Groups | Search | Server Info | Keyboard shortcuts | Login | Register [http] [https] [nntp] [nntps]

Groups > comp.lang.c++.moderated > #1397

Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 Organization: Roundhouse Consulting, Ltd.

Show all headers | View raw

On 06/06/2011 02:29 PM, Florian Weimer wrote:
> 
> * Pete Becker:
> 
>> The most recent draft is identical to the FDIS, except for the title
>> page and the running heads. Since the FDIS will, in all probability,
>> become the standard, ISO doesn't allow the FDIS or the most recent
>> draft to be distributed for free.
> 
> ISO does allow free distribution of standards.  It's just that it has
> to be negotiated upfront.  Now it's too late, of course.
> 
> On the other hand, almost everybody in the C++ community hopes that
> the FDIS continues to leak to the Internet and is consulted by
> programmers because everything else would have a disastrous impact on
> adoption.
> 

I certainly hope that they make it available for a reasonable fee. Some ISO standards cost $30, and some cost $300. If it ends up in the $300 category... then very few programmers will buy it.

Right now, there isn't any good free online reference documentation for the C++ standard. The SGI docs are the best, but they only partially cover the standard library. There's no iostreams documentation for instance. They also don't cover any of the new additions in C++0x.

I think there's an expectation among the standards committee that programmers will just buy a bunch of C++ books. However, today that's unrealistic.

First of all, C++ is a huge language, and you need maybe 5 or 6 books to get what's in the standard. That's a pretty big investment for a new C++ programmer. The main reason people learn C instead of C++ is that learning it is less of an investment in time and money.

Secondly, programmers no longer expect to have to buy books. Personally, when I learn a new language now, I expect there to be free online documentation. Python, Ruby, Java, C#, Haskell, Clojure, etc, all have free authoritative online references for their standard library and language.

I think that the "programmers will buy a bunch of books to learn a language" expectation comes from an era before the internet.


-- 
      [ See http://www.gotw.ca/resources/clcm.htm for info about ]
      [ comp.lang.c++.moderated.    First time posters: Do this! ]

Back to comp.lang.c++.moderated | Previous | Next — Previous in thread | Next in thread | Find similar | Unroll thread

Thread

Latest draft of C++ 11  Joe Gottman <josephgottman@comcast.net> - 2011-06-05 21:45 -0600
  Re: Latest draft of C++ 11  Anthony Williams <anthony.ajw@gmail.com> - 2011-06-06 12:46 -0600
  Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 Organization: Roundhouse Consulting, Ltd.  Pete Becker <pete@versatilecoding.com> - 2011-06-06 12:44 -0600
    Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 Organization: Roundhouse Consulting, Ltd. Florian Weimer <fw@deneb.enyo.de> - 2011-06-06 15:29 -0600
      Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 Organization: Roundhouse Consulting, Ltd. Elias Salomão Helou Neto <eshneto@gmail.com> - 2011-06-07 03:05 -0600
        Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 Organization: Roundhouse Consulting,  Ltd.  Daniel Krügler <daniel.kruegler@googlemail.com> - 2011-06-07 10:33 -0600
          Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 Organization: Roundhouse Consulting, Ltd.  Francis Glassborow <francis.glassborow@btinternet.com> - 2011-06-08 01:55 -0600
            Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 Organization: Roundhouse Consulting, Ltd.  Elias Salomão Helou Neto <eshneto@gmail.com> - 2011-06-08 17:28 -0600
              Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 Organization: Roundhouse Consulting, Ltd.  Thomas Richter <thor@math.tu-berlin.de> - 2011-06-09 07:04 -0600
          Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 Organization: Roundhouse Consulting, Ltd.  Elias Salomão Helou Neto <eshneto@gmail.com> - 2011-06-08 02:05 -0600
            Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 Organization: Roundhouse Consulting, Ltd.  "Bo Persson" <bop@gmb.dk> - 2011-06-08 17:23 -0600
            Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 Organization: Roundhouse Consulting, Ltd.  Francis Glassborow <francis.glassborow@btinternet.com> - 2011-06-08 17:31 -0600
        Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 Organization: Roundhouse Consulting, Ltd.  Miles Bader <miles@gnu.org> - 2011-06-08 02:03 -0600
          Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 Organization: Roundhouse Consulting, Ltd.  John G Harris <news0@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2011-06-08 17:26 -0600
            Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 Organization: Roundhouse Consulting, Ltd. Alexander Terekhov <terekhov@web.de> - 2011-06-09 15:49 -0600
              Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 Organization: Roundhouse Consulting, Ltd.  Pete Becker <pete@versatilecoding.com> - 2011-06-10 02:50 -0600
                Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 Organization: Roundhouse Consulting,  Ltd.  Alexander Terekhov <terekhov@web.de> - 2011-06-10 09:22 -0600
      Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 Organization: Roundhouse Consulting, Ltd.  Brendan Miller <catphive@catphive.net> - 2011-06-08 02:04 -0600
        Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 Organization: Roundhouse Consulting, Ltd.  Francis Glassborow <francis.glassborow@btinternet.com> - 2011-06-08 17:19 -0600
        Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 Organization: Roundhouse Consulting, Ltd.  Florian Weimer <fw@deneb.enyo.de> - 2011-06-08 17:26 -0600
  Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 "Bo Persson" <bop@gmb.dk> - 2011-06-06 12:49 -0600
    Re: Latest draft of C++ 11  Helmut Jarausch <jarausch@igpm.rwth-aachen.de> - 2011-06-08 02:06 -0600
      Re: Latest draft of C++ 11  "Bo Persson" <bop@gmb.dk> - 2011-06-08 17:29 -0600
      Re: Latest draft of C++ 11  Alexander Terekhov <terekhov@web.de> - 2011-06-08 17:24 -0600
        Re: Latest draft of C++ 11  Francis Glassborow <francis.glassborow@btinternet.com> - 2011-06-09 06:57 -0600
          Re: Latest draft of C++ 11 Alexander Terekhov <terekhov@web.de> - 2011-06-09 15:53 -0600
  Re: Latest draft of C++ 11  Florian Weimer <fw@deneb.enyo.de> - 2011-06-06 12:45 -0600
  Re: Latest draft of C++ 11  Francis Glassborow <francis.glassborow@btinternet.com> - 2011-06-06 12:48 -0600
  Re: Latest draft of C++ 11  Daniel Krügler <daniel.kruegler@googlemail.com> - 2011-06-06 12:48 -0600
  Re: Latest draft of C++ 11  Nicola  Bonelli <nicola.bonelli@gmail.com> - 2011-06-08 02:01 -0600

csiph-web