail.fm> - 2011-08-27 13:33 +0200
      Re: Style Police (a rant) Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2011-08-27 11:08 -0400
      Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-08-27 08:34 -0700
        Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-08-27 08:37 -0700
        Re: Style Police (a rant) Jan Burse <janburse@fastmail.fm> - 2011-08-27 17:59 +0200
          Re: Style Police (a rant) Jan Burse <janburse@fastmail.fm> - 2011-08-27 18:06 +0200
            Re: Style Police (a rant) Jan Burse <janburse@fastmail.fm> - 2011-08-27 18:08 +0200
            Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-08-27 09:50 -0700
              Re: Style Police (a rant) Jan Burse <janburse@fastmail.fm> - 2011-08-27 19:15 +0200
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-08-27 13:09 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Jan Burse <janburse@fastmail.fm> - 2011-08-27 23:18 +0200
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-08-27 16:10 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Jan Burse <janburse@fastmail.fm> - 2011-08-28 01:59 +0200
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-08-27 18:59 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Jan Burse <janburse@fastmail.fm> - 2011-08-28 15:32 +0200
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-08-28 13:09 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Jan Burse <janburse@fastmail.fm> - 2011-08-29 04:02 +0200
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-08-28 19:20 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Jan Burse <janburse@fastmail.fm> - 2011-08-29 09:44 +0200
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-08-29 08:30 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-08-29 16:37 +0000
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-08-29 12:10 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Robert Klemme <shortcutter@googlemail.com> - 2011-08-29 18:21 +0200
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Jan Burse <janburse@fastmail.fm> - 2011-08-29 04:06 +0200
    Re: Style Police (a rant) Wanja Gayk <brixomatic@yahoo.com> - 2011-09-10 06:45 +0200
      Re: Style Police (a rant) Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-09-10 11:40 +0000
        Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-09-10 14:06 -0700
          Re: Style Police (a rant) Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-09-11 14:07 +0000
            Re: Style Police (a rant) Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-09-11 10:55 -0400
              Re: Style Police (a rant) Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-09-11 23:34 +0000
            Re: Style Police (a rant) Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-09-11 10:58 -0400
              Re: Style Police (a rant) Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-09-11 10:12 -0700
              Re: Style Police (a rant) Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-09-14 12:22 +0000
              Re: Style Police (a rant) Bent C Dalager <bcd@pvv.ntnu.no> - 2011-09-14 15:04 +0000
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Paul Cager <paul.cager@googlemail.com> - 2011-09-14 09:36 -0700
            Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-09-11 09:47 -0700
              Re: Style Police (a rant) Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-09-11 23:32 +0000
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Wanja Gayk <brixomatic@yahoo.com> - 2011-09-17 00:57 +0200
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-09-17 19:56 +0000
            Re: Style Police (a rant) Wanja Gayk <brixomatic@yahoo.com> - 2011-09-11 21:20 +0200
              Re: Style Police (a rant) Cthun <cthun_117@qmail.net.au> - 2011-09-11 17:11 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Wanja Gayk <brixomatic@yahoo.com> - 2011-09-12 01:22 +0200
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-09-11 21:13 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Retahiv Oopsiscame <roopsisc@gmail.com> - 2011-09-11 16:54 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Cthun <cthun_117@qmail.net.au> - 2011-09-11 23:42 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Retahiv Oopsiscame <roopsisc@gmail.com> - 2011-09-12 21:54 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) "Cthun" <cthun_117@qmail.net.au> - 2011-09-13 07:18 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Cthun <cthun_117@qmail.net.au> - 2011-09-13 10:07 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-09-13 08:15 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Cthun <cthun_117@qmail.net.au> - 2011-09-13 12:00 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Cthun <cthun_117@qmail.net.au> - 2011-09-13 10:10 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Retahiv Oopsiscame <roopsisc@gmail.com> - 2011-09-13 09:55 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Cthun <cthun_117@qmail.net.au> - 2011-09-15 10:37 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) "Cthun" <cthun_9112011@qmail.net.au> - 2011-09-15 22:58 -0400
                Murphy = Troll [DO NOT FEED] thoolen <th00len@th0lenbot.thorium> - 2011-09-16 00:23 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Retahiv Oopsiscame <roopsisc@gmail.com> - 2011-09-16 03:26 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) un-Bent <dob@dib.dib.null> - 2011-09-16 13:02 +0000
                Murphy = Troll [DO NOT FEED] thoolen <th00len@th0lenbot.thorium> - 2011-09-16 22:40 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Cthun <cthun_117@qmail.net.au> - 2011-09-17 19:36 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) "kaffel'latte" <jiggingjava@qmail.net> - 2011-09-19 08:58 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) thoolen <th00len@th0lenbot.thorium> - 2011-09-19 11:56 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) "kaffel'latte" <jiggingjava@qmail.net> - 2011-09-19 17:05 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) thoolen <th00len@th0lenbot.thorium> - 2011-09-19 19:13 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) k00k Derbyshire spins freely "kaffel'latte" <jiggingjava@qmail.net> - 2011-09-19 20:45 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) k00k Derbyshire spins freely thoolen <th00len@th0lenbot.thorium> - 2011-09-21 18:37 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) "Cthun" <cthun_117@qmail.net.au> - 2011-09-12 04:56 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Cthun <cthun_117@qmail.net.au> - 2011-09-12 05:12 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) "Cthun" <cthun_117@qmail.net.au> - 2011-09-12 04:59 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Cthun <cthun_117@qmail.net.au> - 2011-09-12 05:13 -0400
              Re: Style Police (a rant) Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-09-11 23:17 +0000
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-09-11 21:12 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-09-12 07:36 -0300
              Re: Style Police (a rant) "Cthun" <cthun_117@qmail.net.au> - 2011-09-12 04:58 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Cthun <cthun_117@qmail.net.au> - 2011-09-12 05:12 -0400
        Re: Style Police (a rant) Wanja Gayk <brixomatic@yahoo.com> - 2011-09-11 15:33 +0200
          Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-09-11 09:42 -0700
            Re: Style Police (a rant) Lars Enderin <lars.enderin@telia.com> - 2011-09-11 20:35 +0200
              Re: Style Police (a rant) Retahiv Oopsiscame <roopsisc@gmail.com> - 2011-09-11 16:55 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-09-11 20:36 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Lars Enderin <lars.enderin@telia.com> - 2011-09-12 10:05 +0200
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-09-12 15:35 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Lars Enderin <lars.enderin@telia.com> - 2011-09-13 10:35 +0200
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Retahiv Oopsiscame <roopsisc@gmail.com> - 2011-09-13 09:48 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-09-13 12:18 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Retahiv Oopsiscame <roopsisc@gmail.com> - 2011-09-13 17:30 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Retahiv Oopsiscame <roopsisc@gmail.com> - 2011-09-12 21:59 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Joe Attardi <jattardi@gmail.com> - 2011-09-23 10:54 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) thoolen <th00len@th0lenbot.thorium> - 2011-09-24 01:54 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) "tholen@antispam.ham" <tholen@ifa.hawaii.edu> - 2011-09-24 02:58 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) thoolen <th00len@th0lenbot.thorium> - 2011-09-24 11:35 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Retahiv Oopsiscame <roopsisc@gmail.com> - 2011-09-12 21:58 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) "Cthun" <cthun_117@qmail.net.au> - 2011-09-12 04:52 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Cthun <cthun_117@qmail.net.au> - 2011-09-12 05:14 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) "Cthun" <cthun_117@qmail.net.au> - 2011-09-12 06:42 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Cthun <cthun_117@qmail.net.au> - 2011-09-12 07:20 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) "Cthun" <cthun_117@qmail.net.au> - 2011-09-12 08:46 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) thoolen <th00len@th0lenbot.thorium> - 2011-09-12 21:03 -0400
              Re: Style Police (a rant) Tom Anderson <twic@urchin.earth.li> - 2011-09-12 20:18 +0100
            Re: Style Police (a rant) Wanja Gayk <brixomatic@yahoo.com> - 2011-09-11 21:20 +0200
              Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-09-11 13:52 -0700
          Re: Style Police (a rant) Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-09-12 00:17 +0000
      Re: Style Police (a rant) Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-09-10 21:32 -0400
        Re: Style Police (a rant) Wanja Gayk <brixomatic@yahoo.com> - 2011-09-11 13:27 +0200
          Re: Style Police (a rant) Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-09-11 11:05 -0400
        Re: Style Police (a rant) Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-09-11 13:23 +0000
          Re: Style Police (a rant) Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2011-09-11 10:04 -0400
            Re: Style Police (a rant) Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-09-11 12:45 -0300
              Re: Style Police (a rant) Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-09-11 16:53 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-09-14 12:30 +0000
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2011-09-14 20:47 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-09-14 18:06 -0700
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-09-15 10:06 +0000
                Re: Style Police (a rant) blmblm@myrealbox.com <blmblm.myrealbox@gmail.com> - 2011-09-20 11:28 +0000
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2011-09-20 07:36 -0400
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-09-20 13:04 +0000
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-09-20 20:34 -0300
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-09-14 22:33 -0300
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-09-15 13:46 +0000
                Re: Style Police (a rant) Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-09-14 21:40 -0400
          Re: Style Police (a rant) Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> - 2011-09-11 10:59 -0400
            Re: Style Police (a rant) Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-09-11 21:25 +0000
  Re: Style Police (a rant) Tom Anderson <twic@urchin.earth.li> - 2011-08-27 14:00 +0100
    Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-08-27 08:42 -0700
    Re: Style Police (a rant) Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2011-08-27 11:58 -0400
  Re: Style Police (a rant) "John B. Matthews" <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2011-08-28 08:21 -0400
    Re: Style Police (a rant) Arved Sandstrom <asandstrom3minus1@eastlink.ca> - 2011-08-28 18:07 -0300
  Re: Style Police (a rant) Roedy Green <see_website@mindprod.com.invalid> - 2011-08-29 04:20 -0700
  Re: Style Police (a rant) Tim Slattery <Slattery_T@bls.gov> - 2011-08-29 09:11 -0400
    Re: Style Police (a rant) Eric Sosman <esosman@ieee-dot-org.invalid> - 2011-08-29 20:50 -0400
      Re: Style Police (a rant) Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-08-30 11:27 +0000
        Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-08-30 09:36 -0700
          Re: Style Police (a rant) Andreas Leitgeb <avl@gamma.logic.tuwien.ac.at> - 2011-08-30 17:51 +0000
      Re: Style Police (a rant) Tim Slattery <Slattery_T@bls.gov> - 2011-08-30 08:51 -0400
      Re: Style Police (a rant) Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2011-08-30 09:04 -0700
        Re: Style Police (a rant) Lew <lewbloch@gmail.com> - 2011-08-30 09:43 -0700
          Re: Style Police (a rant) Daniele Futtorovic <da.futt.news@laposte-dot-net.invalid> - 2011-08-31 00:31 +0200

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