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Groups > comp.sys.mac.hardware.misc > #1300

Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to.

From Bread <BreadWithSpam@Fractious.net>
Newsgroups comp.sys.mac.hardware.misc, comp.sys.mac.system
Subject Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to.
Date 2013-12-12 09:19 -0800
Organization lined up neatly
Message-ID <l8cr75$3i8$1@reader1.panix.com> (permalink)
References (9 earlier) <081220131242438713%nospam@nospam.invalid> <1ldlqgv.1ltvphp15zm2gbN%jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz> <l86bfi$ber$2@dont-email.me> <1ldogf3.1a9xdjq7b6u7pN%jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz> <101220131222523888%nospam@nospam.invalid>

Cross-posted to 2 groups.

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On 2013-12-10 17:22:52 +0000, nospam said:
> yep. creator codes and file types was an idea well ahead of its time.
> 
> the problem was that nobody else used them so you had to add an
> extension when sending it to someone else. lesser systems choked on
> 'foo' but not on 'foo.txt'. it was a pain and confused a lot of people.

I'd also say that the problem was that they weren't easily seen and
modified, and that the codes were often completely gibberish so that
it was far from obvious looking at them what they were for.  That was
partly because they were limited to 4 chars, and partly because they
tried so hard to make them invisible (with the idealized vision that
people shouldn't have to care about them and that clicking on files
would "just work").

File extensions, especially when not limited to three chars, is easy
to see, change, understand.  The main advantage to type/creator was
the additional dimension.  Extensions are just type, and we rely on
a separate mapping of preferred apps to open various file types.

> that could easily have been automated (and was to an extent) but
> instead, the nexties ditched it entirely and went back to extensions
> and path names, just like it was done in the 1960s. they couldn't be
> bothered with doing it properly.
> 
> that's why if you move an app out of the applications folder or dare to
> rename it (notably apple's apps), it won't update properly because
> apple's braindead update mechanism uses hard coded paths and can't be

That only applies to the update mechanism and, as far as I can tell, only
on Apple's apps (though in fairness, I haven't tested with other apps I
got from the App Store).

When clicking on files to launch them, or using Launch Services in
general, no - path names are not an issue.  Similarly when using the
open command from the command line, if you add -a AppName, it certainly
doesn't ask for a path and unless you have a specific instance of an app
which you want to use, it doesn't usually matter.

> in classic mac os, all you needed to do was a lookup for the creator
> code, get its folder id and then update. it didn't matter where the app
> was or what it was called. you always got back the correct location.

Unless you had more than one copy of an app.

> that's one of the many things that set the mac apart from more
> primitive systems.

Face it - the issues of types, creators, mappings to apps is just complex
and no matter how it's done, there are going to be issues.  I very much prefer
solutions where it's obvious what's happening.  For the most part, I find
extensions vastly easier to see and manage.  The paths issue, well, it would
also be nice if it were easier to manage the Launch Services DB, but overall,
I very much prefer what we've got now in OS X versus the old creater/type
codes.

MIME-types may have been a better modern improvement - allowing specification
of a lot more with much less cryptic info - but again, there's no easy
way to attach that data to files and see it or change it.

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Thread

Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-12-07 03:12 +1300
  Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2013-12-06 17:24 +0000
    Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-12-07 15:51 +1300
      Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. George Kerby <ghost_topper@hotmail.com> - 2013-12-07 08:27 -0600
        Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-12-08 09:08 +1300
          Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. George Kerby <ghost_topper@hotmail.com> - 2013-12-07 15:38 -0600
  Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. isw <isw@witzend.com> - 2013-12-06 09:46 -0800
    Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-12-07 15:51 +1300
      Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2013-12-07 09:00 +0000
        Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-12-07 23:11 +1300
        Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. Fred Bambrough <fred@[127.0.0.1]> - 2013-12-07 16:32 +0000
          Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-12-08 07:58 +1300
            Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2013-12-07 14:19 -0500
              Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-12-08 08:46 +1300
                Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2013-12-08 15:08 +1300
                Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-12-08 16:25 +1300
                Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2013-12-08 23:08 +1300
                Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-12-08 23:59 +1300
                Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2013-12-08 17:42 +0000
                Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2013-12-08 17:30 +0000
                Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2013-12-08 12:42 -0500
                Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-12-09 08:08 +1300
                Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2013-12-08 19:12 +0000
                Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2013-12-08 14:19 -0500
                Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2013-12-08 23:54 +0000
                Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. Wes Groleau <Groleau+news@FreeShell.org> - 2013-12-10 01:14 -0500
                Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-12-10 19:26 +1300
                Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2013-12-10 12:22 -0500
                Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. Bread <BreadWithSpam@Fractious.net> - 2013-12-12 09:19 -0800
                Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2013-12-12 19:22 +0000
                Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2013-12-12 14:37 -0500
                Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2013-12-08 03:08 +0000
                Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2013-12-08 17:36 +0000
          Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2013-12-08 03:06 +0000
        Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. Wes Groleau <Groleau+news@FreeShell.org> - 2013-12-10 01:11 -0500
  Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2013-12-07 10:26 +1300
    Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-12-07 15:51 +1300
      Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2013-12-08 15:08 +1300
        Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-12-08 16:25 +1300
          Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2013-12-08 23:08 +1300
            Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-12-08 23:59 +1300
              Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-12-10 22:17 +1300
          Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2013-12-08 17:32 +0000
            Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-12-09 08:08 +1300
      Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2013-12-08 03:17 +0000
        Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-12-08 16:36 +1300
          Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2013-12-08 06:23 +0000
            Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-12-08 22:47 +1300
    Re: Bought refurbished iPod touch, it's FUBARed, and other shit to. David Fritzinger <dfritzin@nospam.mac.com> - 2013-12-07 14:58 -0500

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