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Re: who believes EV batteries are good for 10 years? haha!

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On 30/3/2023 8:49 am, Computer Nerd Kev wrote:
> In aus.science Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>> On 29/3/2023 10:58 pm, Nomen Nescio wrote:
>>> I mean the lithium batteries in a laptop computer only
>>> last a few years.
>>>
>> You *might* benefit from a good read of this.
>>
>> https://au.renogy.com/blog/everything-you-need-to-know-about-lithium-battery-charging-cycles/
>>
>> It's the charging cycle and the usage style that are the critical
>> things. I know of a number of hybrid cars where the batteries are in
>> excess of 10 years old. At 10 years, if charged and used correctly, they
>> should still have better than 80% capacity remaining.
> 
> The numbers from that article suggest (vaguely) that "used
> correctly" means you only use 25% of the available capacity before
> recharging, so that's rather a big chunk off the advertised range
> of the vehicles. It probably does apply to many urban commuters,
> but EVs are advertised now as being replacements for internal
> combustion powered cars, so presumably many are used as such in
> longer trips.

Research suggests that most people could easily substitute a BEV for 
their daily driver since they drive less than 50 kilometres daily. 
Certainly, were either or both of our cars BEVs, then we would use less 
than 20% of battery capacity daily with occasional long trips. Some of 
those trips would be 100-200 km round trip, some rarer trips would 
exceed that. I consider my self an average car user though not a 
commuter since I'm retired, certainly my annual mileage indicates that.

> 
> Also the article's about solar power, not electric vehicles, so
> their conversion of charge cycles to years probably isn't based on
> factors relevent to vehicle use.

Maybe not but EV batteries are generally warranted for 8 years or more. 
That gives a good expectation of a 10+ year average lifespan. My point, 
by including that article, was to demonstrate that *how you charge* and 
*how you use* the EV battery is what ultimately determines the battery 
lifespan. Phones and laptops are no different and this is a point lost 
on most people.

Tesla
Model S and Model X - 8 years (with the exception of the original 60 kWh 
battery manufactured before 2015 that is covered for a period of 8 years 
or 125,000 miles/200,000 km, whichever comes first).
Model 3 with Standard or Mid-Range Battery - 8 years or 100,000 miles 
(160,000 km), whichever comes first, with minimum 70% retention of 
Battery capacity* over the warranty period.
Model 3 with Long Range Battery - 8 years or 120,000 miles (192,000 km), 
whichever comes first, with minimum 70% retention of Battery capacity* 
over the warranty period.

Hyundai
8 year battery warranty; Each high voltage lithium-ion battery is backed 
by an 8 year/ 160,000km replacement warranty (whichever occurs first)
> 
> My guess is that many won't make it to 10 years in useful
> condition, but some will, which is actually the same as I've

The reality, with Toyota hybrids at least, is that EV batteries do last 
longer than 10 years and still retain a useful range. I suspect the 
BEVs, once they get up to 10 year lifespans, will be no different.

> experienced with laptops from different users. My laptop experience

Cars *are not* laptops.

> also suggests that battery quality is a big factor as well (cheap
> no-name replacement packs die much sooner than OEM batteries).
> 
That's true for any and all batteries.

-- 
Xeno


Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
       (with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)

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who believes EV batteries are good for 10 years? haha! Nomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com> - 2023-03-29 13:58 +0200
  Re: who believes EV batteries are good for 10 years? haha! Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> - 2023-03-30 00:13 +1100
    Re: who believes EV batteries are good for 10 years? haha! not@telling.you.invalid (Computer Nerd Kev) - 2023-03-30 07:49 +1000
      Re: who believes EV batteries are good for 10 years? haha! Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> - 2023-03-30 12:13 +1100
  Re: who believes EV batteries are good for 10 years? haha! Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> - 2023-03-30 12:45 +1100
    Re: who believes EV batteries are good for 10 years? haha! Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> - 2023-03-30 14:59 +1100

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