Re: pedagogy

From	Bartc <bc@freeuk.com>
Newsgroups	comp.lang.c
Subject	Re: pedagogy
Date	2015-05-31 17:04 +0100
Organization	A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID	<mkfbc6$4j2$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References	(2 earlier) <slrnmmj7t8.2ot.grahn+nntp@frailea.sa.invalid> <f1506bdf-e9d9-4132-93ee-07d1b22bf2d2@googlegroups.com> <mkchvn$d1u$1@dont-email.me> <ct0l09Fg841U1@mid.individual.net> <87r3pwhjr3.fsf@bsb.me.uk>

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On 31/05/2015 16:03, Ben Bacarisse wrote:
> "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> writes:

>> If so, that language is Pascal. I sort
>> of learned Lisp many, many years ago.  Nothing.  When I got my Atari ST, the
>> big thing was Logo. I spent hours on it.  Nothing. As far as I can tell
>> Pascal is a pretty good cut at a working form of pseudocode.  One huge
>> advantage over C is that types and variables and initial values are
>> different things and you damn well know it while it is going on. Pascal also
>> makes very clear the difference between a small integer and a character.
>> Pascal's wordiness may also make you appreciate C more when you learn the
>> two languages in that order.
>
> But Pascal is an odd suggestion, at least for those reasons!  Pascal is
> horrid to work in because it is so restrictive

The main restrictions (IIRC) were problems with the type system in not 
being able to deal with generic arrays and strings, instead of fixed 
length ones. Also the entire application had to be in one source file 
(the version I used anyway).

OK for teaching (the type system was otherwise cool, IMO), but a few 
tweaks would have been it more practical for real applications.

> and, in my experience,
> students hate it.

What did they want to learn instead? It could be that they'd heard of C 
or C++, which may have acquired a certain reputation, but some might 
have changed their minds when they actually used them!

> The big plus point (and it should not be ignored) is
> the vast number of good books available that use or are about Pascal.
> And because it a language from another century, many can be picked up
> for pennies.

Pascal is about the same age as C, and probably most C compilers 
implement the standard from the last century. Pascal has just become 
unpopular.

-- 
Bartc

Thread

pedagogy luser droog <luser.droog@gmail.com> - 2015-05-28 22:42 -0700
  Re: pedagogy Morris Dovey <mrdovey@iedu.com> - 2015-05-29 00:57 -0500
  Re: pedagogy Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-05-29 11:10 +0100
    Re: pedagogy raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2015-05-29 12:42 +0000
      Re: pedagogy David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-05-29 10:02 -0700
        Re: pedagogy raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2015-05-29 18:23 +0000
  Re: pedagogy Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2015-05-29 13:34 +0200
  Re: pedagogy John Bode <jfbode1029@gmail.com> - 2015-05-29 08:17 -0700
    Re: pedagogy rick.c.hodgin@gmail.com - 2015-05-29 08:33 -0700
      Re: pedagogy Etienne Prud'homme <e.e.f.prudhomme@gmail.com> - 2015-05-29 12:25 -0400
        Re: pedagogy John Bode <jfbode1029@gmail.com> - 2015-05-29 14:28 -0700
          Re: pedagogy Etienne Prud'homme <e.e.f.prudhomme@gmail.com> - 2015-05-30 00:58 -0400
    Re: pedagogy gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2015-05-29 15:46 +0000
  Re: pedagogy Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com> - 2015-05-29 22:16 -0500
  Re: pedagogy luser droog <luser.droog@gmail.com> - 2015-05-30 00:16 -0700
    Re: pedagogy Jorgen Grahn <grahn+nntp@snipabacken.se> - 2015-05-30 11:31 +0000
      Re: pedagogy David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-05-30 07:10 -0700
        Re: pedagogy Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-05-30 15:38 +0100
          Re: pedagogy "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2015-05-31 09:43 -0500
            Re: pedagogy Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-05-31 16:03 +0100
              Re: pedagogy "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2015-05-31 10:34 -0500
                Re: pedagogy Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-05-31 16:56 +0100
                Re: pedagogy luser droog <luser.droog@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 10:28 -0700
              Re: pedagogy Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-05-31 17:04 +0100
                Re: pedagogy Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com> - 2015-05-31 12:10 -0500
                Re: pedagogy raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2015-06-05 15:21 +0000
          Re: pedagogy David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-05-31 09:01 -0700
            Re: pedagogy luser droog <luser.droog@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 21:51 -0700
              Re: pedagogy David Kleinecke <dkleinecke@gmail.com> - 2015-06-03 09:14 -0700
              Re: pedagogy "Chris M. Thomasson" <nospam@nospam.nospam> - 2015-06-04 00:48 -0700
  Re: pedagogy luser droog <luser.droog@gmail.com> - 2015-06-02 22:12 -0700

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