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Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures...

From Bartc <bc@freeuk.com>
Newsgroups comp.lang.c
Subject Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures...
Date 2015-02-08 20:01 +0000
Organization A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID <mb8fa5$9og$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References (8 earlier) <2d553976-5abe-47d3-85f6-e98c261c6aa8@googlegroups.com> <mb6239$unr$1@dont-email.me> <lnk2ztjjmb.fsf@nuthaus.mib.org> <mb7hab$90b$1@dont-email.me> <ln7fvsjjzl.fsf@nuthaus.mib.org>

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On 08/02/2015 19:12, Keith Thompson wrote:
> Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> writes:

>> They are grossly unintuitive, which is the point I'm making. But look at
>> this point of code:
>>
>>    x = c[i];
>>
>> Is c declared like int a[100] above (so there is no explicit pointer
>> involved), or like int *b above (with an explicit pointer)?
>>
>> It's impossible to tell! Once someone has learned C, this can be a good
>> thing. But they have to get there first.
>
> Look at this piece of code:
>
>      x = y + z;
>
> Any of x, y, and z could be either an integer or a floating-point
> object.  In some languages, including C, they could be certain
> combinations of integers and pointers.

Sure, but in the absence of any "*" prefix operators, you know there is 
no pointer dereferencing going on. Not so with array indexing.

With a[i][j], is that a direct, rectangular array, a pointer to a 
rectangular array, a direct 1D array of pointers to arrays, or ... it 
could be anything! (BTW what happened to 'declaration follows use'? They 
seem to have dropped that idea here!)

It's marvellous in a way that it can completely mask what's going on, 
unless something doesn't work of course, then a few explicit "*" 
prefixes might have given a hint as to what might be amiss.

With this Pascal code: a^[i][j] (or a^[i,j]) tells you straight-away 
that a is a pointer to a rectangular array; there is only one pointer 
involved. With a[i]^[j] (odd as it might look to C users), it's an array 
of pointers to arrays.

-- 
Bartc

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Thread

Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... jeffkrob16@gmail.com - 2015-02-03 09:33 -0800
  Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-02-03 17:59 +0000
  Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-02-03 13:01 -0500
  Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Barry Schwarz <schwarzb@dqel.com> - 2015-02-03 10:49 -0800
  Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2015-02-03 18:54 +0000
  Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... asetofsymbols@gmail.com - 2015-02-03 11:50 -0800
    Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... asetofsymbols@gmail.com - 2015-02-03 12:07 -0800
    Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Lew Pitcher <lew.pitcher@digitalfreehold.ca> - 2015-02-03 15:14 -0500
    Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Barry Schwarz <schwarzb@dqel.com> - 2015-02-03 15:06 -0800
      Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... asetofsymbols@gmail.com - 2015-02-03 22:19 -0800
  Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-02-03 21:40 +0000
    Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... asetofsymbols@gmail.com - 2015-02-03 22:56 -0800
      Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... asetofsymbols@gmail.com - 2015-02-03 23:02 -0800
      Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... asetofsymbols@gmail.com - 2015-02-04 00:01 -0800
  Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... jeffkrob16@gmail.com - 2015-02-04 10:53 -0800
    Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-02-04 11:21 -0800
    Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-02-04 19:32 +0000
    Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Barry Schwarz <schwarzb@dqel.com> - 2015-02-04 11:59 -0800
    Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... hormelfree@gmail.com - 2015-02-04 15:30 -0800
      Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... jeffkrob16@gmail.com - 2015-02-04 19:41 -0800
        Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-05 04:06 +0000
          Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-02-05 10:36 +0000
            Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-05 10:59 +0000
            Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-02-05 11:03 +0000
            Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-02-05 12:30 +0000
              Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-05 12:46 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-05 12:49 +0000
            Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... hormelfree@gmail.com - 2015-02-05 15:08 -0800
          Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-02-05 08:48 -0800
          Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... hormelfree@gmail.com - 2015-02-05 15:16 -0800
            Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-05 23:35 +0000
              Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... hormelfree@gmail.com - 2015-02-07 12:11 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-02-07 12:22 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-02-07 22:03 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-02-07 14:47 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-02-07 17:15 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2015-02-08 17:22 +1300
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-02-08 02:47 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-02-08 11:20 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-02-08 14:36 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2015-02-09 11:51 +1300
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-02-08 15:02 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Geoff <geoff@invalid.invalid> - 2015-02-08 16:55 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-02-09 03:24 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-09 11:56 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-02-09 14:25 +0100
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-09 14:00 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-02-09 15:26 +0100
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-09 14:39 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-02-09 16:59 +0100
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2015-02-09 16:01 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-02-09 13:39 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-02-09 09:46 -0500
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-09 14:50 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-02-09 08:22 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2015-02-09 13:24 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-02-09 16:03 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-02-09 11:01 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-02-09 21:54 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2015-02-09 19:22 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-02-10 11:34 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-02-10 14:15 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-02-10 00:38 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-02-10 09:21 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2015-02-10 22:24 +1300
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-10 09:25 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-02-10 09:03 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-10 17:12 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-02-10 09:56 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-10 18:12 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-02-10 11:24 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2015-02-10 20:18 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-02-10 09:16 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-02-10 22:12 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-02-11 02:58 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-02-10 19:00 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-11 07:56 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... David Thompson <dave.thompson2@verizon.net> - 2015-02-22 18:08 -0500
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-02-10 16:01 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2015-02-10 11:26 +1300
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-02-10 10:29 +0100
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-02-09 08:32 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-02-09 11:09 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2015-02-09 19:39 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Martin Shobe <martin.shobe@yahoo.com> - 2015-02-09 14:04 -0600
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-02-09 12:24 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-02-10 10:34 +0100
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-02-08 11:42 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-02-07 22:50 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-02-07 17:07 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-02-08 11:29 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-02-08 12:14 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-02-08 13:44 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-02-08 22:39 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-02-08 11:12 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-02-08 20:01 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-08 20:06 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-02-08 21:04 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-08 21:11 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-02-08 23:48 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-02-08 13:30 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Lew Pitcher <lew.pitcher@digitalfreehold.ca> - 2015-02-08 16:47 -0500
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-02-08 14:53 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-02-09 02:31 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-02-09 10:35 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-02-09 13:57 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-02-09 07:59 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2015-02-09 18:15 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-02-10 05:54 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-02-09 16:17 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-08 22:04 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-02-08 14:57 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-08 23:45 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-02-09 02:53 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-09 09:29 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-02-09 10:10 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-09 11:24 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Ike Naar <ike@iceland.freeshell.org> - 2015-02-09 17:36 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-09 17:56 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-02-09 10:51 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-02-09 11:10 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-02-09 11:25 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-02-09 11:43 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-02-10 02:13 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-10 03:26 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2015-02-09 21:18 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-02-09 23:11 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-08 12:10 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-02-08 11:18 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-02-08 19:27 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... hormelfree@gmail.com - 2015-02-09 15:00 -0800
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-02-09 16:00 -0800
        Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-02-05 02:49 -0800
          Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-02-05 11:16 +0000
          Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-02-05 09:00 -0800
            Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-02-06 00:29 +0000
              Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-02-05 19:20 -0600
              Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... "Charles Richmond" <numerist@aquaporin4.com> - 2015-02-06 16:15 -0600
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-02-07 00:57 +0000
              Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2015-02-07 01:40 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-02-07 08:22 +0000
                Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-02-07 12:06 +0000
            Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... John Bode <jfbode1029@gmail.com> - 2015-02-06 15:03 -0800
        Re: Fortran Guy Learning C - Structures... hormelfree@gmail.com - 2015-02-05 15:12 -0800

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