Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles

Newsgroups	rec.arts.sf.written
From	djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt)
Subject	Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles
Message-ID	<oEDv9u.23AH@kithrup.com> (permalink)
Date	2016-10-01 19:25 +0000
References	<a8f125ff-360a-412b-8046-076512ae13b4@googlegroups.com> <MPG.325973c12038989898a5bc@news.eternal-september.org> <oEDFK6.19Fn@kithrup.com> <20161001a@crcomp.net>
Organization	Kithrup Enterprises, Ld.

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In article <20161001a@crcomp.net>, Don Kuenz  <g@crcomp.net> wrote:
>
>Dorothy J Heydt <djheydt@kithrup.com> wrote:
>> In article <MPG.325973c12038989898a5bc@news.eternal-september.org>,
>> J. Clarke <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>In article <yEFIQLKasr7XFwIY@dimetrodon.demon.co.uk>,
>>>brett@dimetrodon.me.uk says...
>>>>
>>>> In message <nsci1p$28n$1@panix2.panix.com>, William December Starr
>>>> <wdstarr@panix.com> writes
>>>> >In article <62a5d409-2e96-4bff-ac2b-b0cdf92add79@googlegroups.com>,
>>>> >William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> said:
>>>> >
>>>> >> William December Starr wrote:
>>>> >>> William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> said:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>> It was intended as a pure entertainment, but he wasn't describing
>>>> >>>> a fantasy world.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> If a novel is intended as entertainment but fails to entertain
>>>> >>> because of the Fifteen Deadly Words -- "I _do_ care what happens to
>>>> >>> these people, and I don't like it a bit" -- well, perhaps the word
>>>> >>> "failure" applies.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Speaking of fantasy worlds!  When a novel is still in print one
>>>> >> hundred and twenty five years after publication, I think it's safe
>>>> >> to say that the word "failure" does not apply.
>>>> >
>>>> >I did say "fails to entertain," not "fails to stay in print."
>>>>
>>>> To stay in print it has to entertain, ultimately any other objective is
>>>> dependent on the novel being read. So it needs to actually convince the
>>>> reader that there is some value in finding out what happens next, that
>>>> is there must be entertainment value all else is secondary.
>>>
>>>Convince enough elderly maiden ladies that it is "lit her a tour" and it
>>>will continue to sell, inflicted unwillingly on legions of hapless
>>>schoolchildren to poison for ever any hope of their becoming interested
>>>in reading.
>>
>> My junior-uear English teacher was neither elderly, a maiden, nor
>> a lady, but he still made us read Willa Cather and Ralph Waldo
>> Emerson.
>
>_The Cambridge Companion to Science Fiction_ regards Egdar Allan Poe as
>the first writer to experiment with the science-fictional method. And
>Poe regards his contemporary Emerson as yet another Frogpondian
>Euphuist. A couple of Poe's essays eloquently elucidate the problem with
>Emerson. :0)
>
>        It has been well said of the French orator, Dupin, that "he
>    spoke, as nobody else, the language of every body;" and thus his
>    manner seems to be exactly conversed in that of the Frogpondian
>    Euphuists, who, on account of the familiar tone in which they
>    lisp their outre phrases, may be said to speak, as every body,
>    the language of nobody - that is to say, a language emphatically
>    their own. [1]
>
>        even when we let these modern hexameters go, as Greek, and
>    merely hold them fast in their proper character of Longfellowian,
>    or Feltonian, or Frogpondian, we must still condemn them as
>    having been committed in a radical misconception of the
>    philosophy of verse. [2]
>
>Note.
>
>1. http://www.eapoe.org/works/pollin/brp20416.htm
>2. http://www.bc.edu/schools/cas/english/poebostonexhibit/poesquarrel/34.html

I have learned a new word: Frogpondian.  Still don't know what it
means, but what the hey.

-- 
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com

Thread

OT: Tess of the d’Urbervilles William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2016-09-24 13:28 -0700
  Re: OT: Tess of the d’Urbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-09-25 01:30 +0000
    Re: OT: Tess of the dUrbervilles Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2016-09-24 22:29 -0700
      Re: OT: Tess of the dUrbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-09-25 14:17 +0000
        Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2016-09-25 11:19 -0400
          Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Joe Bernstein <joe@sfbooks.com> - 2016-09-25 09:37 -0700
            Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-09-25 22:41 +0000
              Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Lawrence Watt-Evans <lwe@sff.net> - 2016-09-26 01:00 -0400
          Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-09-25 22:37 +0000
            Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2016-09-25 20:01 -0400
              Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-09-26 01:39 +0000
              Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2016-09-26 12:32 -0700
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Peter Trei <petertrei@gmail.com> - 2016-09-26 13:51 -0700
          Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2016-09-25 18:32 -0700
            Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles James Rau <jrau@beep.beep.com> - 2016-09-25 18:52 -0700
              Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-09-26 04:59 +0000
            Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2016-09-25 23:04 -0400
              Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Kevrob <kevrob@my-deja.com> - 2016-09-25 21:51 -0700
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Robert Bannister <robban@clubtelco.com> - 2016-09-27 07:36 +0800
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2016-09-27 05:50 -0500
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2016-09-27 13:58 -0700
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2016-09-26 20:54 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Kevrob <kevrob@my-deja.com> - 2016-09-26 19:51 -0700
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Cryptoengineer <treifamily@gmail.com> - 2016-09-26 22:12 -0500
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2016-09-26 21:06 -0700
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Robert Carnegie <rja.carnegie@excite.com> - 2016-09-26 23:02 -0700
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2016-09-28 12:20 -0700
              Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-09-26 05:01 +0000
              Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2016-09-26 13:19 -0700
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2016-09-26 21:01 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2016-09-28 12:30 -0700
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Peter Trei <petertrei@gmail.com> - 2016-09-28 13:17 -0700
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Kevrob <kevrob@my-deja.com> - 2016-09-28 13:50 -0700
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Peter Trei <petertrei@gmail.com> - 2016-09-28 14:51 -0700
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles ted@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan <tednolan>) - 2016-09-28 21:56 +0000
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles "Brian M. Scott" <b.scott@csuohio.edu> - 2016-09-28 18:41 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2016-09-30 10:48 -0700
                Opera (was Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2016-09-29 15:34 +0000
                Re: Opera (was Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles) Kevrob <kevrob@my-deja.com> - 2016-09-30 13:24 -0700
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles "Brian M. Scott" <b.scott@csuohio.edu> - 2016-09-28 17:41 -0400
            Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles nebusj-@-rpi-.edu (Joseph Nebus) - 2016-09-26 04:45 +0000
              Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Lawrence Watt-Evans <lwe@sff.net> - 2016-09-26 01:15 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles David Johnston <Davidjohnston29@yahoo.com> - 2016-09-26 00:06 -0600
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles "Brian M. Scott" <b.scott@csuohio.edu> - 2016-09-26 02:31 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Kevrob <kevrob@my-deja.com> - 2016-09-26 05:08 -0700
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles "Brian M. Scott" <b.scott@csuohio.edu> - 2016-09-26 14:25 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2016-09-26 21:04 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles ted@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan <tednolan>) - 2016-09-27 03:42 +0000
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Robert Bannister <robban@clubtelco.com> - 2016-09-27 07:38 +0800
              Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2016-09-26 12:57 -0700
            Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Mart van de Wege <mvdwege@gmail.com> - 2016-09-26 10:59 +0200
              Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles "Brian M. Scott" <b.scott@csuohio.edu> - 2016-09-26 05:22 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Mart van de Wege <mvdwege@gmail.com> - 2016-09-26 12:17 +0200
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles "Brian M. Scott" <b.scott@csuohio.edu> - 2016-09-26 14:07 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2016-09-26 21:08 -0400
            Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2016-09-26 20:39 -0400
          Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2016-09-26 01:00 -0700
            Re: OT: Tess of the d?Urbervilles David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2016-09-27 05:55 -0500
        Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2016-09-25 15:44 -0700
          Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2016-09-25 23:16 -0400
            Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2016-09-26 12:57 -0700
              Re: Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2016-09-26 21:29 -0400
                Re: Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2016-09-28 12:39 -0700
                Re: Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles Brett Dunbar <brett@dimetrodon.me.uk> - 2016-09-30 20:20 +0100
                Re: Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles Kevrob <kevrob@my-deja.com> - 2016-09-30 13:15 -0700
                Re: Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2016-10-02 14:16 -0700
                Re: Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2016-09-30 16:57 -0400
                Re: Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2016-10-01 08:19 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-10-01 13:45 +0000
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2016-10-01 10:04 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles Kevrob <kevrob@my-deja.com> - 2016-10-01 09:54 -0700
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-10-01 17:11 +0000
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2016-10-01 14:04 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles Lawrence Watt-Evans <lwe@sff.net> - 2016-10-01 15:05 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2016-10-02 06:47 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-10-02 13:30 +0000
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2016-10-02 11:29 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles Cryptoengineer <treifamily@gmail.com> - 2016-10-02 10:52 -0500
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-10-02 20:39 +0000
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2016-10-02 17:02 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-10-02 21:51 +0000
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2016-10-02 19:31 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-10-02 23:45 +0000
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles Cryptoengineer <treifamily@gmail.com> - 2016-10-02 20:30 -0500
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles Lawrence Watt-Evans <lwe@sff.net> - 2016-10-03 01:10 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles Peter Trei <petertrei@gmail.com> - 2016-10-03 06:51 -0700
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles Lawrence Watt-Evans <lwe@sff.net> - 2016-10-03 13:07 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles Cryptoengineer <treifamily@gmail.com> - 2016-10-02 17:39 -0500
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2016-10-02 19:32 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-10-02 23:46 +0000
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles Lawrence Watt-Evans <lwe@sff.net> - 2016-10-03 01:07 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-10-03 13:15 +0000
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles Lawrence Watt-Evans <lwe@sff.net> - 2016-10-03 13:06 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles Don Kuenz <g@crcomp.net> - 2016-10-01 18:03 +0000
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-10-01 19:25 +0000
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles David Johnston <Davidjohnston29@yahoo.com> - 2016-10-01 13:52 -0600
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles Lawrence Watt-Evans <lwe@sff.net> - 2016-10-01 16:13 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles David Johnston <Davidjohnston29@yahoo.com> - 2016-10-01 14:23 -0600
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-10-01 22:22 +0000
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2016-10-01 19:19 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2016-10-01 22:33 -0700
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles "Brian M. Scott" <b.scott@csuohio.edu> - 2016-10-02 02:16 -0400
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles Robert Carnegie <rja.carnegie@excite.com> - 2016-10-02 04:15 -0700
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-10-02 13:32 +0000
                Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles Don Kuenz <g@crcomp.net> - 2016-10-01 21:48 +0000
                Re: Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy <taustinca@gmail.com> - 2016-10-01 10:09 -0700
                Re: Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles ted@loft.tnolan.com (Ted Nolan <tednolan>) - 2016-10-01 17:13 +0000
                Re: Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles Joe Bernstein <joe@sfbooks.com> - 2016-10-01 10:57 -0700
                Re: Re: Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-10-01 19:28 +0000
                Re: Re: Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d?rbervilles "J. Clarke" <j.clarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2016-10-01 15:47 -0400
                Re: Re: Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles wdstarr@panix.com (William December Starr) - 2016-10-02 06:52 -0400
                Re: Re: Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-10-02 13:35 +0000
                Re: OT: Tess of the díUrbervilles Robert Woodward <robertaw@drizzle.com> - 2016-10-02 09:42 -0700
                Re: OT: Tess of the díUrbervilles David DeLaney <daviddelaney@earthlink.net> - 2016-10-03 14:54 -0500
                Re: OT: Tess of the díUrbervilles Kevrob <kevrob@my-deja.com> - 2016-10-03 13:17 -0700
                Re: OT: Tess of the díUrbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-10-03 21:00 +0000
                Re: Re: Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles Joe Bernstein <joe@sfbooks.com> - 2016-10-04 15:04 -0700
                Re: Re: Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles Kevrob <kevrob@my-deja.com> - 2016-10-04 15:36 -0700
                Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-10-05 00:04 +0000
                Re: Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> - 2016-10-01 22:35 -0700
                Re: Re: Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-10-02 13:37 +0000
                Re: Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles Tom Kratman <tomkratman@gmail.com> - 2016-10-01 16:13 -0700
          Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles Brett Dunbar <brett@dimetrodon.me.uk> - 2016-09-26 09:25 +0100
            Re: Re: OT: Tess of the d旦rbervilles William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> - 2016-09-26 13:07 -0700
        Re: OT: Tess of the dUrbervilles Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2016-09-25 18:29 -0700
          Re: OT: Tess of the dUrbervilles djheydt@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) - 2016-09-26 01:40 +0000
            Re: OT: Tess of the dUrbervilles Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2016-09-26 12:50 -0700
        Re: OT: Tess of the d'Urbervilles nebusj-@-rpi-.edu (Joseph Nebus) - 2016-09-26 04:47 +0000
    Re: OT: Tess of the d’Urbervilles Robert Bannister <robban@clubtelco.com> - 2016-09-26 08:17 +0800
      Re: OT: Tess of the dUrbervilles Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2016-09-26 12:52 -0700
        Re: OT: Tess of the d’Urbervilles Robert Bannister <robban@clubtelco.com> - 2016-09-27 07:47 +0800

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