Groups > linux.debian.bugs.dist > #843420

Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds

From	Russ Allbery <rra@debian.org>
Newsgroups	linux.debian.bugs.dist, linux.debian.policy
Subject	Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds
Date	2017-08-15 22:10 +0200
Message-ID	<ueQk2-5RL-31@gated-at.bofh.it> (permalink)
References	(4 earlier) <uePei-4Zy-9@gated-at.bofh.it> <sDPS9-7Wd-3@gated-at.bofh.it> <uePxE-5lL-13@gated-at.bofh.it> <sDPS9-7Wd-3@gated-at.bofh.it> <uePxE-5lL-13@gated-at.bofh.it>
Organization	The Eyrie

Cross-posted to 2 groups.

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Adrian Bunk <bunk@debian.org> writes:

> Future policy versions might change this definition, but whatever latest
> policy states has to be the definition used by both packages and the
> reproducible builds team.

> Another example is that a package that is reproducible according to the 
> policy definition must not show up as non-reproducible in tracker/DDPO 
> based on results from the reproducible infrastructure.

This seems really inflexible and unnecessarily absolutist.  I don't agree
with taking this approach.

The point of adding this definition to Policy is that we're setting a new
minimum bar for packages in Debian to meet.  We're giving official
blessing to this requirement for Debian packages (at the normal bug level,
not RC bug, for now), meaning this is a goal that the project is working
towards and something every packager should think about at this level.

This in absolutely no way constrains the reproducible build team from
working on raising the bar in the future, just as the absence of this
language from Policy did not prevent them from starting to work on this
problem four years ago.  They should continue to work on making package
builds more reproducible and raising the bar for reproducibility as makes
sense for their goals and judging the impact of that.  Once any new
requirements reach maturity and look feasible and have some project
committment, we'll change Policy to set a new baseline for the whole
project.  But the reproducible builds work should not *wait* for that, and
should definitely push forward and experiment just as they have up until
now.

I do think it might be worth considering distinguishing between packages
that are minimally reproducible and packages that meet higher
reproducibility bars (such as not caring about the location of the build
tree) in reporting infrastructure like tracker.  But I'm totally fine with
surfacing failures on new, higher bars in places like tracker before we
change Policy, just like we've been surfacing reproducibility failures
before Policy said anything about it at all.

-- 
Russ Allbery (rra@debian.org)               <http://www.eyrie.org/~eagle/>

Thread

Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Sean Whitton <spwhitton@spwhitton.name> - 2017-08-12 20:30 +0200
  Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Holger Levsen <holger@layer-acht.org> - 2017-08-12 21:00 +0200
  Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Ondrej Novy <novy@ondrej.org> - 2017-08-12 21:00 +0200
  Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Russ Allbery <rra@debian.org> - 2017-08-12 21:30 +0200
  Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Ximin Luo <infinity0@debian.org> - 2017-08-12 22:10 +0200
    Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Russ Allbery <rra@debian.org> - 2017-08-12 22:30 +0200
      Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Holger Levsen <holger@layer-acht.org> - 2017-08-12 22:40 +0200
  Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Johannes Schauer <josch@debian.org> - 2017-08-12 22:50 +0200
    Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Russ Allbery <rra@debian.org> - 2017-08-12 23:10 +0200
      Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Sean Whitton <spwhitton@spwhitton.name> - 2017-08-13 00:40 +0200
        Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Ximin Luo <infinity0@debian.org> - 2017-08-13 01:20 +0200
          Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Sean Whitton <spwhitton@spwhitton.name> - 2017-08-13 14:30 +0200
        Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Holger Levsen <holger@layer-acht.org> - 2017-08-13 15:40 +0200
        Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds gregor herrmann <gregoa@debian.org> - 2017-08-13 17:00 +0200
        Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Adrian Bunk <bunk@debian.org> - 2017-08-15 20:10 +0200
          Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Holger Levsen <holger@layer-acht.org> - 2017-08-15 22:10 +0200
        Bug#844431: Revised patch: Oppose Adrian Bunk <bunk@stusta.de> - 2017-08-16 17:40 +0200
          Bug#844431: Revised patch: Oppose Russ Allbery <rra@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 18:40 +0200
            Bug#844431: Revised patch: Oppose Adrian Bunk <bunk@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 20:30 +0200
              Bug#844431: Revised patch: Oppose Russ Allbery <rra@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 20:40 +0200
            Bug#844431: Revised patch: Oppose Bill Allombert <ballombe@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 20:50 +0200
              Bug#844431: Revised patch: Oppose Russ Allbery <rra@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 21:20 +0200
                Bug#844431: Revised patch: Oppose Bill Allombert <ballombe@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 23:50 +0200
                Bug#844431: Revised patch: Oppose Russ Allbery <rra@debian.org> - 2017-08-17 00:10 +0200
                Bug#844431: Revised patch: Oppose Ximin Luo <infinity0@debian.org> - 2017-08-21 16:30 +0200
              Bug#844431: Revised patch: Oppose Don Armstrong <don@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 21:40 +0200
                Bug#844431: Revised patch: Oppose Bill Allombert <ballombe@debian.org> - 2017-08-17 00:00 +0200
  Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Adrian Bunk <bunk@debian.org> - 2017-08-15 20:00 +0200
    Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Russ Allbery <rra@debian.org> - 2017-08-15 21:00 +0200
      Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Adrian Bunk <bunk@debian.org> - 2017-08-15 21:20 +0200
        Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Holger Levsen <holger@layer-acht.org> - 2017-08-15 22:00 +0200
          Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Bill Allombert <ballombe@debian.org> - 2017-08-15 23:20 +0200
            Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Ximin Luo <infinity0@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 18:40 +0200
        Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Russ Allbery <rra@debian.org> - 2017-08-15 22:10 +0200
          Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Sean Whitton <spwhitton@spwhitton.name> - 2017-08-15 22:20 +0200
          Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Adrian Bunk <bunk@debian.org> - 2017-08-15 23:10 +0200
            Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Russ Allbery <rra@debian.org> - 2017-08-15 23:40 +0200
            Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Sean Whitton <spwhitton@spwhitton.name> - 2017-08-16 01:10 +0200
              Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Adrian Bunk <bunk@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 07:40 +0200
            Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Mattia Rizzolo <mattia@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 12:30 +0200
              Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Adrian Bunk <bunk@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 13:30 +0200
                Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Ximin Luo <infinity0@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 13:50 +0200
                Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Adrian Bunk <bunk@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 17:10 +0200
                Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Ximin Luo <infinity0@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 17:50 +0200
                Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Adrian Bunk <bunk@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 18:20 +0200
                Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Ximin Luo <infinity0@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 18:40 +0200
                Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Russ Allbery <rra@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 18:50 +0200
                Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Ximin Luo <infinity0@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 20:30 +0200
          Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Bill Allombert <ballombe@debian.org> - 2017-08-15 23:40 +0200
            Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Ximin Luo <infinity0@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 13:00 +0200
            Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Russ Allbery <rra@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 18:40 +0200
              Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Bill Allombert <ballombe@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 20:00 +0200
                Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Russ Allbery <rra@debian.org> - 2017-08-16 20:00 +0200
                Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Chris Lamb <lamby@debian.org> - 2017-08-17 02:50 +0200
                Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Bill Allombert <ballombe@debian.org> - 2017-08-20 21:30 +0200
                Bug#844431: Revised patch: seeking seconds Chris Lamb <lamby@debian.org> - 2017-08-21 02:40 +0200
      Bug#872288: debian-policy: document .buildinfo files Holger Levsen <holger@layer-acht.org> - 2017-08-15 21:50 +0200

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