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Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised)

From David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no>
Newsgroups comp.lang.c
Subject Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised)
Date 2017-05-11 10:41 +0200
Organization A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID <of17ti$q02$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References (12 earlier) <93b7b49c-a31e-4605-8350-dcfe5589bdbd@googlegroups.com> <oev0g8$vef$1@dont-email.me> <55cb8bb2-f209-4000-8f3b-5fd7438c7cc7@googlegroups.com> <of06hu$c05$1@dont-email.me> <c2e33e5c-422b-450e-92dc-5f7853fc0045@googlegroups.com>

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On 11/05/17 06:15, supercat@casperkitty.com wrote:
> On Wednesday, May 10, 2017 at 6:12:13 PM UTC-5, David Brown wrote:> For bare metal single cpu systems, you can use this:
>>
>> uint64_t readAtomic64(volatile uint64_t *p) {
>> 	uint64_t a = *p;
>> 	while (true) {
>> 		uint64_t b = *p;
>> 		if (a == b) return a;
>> 		a = b;
>> 	}
>> }
>>
>> void writeAtomic64(volatile uint64_t *p, uint64_t x) {
>> 	do {
>> 		*p = x;
>> 	} while (*p != x);
>> }
>>
> 
>> That works because a function will either run to completion, or be 
>> interrupted.  If it is interrupted, that interrupt will either run to 
>> completion, or be interrupted.  And so on.  You don't have 
>> multi-threading, and cannot have arbitrary interleaving between threads 
>> of execution.  So while the two instructions that read the halves of the 
>> uin64_t can be interrupted by an operation that writes a new value to 
>> the variable, the write will be completed before continuing.  It is 
>> therefore enough in most real-world cases to check for two adjacent 
>> identical reads.  (There is a possibility of a number of interrupts 
>> during the reads of "a" and "b" causing an incorrect value to be 
>> returned - but that would require an extremely contrived and unrealistic 
>> system.)
> 
> How are you expecting that the above will work?  If the main line is writing
> the variable when an interrupt occurs that tries to read the variable, the
> interrupt will see a half-updated value, and I don't see how the while()
> loop in the write routine is supposed to fix that.

Sorry, that routine was added to the post /far/ too late at night, and
was much too simplistic.  It will not work if you are writing, and an
interrupt function then wants to read the value.

There are many other ways to do this, depending on tradeoffs between
memory usage, interrupt disable time, different assumptions about usage,
etc.

>  I think it may be possible
> to have each atomic uint64 accompanied by a pointer to a structure describing
> a 64-bit compare-exchange request which would include the match and replacement
> values along with a status indicator.  If an interrupt occurs while the CX is
> being processed, the interrupt handler could use the descriptor to complete it
> before performing its own operation, but that would seem tricky.  I'm not
> sure if it would be amenable to other threading scenarios.

You would need extra states somewhere - basically, you need something
that is small enough to be written atomically (such as a sig_atomic_t)
that you use for synchronisation and locking.  You may need two of them
- I haven't thought through the details yet.

> 
>> Often, simply disabling interrupts and re-enabling them around atomic 
>> reads and writes is easier and more efficient.  That is especially true 
>> if you are doing something more complicated than a read or a write.
> 
> I'm pretty sure that the Cortex M3 is used with operating systems that make
> use of Unprivileged mode even if the Cortex M0 isn't, so disabling interrupts,
> while nice, isn't always an option.

I would be surprised if that was commonly the case - most OS's for small
systems are linked as libraries and you don't have a privilege
separation.  However, the details are irrelevant to the programmer - if
you use an OS, you use OS-provided features for mutex's or passing data
in message queues between threads.  It does not matter to the user if
this is done by disabling interrupts in a local function, by a system
call (software interrupt), or any other mechanism.  That is one of the
reasons for using an OS in the first place!

> 
>> Using LDREX and STREX, we can be more correct, even for multi-tasking 
>> and for multiple cores.  The code here is untested, however.
> 
>> typedef union { uint64_t x; uint32_t ws[2]; } mixer_t;
>> uint64_t readAtomic64(volatile uint64_t *p) {
>> 	volatile mixer_t * q = (volatile mixer_t *) p;
>> 	mixer_t m;
>> 	do {
>> 		m.ws[0] = __LDREXW(&q->ws[0]);
>> 		m.ws[1] = q->ws[1];
>> 	} while (__STREXW(m.ws[0], &q->ws[0]));
>> 	return m.x;
>> }
> 
> Since the above code would violate aliasing if p held the address of an
> object whose declared type is uint64_t, an atomic uint64_t would have to
> be a struct or union type rather.  I'll assume you're using uint64_t
> for simplicity, or with the intention that the code will only work on
> compilers that offer some useful exceptions to the aliasing rules.

It is fine to access the uint64_t via a pointer to a union that has
uint64_t as one of its members.

However, we are already solidly in the target dependent code world.  We
are still portable between compilers for the ARM Cortex-M devices.

> 
>> void writeAtomic64(volatile uint64_t *p, uint64_t x) {
>> 	volatile mixer_t * q = (volatile mixer_t *) p;
>> 	mixer_t m;
>> 	m.x = x;
>> 	
>> 	do {
>> 		(void) __LDREXW(&q->ws[0]);
>> 		q->ws[1] = m.ws[1];
>> 	} while (__STREXW(m.ws[0], &q->ws[0]));
>> }
> 
> Here again, if an interrupt happens after the mainline has half-updated the
> value and the interrupt tries to read it, how is the interrupt supposed to
> either find out what the new lower half will be or what the old upper half
> was?
> 

And again, this was written too quickly, too late at night.  The
ldrexw/strexw need to be used to implement a lock independent of the
actual data, in order to cope with arbitrary orderings of reads and writes.


>> You have that backwards.  The OS implementer needs to understand the 
>> compiler for a freestanding C implementation.
> 
> Someone who is implementing an OS using a particular compiler would need to
> understand the compiler.  A compiler that is generating code that needs to
> use features of an OS developed using another compiler, however, would have
> to understand that OS.
> 

That would be more of a hosted implementation, rather than a
free-standing implementation - a hosted implementation needs to know a
bit about the target OS.

But if a freestanding compiler implements atomics and relies on a target
OS to do so, then yes, there needs to be some sort of cooperation
between them such as an agreement on the function names used for these
things.

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gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) James Harris <james.harris.1@gmail.com> - 2017-04-22 09:06 +0100
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    Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) James Harris <james.harris.1@gmail.com> - 2017-04-22 10:52 +0100
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            Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) James Harris <james.harris.1@gmail.com> - 2017-04-28 22:32 +0100
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          Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-04-27 13:57 -0700
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                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) GOTHIER Nathan <nathan.gothier@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 12:18 +0200
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                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2017-05-04 14:19 +0100
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                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2017-05-05 08:17 +1200
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                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2017-05-08 16:21 +0200
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-05-08 09:16 -0700
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                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-05-08 15:09 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) "Chris M. Thomasson" <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2017-05-08 15:14 -0700
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                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) "Chris M. Thomasson" <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2017-05-10 21:56 -0700
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                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) "Chris M. Thomasson" <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2017-05-11 14:43 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2017-05-12 10:55 +0200
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) joel.rees@gmail.com - 2017-05-12 07:30 -0700
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                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-05-16 15:52 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) "Chris M. Thomasson" <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2017-05-17 15:49 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-05-17 16:36 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) "Chris M. Thomasson" <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2017-05-19 14:53 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) joel.rees@gmail.com - 2017-05-18 06:17 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-05-18 07:51 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-18 22:28 -0500
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) joel.rees@gmail.com - 2017-05-19 00:30 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-24 14:51 -0500
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-10 17:33 -0500
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2017-05-09 13:51 +0000
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-05-09 09:14 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2017-05-08 21:07 +0000
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Gareth Owen <gwowen@gmail.com> - 2017-05-09 18:30 +0100
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2017-05-05 10:44 +0200
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2017-05-05 10:42 +0200
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2017-05-05 14:10 +0000
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2017-05-05 17:12 +0200
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2017-05-04 15:08 +0000
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-04 12:24 -0500
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2017-05-04 18:29 +0100
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2017-05-04 18:07 +0000
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) GOTHIER Nathan <nathan.gothier@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 20:15 +0200
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) joel.rees@gmail.com - 2017-05-04 15:47 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) GOTHIER Nathan <nathan.gothier@gmail.com> - 2017-05-05 01:22 +0200
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) joel.rees@gmail.com - 2017-05-04 18:57 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) GOTHIER Nathan <nathan.gothier@gmail.com> - 2017-05-05 09:30 +0200
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-05-05 01:25 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) GOTHIER Nathan <nathan.gothier@gmail.com> - 2017-05-05 10:33 +0200
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-05-05 10:10 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2017-05-05 12:49 +0200
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) joel.rees@gmail.com - 2017-05-05 18:31 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> - 2017-05-05 22:18 -0600
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-05-07 23:58 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-05-08 07:33 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-05-14 13:04 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-05-08 07:51 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) joel.rees@gmail.com - 2017-05-08 19:01 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-05-09 06:39 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-05-10 06:42 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2017-05-05 10:53 +0200
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2017-05-05 00:33 +0100
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2017-05-05 10:54 +0200
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 13:31 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-04 12:27 -0500
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-05-05 02:10 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-07 22:56 -0500
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2017-05-04 13:00 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-04 15:15 -0500
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-05-04 14:06 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-05 00:43 -0500
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-05-04 13:31 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2017-05-01 21:52 +0200
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) GOTHIER Nathan <nathan.gothier@gmail.com> - 2017-05-01 23:16 +0200
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2017-05-02 09:19 +0200
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-04-30 17:28 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2017-05-01 13:12 +0000
              Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2017-04-30 22:23 +0200
            Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-04-30 10:08 -0700
              Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2017-04-30 22:32 +0200
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-04-30 13:59 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-04-30 17:47 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) joel.rees@gmail.com - 2017-04-30 21:49 -0700
            Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-04-30 11:24 -0700
            Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-04-30 12:45 -0700
      Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Andrey Tarasevich <andreytarasevich@hotmail.com> - 2017-04-23 23:11 -0700
        Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2017-04-24 10:46 +0100
          Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2017-04-24 13:23 +0200
            Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2017-04-24 15:38 +0100
              Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2017-04-24 17:31 +0200
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2017-04-24 17:15 +0100
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-04-24 10:36 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-04-24 12:06 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-04-24 14:03 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2017-04-25 11:09 +0200
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-04-24 10:25 -0700
              Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2017-04-27 05:51 +0000
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2017-05-01 09:08 +0000
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2017-05-01 10:48 +0100
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2017-05-01 11:39 +0100
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2017-05-01 13:54 +0200
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-05-01 08:55 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-01 12:18 -0500
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-05-01 11:03 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-01 13:13 -0500
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2017-05-01 19:47 +0100
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2017-05-01 18:51 +0000
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-01 14:06 -0500
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2017-05-01 21:05 +0100
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2017-05-01 16:06 -0500
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-05-01 14:19 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-05-01 08:41 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2017-05-10 10:07 +0000
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-05-01 08:44 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-05-01 09:03 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-05-01 09:51 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-05-01 11:30 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-05-01 11:41 -0700
                Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-05-01 11:51 -0700
            Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-04-24 08:51 -0700
              Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-04-24 12:13 -0700
              Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2017-05-01 09:11 +0000
        Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-04-27 14:04 -0700
    Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) James Harris <james.harris.1@gmail.com> - 2017-04-22 10:57 +0100
      Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Gareth Owen <gwowen@gmail.com> - 2017-04-22 11:38 +0100
        Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2017-04-22 13:43 +0000
          Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Gareth Owen <gwowen@gmail.com> - 2017-04-22 18:22 +0100
            Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2017-04-22 17:48 +0000
        Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-04-22 14:24 -0700
        Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) joel.rees@gmail.com - 2017-04-27 03:03 -0700
          Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2017-04-27 10:12 -0400
      Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2017-04-22 21:48 +0000
        Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) James Harris <james.harris.1@gmail.com> - 2017-04-24 10:14 +0100
          Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2017-04-24 10:33 +0100
          Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2017-04-24 13:32 +0200
  Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2017-04-24 13:47 +0000
  Re: gcc failure (optimised/non-optimised) Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2017-04-26 08:53 +0200

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