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| From | David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> |
|---|---|
| Newsgroups | comp.lang.c |
| Subject | Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter |
| Date | 2015-10-30 09:54 +0100 |
| Organization | A noiseless patient Spider |
| Message-ID | <n0vb4l$6ab$1@dont-email.me> (permalink) |
| References | (19 earlier) <n0rrd7$gh$1@dont-email.me> <n0t5i9$m6a$1@dont-email.me> <n0t8go$1sb$1@dont-email.me> <n0tdg4$nsi$1@dont-email.me> <n0trc1$kim$1@dont-email.me> |
On 29/10/15 20:19, Bartc wrote:
> On 29/10/2015 15:22, David Brown wrote:
>> On 29/10/15 14:57, Bartc wrote:
>
>>> Here's a typical example. I want to have the equivalent of getch(), but
>
>>> #include <windows.h>
>>>
>>> INPUT_RECORD lastkey;
>
>>> In C, it's easy: you just include windows.h, and it includes everything
>>> needed, which also takes care of the special struct packing rules used
>>> by Windows.
>>>
>>> Now you want to write this code in a language where windows.h is not
>>> available.
>
>> But okay, you want to figure out the offsets in this structure for use
>> in assembly, and you want to do it manually rather than with a simple
>> automated tool.
>
>> Step one is the same as always - understand the types involved, their
>> sizes, and their alignments.
>
> In the case of Win32 types, the padding and rounding rules for structs
> might not match the defaults of the C compiler being used.
They will match the padding and "rounding" (do you mean "alignment"?)
rules for any C compiler compatible with that header. If Windows.h is a
standard header file for that OS, then any C compiler capable of
generating binaries for that OS will having matching rules suitable for
using that header.
A compiler for a completely different target may have different rules
for alignment, of course - but it is not directly suitable for
interacting with Windows using that API.
In this particular case, the alignment and padding rules for Win32 types
is quite simple and obvious in most cases. More complex cases, such as
for vector types, might require a few seconds of googling to learn the
alignments.
> You will
> anyway need to know the padding and alignment used by the C compiler.
> That is not always obvious (what /is/ the alignment used by C compiler
> 'X'? I don't know).
For the most part, people don't /need/ to know about padding and
alignments to work with C. Those that do are either working with very
low-level code, aiming for binary compatibility across targets (file
formats, communication protocols, etc.), or aiming for compatibility
across different programming languages.
If you are working on a "weird" architecture, you should already know
the details. For other systems, you can normally assume the following
rules, but should check in the documentation:
For "normal" systems, types up to the cpu width will always be naturally
aligned. Thus on a 32-bit system, 8-bit, 16-bit and 32-bit data types
will be aligned on 1-byte, 2-byte and 4-byte boundaries.
For types bigger than the natural size of the cpu, they will have higher
alignment if that will be faster on that cpu architecture, considering
features like caches. So 8-byte types are 8-byte aligned on some 32-bit
systems, and not on others. These need to be checked in the
documentation, on the web, or with a couple of minutes experimentation.
> Neither do you know if a 'pragma pack(N)' is in
> effect or has been assumed.
That should be either immediately obvious, or very well documented.
Otherwise assume that it is not in effect, because "pragma pack" would
be an idiotic thing to use.
>
> As I said, it's trial and error.
You are talking about /two/ platforms at most - Windows 32 and Windows
64. These are hardly rare or unusual platforms - there is no shortage
of documentation and information. The type names, sizes and alignments
are almost all clear and simple.
If you want to do trial-and-error, do so - then you will be sure. But
you only need to write a single quick little program, run it once, and
make a note of the results. That's all. It is the work of a few
minutes. You make it sound like you have to do extensive research every
time you want to access a different Windows API.
>
>>> So, I'm interested in what your approach would be to extracting the
>>> relevant data from that lot.
>>
>> Just write it down and add up the numbers. It's not even /remotely/
>> difficult. If you find this too hard, trying taking your socks and
>> shoes off so that you can count to 20.
>
>> I'm sorry, but I completely fail to see the problem here. Converting
>> between Windows struct definitions and your own language seems
>> absolutely trivial to me.
>
> The problem is that there are tens of thousands of lines of this stuff
> in the Windows headers. Every new function, you've got dozens of new
> entities to translate (structs and types and messages and constants). I
> don't know an automatic that can do that without writing half a C compiler.
Writing a translator that will cope with /all/ the variations in the
windows headers is not trivial, but it is not hard either.
>
> (With Python of course, it apparently knows all the answers. You
> presumably just feed it the INPUT_RECORD definition, and it magically
> understands the C code, and knows the meanings of all the macros and
> typedefs that have been used.)
For reading C (or C++) headers and automatically generating Python
interfaces, there are lots of tools - SIP and SWIG are two of them. For
other languages, I have heard of "h2xml" and "h2nasm".
You can also use clang as a library (libclang) for parsing C or C++ code
if you really want a full parser. (There are even python bindings for it.)
But my comment about Python not needing offsets was at a much simpler
level than this. You claimed that Python needs to be told about the
offsets when doing struct packing/unpacking. That is incorrect.
struct { uint16_t a; uint16_t b; int32_t; } s
translates roughly to Python:
s = struct.pack("HHi", (a, b, c));
(a, b, c) = struct.unpack("HHi", s);
The struct definition string characters tell Python that the binary
structure here consists of two uint16_t's and then an int32_t. Python
knows the sizes, and does not need help to work out offsets. (And you
can choose between using platform-native alignments, or no alignment.)
>
> I'm simply saying I need to know C well and/or use C to derive all this
> information, even if my intention is to code in a different language.
You need to know almost /nothing/ about C to handle this. You have to
know the types, and the meanings of "struct" and "union", and that's
about it. From your single post on your own language, I can guess my
way to all the information I need in order to make structures that match
those defined in your language. That's all you need.
>
> And sometimes even the 'trick' of adding up the offsets is not
> practical. I've lost the original C of this example, but the version I
> ended up using in my language is this; notice the size of the first member:
>
> type jpeg_properties = record
> [19966]byte padding # skip complicated jpeg stuff
> int16 jfif_app0_units # 19966
> int16 jfif_app0_xdensity # 19968
> int16 jfif_app0_ydensity # 19970
> ref char jpeg_comment # 19972
> int32 jpeg_comment_size # 19976
> int32 padding2 # 19980, total size 19984
> end
>
Sometimes you might want a quick script to do the sums for you - or put
the struct in a C program and print out its size.
You really are making a mountain out of a molehill here.
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Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-27 09:52 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-27 10:06 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter John Gordon <gordon@panix.com> - 2015-10-27 17:16 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-27 11:28 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-27 10:09 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-27 10:12 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Barry Schwarz <schwarzb@dqel.com> - 2015-10-27 13:12 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter supercat@casperkitty.com - 2015-10-27 13:23 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-10-27 13:49 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-27 21:27 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Lew Pitcher <lew.pitcher@digitalfreehold.ca> - 2015-10-27 18:00 -0400
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-10-28 02:53 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-10-28 00:43 -0500
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-28 06:08 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-10-28 08:44 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-10-28 09:26 +0100
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-28 08:44 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-10-28 10:40 +0100
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter supercat@casperkitty.com - 2015-10-28 06:44 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter supercat@casperkitty.com - 2015-10-28 06:35 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter "D. Aaron Sawyer" <aaron@110.net> - 2015-10-27 13:40 -0400
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter "D. Aaron Sawyer" <aaron@110.net> - 2015-10-27 13:47 -0400
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-27 11:38 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter "D. Aaron Sawyer" <aaron@110.net> - 2015-10-27 16:46 -0400
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-27 11:39 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-27 18:20 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-27 11:36 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-27 12:09 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-27 11:51 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-27 19:25 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-27 12:27 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-28 10:07 +1300
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 00:50 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-28 21:04 +1300
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 01:13 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-28 10:40 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-28 11:02 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-10-28 11:28 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-28 11:57 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-28 12:53 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-10-28 13:33 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-28 08:35 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-28 10:59 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-28 11:04 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-28 11:38 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-28 11:43 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-28 12:10 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-28 12:58 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-28 13:55 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-28 14:02 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-28 15:01 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-28 15:44 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-28 16:22 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-28 16:26 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-28 16:44 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-28 18:45 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-28 19:26 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-28 20:44 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-10-28 22:59 +0100
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-28 22:48 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-10-29 01:14 +0100
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-29 01:07 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-10-29 14:07 +0100
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-29 13:57 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-10-29 16:22 +0100
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter supercat@casperkitty.com - 2015-10-29 08:38 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-10-29 17:25 +0100
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter supercat@casperkitty.com - 2015-10-29 12:46 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-10-30 09:03 +0100
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-29 19:19 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-10-30 09:54 +0100
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-30 12:20 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-29 21:36 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-30 10:47 +1300
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-29 22:25 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-10-30 09:59 +0100
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-10-30 10:07 +0100
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-10-28 16:25 +0100
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-28 16:01 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-10-28 09:50 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-10-28 21:57 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Geoff <geoff@invalid.invalid> - 2015-10-28 18:25 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Geoff <geoff@invalid.invalid> - 2015-10-28 18:23 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-29 01:44 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-10-28 07:07 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2015-10-30 07:07 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-10-30 09:08 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2015-10-30 14:29 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-10-30 16:10 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2015-10-30 20:27 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-10-31 12:40 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2015-11-02 02:16 -0800
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 03:36 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-29 10:46 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 03:56 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 04:00 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-29 11:02 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 04:05 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-29 11:14 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 04:14 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-29 11:26 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-29 11:26 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 05:29 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-29 09:23 -0400
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 07:44 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-29 11:39 -0400
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 09:52 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-10-29 16:02 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 09:56 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-29 13:41 -0400
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-29 17:46 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Udyant Wig <udyantw@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 00:14 +0530
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2015-10-29 19:30 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-29 22:08 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 22:28 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2015-10-30 08:10 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter supercat@casperkitty.com - 2015-10-30 08:56 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2015-10-30 13:18 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2015-10-30 09:11 +1300
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 01:21 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 04:04 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-29 11:11 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 04:19 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-29 11:24 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 05:26 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-10-29 08:31 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-29 09:42 -0400
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 08:31 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 10:17 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-29 17:36 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 01:18 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-30 08:36 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-30 08:38 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 02:26 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-30 09:32 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-10-30 13:39 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 03:59 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-30 11:18 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 06:24 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-10-30 14:18 -0400
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 06:34 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-30 13:39 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 06:57 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-11-01 09:06 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-10-30 08:49 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 10:18 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Barry Schwarz <schwarzb@dqel.com> - 2015-10-29 11:48 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 01:23 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 01:42 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-30 09:13 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-10-30 10:17 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-30 10:23 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 06:39 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 06:45 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-10-30 13:55 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 07:05 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Steve Thompson <stevet810@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 23:29 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-10-31 01:14 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Steve Thompson <stevet810@gmail.com> - 2015-10-31 17:02 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-10-31 18:05 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Steve Thompson <stevet810@gmail.com> - 2015-10-31 23:46 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter supercat@casperkitty.com - 2015-11-01 08:46 -0800
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Steve Thompson <stevet810@gmail.com> - 2015-11-01 23:43 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter supercat@casperkitty.com - 2015-11-01 16:05 -0800
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-11-01 21:41 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Steve Thompson <stevet810@gmail.com> - 2015-11-01 22:46 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-31 18:22 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Steve Thompson <stevet810@gmail.com> - 2015-10-31 23:57 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Steve Thompson <stevet810@gmail.com> - 2015-10-31 17:20 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-10-31 13:38 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter supercat@casperkitty.com - 2015-10-31 11:28 -0700
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Steve Thompson <stevet810@gmail.com> - 2015-11-01 00:06 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Steve Thompson <stevet810@gmail.com> - 2015-10-31 17:58 +0000
Re: Problem with the function that should display new letter Alla _ <modelling.data@gmail.com> - 2015-10-31 01:14 -0700
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