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Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge

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On 2013-07-12, Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> wrote:

> Very nice, but the first educational effort must be like jonesforth,
> brutally concrete and single minded. There is but One True Operating
> System Linux and fasm is Its Tool. Death to the infidels!  (Oops.)

These are good choices. I agree Linux is the obvious target for such a
project since people who write code overwhelmingly use Linux on x86 these
days and I said so earlier. Reading Randy Hyde's comments in his HLA
Reference manual starting around 1.7 I wonder if HLA might be a better
choice than fasm since the yourforth project is targeted at beginners and
focused on clear presentation. Professor Hyde's experience was people with
HLL programming experience (Pascal, C, C++, etc.) were able to "get their
heads around the HLA code" much faster than when he used to teach with
MASM. I like fasm because it's elemental and lets you produce an executable
in one go, but hla does that also. I can see  where fasm ought to be very
appealing to Forthers but beginners using this project aren't likely to be
aware of the beauty of a partially self-hosted Forth hosted in a fully
self-hosting assembler ;-)

Hyde does argue rather pursuasively for his approach and has the rubber
meets the road experience to be able to say it. If one doesn't get too
sidetracked by personal feelings on what an assembler out to be and just
wants a low-level language that also happens to present things in a way many
people are used to viewing them the idea would seem to be very practical for
this project, almost perfect really.

However HLA will make porting yourforth to non-x86 targets much harder than
using g(h)as(tly) or even fasm on Linux but again not many people have the
other targets listed who don't also have an x86 desktop computer.

Thanks to everyone carrying on with this idea. I'm excited about seeing what
you come up with.

Bill

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Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge Carsten Strotmann <cas@strotmann.de> - 2013-07-11 22:38 +0200
  Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-07-11 14:08 -0700
    Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-07-12 01:53 +0000
      Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge m.a.m.hendrix@tue.nl - 2013-07-11 23:49 -0700
        Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-07-12 12:24 +0000
    Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge Hannu Vuolasaho <hannu.vuolasaho@nospam.tut.fi.invalid> - 2013-07-12 12:29 +0000
  Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-07-12 01:42 +0000
    Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-07-11 19:42 -0700
      Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-07-12 02:56 +0000
        Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-07-11 20:16 -0700
          Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnotq.cpm> - 2013-07-12 03:14 -0400
            Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-07-12 00:35 -0700
              Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnotq.cpm> - 2013-07-12 04:02 -0400
                Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge Bill Richards <billrich@gmx.com> - 2013-07-12 09:08 +0000
                Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_have@notemailnotq.cpm> - 2013-07-13 06:16 -0400
              Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-07-12 03:02 -0500
                yourforth : progress report albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-08-01 11:00 +0000
                Re: yourforth : progress report "David N. Williams" <williams@umich.edu> - 2013-08-01 08:13 -0400
                Re: yourforth : progress report m.a.m.hendrix@tue.nl - 2013-08-01 07:22 -0700
    Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge Bill Richards <billrich@gmx.com> - 2013-07-12 06:10 +0000
      Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-07-12 12:37 +0000
        Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge Bill Richards <billrich@gmx.com> - 2013-07-12 12:56 +0000
          Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-07-12 13:55 +0000
            Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge Bill Richards <billrich@gmx.com> - 2013-07-12 14:22 +0000
        Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge Bill Richards <billrich@gmx.com> - 2013-07-12 14:30 +0000
          Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-07-12 11:12 -0700
            Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-07-12 19:01 +0000
              Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2013-07-12 23:05 -0700
                Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-07-18 19:38 +0000
    Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge m.a.m.hendrix@tue.nl - 2013-07-12 00:10 -0700
  Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-07-12 16:55 +0000
    jonesforth: taking up the challenge albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-07-18 19:18 +0000
      Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2013-07-18 11:18 -1000
      Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2013-07-18 23:23 +0200
      Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge Mark Wills <markrobertwills@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-07-19 00:47 -0700
        Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge Mark Wills <markrobertwills@yahoo.co.uk> - 2013-07-19 00:54 -0700
        Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2013-07-19 09:50 +0000
          Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2013-07-19 05:24 -0500
      Re: jonesforth: taking up the challenge anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2013-07-22 09:47 +0000

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