Re: Who pays for Illegals?

From	Peter Franks <none@none.com>
Newsgroups	talk.politics.guns, misc.survivalism, alt.atheism, alt.politics.economics, alt.philosophy, alt.politics.usa.constitution
Subject	Re: Who pays for Illegals?
Date	2019-01-18 16:47 -0800
Organization	.
Message-ID	<q1ts21$d7m$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References	(12 earlier) <g9t2q5Fs6seU1@mid.individual.net> <q1t6de$ekf$2@dont-email.me> <gaencvFp0jlU4@mid.individual.net> <q1tplk$vj8$4@dont-email.me> <gaf95iFsk8aU15@mid.individual.net>

Cross-posted to 6 groups.

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On 1/18/2019 4:26 PM, Snit wrote:
> On 1/18/19 5:06 PM, Peter Franks wrote:
>> On 1/18/2019 11:23 AM, Snit wrote:
>>> On 1/18/19 11:37 AM, Peter Franks wrote:
>>>> On 1/11/2019 6:47 PM, Snit wrote:
>>>>> On 1/11/19 7:39 PM, Peter Franks wrote:
>>>>>> On 1/9/2019 9:03 PM, Snit wrote:
>>>>>>> Peter Franks <none@none.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 1/9/2019 5:28 PM, Snit wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 1/9/19 4:08 PM, Peter Franks wrote:
>>>>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So kill it and move to universal health care... saving us 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> billions.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Who pays for it?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Who pays for the savings? What?
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Who pays for the universal health care?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> We can split the savings.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Regardless of any savings,
>>>>>>>>>>>> there will be a net cost.  Who pays for those costs?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Taxes. That is how the government works.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Taxes aren't universally applied (they are progressive), so it 
>>>>>>>>>> is no
>>>>>>>>>> longer universal healthcare.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Universal healthcare is a system where everyone pays equally 
>>>>>>>>>> for equal
>>>>>>>>>> services.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> What do you base that on? What country do you think does it 
>>>>>>>>> that way?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> What you are talking about is yet another entitlement program, 
>>>>>>>>>> paid
>>>>>>>>>> for by the rich.  Please get your facts straight.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> What we are talking about is joining the rest of the 
>>>>>>>>> industrialized
>>>>>>>>> world and investing in our future so we can compete better. 
>>>>>>>>> What we are
>>>>>>>>> talking about is having it so people are not a health crisis 
>>>>>>>>> away from
>>>>>>>>> losing everything. What we are talking about is doing what is 
>>>>>>>>> morally
>>>>>>>>> right. What we are talking about is MOST people paying less 
>>>>>>>>> than they do
>>>>>>>>> now and getting better service.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Right, you are advocating for an unequal system.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> How so?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Some pay.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Some don't.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Explain how that is equal.
>>>>>
>>>>> We are not talking about buying a toaster... we are talking about 
>>>>> running the government. The only way to do so is to have those who 
>>>>> can pay more do so, and those who cannot pay at all not pay.
>>>>
>>>> In case you missed it last time:
>>>>
>>>> Explain how that is equal.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Where are you confused? If I tell you 2+2=4 and you need help, the 
>>> only way to help you is to understand what part you are missing. You 
>>> have not said where you are lost on the idea of equal rights.
>>
>> How is taking from one and giving to another equal?
> 
> Are you suggesting we cannot require one person to give to another, even 
> if the other is dependent on the first for life? If so you just struck 
> down your own abortion arguments. LOL!
> 
> But as far as a more direct answer: to tax people based on their income 
> (or other circumstances) is not unequal 

Which is not what you are suggesting.  You are suggesting that those 
that have pay for those that don't.

You've failed multiple 'attempts' to explain how that is equal.

Bye

> as long as you do not do so in 
> an unequal way (say based on sex or color or race or gender). And to say 
> we will help ANYONE who cannot work, no matter sex or color or race or 
> gender, is also not unequal.
> 
> I do get what you are trying to say -- you want to look at things in a 
> very naive and superficial way. It is a common rhetorical "trick" but it 
> is not a rational argument against having a good safety net.
>

Thread

Re: Who pays for Illegals? Peter Franks <none@none.com> - 2019-01-09 15:08 -0800
  Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-09 18:28 -0700
    Re: Who pays for Illegals? Klaus  Schadenfreude <klausschadenfreude@null.net> - 2019-01-09 17:40 -0800
      Re: Who pays for Illegals? Clave <ChrisClavius@TheMonastery.com> - 2019-01-09 18:00 -0800
        Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-09 19:21 -0700
          Re: Who pays for Illegals? Peter Franks <none@none.com> - 2019-01-09 19:55 -0800
            Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-10 05:03 +0000
              Re: Who pays for Illegals? Peter Franks <none@none.com> - 2019-01-11 18:22 -0800
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-11 19:33 -0700
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Peter Franks <none@none.com> - 2019-01-18 09:43 -0800
            Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-10 07:30 -0700
              Re: Who pays for Illegals? Klaus  Schadenfreude <klausschadenfreude@null.net> - 2019-01-10 06:38 -0800
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Peter Franks <none@none.com> - 2019-01-11 18:37 -0800
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-11 19:52 -0700
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Klaus  Schadenfreude <klausschadenfreude@null.net> - 2019-01-12 04:50 -0800
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Peter Franks <none@none.com> - 2019-01-18 10:27 -0800
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-18 12:27 -0700
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Peter Franks <none@none.com> - 2019-01-18 16:03 -0800
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-18 17:29 -0700
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Clave <ChrisClavius@TheMonastery.com> - 2019-01-18 17:07 -0800
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Clave <ChrisClavius@TheMonastery.com> - 2019-01-11 18:53 -0800
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-11 19:58 -0700
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Clave <ChrisClavius@TheMonastery.com> - 2019-01-11 19:15 -0800
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-11 20:19 -0700
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Clave <ChrisClavius@TheMonastery.com> - 2019-01-11 20:06 -0800
              Re: Who pays for Illegals? Peter Franks <none@none.com> - 2019-01-11 18:34 -0800
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-11 19:51 -0700
      Re: Who pays for Illegals? "Scout" <me4guns@removethis.this2.spam.centurylink.net> - 2019-01-10 00:28 -0500
        Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-10 05:54 +0000
          Re: Who pays for Illegals? Peter Franks <none@none.com> - 2019-01-11 18:38 -0800
            Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-11 19:54 -0700
              Re: Who pays for Illegals? Peter Franks <none@none.com> - 2019-01-18 10:36 -0800
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-18 12:25 -0700
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Peter Franks <none@none.com> - 2019-01-18 16:05 -0800
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-18 17:27 -0700
            Re: Who pays for Illegals? "Scout" <me4guns@removethis.this2.spam.centurylink.net> - 2019-01-11 22:16 -0500
          Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-12 06:44 +0000
    Re: Who pays for Illegals? Peter Franks <none@none.com> - 2019-01-09 19:53 -0800
      Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-10 05:03 +0000
        Re: Who pays for Illegals? Peter Franks <none@none.com> - 2019-01-11 18:39 -0800
          Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-11 19:47 -0700
            Re: Who pays for Illegals? Peter Franks <none@none.com> - 2019-01-18 10:37 -0800
              Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-18 12:23 -0700
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Peter Franks <none@none.com> - 2019-01-18 16:06 -0800
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-18 17:26 -0700
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Peter Franks <none@none.com> - 2019-01-18 16:47 -0800
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-18 17:56 -0700
    Re: Who pays for Illegals? Avenging Angel <Not.fucking.likely@NoWay.com> - 2019-01-12 17:53 +0000
      Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-12 18:41 +0000
        Re: Who pays for Illegals? Klaus  Schadenfreude <klausschadenfreude@null.net> - 2019-01-12 10:49 -0800
  Re: Who pays for Illegals? jim <"sjedgingNOSp@m"@mwt.net> - 2019-01-20 16:31 -0600
    Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-20 15:49 -0700
      Re: Who pays for Illegals? jim <"sjedgingNOSp@m"@mwt.net> - 2019-01-20 17:37 -0600
        Re: Who pays for Illegals? Just Wondering <JW@me.com> - 2019-01-20 17:03 -0700
          Re: Who pays for Illegals? jim <"sjedgingNOSp@m"@mwt.net> - 2019-01-20 18:37 -0600
          Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-20 21:12 -0700
            Re: Who pays for Illegals? Just Wondering <JW@me.com> - 2019-01-20 22:17 -0700
              Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-21 06:36 +0000
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Just Wondering <JW@me.com> - 2019-01-21 02:04 -0700
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-21 09:10 +0000
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Klaus  Schadenfreude <klausschadenfreude@null.net> - 2019-01-22 04:20 -0800
            Re: Who pays for Illegals? jim <"sjedgingN0Sp@m"@mwt.net> - 2019-01-21 07:42 -0600
              Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-21 15:49 +0000
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? jim <"sjedgingNOSp@m"@mwt.net> - 2019-01-21 10:38 -0600
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-21 18:03 +0000
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? % <persent@gmail.com> - 2019-01-21 11:05 -0700
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-21 11:20 -0700
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? % <persent@gmail.com> - 2019-01-21 11:29 -0700
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-21 14:20 -0700
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? % <persent@gmail.com> - 2019-01-21 14:23 -0700
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-21 15:03 -0700
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-22 06:23 +0000
                Re: Who pays for Illegals? jim <"sjedgingNOSp@m"@mwt.net> - 2019-01-21 12:54 -0600
          Re: Who pays for Illegals? jim <"sjedgingNOSp@m"@mwt.net> - 2019-01-21 10:23 -0600
    Re: Who pays for Illegals? Just Wondering <JW@me.com> - 2019-01-20 16:43 -0700
      Re: Who pays for Illegals? jim <"sjedgingNOSp@m"@mwt.net> - 2019-01-20 18:21 -0600
    Re: Who pays for Illegals? Peter Franks <none@none.com> - 2019-01-22 07:41 -0800
      Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-22 09:28 -0700
        Re: Who pays for Illegals? Peter Franks <none@none.com> - 2019-01-22 11:06 -0800
          Re: Who pays for Illegals? Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2019-01-22 14:07 -0700

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