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Re: Interrupts: can be lost?

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On 07/29/20 21:23, Rick C wrote:
> On Wednesday, July 29, 2020 at 2:44:46 PM UTC-4, Chris wrote:
>> On 07/10/20 07:28, Rick C wrote:
>>> On Friday, July 10, 2020 at 2:01:49 AM UTC-4, Clifford Heath wrote:
>>>> On 10/7/20 11:41 am, Rick C wrote:
>>>>> On Thursday, July 9, 2020 at 6:22:24 PM UTC-4, lasselangwad...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>>> torsdag den 9. juli 2020 kl. 20.47.25 UTC+2 skrev Paul Rubin:
>>>>>>> Rick C<gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com>   writes:
>>>>>>>> I have yet to find a single ARM processor that had a true, pin
>>>>>>>> compatible second source.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I thought there were some Chinese clones of the lower end STM32F series
>>>>>>> but I haven't paid close attention.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> yep, I know there are several clones of STM32F103xxxx
>>>>>
>>>>> So "clone" equals "second source"???
>>>>
>>>> Not really. They haven't licensed ST's masks, they've just designed
>>>> their own chips to match the documented behaviour.
>>>>
>>>> The chips I know of are by GigiDevice and Mindmotion, part numbers
>>>> GD32F3??? and MM32F??? to match the STM32F???.
>>>>
>>>> I see over 100 variants waiting on reels in JLCPCB's fab.
>>>>
>>>> Clifford Heath.
>>>
>>> Ok, then they are pretty useless as second sources.  I see someone mentioned bugs that are being worked out.  Not encouraging.  Is Gigidevice a company that makes FPGAs?  Or am I mixing them up with someone else?  Ah, I see I have downloaded their data sheets, so I guess I was looking at a low cost RISC-V board and also have info on their ARM ST clone chip.  Wait, it's the same chip!  No sign of FPGAs.  That was one of the other companies like AGM, Anlogic or maybe Gowin.  AGM has an interesting data sheet, but it's two years old and no sign of the device.
>>>
>>
>> Seems to me that companies that box themselves into a corner over
>> processors and second sources get what they deserve and is generally
>> a sign of poor strategy and project management. I've worked on a
>> couple of projects using essentially obsolete 8051 hardware,
>> recommended a redesign using a more modern architecture, but they
>> were not listening. Result was a greatly extended development time,
>> costs, difficult ongoing software maintenance and compromises
>> everywhere due to banked architecture for code and data. Having said
>> that, have used the silabs 80F... series for a couple of small
>> projects which worked really well. You wouldn't want to look at the
>> asm op from the compiler, but more than adequate for the task and
>> all written in C...
>>
>> Chris
>
> If a product requirement is to use only second sourced devices, that's the requirement.  How do you propose getting around that?
>

Fire the manager involved ?.

As I said, if you box yourself into a corner in the design, then
choices become limited. I prefer to take a higher level view and
try to abstract  the hardware into functions that are common to
most micros. For example comms, timers and other core functions.
Define a set of call interfaces into that required functionality,
then all that's needed is an abstraction layer between that and
the underlying hardware. There are great benefits in terms of code
reuse, reliablity, cost and project times. Use a subset of processor
capabilities and deal with special cases as needed. There is some
work, but develop over a few projects, to end up with a set of known
good library code that can be added to and reused indefinately. I
think it was Win NT that first publicised the idea of a hw abstraction
layer, but with the speed of modern micros, you can apply that idea to
just about any embedded project.

The whole idea is to design assuming that the hardware will change
over time, new requirements, performance, cost, whatever, as new
micros come to market. The exact opposite of s design frozen in
time, with all the hassle that involves...

Chris

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Interrupts: can be lost? pozz <pozzugno@gmail.com> - 2020-07-08 00:38 +0200
  Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2020-07-08 09:11 +1000
    Re: Interrupts: can be lost? pozz <pozzugno@gmail.com> - 2020-07-08 08:13 +0200
      Re: Interrupts: can be lost? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-07-08 09:13 +0200
  Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-07-07 16:14 -0700
    Re: Interrupts: can be lost? pozz <pozzugno@gmail.com> - 2020-07-08 08:16 +0200
      Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-07-08 06:55 -0700
  Re: Interrupts: can be lost? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-07-08 09:02 +0200
    Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Niklas Holsti <niklas.holsti@tidorum.invalid> - 2020-07-08 11:43 +0300
      Re: Interrupts: can be lost? pozz <pozzugno@gmail.com> - 2020-07-08 12:24 +0200
        Re: Interrupts: can be lost? antispam@math.uni.wroc.pl - 2020-07-09 23:24 +0000
          Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Dave Nadler <drn@nadler.com> - 2020-07-09 17:13 -0700
          Re: Interrupts: can be lost? pozz <pozzugno@gmail.com> - 2020-07-10 08:09 +0200
            Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-07-09 23:39 -0700
            Re: Interrupts: can be lost? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-07-10 08:59 +0200
      Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Tauno Voipio <tauno.voipio@notused.fi.invalid> - 2020-07-08 14:57 +0300
        Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-07-08 07:01 -0700
          Re: Interrupts: can be lost? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-07-08 16:07 +0200
            Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-07-08 07:35 -0700
              Re: Interrupts: can be lost? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-07-09 14:16 +0200
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-07-09 11:04 -0700
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> - 2020-07-09 14:32 -0400
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2020-07-09 11:47 -0700
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? lasselangwadtchristensen@gmail.com - 2020-07-09 15:22 -0700
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Dave Nadler <drn@nadler.com> - 2020-07-09 15:35 -0700
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-07-09 18:41 -0700
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2020-07-10 16:01 +1000
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-07-09 23:28 -0700
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Chris <xxx.syseng.yyy@gfsys.co.uk> - 2020-07-29 19:44 +0100
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-07-29 13:23 -0700
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Chris <xxx.syseng.yyy@gfsys.co.uk> - 2020-07-29 22:57 +0100
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-07-29 16:47 -0700
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2020-07-30 10:04 +1000
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-07-29 17:46 -0700
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2020-07-30 11:04 +1000
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-07-29 21:16 -0700
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2020-07-30 16:36 +1000
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-07-31 11:26 -0700
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Chris <xxx.syseng.yyy@gfsys.co.uk> - 2020-07-30 01:11 +0100
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-07-29 17:53 -0700
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Chris <xxx.syseng.yyy@gfsys.co.uk> - 2020-07-30 19:05 +0100
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Dimiter_Popoff <dp@tgi-sci.com> - 2020-07-31 00:21 +0300
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-08-04 20:40 +0200
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-08-04 14:36 -0700
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2020-08-04 22:32 -0400
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-08-05 15:26 +0200
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? upsidedown@downunder.com - 2020-07-30 08:31 +0300
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Tom Gardner <spamjunk@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2020-07-30 07:53 +0100
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2020-07-30 08:10 -0400
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-07-09 18:40 -0700
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-07-10 09:09 +0200
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-07-10 01:41 -0700
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-07-10 13:47 +0200
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Dimiter_Popoff <dp@tgi-sci.com> - 2020-07-11 13:41 +0300
          Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Tauno Voipio <tauno.voipio@notused.fi.invalid> - 2020-07-08 17:33 +0300
            Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-07-08 09:31 -0700
              Re: Interrupts: can be lost? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2020-07-09 14:30 +0200
              Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Przemek Klosowski <przemek@tux.dot.org> - 2020-07-19 18:38 +0000
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Dimiter_Popoff <dp@tgi-sci.com> - 2020-07-19 23:11 +0300
                Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Rick C <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> - 2020-07-19 13:43 -0700
    Re: Interrupts: can be lost? pozz <pozzugno@gmail.com> - 2020-07-08 13:19 +0200
  Re: Interrupts: can be lost? Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2020-07-09 08:00 -0400
  Re: Interrupts: can be lost? dalai lamah <antonio12358@hotmail.com> - 2020-07-11 12:12 +0200
    Re: Interrupts: can be lost? pozz <pozzugno@gmail.com> - 2020-07-13 08:35 +0200

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