Groups > sci.physics.relativity > #361790

Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN

From	Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com>
Newsgroups	sci.physics.relativity
Subject	Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN
Date	2015-08-25 08:18 -0500
Organization	Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID	<mrhpvt$36f$1@speranza.aioe.org> (permalink)
References	(7 earlier) <bb1dfe8b-30d1-4a07-84c4-db3c0477b754@googlegroups.com> <mrfdb4$ejk$3@speranza.aioe.org> <f91c5eee-240e-4f8e-a29d-d4e3a897a363@googlegroups.com> <mrfnfi$bl2$1@speranza.aioe.org> <d269c971-71ea-45a3-b45e-e3a1d22e319e@googlegroups.com>

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On 8/25/2015 7:19 AM, kenseto wrote:
> On Monday, August 24, 2015 at 2:23:52 PM UTC-4, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>> On 8/24/2015 12:47 PM, kenseto wrote:
>>> On Monday, August 24, 2015 at 11:30:49 AM UTC-4, Odd Bodkin wrote:
>>>> On 8/23/2015 5:39 PM, kenseto wrote:
>>>>> On Saturday, August 22, 2015 at 12:05:33 PM UTC-4, tjrob137 wrote:
>>>>>> On 8/22/15 8/22/15   9:13 AM, kenseto wrote:
>>>>>>> On Friday, August 21, 2015 at 10:34:19 AM UTC-4, tjrob137 wrote:
>>>>>>>> But it it NOT the light "changing its own wavelength".
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So does that imply that you agree that the wavelength of a specfic source is
>>>>>>> universal......eg the universal wavelength of sodium is 589 nm?
>>>>>> YOU HAVE TO READ WHAT I WROTE.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Light does not "have" a wavelength, only suitable MEASUREMENTS of light
>>>>>> attribute a wavelength to it.
>>>>>
>>>>> The better alternate explanation is that every light source have have a universal
>>>>> wavelength in a medium called the E-Matrix.
>>>>
>>>> I think physicists disagree with you.
>>>
>>> So??? Whatt I said is better than the assertion that the one-way speed of light is constant c
>>> independent of the motion of the source or the observer.
>>
>> I don't know why you think it's better.
>
> Constant c violates our definition of relative speed.....

Who is "our" here? Your definition of relative speed doesn't seem to 
match anything I've ever seen written in books.

> The causes of relative motion between A (observer) and B(light front) are as follows:
> 1. A moves individually wrt B.
> 2. B moves indinidually wrt A.
> 3. Both A and B are each moving individually.

Item 3 in particular doesn't look at all like what I've seen in books. 
Relative speed doesn't come conceptually from a combination of 
individual speeds, at least as far as scientists are concerned.

>
> None of the above causes of relative motion can satisfy the assertion that B is always moving
> at a constant speed.
>
>
>>
>>>
>>>> You asked if Tom's earlier statement meant that agreed that the
>>>> wavelength of a specific source is universal. Tom has reiterated -- and
>>>> physicists agree -- that light does not have any wavelength, let alone a
>>>> universal one.
>>>
>>> Light certainly have wavelength.....like water waves in a pond.
>>
>> Light is nothing like water waves.
>
>
> That's the point.....Einstein invented the special properties for light to derive SR.

Long before Einstein, light was known through OBSERVATION to be nothing 
like water waves.

>...the sad
> thing is that there is no need for such invention.
>>
>>> The wavelength of the water waves
>>> does not change. The speed of arrival of water waves is dependent on the relative
>>> speed of the observer wrt the source.
>>
>> Light is nothing like water waves. This has been known for more than a century.
>
> No....this has been asserted for more than a century.
>

No, known. By observation. No amount of thinking about what it should be 
will ever trump observation.


-- 
Odd Bodkin --- maker of fine toys, tools, tables

Thread

EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Pentcho Valev <pvalev@yahoo.com> - 2015-08-17 06:28 -0700
  Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2015-08-17 18:21 -0700
    Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Jason Burchett <jasb@h3ipotal.org> - 2015-08-19 15:12 +0000
    Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN alsor@interia.pl - 2015-08-21 08:27 -0700
  Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Pentcho Valev <pvalev@yahoo.com> - 2015-08-18 00:50 -0700
    Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2015-08-18 05:34 -0700
      Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Pentcho Valev <pvalev@yahoo.com> - 2015-08-18 06:20 -0700
        Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2015-08-18 20:07 -0700
        Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Pentcho Valev <pvalev@yahoo.com> - 2015-08-19 01:16 -0700
          Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2015-08-19 05:39 -0700
          Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN John Gogo <jfgogo22@yahoo.com> - 2015-08-22 18:48 -0700
      Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Karolina Vandeweghe <newisa@kerseyhouse.au> - 2015-08-19 20:03 +0000
        Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-08-21 09:34 -0500
          Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Pentcho Valev <pvalev@yahoo.com> - 2015-08-21 08:15 -0700
            Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-08-21 12:10 -0500
              Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Pentcho Valev <pvalev@yahoo.com> - 2015-08-21 10:28 -0700
              Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Karolina Vandeweghe <newisa@kerseyhouse.au> - 2015-08-21 17:31 +0000
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-08-21 15:47 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Karolina Vandeweghe <newisa@kerseyhouse.au> - 2015-08-22 09:10 +0000
              Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Maciej Woźniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2015-08-21 19:35 +0200
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2015-08-21 11:44 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Maciej Woźniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2015-08-21 20:59 +0200
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2015-08-21 13:12 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Maciej Woźniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2015-08-21 22:24 +0200
          Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Maciej Woźniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2015-08-21 17:56 +0200
          Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Karolina Vandeweghe <newisa@kerseyhouse.au> - 2015-08-21 17:19 +0000
            Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-08-21 21:03 -0500
              Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Karolina Vandeweghe <newisa@kerseyhouse.au> - 2015-08-22 09:05 +0000
              Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Maciej Woźniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2015-08-22 20:09 +0200
          Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-08-21 21:21 -0700
          Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-08-22 07:13 -0700
            Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Karolina Vandeweghe <newisa@kerseyhouse.au> - 2015-08-22 15:58 +0000
            Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-08-22 11:05 -0500
              Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Karolina Vandeweghe <newisa@kerseyhouse.au> - 2015-08-22 16:19 +0000
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-08-22 17:09 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN James Birdy <jamesb@barefootwalking.org> - 2015-08-22 22:24 +0000
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Tom Roberts <tjroberts137@sbcglobal.net> - 2015-08-23 08:35 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Maciej Woźniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2015-08-23 15:45 +0200
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Maciej Woźniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2015-08-23 08:59 +0200
              Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Maciej Woźniak <mlwozniak@wp.pl> - 2015-08-22 20:19 +0200
              Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-08-23 15:39 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-08-24 10:30 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-08-24 10:47 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-08-24 13:23 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-08-25 05:19 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kefischer <emoneyjoe@iglou.com> - 2015-08-25 08:45 -0400
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-08-25 08:18 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-08-25 06:58 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-08-25 09:05 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-08-25 12:09 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-08-25 14:50 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-08-25 15:58 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-08-26 06:58 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-08-26 09:28 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-08-26 11:37 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-08-26 17:57 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-08-27 07:58 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-08-27 07:08 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Gary Harnagel <hitlong@yahoo.com> - 2015-08-27 07:28 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-08-27 08:09 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-08-27 10:36 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-08-27 10:40 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-08-28 09:02 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-08-28 11:55 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-08-28 17:24 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-08-27 10:10 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-08-28 17:12 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-08-31 08:18 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-08-31 08:48 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-08-31 11:09 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-08-31 15:08 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-08-31 17:36 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-08-31 20:24 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-01 08:23 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-01 07:26 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-01 09:47 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-01 10:07 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-01 12:10 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-01 12:22 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-01 14:58 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-09-01 14:57 -0700
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN Odd Bodkin <bodkinodd@gmail.com> - 2015-09-01 17:48 -0500
                Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kefischer <emoneyjoe@iglou.com> - 2015-08-26 13:40 -0400
              Re: EINSTEINIANS TOPPLE EINSTEIN kenseto <setoken@att.net> - 2015-08-24 10:35 -0700

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