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Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit?

From David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no>
Newsgroups comp.lang.c
Subject Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit?
Date 2015-04-07 11:01 +0200
Organization A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID <mg06c7$bnc$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References <0c864744-32bf-4ce9-8b2e-f2a842fec7bb@googlegroups.com> <mfrv11$tui$1@dont-email.me>

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On 05/04/15 20:31, Paul wrote:
> Weng Tianxiang wrote:
>> Hi, Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent
>> floating X87 unit?
>> Here are some texts from Intel latest datasheet:
>> Intel(R) Core(tm) i7 Processor Family for LGA2011-v3 Socket Datasheet
>> - Volume 1 of 2
>> Processor Feature Details *Up to 8 execution cores *Each core supports
>> two threads (Intel(R) Hyper-Threading Technology) *32 KB instruction
>> and 32 KB data first-level cache (L1) for each core *256 KB shared
>> instruction/data mid-level (L2) cache for each core *Up to 15 MB last
>> level cache (LLC): up to 2.5 MB per core instruction/data last level
>> cache (LLC), shared among all cores.
>> 5.2 X87 FPU INSTRUCTIONS The x87 FPU instructions are executed by the
>> processor's x87 FPU. These instructions operate on floating-point,
>> integer, and binary-coded decimal (BCD) operands. For more detail on
>> x87 FPU instructions, see Chapter 8, "Programming with the x87 FPU."
>>
>> These instructions are divided into the following subgroups: data
>> transfer, load constants, and FPU control instructions.
>> From above text I have a feeling that all 8 execution cores share the
>> same X87 FPU unit.
>> Am I right or not?
>> Is there anyone who has real experiences with X87 FPU unit?
>> Thank you.
>> Weng 
> 
> Take a 4C 8T (hyperthreaded) processor, like this one.
> 
> http://ark.intel.com/products/80807/Intel-Core-i7-4790K-Processor-8M-Cache-up-to-4_40-GHz
> 
> 
> This would be a drawing of the processor. I do not know the
> details of the FPU section, whether there are one or two
> units, how fast they can retire instructions. So this is only
> a rough approximation.
> 
> Logical  Logical  Logical Logical  Logical Logical  Logical Logical
> Core 0   Core 1   Core 2  Core 3   Core 4  Core 5   Core 6  Core 7
>    \      /         \       /        \       /        \       /
>    Physical         Physical         Physical         Physical
>    Dispatch -- FPU  Dispatch -- FPU  dispatch -- FPU  Dispatch -- FPU
>       |                |
>    (retired        (retired          (retired        (retired
>     instructions)   instructions)     instructions)   instructions)
> 
> Only enough of the architecture is shown in this diagram,
> to point out that the processor *actually* only has 4 cores (not 8),
> and a dedicated FPU is associated with each core. I do not
> know the exact details of that FPU.
> 
> Hyperthreading is an overlay on top of that, where core state
> is preserved on a stall, and the core can work on a second task
> which is not stalled. Thus squeezing 10% more performance from the
> four cores. In Windows, you see eight performance graphs,
> but it's all a sham. You're seeing 4.4 cores of performance,
> graphed in 8 graph columns.
> 

The performance gain from hyperthreading depends on the hardware
implementation of hyperthreading, the software tasks in question, and
the sophistication of the operating system.  Back when hyperthreading
was young in the x86 world (on the P4), the "logical cores" had very
little in them, and Windows was incapable of using them properly - it
viewed them as two real processors.  The result was poor scheduling and
the extra cache abuse meant that many tasks ran slower with
hyperthreading enabled.

At around the same time, hyperthreading (or SMT) was used in the big cpu
world (such as MIPS, Power, SPARC, etc.) to much greater effect - partly
because of better hardware, partly because of better OS support (which
was developed tightly together with the chips), and partly because of
more appropriate software loads (server software rather than desktop
software).  Modern "big cpu" designs usually have between 2 and 8
logical cores per physical core.

These days, the x86 hardware implementation is better, and more
efficiently combined with superscaler execution.  Linux understands SMT,
and schedules processes and threads to take advantage of them (such as
by spreading operations amongst real cores, or considering cache
contents) - and from something I read, I think one of the only
advantages of Win8 over Win7 is that it is better at scheduling on
hyperthreaded cores.  And the use of multiple threads has become more
common in software, leading to further improvements.

Testing "time make", "time make -j 4" and "time make -j 8" on a project
with 80-something C files on my i7 with 4 + 4 cores, shows that
utilising 4 cores builds a little over 3 times faster than 1 core, and
utilising 8 cores builds almost 4.5 times faster.  The hyperthreading
does not give me twice the processing power for this real-world task,
but it's around 30% faster.  If I were to cut out the single thread
bottlenecks (like linking, or the makefile processing), it would be even
higher.

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Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Weng Tianxiang <wtxwtx@gmail.com> - 2015-04-05 06:50 -0700
  Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2015-04-05 17:17 +0200
    Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> - 2015-04-05 17:35 +0200
      Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-05 11:21 -0500
        Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> - 2015-04-05 18:40 +0200
          Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-05 11:56 -0500
            Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2015-04-05 10:08 -0700
              Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-05 13:17 -0500
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-04-07 10:10 +0200
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-07 10:26 -0500
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-04-07 23:40 +0200
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-04-07 23:06 +0100
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-04-08 01:23 +0200
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-07 23:15 -0500
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-07 20:16 -0500
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-04-08 09:27 +0200
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-08 09:44 -0500
            Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> - 2015-04-05 19:37 +0200
              Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-05 18:50 -0500
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-04-05 22:29 -0500
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-05 23:09 -0500
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-04-06 01:54 -0500
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-06 07:44 -0500
              Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-04-07 10:16 +0200
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-04-07 03:32 -0500
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-04-07 12:48 +0200
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-04-07 11:57 +0100
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-04-07 13:33 +0200
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-04-07 15:21 -0500
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-04-07 17:15 +0000
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Tim Prince <tprince@computer.org> - 2015-04-07 14:21 -0400
            Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-04-05 13:08 -0700
              Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-05 15:27 -0500
          Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2015-04-05 19:04 +0200
            Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> - 2015-04-05 19:38 +0200
              Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2015-04-05 10:46 -0700
            Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-04-05 13:12 -0700
        Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2015-04-05 09:51 -0700
          Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-05 12:18 -0500
      Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-04-06 01:30 +0200
        Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-05 19:27 -0500
          Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? christian.bau@cbau.wanadoo.co.uk - 2015-04-07 23:58 -0700
            Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-08 08:08 -0500
        Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> - 2015-04-06 03:36 +0200
        Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-04-07 10:27 +0200
          Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-07 10:39 -0500
        Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? christian.bau@cbau.wanadoo.co.uk - 2015-04-07 23:47 -0700
    Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-05 11:04 -0500
      Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> - 2015-04-05 18:20 +0200
        Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-05 11:43 -0500
      Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-04-05 20:28 +0000
        Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-04-05 14:46 -0700
          Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? fir <profesor.fir@gmail.com> - 2015-04-05 15:01 -0700
    Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-04-05 13:17 -0700
  Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Paul <nospam@needed.com> - 2015-04-05 14:31 -0400
    Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-04-07 11:01 +0200
  Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-04-05 22:34 -0500
    Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Weng Tianxiang <wtxwtx@gmail.com> - 2015-04-05 23:39 -0700
      Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-04-06 02:06 -0500
        Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-06 08:57 -0500
          Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-04-06 12:38 -0500
            Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-06 16:30 -0500
              Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Stephen Sprunk <stephen@sprunk.org> - 2015-04-06 17:10 -0500
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating   X87 unit? Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-07 10:16 +1200
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating   X87 unit? Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> - 2015-04-07 02:23 +0200
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-06 17:36 -0500
              Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-04-06 17:41 -0500
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-06 20:09 -0500
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2015-04-06 22:44 -0400
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-04-07 11:11 +0200
        Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Weng Tianxiang <wtxwtx@gmail.com> - 2015-04-06 08:04 -0700
          Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-04-06 12:43 -0500
          Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Paul <nospam@needed.com> - 2015-04-06 14:52 -0400
            Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-06 17:09 -0500
      Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Paul <nospam@needed.com> - 2015-04-06 11:11 -0400
        Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-04-06 12:47 -0500
          Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Stephen Sprunk <stephen@sprunk.org> - 2015-04-06 17:15 -0500
            Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-04-07 03:41 -0500
              Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2015-04-07 21:19 +1200
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Stephen Sprunk <stephen@sprunk.org> - 2015-04-07 10:37 -0500
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating   X87 unit? Tim Prince <tprince@computer.org> - 2015-04-07 12:13 -0400
                Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating   X87 unit? Stephen Sprunk <stephen@sprunk.org> - 2015-04-09 12:34 -0500
              Re: Does each core of 8-core Intel processor has an independent floating X87 unit? Stephen Sprunk <stephen@sprunk.org> - 2015-04-07 10:48 -0500

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