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Groups > uk.tech.broadcast > #57231
| From | Ken Blake <ken@invalidemail.com> |
|---|---|
| Newsgroups | uk.tech.broadcast, alt.comp.software.thunderbird |
| Subject | Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text |
| Date | 2021-04-27 09:15 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <ieqrl3Fa1s9U1@mid.individual.net> (permalink) |
| References | (4 earlier) <s6708p$poq$2@dont-email.me> <ieofvuFqmlaU2@mid.individual.net> <s67db6$1hk$2@tncsrv09.home.tnetconsulting.net> <iep1ruFtu60U2@mid.individual.net> <s67mic$cti$1@tncsrv09.home.tnetconsulting.net> |
Cross-posted to 2 groups.
On 4/26/2021 5:39 PM, Grant Taylor wrote:
> On 4/26/21 5:49 PM, Ken Blake wrote:
>> This message, as you trimmed it and I replied to it, fits on a single
>> screen.
>
> What I'm replying to would fit in a (new) tweet.
I'll believe you. I have no interest in Twitter, have never used it, and
know next to nothing about it.
> IMHO, Tweets aren't in and of themselves sufficient for actual honest to
> $DEITY communications.
I'll believe that too.
> When you start getting into communications where someone takes more than
> five minutes to type a reply chances are good that their message, much
> less a sufficiently detailed response, will not fit on a number of
> screens and will require scrolling. Especially if one or both parties
> enforces hard line breaks between 70 and 80 characters.
Yes.
>> Would it be worse if if my reply was top-posted?
>
> Definitely. >
>> Maybe slightly worse, but it wouldn't be a big deal to me.
> More than slightly.
We disagree. See my point below.
> You're using English, so I'm going to assume that it's familiar to you.
> As such, you are probably also familiar with the top to bottom flow of
> normal English writing.
And all (almost all?) other languages.
> You probably also realize that this is a
> representation of chronological ""speech (of sorts).
> > With that in mind, I speculate that you would be disconcerted to hear
> someone answer a question before the question was asked. Be it a time
> jump or whatever. So ... why should textual representation of speech be
> any different than the verbal form of speech?
We agree. Of course it shouldn't. My point is simply that if someone
asks me a question like
How old are you?
and I reply
83.
> How old are you?
even though it's illogical and wrong, it's *very* easy to read and
understand the reply.
Contrast that with
83
two screens full of quoted material ending with
> How old are you?
*That* is very hard to read and understand the reply without scrolling
all the way to end and then perhaps back up to reread the reply (unless
you remember the question from whenever it was asked (which I seldom do).
That's the reason why in my opinion, sufficient trimming is often more
important than whether someone top posts or bottom posts
> Once you get beyond a certain length of email or discussion, there is a
> sequence of multiple points. And it's quite common to give participants
> the opportunity to respond to various points during the course of a
> longer discussion. I view interspersing point with counter points to be
> the same way. This is typically referred to in-line style.
>
> I strongly prefer in-line style.
As do I, as you can see from my reply here.
Once again, my only point is that regardless of what you and I prefer,
for simple replies to simple points that have been trimmed to fit on a
single screen, it's not as important as it it sometime is in other cases.
And despite what some people say, as far as I'm concerned, that goes for
e-mail as well as usenet posts. Top-posting is not a good way to do it.
It's as illogical and wrong in e-mail as it is is usenet. Even worse are
those people who reply to e-mail (or usenet posts) without quoting
anything; it may work for them if they read very few messages each day,
but it doesn't work for me, since I read many and can almost never
remember much of yesterday's messages, and I don't want to have go back
and look at yesterday's messages (which are no longer on my screen) to
see what they're talking about.
> Bottom posting does maintain
> conversation chronology. -- As in someone new to the conversation, say
> reading a newsgroup / mailing list archive. -- Can read from the start
> at the top to the end at the bottom in one pass and likely not be confused.
>
> whack
> out
> of
> that
> of
> all
> throws
> posting
> top
Of course. We basically agree on everything here except the minor (to
me) point of a brief answer to a statement or point that all fits on a
single screen. We agree that it's wrong, but disagree on how much of a
problem it usually is.
> Aside: I view "but my client does $THIS automaticaly" comments to be an
> excuse at best. Also, the size and popularity of the institution that
> creates a tool to do something does not speak to it's properness, rather
> simply nods to it's likely probability.
I completely agree. If a program doesn't put the reply cursor where you
want it, either switch to a different program or get into the habit of
moving the cursor to where you want it.
However, note that no program can put the cursor wherever you want it
for inline posting.
By the way, I might be wrong, but I think it was Microsoft that in its
programs (Outlook and Outlook Express) started the habit of
top-posting--something that many other programs copied and many people
also copied, thinking that since their program puts the cursor there,
that was the *correct* way to do it.
Another by the way: every now and then I write to some come company,
either asking a question or making a request, and their reply often
contains a note warning me that if I don't don't top-post when replying
to their reply, my message will be ignored. That always pisses me off,
but I do as they say, since I wouldn't have written if I didn't think it
was important.
--
Ken
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Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text MB <MB@nospam.net> - 2021-04-25 08:58 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2021-04-25 09:28 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text MB <MB@nospam.net> - 2021-04-25 10:11 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Jim S <jim@jimXscott.co.uk> - 2021-04-25 10:25 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2021-04-25 10:47 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text MB <MB@nospam.net> - 2021-04-25 11:04 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Chris Youlden <fbx@youlden.co.uk> - 2021-04-25 12:13 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2021-04-25 12:27 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Chris Youlden <fbx@youlden.co.uk> - 2021-04-26 12:33 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text "Brian Gaff \(Sofa\)" <briang1@blueyonder.co.uk> - 2021-04-26 09:11 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2021-04-26 09:19 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Ken Blake <ken@invalidemail.com> - 2021-04-26 07:55 -0700
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text MB <MB@nospam.net> - 2021-04-26 17:11 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text "Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com> - 2021-04-26 16:47 +0000
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Ken Blake <ken@invalidemail.com> - 2021-04-26 10:45 -0700
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text "Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com> - 2021-04-26 18:20 +0000
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Ken Blake <ken@invalidemail.com> - 2021-04-26 11:44 -0700
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Grant Taylor <gtaylor@tnetconsulting.net> - 2021-04-26 16:02 -0600
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Ken Blake <ken@invalidemail.com> - 2021-04-26 16:49 -0700
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Grant Taylor <gtaylor@tnetconsulting.net> - 2021-04-26 18:39 -0600
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Ken Blake <ken@invalidemail.com> - 2021-04-27 09:15 -0700
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Grant Taylor <gtaylor@tnetconsulting.net> - 2021-04-27 12:26 -0600
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Ken Blake <ken@invalidemail.com> - 2021-04-28 08:20 -0700
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Grant Taylor <gtaylor@tnetconsulting.net> - 2021-04-28 10:37 -0600
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Laurence Taylor <laurence@nospam.plus.com> - 2021-04-28 21:40 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text MB <MB@nospam.net> - 2021-04-28 22:01 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text charles <charles@candehope.me.uk> - 2021-04-29 09:19 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Miguel Tomar Nogueira <mnogueira@mail.telepac.pt> - 2021-04-28 02:29 +0000
OT: posting/emailing style (was: Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text) "J. P. Gilliver (John)" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2021-04-28 16:14 +0100
Re: OT: posting/emailing style (was: Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text) Ken Blake <ken@invalidemail.com> - 2021-04-28 08:42 -0700
Re: OT: posting/emailing style (was: Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text) "J. P. Gilliver (John)" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2021-04-28 17:42 +0100
Re: OT: posting/emailing style (was: Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text) Ken Blake <ken@invalidemail.com> - 2021-04-28 10:07 -0700
Re: OT: posting/emailing style (was: Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text) "J. P. Gilliver (John)" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2021-04-28 18:37 +0100
Re: OT: posting/emailing style (was: Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text) Roderick Stewart <rjfs@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> - 2021-04-29 09:06 +0100
Re: OT: posting/emailing style (was: Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text) Grant Taylor <gtaylor@tnetconsulting.net> - 2021-04-28 10:45 -0600
Re: OT: posting/emailing style (was: Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text) "J. P. Gilliver (John)" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2021-04-28 17:50 +0100
Re: OT: posting/emailing style (was: Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text) Grant Taylor <gtaylor@tnetconsulting.net> - 2021-04-28 10:57 -0600
Re: OT: posting/emailing style (was: Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text) "J. P. Gilliver (John)" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2021-04-28 18:10 +0100
Re: OT: posting/emailing style (was: Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text) Roderick Stewart <rjfs@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> - 2021-04-29 09:31 +0100
Re: OT: posting/emailing style liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2021-04-28 20:06 +0100
Re: OT: posting/emailing style "J. P. Gilliver (John)" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2021-04-28 20:24 +0100
Re: OT: posting/emailing style liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2021-04-29 10:29 +0100
Re: OT: posting/emailing style "NY" <me@privacy.invalid> - 2021-04-29 10:35 +0100
Re: OT: posting/emailing style John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> - 2021-04-29 11:05 +0100
Re: OT: posting/emailing style "J. P. Gilliver (John)" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> - 2021-04-29 15:58 +0100
Re: OT: posting/emailing style liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) - 2021-04-29 19:04 +0100
Re: OT: posting/emailing style Robin <rbw@outlook.com> - 2021-04-29 11:01 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text williamwright <wrightsaerials@f2s.com> - 2021-04-26 23:29 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Grant Taylor <gtaylor@tnetconsulting.net> - 2021-04-26 16:01 -0600
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text williamwright <wrightsaerials@f2s.com> - 2021-04-26 23:28 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Ken Blake <ken@invalidemail.com> - 2021-04-26 16:57 -0700
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Grant Taylor <gtaylor@tnetconsulting.net> - 2021-04-26 18:56 -0600
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Ken Blake <ken@invalidemail.com> - 2021-04-27 09:32 -0700
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Grant Taylor <gtaylor@tnetconsulting.net> - 2021-04-27 10:59 -0600
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Ken Blake <ken@invalidemail.com> - 2021-04-27 10:26 -0700
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Grant Taylor <gtaylor@tnetconsulting.net> - 2021-04-27 12:28 -0600
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Ken Blake <ken@invalidemail.com> - 2021-04-28 08:23 -0700
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Grant Taylor <gtaylor@tnetconsulting.net> - 2021-04-28 10:50 -0600
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Grant Taylor <gtaylor@tnetconsulting.net> - 2021-04-28 10:51 -0600
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Ken Blake <ken@invalidemail.com> - 2021-04-28 10:15 -0700
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Grant Taylor <gtaylor@tnetconsulting.net> - 2021-04-28 11:48 -0600
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Ken Blake <ken@invalidemail.com> - 2021-04-28 10:58 -0700
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2021-04-26 20:00 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Ken Blake <ken@invalidemail.com> - 2021-04-26 12:25 -0700
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> - 2021-04-26 16:26 -0500
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Miguel Tomar Nogueira <mnogueira@mail.telepac.pt> - 2021-04-27 05:07 +0000
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Dave W <davewi11@yahoo.co.uk> - 2021-04-26 21:19 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> - 2021-04-26 15:54 -0500
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text Chris Youlden <fbx@youlden.co.uk> - 2021-04-26 22:58 +0100
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> - 2021-04-26 17:55 -0500
Re: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> - 2021-04-25 09:47 -0500
Cross-posting not showing in Newsgroups header (was: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text) VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> - 2021-04-26 18:27 -0500
Re: Cross-posting not showing in Newsgroups header (was: Thunderbird - disabling display of quoted text) Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2021-04-27 10:45 +0100
Re: Cross-posting not showing in Newsgroups header VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> - 2021-04-27 14:05 -0500
Re: Cross-posting not showing in Newsgroups header Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2021-04-27 20:10 +0100
Re: Cross-posting not showing in Newsgroups header VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> - 2021-04-27 15:05 -0500
Re: Cross-posting not showing in Newsgroups header Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2021-04-27 21:20 +0100
Re: Cross-posting not showing in Newsgroups header VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> - 2021-04-27 17:39 -0500
Re: Cross-posting not showing in Newsgroups header Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2021-04-28 06:58 +0100
Re: Cross-posting not showing in Newsgroups header VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> - 2021-04-28 01:59 -0500
Re: Cross-posting not showing in Newsgroups header MB <MB@nospam.net> - 2021-04-27 22:03 +0100
Re: Cross-posting not showing in Newsgroups header Miguel Tomar Nogueira <mnogueira@mail.telepac.pt> - 2021-04-28 02:50 +0000
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