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Re: More than half of kids think astrology is a science.

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On 2014-02-12 21:18:02 +0000, Koen Lefever said:

> I'm not sure I understand your point.
> 
> (1) Geocentrism can still be maintained, it is just a choice of 
> reference frame. Heliocentrism gives a more simple model (an ellipse 
> around the sun) than geocentrism (circles on circles on circles on 
> circles... around the earth) and that is why we mostly prefer it today.
> 
> (2) Both geocentrism and heliocentrism can exist with or without 
> magical thinking. For example, Kepler was a copernican (heliocentrism) 
> and he was also an astrologer (in the sense of magical thinking).
> 
> (3) What we today call astronomy was once called astrology indeed. The 
> shift of meaning may be unfortunate, but language is a convention, so 
> trying to use a word in its historical meaning rather than how the 
> community understands it today only adds to the confusion.
> 
> (4) Magical thinking (including astrology as how the word is used 
> today) is unscientific. That is a different matter from whether is it 
> wrong or correct (even if I personally think magical thinking is 
> incorrect: in my opinion scientific thinking may be imperfect, but it 
> is the best we have). Still a different matter is if people have the 
> right to be wrong (I think they do).

I believe that the current astro-physical model of the universe quashes 
geocentrism.  It is still a very useful model for astrological 
observation of the heavens, but as far as its vaildity in cosmology it 
is now obsolete.  Anyway I have been bucking the trend for years and 
calling astrology by its proper name, as it has led to some great 
conversations.  Conventions can be bucked and trends can be reversed 
with persistence, and though others may feel I am a crank or a troll I 
am comfortable with this.

While your last point is true, I have moved beyond the stage in my life 
where I was worried about whether or not other people hold views that 
are scientifically supported.  It smacks of groupthink, especially when 
people are presssured to have views that they are merely told are 
scientifically supportable without having the tools or time to verify 
these supposedly scientific ideas for themselves.  It's simply swapping 
one religion, with one priesthood, for another, and ultimately is 
merely magical thinking under a different name.  I try not to believe 
anything unless I can prove it to myself, to my own satisfaction, with 
my own resources any more.  If I can't test a theory myself it is not 
likely that my belief in it (or not) will cause any great impact on my 
day to day life.

Ultimately I was moved to post the link by the commets posted at 
Slashdot, which were a perfect example of mass groupthink.  People are 
conditioned to hate astrology and geocentrism, and many don't even know 
why.  My comment following was just a rant in the vein of Slashdot 
posts.

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Thread

More than half of kids think astrology is a science. Oregonian Haruspex <bob_davis_retired@yahoo.com> - 2014-02-12 20:11 +0000
  Re: More than half of kids think astrology is a science. Koen Lefever <koen.lefever@gmail.com> - 2014-02-12 13:18 -0800
    Re: More than half of kids think astrology is a science. Oregonian Haruspex <bob_davis_retired@yahoo.com> - 2014-02-12 14:10 -0800
      Re: More than half of kids think astrology is a science. cykros@devio.us - 2014-02-13 05:42 +0000
        Re: More than half of kids think astrology is a science. Oregonian Haruspex <bob_davis_retired@yahoo.com> - 2014-02-12 22:39 -0800
          Re: More than half of kids think astrology is a science. Marko Rauhamaa <marko@pacujo.net> - 2014-02-13 09:24 +0200
            Re: More than half of kids think astrology is a science. Oregonian Haruspex <bob_davis_retired@yahoo.com> - 2014-02-12 23:44 -0800
  Re: More than half of kids think astrology is a science. Koen Lefever <koen.lefever@gmail.com> - 2014-02-14 12:29 -0800
    Re: More than half of kids think astrology is a science. Spalls Hurgenson <spallshurgenson@gmail.com> - 2014-02-15 09:22 -0500
    Re: More than half of kids think astrology is a science. Vince Mulhollon <vincemulhollon@gmail.com> - 2014-02-16 05:32 -0800

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