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Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox

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On 9/1/17 7:26 AM, kenseto wrote:
> On Thursday, August 31, 2017 at 3:13:30 PM UTC-4, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>> On 8/29/17 10:12 AM, kenseto wrote:
>>> On Monday, August 28, 2017 at 12:13:50 PM UTC-4, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>>>> On 8/28/17 10:41 AM, kenseto wrote:
>>>>> On Monday, August 28, 2017 at 11:12:08 AM UTC-4, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>>>>>> On 8/28/17 9:32 AM, kenseto wrote:
>>>>>>> On Friday, August 25, 2017 at 9:31:06 AM UTC-4, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 8/25/17 8:17 AM, kenseto wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Wednesday, August 23, 2017 at 10:28:29 AM UTC-4, Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On Wednesday, August 23, 2017 at 9:19:28 AM UTC-5, kenseto wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On Wednesday, August 23, 2017 at 7:36:21 AM UTC-4, Prokaryotic Caspase Homolog wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tuesday, August 22, 2017 at 6:03:19 PM UTC-5, kenseto wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> So are you saying that from the ball’s point of view the hole get larger so it can get through it and from the hole point of view the ball gets gets smaller so the ball can pass through it? I don’t think so. I think you are full of shit.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Length contraction is observed ONLY along the direction of motion.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Why?
>>>>>>>>>>> Other observers will see the ball moving the ball moving in different directions.  Doesn’t that mean that the ball is contracted in all directions? That means that if contraction is real (material) then the ball should be able to pass through the hole.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Different observers OBSERVE the ball moving in different directions, and
>>>>>>>>>> OBSERVE differing directions and magnitudes of length contraction.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> So observe contraction is not real and thus not directly measurable.....right?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Nope, it is very real and very measurable. And STILL different observers
>>>>>>>> will see different things.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> See different thing is not measurement.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The observed length contraction is real and very measurable. And STILL
>>>>>> different observers will measure different amounts of length contraction.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Nope.....assertion is not a valid argument.
>>>>
>>>> Do you know the difference between an assertion and a documented fact?
>>>> Oh, I know, any documented fact that you haven't read about is an
>>>> assertion unless someone presents it to you on usenet. I see.
>>>
>>> There is no real documented facts for real physical length contraction.
>>
>> Of course there are.
>>
>>> There are falsely interpretations of documented results that interpreted as the effect of length contraction.
>>
>> If you have a documented result that is consistent with the prediction
>> of a theory like relativity, then that result supports the theory. It
>> doesn't matter that you don't like the "interpretation" of that theory.
>> It is still true that the experimental result supports that theory. What
>> part of this fundamental aspect of the scientific method do you not
>> understand?
> 
> The point is that other interpretations will give the same predictions (eg. LET or IRT).
> 

LET also predicts real physical length contraction, which is in 
agreement with data. See Lorentz's paper on the subject, in which this 
is discussed.

Now IRT may say that the observed length contraction isn't physical. 
Don't know for sure and don't care.

Doesn't really matter. There are predictions of observable measurements 
made by relativity, and those predictions match actual observations. 
Thus those observations support relativity. They may ALSO support other 
theories. For example, the Michelson-Morely experimental result supports 
relativity and it also ballistic theories of light. A single experiment 
does not and cannot single out one theory to the exclusion of all 
others. It is the accumulation of ALL data that has the capacity to rule 
out other competing theories, leaving only one standing.

You can't seem to figure out if you want to acknowledge that length 
contraction has been observed but that it may have alternate 
interpretations like IRT, or if you want to say that the length 
contraction has never been observed (which is just factually incorrect).

-- 
Odd Bodkin -- maker of fine toys, tools, tables

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Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2017-08-28 07:32 -0700
  Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-08-28 10:12 -0500
    Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2017-08-28 08:41 -0700
      Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-08-28 11:13 -0500
        Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-08-28 09:48 -0700
          Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-08-31 16:03 +0000
        Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2017-08-29 08:12 -0700
          Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2017-08-29 12:46 -0500
            Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2017-08-29 14:40 -0700
              Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2017-08-29 14:49 -0700
              Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-08-31 14:13 -0500
            Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-09-01 01:08 -0700
            Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox Bídníkùm Laterá <bila@wehia.ui> - 2017-09-01 08:21 +0000
          Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-08-31 14:13 -0500
            Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox Ned Latham <nedlatham@woden.valhalla.oz> - 2017-08-31 15:05 -0500
              Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-08-31 15:14 -0500
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox Ned Latham <nedlatham@woden.valhalla.oz> - 2017-08-31 16:31 -0500
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-08-31 16:58 -0500
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox Ned Latham <nedlatham@woden.valhalla.oz> - 2017-08-31 19:12 -0500
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-09-01 14:53 -0500
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-09-01 14:54 -0500
            Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2017-09-01 05:26 -0700
              Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-09-01 14:48 -0500
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-09-01 14:51 -0700
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox gehan.ameresekere@gmail.com - 2017-09-03 19:06 -0700
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-09-03 23:49 -0700
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox gehan.ameresekere@gmail.com - 2017-09-04 05:09 -0700
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-09-04 05:52 -0700
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2017-09-04 07:00 -0700
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-09-04 08:02 -0700
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2017-09-04 08:20 -0700
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-09-04 11:01 -0700
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2017-09-05 06:21 -0700
                Cretin Ken Sito at work "Dono," <sa_ge@comcast.net> - 2017-09-05 06:29 -0700
                Re: Cretin Ken Sito at work mlwozniak@wp.pl - 2017-09-05 06:50 -0700
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2017-09-05 06:08 -0700
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-09-05 09:05 -0500
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2017-09-05 08:39 -0700
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-09-05 14:05 -0700
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-09-05 16:10 -0500
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2017-09-06 07:22 -0700
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-09-06 13:10 -0500
                Re: Why is there more than one explanation for the Twin Paradox The Starmaker <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> - 2017-09-06 11:10 -0700

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