Groups | Search | Server Info | Keyboard shortcuts | Login | Register [http] [https] [nntp] [nntps]

Groups > comp.lang.c > #69937

Re: printf format specifier changes

From Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org>
Newsgroups comp.lang.c
Subject Re: printf format specifier changes
Date 2015-09-08 10:08 -0700
Organization None to speak of
Message-ID <lnd1xssus6.fsf@kst-u.example.com> (permalink)
References (8 earlier) <mskcnu$c3b$1@dont-email.me> <HPjHx.11625$La5.4277@fx21.iad> <msmg00$9ob$1@dont-email.me> <cjutua1ginntcb0j3pis2an2s2t9r637f5@4ax.com> <msn142$esu$1@dont-email.me>

Show all headers | View raw

Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> writes:
> On 08/09/2015 16:13, Robert Wessel wrote:
>> On Tue, 8 Sep 2015 12:17:01 +0100, Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> wrote:
>
> [clang]
>>> (** It turns out that clang has been piggy-backing onto top of whatever
>>> gcc has been installed. It uses the include files and library files of
>>> gcc; possibly even its linker. By itself, it can't even compile Hello
>>> World, and that's a 400MB installation!)
>>
>> You do know that GCC doesn't have any of that stuff either
>
> Actually, no I didn't.

Really?  It's been mentioned here numerous times; how did you not know
that?

>                        Although people are always on about the compiler 
> and runtime library being distinct, they are generally supplied 
> together. The person trying to program doesn't care: usually he or she 
> just wants to go from C sources to executable or library.

Yes, a compiler and a runtime library implementation are commonly
supplied together, because you need both of them (along with a linker,
etc.) to be able to compile and run C programs.

> For example, on Windows (forget *nix which lives in a world of its own):
>
> lccwin contains a compiler, include files, linker and library files.
>
> So does Digital Mars C.
>
> So does Pelles C.
>
> So does Tiny C.

Yes, *some* C implementations include both a compiler and a runtime
library implemented by the same group.  Others do not.  (I'll take your
word for it that the ones listed above do so; I'm not familiar with
them.)

> And so does every install of gcc I've ever seen. In spades.
>
> (I installed something a few days ago, which might have been Mingw64, 
> which contains 3500 ".a" library files, and 8200 .h files. Although I'm 
> not sure exactly what I installed as I can't make head of tail of these 
> install/package managers. But gcc on Windows does anyway comes with huge 
> numbers of include files and libraries.

MinGW is a C implementation that includes the gcc compiler and the
Microsoft runtime library.  (I don't know whether the runtime library
is packaged along with it, or whether it depends on it already being on
the system.)

> Actually, I'd quite like to know how to download a bare version of gcc!)

Well, you could build it from source, but it's a little more
compilicated than the usual configure/make/make install sequence,
since gcc bootstraps itself during the build process.

> (except
>  > perhaps the linker, not sure where that comes from, but linkers are
>  > historically system supplied, unlike compilers
>
> (I've just discovered I can use gcc's linker LD.EXE, a single 1.2MB 
> executable, by itself. That solves a lot of problems, removes a 400MB 
> dependency from one of my projects, and is a lot easier to use than via 
> gcc where I usually haven't got a clue what it's up to.)

On my Linux system, the linker (/usr/bin/ld) is provided by the
"binutils" package, which includes a number of other programs including
"ar", "as" (the assembler), "strip", et al.  So there are (at least)
three different software packages (gcc, libc6, binutils) that together
make up the C implementation.  And any of them could be replaced with
something else.

> )?  Hint: glibc is
>> maintained by an essentially entirely independent group of people
>> completely.  Nor is glibc necessary for GCC - Mingw, for example, uses
>> gcc and the MS C library.
>
> I might forget glibc, if it makes life easier to just use the MSVCRT.DLL 
> file guaranteed to be on every Windows machine. If using LD.EXE is 
> viable, then it's usually to have control over exactly what is linked in.

-- 
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) kst-u@mib.org  <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst>
Working, but not speaking, for JetHead Development, Inc.
"We must do something.  This is something.  Therefore, we must do this."
    -- Antony Jay and Jonathan Lynn, "Yes Minister"

Back to comp.lang.c | Previous | Next — Previous in thread | Next in thread | Find similar | Unroll thread

Thread

printf format specifier changes "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2015-07-06 09:04 -0700
  Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-07-06 17:50 +0100
    Re: printf format specifier changes "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2015-07-06 11:34 -0700
      Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-07-06 19:47 +0100
        Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-07-06 19:53 +0100
          Re: printf format specifier changes "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2015-07-06 11:57 -0700
      Re: printf format specifier changes "James Harris" <james.harris.1@gmail.com> - 2015-09-06 10:53 +0100
        Re: printf format specifier changes Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-09-06 04:21 -0700
          Re: printf format specifier changes "James Harris" <james.harris.1@gmail.com> - 2015-09-07 10:40 +0100
            Re: printf format specifier changes Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-09-07 03:07 -0700
              Re: printf format specifier changes "James Harris" <james.harris.1@gmail.com> - 2015-09-07 15:09 +0100
            Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-09-07 12:03 +0100
              Re: printf format specifier changes Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-09-07 12:46 +0100
                Re: printf format specifier changes "James Harris" <james.harris.1@gmail.com> - 2015-09-07 15:24 +0100
              Re: printf format specifier changes "James Harris" <james.harris.1@gmail.com> - 2015-09-07 15:16 +0100
                Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-09-07 17:09 +0100
                Re: printf format specifier changes "James Harris" <james.harris.1@gmail.com> - 2015-09-07 17:47 +0100
                Re: printf format specifier changes Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2015-09-07 13:29 -0400
                Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-09-08 12:17 +0100
                Re: printf format specifier changes Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-09-08 10:13 -0500
                Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-09-08 17:09 +0100
                Re: printf format specifier changes Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-09-08 10:08 -0700
                Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-09-08 19:11 +0100
                Re: printf format specifier changes Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-09-08 12:24 -0700
                Re: printf format specifier changes Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-09-08 14:56 -0500
                Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-09-08 22:18 +0100
                Re: printf format specifier changes Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2015-09-09 09:29 +1200
                Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-09-08 22:58 +0100
                Re: printf format specifier changes Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2015-09-09 10:32 +1200
                Re: printf format specifier changes supercat@casperkitty.com - 2015-09-08 15:57 -0700
                Re: printf format specifier changes Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-09-08 15:12 -0700
                Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-09-08 23:45 +0100
                Re: printf format specifier changes Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-09-08 16:36 -0700
                Re: printf format specifier changes Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-09-08 19:17 -0500
                Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-09-09 09:56 +0100
                Re: printf format specifier changes Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-09-09 11:33 -0700
                Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-09-09 20:35 +0100
                Re: printf format specifier changes Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-09-08 14:51 -0500
                Re: printf format specifier changes David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-09-08 22:41 +0200
              Re: printf format specifier changes Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2015-09-07 12:03 -0400
          Re: printf format specifier changes glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-09-10 06:33 +0000
            Re: printf format specifier changes Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-09-10 02:38 -0700
          Re: printf format specifier changes supercat@casperkitty.com - 2015-09-10 07:01 -0700
            Re: printf format specifier changes Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-09-10 12:47 -0700
              Re: printf format specifier changes supercat@casperkitty.com - 2015-09-10 14:08 -0700
                Re: printf format specifier changes Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-09-10 15:17 -0700
                Re: printf format specifier changes supercat@casperkitty.com - 2015-09-10 16:02 -0700
                Re: printf format specifier changes Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-09-10 17:31 -0700
                Re: printf format specifier changes supercat@casperkitty.com - 2015-09-11 15:43 -0700
                Re: printf format specifier changes Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-09-11 16:23 -0700
                Re: printf format specifier changes Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-09-11 23:33 -0500
                Re: printf format specifier changes Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2015-09-11 21:44 -0700
                Re: printf format specifier changes supercat@casperkitty.com - 2015-09-12 09:02 -0700
                Re: printf format specifier changes Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2015-09-26 15:00 -0700
                Re: printf format specifier changes supercat@casperkitty.com - 2015-09-27 11:21 -0700
                Re: printf format specifier changes Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2015-09-29 10:10 -0700
        Re: printf format specifier changes Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-09-06 13:41 +0100
          Re: printf format specifier changes Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-09-07 00:23 -0500
          Re: printf format specifier changes "James Harris" <james.harris.1@gmail.com> - 2015-09-07 11:31 +0100
            Re: printf format specifier changes Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-09-07 03:54 -0700
    Re: printf format specifier changes Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-07-06 19:44 +0100
      Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-07-06 22:14 +0100
        Re: printf format specifier changes Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-07-06 22:43 -0500
        Re: printf format specifier changes Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-07-06 23:01 -0700
          Re: printf format specifier changes glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-07-07 06:43 +0000
          Re: printf format specifier changes Phil Carmody <pc+usenet@asdf.org> - 2015-07-09 10:52 +0300
            Re: printf format specifier changes Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-07-09 09:26 +0100
              Re: printf format specifier changes Phil Carmody <pc+usenet@asdf.org> - 2015-07-12 12:56 +0300
                Re: printf format specifier changes Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-07-12 06:12 -0700
        Re: printf format specifier changes Rosario19 <Ros@invalid.invalid> - 2015-07-07 10:22 +0200
          Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-07-07 10:10 +0100
      Re: printf format specifier changes Philip Lantz <prl@canterey.us> - 2015-07-07 00:54 -0700
    Re: printf format specifier changes Nobody <nobody@nowhere.invalid> - 2015-07-07 15:08 +0100
      Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-07-07 16:12 +0100
        Re: printf format specifier changes raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2015-07-09 10:34 +0000
          Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-07-09 12:25 +0100
            Re: printf format specifier changes Phil Carmody <pc+usenet@asdf.org> - 2015-07-12 13:02 +0300
              Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-07-12 11:23 +0100
    Re: printf format specifier changes <william@wilbur.25thandClement.com> - 2015-07-07 11:50 -0700
      Re: printf format specifier changes "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2015-07-07 12:14 -0700
    Re: printf format specifier changes Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com> - 2015-07-07 21:52 -0500
      Re: printf format specifier changes Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-07-07 20:42 -0700
        Re: printf format specifier changes Phil Carmody <pc+usenet@asdf.org> - 2015-07-09 11:12 +0300
          Re: printf format specifier changes Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-07-09 05:03 -0700
            Re: printf format specifier changes BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-07-09 13:10 -0500
          Re: printf format specifier changes James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-07-09 08:58 -0400
          Re: printf format specifier changes Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-07-09 08:10 -0700
            Re: printf format specifier changes Phil Carmody <pc+usenet@asdf.org> - 2015-07-12 12:58 +0300
              Re: printf format specifier changes James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-07-12 12:57 -0400
              Re: printf format specifier changes Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-07-12 11:14 -0700
                Re: printf format specifier changes gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2015-07-12 18:26 +0000
      Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-07-08 13:09 +0100
      Re: printf format specifier changes James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-07-08 08:10 -0400
        Re: printf format specifier changes Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com> - 2015-07-08 08:12 -0500
          Re: printf format specifier changes Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-07-08 08:38 -0700
          Re: printf format specifier changes James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-07-08 12:00 -0400
            Re: printf format specifier changes Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com> - 2015-07-08 17:20 -0500
      Re: printf format specifier changes Phil Carmody <pc+usenet@asdf.org> - 2015-07-09 11:08 +0300
    Re: printf format specifier changes Phil Carmody <pc+usenet@asdf.org> - 2015-07-08 20:30 +0300
      Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-07-08 18:56 +0100
        Re: printf format specifier changes gordonb.lmwiv@burditt.org (Gordon Burditt) - 2015-07-09 11:09 -0500
          Re: printf format specifier changes BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-07-09 14:05 -0500
      Re: printf format specifier changes Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-07-08 11:27 -0700
        Re: printf format specifier changes BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-07-08 15:07 -0500
  Re: printf format specifier changes BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-07-06 23:39 -0500
    Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-07-07 10:19 +0100
      Re: printf format specifier changes BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-07-07 07:57 -0500
        Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-07-07 14:15 +0100
          Re: printf format specifier changes Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-07-07 14:46 +0100
          Re: printf format specifier changes BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-07-07 09:37 -0500
        Re: printf format specifier changes Phil Carmody <pc+usenet@asdf.org> - 2015-07-09 11:24 +0300
          Re: printf format specifier changes BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-07-09 09:55 -0500
            Re: printf format specifier changes <william@wilbur.25thandClement.com> - 2015-07-09 11:53 -0700
              Re: printf format specifier changes <william@wilbur.25thandClement.com> - 2015-07-09 13:48 -0700
              Re: printf format specifier changes BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-07-09 17:01 -0500
    Re: printf format specifier changes Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-07-07 10:59 +0100
      Re: printf format specifier changes BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-07-07 07:48 -0500
        Re: printf format specifier changes Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-07-07 14:30 +0100
          Re: printf format specifier changes BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-07-07 10:05 -0500
            Re: printf format specifier changes Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-07-07 23:16 +0100
              Re: printf format specifier changes BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-07-07 20:29 -0500
              Re: printf format specifier changes Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-07-08 00:43 -0700
              Re: printf format specifier changes Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-07-09 02:29 -0500
                Re: printf format specifier changes Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-07-09 10:34 +0100
                Re: printf format specifier changes BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-07-09 09:35 -0500
          Re: printf format specifier changes Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-07-07 08:37 -0700
            Re: printf format specifier changes "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2015-07-07 08:45 -0700
            Re: printf format specifier changes supercat@casperkitty.com - 2015-09-07 08:29 -0700
          Re: printf format specifier changes <william@wilbur.25thandClement.com> - 2015-07-07 12:12 -0700
  Re: printf format specifier changes pooja deshpande <namitadeshpande25@gmail.com> - 2015-07-09 09:29 -0700
    Re: printf format specifier changes "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2015-07-09 09:34 -0700
      Re: printf format specifier changes "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2015-07-09 09:59 -0700
        Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-07-09 22:33 +0100
          Re: printf format specifier changes Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-07-09 15:17 -0700
            Re: printf format specifier changes glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-07-10 00:30 +0000
              Re: printf format specifier changes Reinhardt Behm <rbehm@hushmail.com> - 2015-07-10 09:17 +0800
      Re: printf format specifier changes David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-07-09 10:02 -0700
        Re: printf format specifier changes "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2015-07-09 10:19 -0700
      Re: printf format specifier changes Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-07-09 21:50 +0100
        Re: printf format specifier changes Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-07-09 15:05 -0700
          Re: printf format specifier changes "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2015-07-09 15:09 -0700
          Re: printf format specifier changes Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-07-10 00:28 +0100
            Re: printf format specifier changes raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2015-07-13 20:39 +0000
        Re: printf format specifier changes "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2015-07-09 15:07 -0700
          Re: printf format specifier changes Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-07-09 23:16 +0100
            Re: printf format specifier changes "Rick C. Hodgin" <rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com> - 2015-07-09 15:25 -0700

csiph-web