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Groups > sci.physics.relativity > #476788
| From | moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) |
|---|---|
| Newsgroups | sci.physics.relativity |
| Subject | Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! |
| Date | 2018-11-11 17:21 +0000 |
| Organization | The World : www.TheWorld.com : Since 1989 |
| Message-ID | <ps9oen$1ig$1@pcls7.std.com> (permalink) |
| References | <nLzED.117352$%T7.101830@fx30.am4> <11izd6qi7htpb.1wdlwujcqw2ny.dlg@40tude.net> <IKWED.183852$px6.121141@fx41.am4> <ps84j1$fvh$1@pcls7.std.com> <PzXFD.1162089$621.1015490@fx06.am4> |
Keith Stein <keithstein111@gmail.com> writes: >On 11/11/2018 02:36, Michael Moroney wrote: >> Keith Stein <keithstein111@gmail.com> writes: >> >>> On 08/11/2018 12:45, SolomonW wrote: >> >>>> he knew that light travels slower >>>> in water then in air. >> >>> but did he [Einstein] also know that when light travels in water, >>> it travels at c/n(water)) RELATIVE TO THE water ? >> >> Hey, Einstein wasn't stupid, he knew of Fizeau's experiment, so of course >> he knew that claim was false! >So please tell us all what the speed c/n(water) IS ? Are you asking what the speed of light in moving water is, or are you asking what the value of c/n(water) is? Different answers, you know, as Fizeau demonstrated. Since water has an index of refraction of about 1.33, c/n(water) gives a speed (for stationary water) of about 225,400 km/s. If the water is moving at v<<c, we get approximately c_w = c/n+v(1-1/n^2) or (approximately) 225,400 km/s + 0.43*v, relative to the frame which v is measured relative to. For air (n=1.00029) it is even more extreme, with c_a = 299,705.543 km/s + 0.00058*v. >RELATIVE TO WHAT EXACTLY eh? If we're talking about "moving" water, it would be relative to whatever the water is moving relative to, typically what is referred to as the lab frame. >> Even better, Einstein figured out *why* it is false! >>> did he also know that when light travels in air, >>> it travels at c/n(air) RELATIVE TO THE Aair ? >> And again, he wasn't stupid, >Indeed he must of been a genius, >to achieve the position he achieved. >Especially as he hadn't got a clue > about PHYSICS eh! Nope. He came up with the answer _why_ light doesn't move at c/n relative to moving water. And why c/n(air) relative to moving air is even MORE wrong. Einstein could have told you why. And c/n(good lab vacuum) is even MORE wrong. For example, as I stated, light from the sun doesn't move at c/n(solar wind)+v(solar solar wind), it moves so close to c(vacuum) that the difference is an atomic diameter. Cool, eh? Of course, if the medium is STATIONARY in the lab frame, light moving at c/n(medium) relative to the medium is technically true, but this is a degenerate case, since the light is also moving at c/n relative to the lab frame, because the lab frame and the medium frame are one and the same. >>> Einstein knew how fast light travels in NOTHING eh! >> He knew of limits. >Not of his own he didn't. Yet he still knew of limits. >> He'd likely would have been impressed how the >> speed of light in the interplanetary medium is so close to that of the >> theoretical speed of light in a perfect vacuum, >The "theoretical speed of light" is derived from Maxwell's Theory, >and Maxwell's Theory give the speed of light RELATIVE TO THE MEDIUM. No, Maxwell noticed that a speed came out of the equation v = 1/sqrt(E0*mu0), and that value does NOT depend on the motion of any medium. It doesn't depend on the motion of anything, only on what he knew as the electric and magnetic constants. Since this speed depends ONLY on fixed constants, it must ALSO be a constant, so it CANNOT depend on the motion of anything. Maxwell noticed that that speed happened to be the same as the measured vacuum speed of light and he realized that was not a coincidence. Also Maxwell's equations have since been updated by later physics. >Maxwell could not of been clearer, "A MEDIUM NECESSARY", he wrote,in big >crackpot capitals, just like that eh! Whatever he meant by that, he never claimed a connection between whatever this "NECESSARY" medium was and its motion when deriving the invariant speed that depends ONLY on unvarying constants. He realized that since the speed of light depended ONLY on fixed constants, it MUST also be a fixed constant. >> that a photon traveling >> the Earth-Sun distance would trail the theoretical perfect vacuum photon >> by less than an atomic diameter at that distance! >The point is Mr.Moroney that there isn't any "perfect vacuum", Irrelevant. > and >in actual fact light travels relative to the "stuff" it is traveling >through. Experiments show otherwise. If a theory (light moves at c/n relative to the medium) disagrees with actual measurements, it is the theory which is wrong, not the measurements! Stating the opposite (disputing measurements is disputing reality) is delusional behavior, often a sign of mental illness. Don't forget this has been known for well over 150 years, from Fizeau's experiment.
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EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Keith Stein <keithstein111@gmail.com> - 2018-11-07 11:11 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2018-11-07 03:24 -0800
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Keith Stein <keithstein111@gmail.com> - 2018-11-07 15:13 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2018-11-07 10:09 -0600
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Keith Stein <keithstein111@gmail.com> - 2018-11-07 17:34 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Gaston Castaneda <agn@j2awdos.nc> - 2018-11-07 20:26 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2018-11-07 17:39 -0600
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Gaston Castaneda <agn@j2awdos.nc> - 2018-11-08 00:51 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! SolomonW <SolomonW@citi.com> - 2018-11-08 23:45 +1100
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Keith Stein <keithstein111@gmail.com> - 2018-11-08 13:20 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-11-08 19:34 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2018-11-08 11:42 -0800
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Keith Stein <keithstein111@gmail.com> - 2018-11-08 20:10 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2018-11-09 06:52 -0800
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Keith Stein <keithstein111@gmail.com> - 2018-11-12 08:23 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2018-11-12 04:29 -0800
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Keith Stein <keithstein111@gmail.com> - 2018-11-12 20:00 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2018-11-12 14:51 -0800
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Gaston Castaneda <uucp@jav4ow.nq> - 2018-11-13 20:32 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2018-11-12 11:25 -0600
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-11-12 17:37 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Keith Stein <keithstein111@gmail.com> - 2018-11-12 18:03 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-11-12 18:40 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Keith Stein <keithstein111@gmail.com> - 2018-11-12 19:38 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-11-12 22:16 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-11-12 17:34 -0800
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Gaston Castaneda <uucp@jav4ow.nq> - 2018-11-13 20:16 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-11-13 15:00 -0800
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-11-12 19:44 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-11-09 17:47 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-11-11 03:08 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-11-09 10:18 -0500
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-11-09 17:47 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-11-09 20:06 -0500
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2018-11-10 02:41 +0100
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-11-09 19:33 -0800
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-11-10 13:42 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2018-11-10 05:49 -0800
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-11-10 20:04 -0500
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2018-11-11 12:13 +0100
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2018-11-11 03:23 -0800
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Gaston Castaneda <ucpp@java4ow.nv> - 2018-11-11 15:49 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-11-11 21:01 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! benj <benj.fake@gmail.com> - 2018-11-12 21:13 -0500
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2018-11-12 22:41 -0600
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2018-11-13 14:03 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2018-11-10 08:39 -0600
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-11-11 02:36 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Keith Stein <keithstein111@gmail.com> - 2018-11-11 15:06 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-11-11 17:21 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2018-11-11 09:47 -0800
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Keith Stein <keithstein111@gmail.com> - 2018-11-11 20:06 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-11-12 17:20 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! "David (Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2018-11-12 09:53 -0800
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-11-12 19:33 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! "David (Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2018-11-12 12:41 -0800
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! "David (Kronos Prime) Fuller" <fuller.david@hotmail.com> - 2018-11-12 12:44 -0800
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2018-11-11 20:14 -0600
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Keith Stein <keithstein111@gmail.com> - 2018-11-12 07:42 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-11-12 17:29 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Keith Stein <keithstein111@gmail.com> - 2018-11-12 18:29 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-11-12 19:49 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-11-12 17:25 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-11-12 07:25 -0800
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-11-12 17:50 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-11-12 10:46 -0800
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2018-11-12 19:55 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2018-11-12 12:05 -0800
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! mitchrae3323@gmail.com - 2018-11-11 15:29 -0800
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Keith Stein <keithstein111@gmail.com> - 2018-11-11 23:43 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! mitchrae3323@gmail.com - 2018-11-12 10:45 -0800
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Keith Stein <keithstein111@gmail.com> - 2018-11-12 19:07 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Gaston Castaneda <ucpp@java4ow.nv> - 2018-11-12 19:11 +0000
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! JanPB <filmart@gmail.com> - 2018-11-12 13:05 -0800
Re: EINSTEIN WAS WRONG EH! Gaston Castaneda <ucpp@java4ow.nv> - 2018-11-12 21:41 +0000
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