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Re: CH4 for Odd

From moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney)
Newsgroups sci.physics
Subject Re: CH4 for Odd
Date 2017-05-19 01:09 +0000
Organization The World : www.TheWorld.com : Since 1989
Message-ID <oflgjk$dts$1@pcls7.std.com> (permalink)
References (24 earlier) <cd76c534-03ac-4fdb-a434-92503ad49587@googlegroups.com> <ofk97c$76g$1@pcls7.std.com> <e4a794b1-6f91-47c7-8804-27d771fc48a6@googlegroups.com> <ofkkpp$hh5$1@pcls7.std.com> <25990bdb-3b11-4474-b91d-d8ac32ee21ce@googlegroups.com>

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john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> writes:

>MM
>Roe used to say computer software management was like herding cats- 
>everyone has their own way.

Definitely.  And the closest thing I find to "beauty" would be to
incorporate a cool unusual algorithm, especially one that's much better
than the usual method.  That's much like the beauty in math that you
don't get.

>Surely, simple and elegant is preferable to others. Why are you and Odd 
>arguing against there being better and worse looking results from 
>different approaches?

The "different approaches" have to make sense regarding science. It
has to be close to the scientific method (look that up in detail).
Do you think the "different approaches" of "science by proclamation,
because I said so" as practiced by McGinn and Archie Plutonium is valid
science? Physics by proclamation is certainly simple!

Similarly, "it's all retarded spinny things because I like retarded spinny
things" isn't a valid "different approach" to science just because it's
simple (we disagree on "elegant")

Science isn't about what looks pretty or elegant. Science is trying to 
figure out what actually works.

>You guys are silly.
>

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Thread

Re: CH4 for Odd HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2017-04-23 09:35 -0700
  Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-04-23 10:06 -0700
    Re: CH4 for Odd HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2017-04-23 10:08 -0700
      Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-04-23 11:51 -0700
      Re: CH4 for Odd benj <nobody@gmail.com> - 2017-04-24 00:48 -0400
  Re: CH4 for Odd benj <nobody@gmail.com> - 2017-04-24 00:42 -0400
    Re: CH4 for Odd HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2017-04-24 02:11 -0700
      Re: CH4 for Odd benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2017-04-24 16:06 -0400
        Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-04-25 06:46 -0700
          Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-04-26 06:39 -0700
            Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-04-26 07:04 -0700
            Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-04-26 20:24 +0000
              Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-04-26 15:40 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-04-27 02:22 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-04-26 21:30 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-04-27 20:22 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-04-27 13:51 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-04-28 02:31 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-04-28 15:43 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd benj <nobody@gmail.com> - 2017-04-28 19:43 -0400
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-04-29 20:38 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-04-30 06:10 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-04-30 14:29 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-04-30 10:05 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-01 15:40 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-04-30 10:06 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-01 08:35 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-01 08:23 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-01 16:04 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-01 12:15 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-01 10:25 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-01 13:02 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-01 16:02 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-02 01:34 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-01 23:14 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-01 23:52 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-02 14:18 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-02 07:29 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2017-05-02 09:59 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-02 10:46 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2017-05-02 12:41 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 08:46 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 12:21 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 11:42 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-04 21:06 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 18:40 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-05 13:36 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-05 15:59 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-05 22:40 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 03:06 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-06 07:12 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-06 15:36 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-07 20:45 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2017-05-08 06:11 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-08 06:22 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2017-05-08 06:46 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-08 14:59 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-08 09:43 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-08 16:54 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-08 10:06 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-08 19:56 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-08 15:09 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2017-05-09 06:27 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-09 06:44 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-09 16:11 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2017-05-09 09:25 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2017-05-09 17:43 -0400
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-09 15:27 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2017-05-09 09:26 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-09 14:26 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2017-05-10 06:01 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-10 07:46 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-10 17:02 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2017-05-10 10:15 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-10 10:56 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-10 19:26 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-10 15:15 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-09 16:07 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-13 23:34 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-14 19:29 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2017-05-15 02:39 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2017-05-15 21:27 -0400
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-15 07:57 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-15 15:49 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-15 09:26 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-15 09:32 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-15 11:50 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-15 17:54 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-16 10:29 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-16 20:37 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-16 20:43 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-17 10:47 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-17 11:24 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-17 14:07 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 06:31 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 08:52 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2017-05-17 18:58 -0400
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-17 19:04 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 08:54 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 10:59 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 15:59 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 13:00 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-17 19:22 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-17 15:15 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-18 13:57 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 08:17 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-18 17:14 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 10:50 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-19 01:09 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 21:59 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 11:00 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 12:49 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 16:11 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 16:32 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd pnalsing@gmail.com - 2017-05-18 18:16 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 22:03 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd pnalsing@gmail.com - 2017-05-19 06:14 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 10:05 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 13:21 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 16:34 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 07:47 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 05:55 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 06:05 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 08:26 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 06:33 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 08:43 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 06:57 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 11:59 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 10:04 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 12:18 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 10:23 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 10:36 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 12:41 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 11:37 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 10:47 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-20 01:59 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 20:02 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2017-05-20 11:28 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-20 11:43 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-20 12:53 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Mahipal <mahipal7638@gmail.com> - 2017-05-20 12:15 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-20 12:49 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd benj <nobody@gmail.com> - 2017-05-20 21:15 -0400
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-21 00:49 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 20:40 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 14:01 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 12:06 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 10:14 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd poraty350@gmail.com - 2017-05-20 00:55 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-21 00:53 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-21 07:27 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-21 13:12 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-21 11:37 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd pnalsing@gmail.com - 2017-05-21 12:19 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-21 12:33 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd "Chris M. Thomasson" <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2017-05-21 13:07 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-21 13:54 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd "Chris M. Thomasson" <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2017-05-21 14:04 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-21 19:48 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd pnalsing@gmail.com - 2017-05-21 15:06 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-21 19:51 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-21 11:26 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-21 22:56 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-21 19:54 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-22 04:12 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-22 08:17 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-22 17:54 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-22 12:30 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-22 11:19 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd pnalsing@gmail.com - 2017-05-23 02:05 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-23 05:03 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-23 09:41 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Mahipal <mahipal7638@gmail.com> - 2017-05-23 07:12 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2017-05-23 09:34 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Mahipal <mahipal7638@gmail.com> - 2017-05-23 12:24 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2017-05-23 20:11 -0400
                Re: CH4 for Odd benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2017-05-23 20:03 -0400
                Re: CH4 for Odd Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 06:47 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 07:03 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 08:00 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 08:09 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 12:01 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 10:20 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 08:23 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 12:52 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 13:00 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 15:50 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-18 16:06 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-15 11:41 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd James McGinn <jimmcginn9@gmail.com> - 2017-05-13 19:29 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-08 14:54 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-02 14:15 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2017-05-02 03:55 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-02 13:50 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd Edward Prochak <edprochak@gmail.com> - 2017-05-01 10:35 -0700
                Re: CH4 for Odd moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - 2017-05-01 15:44 +0000
                Re: CH4 for Odd Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2017-05-01 08:34 -0500
                Re: CH4 for Odd HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2017-04-30 07:02 -0700
        Re: CH4 for Odd HVAC <mr.hvac@gmail.com> - 2017-04-26 09:07 -0700
          Re: CH4 for Odd john <johnsefton288@gmail.com> - 2017-04-26 12:06 -0700
          Re: CH4 for Odd benj <benj@nobody.net> - 2017-04-26 18:10 -0400

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